Whackjobian megastructures and FAR

[Wampa842]

I've been trying to get an enormous refueling and decorative space station into orbit with little success. My lifter frame (12 branches, a 3.75 meter tank/engine and equally large reaction wheels on each) is unable to lift it above the atmosphere: it always flips over.

Is it possible to get megastructures of Whackjobian size into orbit without uninstalling FAR? If so, with how many boosters?

Edited February 12, 2014 by Wampa842

[iStickyDuck]

Try building the space station in orbit using docking nodes rather than doing it all in one go... it's a lot easier and will save a lot of effort (although you do have to rendezvous and then dock in orbit)

[Taki117]

What you need are more aerodynamic rockets, might I suggest either:

a) Orbital constriction. Break your ship down into smaller pieces and assemble in orbit.

OR

Get Procedural fairings and encase the entire thing in a fairing.

[mythbusters844]

Try using Procedural Fairings to add fairings to the payload (be prepared for one huge fairing) and to put those massive delta wings at the bottom. ()

EDIT: Ninja'd.... but add the delta wings anyway for stability

[ShadowDragon8685]

Just do be mindful - megahuge proceedural fairings rapidly get stupidly heavy, like in the order of tens of tons heavy.

[TechnicalK3rbal]

There's really no practical way to do this at all....let alone with far...

[KvickFlygarn87]

Practical?, No. Boosterlicious? Yes.

[DrinkV0dka]

Also, if the rocket is flipping over you are turning to quickly. If you really want to send it up in one go do what the other people have suggested and use procedural fairings. Also strut the whole structure really well. Best of luck.

[Raven.]

Everyone here has suggested breaking the station up into smaller pieces. This is an extremely good idea, even for things that are not stations. This:

1) Allows you use a smaller launch vessel (easier to design and fly)

2) Allows you to modularize the design of the space station.

3) Allows for the construction of a much larger station, given enough time and effort.

[Wampa842]

Procedural fairings didn't work. I resized a base to fit 3.75m parts, but it was still way too unstable, and easier to flip because of the increased front weight. Breaking it down was also impossible, it wasn't built with that in mind.

I actually got the thing into orbit with brute force, little science, and lots, lots, LOTS of lag. The lifter frame had even more fuel, more control authority, and pairs of tugging engines. It wasn't nearly a solid body, so I didn't have to worry about the pendulum rocket fallacy.

I launched straight upwards and didn't stop until my apoapsis was half the way to the Mun's orbit. Then I had time to slowly turn it to the east and to raise my periapsis to the target altitude of 400 kilometres. Since I was pointing towards my prograde vector at apoapsis, I was at a perfect angle to lower it once I got to the other side. The result? It took me twenty-four flipping minutes to create a "big, hunkin' weapon" and fuel tank. Pics later when I'm done detaching and tugging the boosters away.

[MerlinsMaster]

Hey, dude. Any chance you could still hook us up with those pictures? I've got a similar problem and I don't want to have to necessarily re-invent the wheel. Thanks.

[ratfusion]

Thats the way I get giant unwieldy stuff into orbit with FAR. Straight up until you're out of the atmosphere, then circularize. You can sometimes get away with half of a normal gravity turn if you adjust in very small increments.

[Shiv]

Yah FAR has killed my ability to make a gravity turn. I don't know what the deal is but any time I turn even slightly, the whole thing just decides to flip right on over. So I just shoot straight up now. Efficient? No, but it does work.

[Hodo]

Yah FAR has killed my ability to make a gravity turn. I don't know what the deal is but any time I turn even slightly, the whole thing just decides to flip right on over. So I just shoot straight up now. Efficient? No, but it does work.

FAR did not kill your ability to perform a gravity turn, you were most likely doing them wrong from the start and now FAR is punishing you for bad habbits.

I perform gravity turns everyday with FAR. I start at 100m/s or 1km altitude AGL which ever happens first or depending on if I am performing the launch with MJ or manually. Once I start the turn at 100m/s the rocket will naturally start to fall prograde after I tilt it a few degrees and it all pretty much automatic after that. I just adjust as needed and watch.

[DaMichel]

About the flipping: Your stuff must be aerodynamically stable, that is, CoM in front of CoL at all times. When you deviate too far from prograde, things will go wrong which means flipping in the best case but more likely destruction of your craft due to aerodynamically induced stresses. Beside stability it is a matter of bringing enough fuel and not overspeeding because of the aerodynamic break up. Have a look at these if you like

example 1

example 2

[ratfusion]

You're both completely right that FAR didn't break a gravity turn, a closer to true gravity turn actually works better in FAR.

The OP is asking about attaching giant chunks of space station to a lifter, which is almost always aerodynamically unstable. These can still be lifted in FAR, but its easiest if you just go straight up. Pitching much away from prograde will flip. Some of us like doing this even though its unstable and inefficient because it saves some gaming time.