Kerbal Construction Time/StageRecovery Dev Thread

[JeffreyCor]

TweakScale makes a mess of everything up so that isn't too surprising With updates I still panic a bit when I see "RealChutes" in there

[Svm420]

Has anyone had an issue with reverting to editor from a sim and being unable to interact with the part menu and the buttons in the top right corner save, load, new, launch with this mod? i am having that issue and haven't in the past updated this recently and thought i may ask see of anyone knew anything. Logs here if that helps.

[JeffreyCor]

I haven't but I'll make a special test just of that to see if I can duplicate the problem. Not the long i'm used to seeing, guessing maybe mac, but it looked like a ton of errors from other mods springing up. Maybe Magico will spot something I missed

[magico13]

That is an impressive mod list! It's hard to say for sure what's happening. There are a lot of errors with FAR after you loaded a ship in the editor. When you revert back to the editor there are some errors with Kerbal Engineer, the PQS system (particularly with Outer Planets it seems), some more with FAR, Procedural Wings. Action groups extended seems to have it's usual round of NREs. No input locks were active according to the log when entering the editor (and that's what would cause that issue).

Some mods that I know use input locks in the editor: KCT, Kerbal Engineer, MechJeb, I think FAR does too. Anything that has a GUI in the editor probably uses input locks there. I would suggest opening the debug menu (Alt-f12 usually) and clicking "Show Input Locks" then sending me a picture of that. It should say whether any locks are active, and if so what they're named. If we're lucky, the mod author named their Input Locks with something descriptive (all of KCT's start with "KCT" and then have semi-descriptive names)

[Svm420]

I had my mouse over the launch button.

My mods are a blessing and a curse lol

[magico13]

Hmm, there's only one input lock and it doesn't look like it's actually doing anything. And usually the buttons get greyed out when a lock is active. I guess I have more questions than answers now

1) Is it only after reverting from a simulation? What if you launch a ship, then revert to editor?

2) What happens when you click the buttons? Does the texture change at all? Do the tooltips pop up when you hover over the buttons? (ie, "save" "load" "launch", etc)

3) If it does happen after normal launches too, when you remove KCT does it still happen?

Also, I don't see the KCT icon anywhere in that screenshot. Are you using the toolbar mod with it set to show up on there? (KCT is obviously installed and running though). I am currently somewhat baffled by what is happening. I don't think it's directly KCT related but you've got so many mods it's hard to diagnose!

[regex]

Not sure if this has been reported, but here goes.

I installed this last night to check out, started a new save, did some upgrades, decided that 21 days was waaay too long to build a damn sounding rocket, deleted the save, started a new one, only had ten upgrade points to spend and the cost for upgrade points was where I left it (16 sci) in the deleted save. Restarting the game fixed it.

The mod itself is not bad, I think I can learn to like it. I disabled roll out time because time-warping twice per rocket is annoying. Is there a way to add the roll-out time to the build time, or maybe add a number to the default build time multiplier? Also, if the roll-out time is 0 you still have to click roll-out before launch. :/

[magico13]

Was this with the development builds or the official release? I thought I had fixed most/all the "out of sync" issues in the dev versions. Initial build times are high, but start to level out/drop substantially once you start reusing and recovering parts. The inventory drops things quite a bit, but you're also rewarded for using identical parts throughout builds.

A large majority of the mod is configurable. There are three build time modifiers: the overall modifier which is applied linearly to the build time calculations, the "build effect" which handles how subsequent builds with the same parts get faster (by default, the fourth launch of an identical rocket will take half the time), and the "inventory effect" which handles how much things decrease when you use parts from the inventory. The recent development builds actually let you completely redefine the entire build time in the KCT_Formulas.cfg file if you want more control, including letting you switch from a cost based time to a mass based one if you want (or a mix if you're feeling adventurous). I should also add the reconditioning and rollout time formulas to that file, thanks for reminding me.

I'll fix the issue where turning rollout down to 0 but keeping reconditioning on requires you to press rollout and then launch, thanks!

[regex]

Was this with the development builds or the official release?

90% certain it was the official release, but I can check in a few hours, and I might even nab the latest.

A large majority of the mod is configurable.

I suppose it behooves me to read the manual. Anyway, I just wanted to know if it was relatively simple and it looks like it is.

keeping reconditioning on requires you to press rollout and then launch

[magico13]

90% certain it was the official release, but I can check in a few hours, and I might even nab the latest.

I suppose it behooves me to read the manual. Anyway, I just wanted to know if it was relatively simple and it looks like it is.

The development builds have had a lot of bug fixes and a few new features, so they're worth checking out. I'm planning on making it the new release version when I get a chance to do some proper testing myself. You'll be glad to know that the latest build should fix the issue with having to press rollout and then launch even when rollout is disabled, but I didn't test that build in-game. I also added the reconditioning formula to the KCT_Formulas.cfg file. I might make a tweak to that before release though to add one more variable (the maximum reconditioning value as defined in the settings) and have it use min(formula, max setting). Edit: I made that tweak.

I need to write up some documentation on how to modify those formulas and what variables are exposed. Edit: And the first draft of that documentation is up on the Github page: https://github.com/magico13/KCT/wiki/KCT_Formula.cfg-and-Math-Parser-Documentation

Edited March 7, 2015 by magico13

[Svm420]

I believe I lost my reconditioning time and rollout time with the latest build. Also I still am having trouble with getting stuck in the vab/sph. I had this happen once while reverting from an edit of a rocket in progress. Because you have options available in the KCT to leave the vab when editing i.e. discard edit, I was able to get out. So what I now want to ask is if you can program a button on the normal window when building a new item while in the VAB/SPH to exit back to KSC incase anyone gets stuck this will allow them to get back without restarting KSP. If you could do this it would be a great help to me. I also don't think it is this mod causing the issue, but as you said I have a huge mod list and finding the culprit would be a time consuming task when I already am limited on play time. I found the problem. In full screen with a monitor and a tv with a continuous desktop across both. KSP read my resolution as 3200x900 so it was like i was never at the top of the screen. I fixed it by running in windowed mode.

Edited March 9, 2015 by Svm420

[magico13]

Hmm, glad you found a solution to that problem! Are reconditioning and rollout not functioning at all with the latest build? I haven't gotten a chance to fire up KSP since I made it so I haven't gotten to test it. It shouldn't be affecting reconditioning (but it wouldn't surprise me if it did some how) and it should only affect rollout when you've got the slider set to 0% rollout, 100% reconditioning. If you had a one-time loss of reconditioning then I'm not going to worry too much. I annoyingly have had several launches where reconditioning hasn't kicked in like it was supposed to.

[Svm420]

I haven't changed any settings recently, so besides updating unless it defaulted to 0 recon and roll out I have lost it. It is only like 10 seconds to rollout and no recon time at all.

[JeffreyCor]

It should be by the mass of the ship previously lauched for recon and the one to be launched for rollout. Check the setting to see if they got goofed and if they look good you might try deleting the settings file to it can be rebuilt. Will also keep an eye out for anything strange happening on my launches.

[magico13]

You know, I think I noticed some strangely short rollout times for me as well. Could be an issue with the mass calculation. Keep an eye out and let me know what you all find.

Edit: I'm an idiot. I know what the problem probably is. Try deleting your KCT_Formulas.cfg file prior to the next time you launch KSP. I made some changes to it that could be affecting things.

Edited March 10, 2015 by magico13

[magico13]

A couple things:

1) I obviously didn't release last weekend. The main reason for that is because I haven't gotten to test the recover to storage feature pretty much at all, especially after adding the module templates file. As such, if you try out that feature please let me know whether it works and any issues you encounter, no matter how minor.

2) I've got a few more formulas I want to expose. Namely, the build rate increases per build point. I also want to add KSC building upgrade level as a possible variable for pertinent formula, like R&D center level for tech upgrades, or VAB level for rocket building.

[JeffreyCor]

Is the recovery to storage still part of the debug option? I just got the newest build and haven't had a chance to try it yet.

[magico13]

Is the recovery to storage still part of the debug option? I just got the newest build and haven't had a chance to try it yet.

No, it's a full on feature now. It's been in for a while now actually (a few weeks). Just open the KCT menu during flight and click the "Recover to Storage" button (has to be able to be recovered normally). Then it takes some time to be available for use.

[JeffreyCor]

Ahh, never use the KCT menu during flight apart from sending something to rollout while doing another flight. After landing always use the normal recover not the KCT menu for it.

[Svm420]

Does a rocket/whatever have to be rolled out for me to be able to launch from the editor? I dont see how i can save a screen trying to use KK. I still have no rollout or recon times I DLed the latest build and deleted the .cfg file you advised. Any ideas

Edited March 12, 2015 by Svm420

[JeffreyCor]

Svm: The editor in the VAB/SPH is only for reordering or canceling a build. The main KCT screen under the VAB button will give the option to rollout a ship that is completed if you have nod turned rollouts off in the settings. Reconditioning after launch is also in settings. There are 3 configs for all the settings, but these have been around for quite a while so shouldn't conflict. In the game if you open KCT and look in Settings make sure Rollout and Reconditioning are both enabled.

Magico: Rollouts seem to be a bit fast, I was able to roll out a rocket in 2 seconds had wiped all configs so it would apply your new formulas. Drag races at rollout

[Svm420]

Magico: Rollouts seem to be a bit fast, I was able to roll out a rocket in 2 seconds had wiped all configs so it would apply your new formulas. Drag races at rollout

Same here thats what i mean. They are all less than a minute unlike previously. Also I know the basics of KCT what I am asking was about KK and a statement magico made here or in the other KCT thread about KK. I appreciate the gesture though.

[magico13]

Not having any rollout and having really fast rollouts are very different. The problems that cause one are different from what causes the other, so that added to my confusion. It also doesn't help that I haven't gotten to test anything in about a week I have some potential ideas for what is causing the ridiculously fast rollouts. I know it's due to the change in the formula, but might also have to do with the mass calculation of the ship (which are related). I'm going to look at what I changed compared to what it was before. I imagine reconditioning is similarly affected, since those use the same formula (and are, in fact, the same internal data types).

Svm420 the way you can save a scene change is that now you don't have to roll out a vessel at the space center, go to the VAB to select the launch site, and then go back to the space center to launch the ship. Instead you roll out the vessel at the space center, go to the VAB to select the launch site, and launch from the VAB. You still have to do rollout in a scene where time passes (space center, flight, tracking station). They have to be totally rolled out to let you launch. I need to make sure that it works properly for the SPH and when rollout percent is 0. I actually haven't tested launching from the VAB at all.

Edit: HA, found the issue! KCT_GameStates.timeSettings.BuildEffect is not the same as KCT_GameStates.timeSettings.ReconditioningEffect. I accidentally am using the Build Effect instead of the Reconditioning Effect. Oops...

Should be fixed in 94.

Edited March 12, 2015 by magico13

[Svm420]

Awesome! Sorry for the miscom I could have been clearer. No worry or speed/urgency you are one of the fastest at updating and replying I have seen any faster and wed be downloaded multiple updates every day lol. Keep up the great work and thanks for the clarification toward KK.

[magico13]

any faster and wed be downloaded multiple updates every day lol. Keep up the great work and thanks for the clarification toward KK.

Unfortunately I'm really behind in updating the official release :/ It's been a few months and I really want to get these changes out since there are quite a few bug fixes and some cool changes. Which is why I'm glad people like you are testing out these development versions and letting me know what issues you find, since I don't get enough time to

As for KK, like I mentioned in the main thread, after this next release I'm gonna try to get some tighter integration with KK so it isn't such a pain to use KCT with it. Things like rollout and reconditioning on a per launchsite basis, along with letting you choose the launch site when you go to launch from the space center or flight. It should also open up multiple launchpads in the stock game, which I have a kind of cool idea for how to handle (since each pad will be upgraded independently, I'm going to use the stock upgrade system and "replace" the launchpad with the one you have selected. So if you have a tier 3 launchpad as your primary, and a tier 1 launchpad as your secondary, when you switch from the tier 3 to the tier 1 it will actually switch the model to the tier 1 launchpad I'll need to figure out how to handle switching pads if you destroy one of them).

Also, once I add in the things mentioned in this github issue (point 2 from the post I made at the end of the previous page of this thread) then I'm gonna try to come up with some example configurations that people might find interesting. RP-0 will obviously have one that will have some major changes, but two of the ones I'm considering are one that makes things in line with ExtraPlanetary Launchpads times, and a second one that "simplifies" things by relying entirely on the Stock upgrades and doesn't use upgrade points at all

That second one sounds like fun to me. Things like having build rates have 3 tiers in line with the R&D center tiers, and the number of build rates in each building determined by their level. (So R&D tier 1 might have rates of (1.0, 0.5, 0.25) with only 1 rate unlocked with VAB level 1. If you up to R&D tier 2 the rates go to (1.5, 1.0, 0.5) or if you unlock VAB tier 2 you unlock the second rate (so 0.5 with R&D tier 1, or 1.0 with R&D tier 2). Tech node rates might depend only on their cost, or might get a boost with R&D tier (so if you unlock tier 2 without unlocking all of the tier 1 nodes, the remaining tier 1 nodes will unlock faster).

I want to start a thread to have people submit configs so we can have a "library" of them, but I doubt too many people will take the time to play around with them that much.