My Take on Meteors

[Shna_na]

I think that SQUAD could implement a meteor effect that would put very little stress on performance, but make a real difference aesthetics-wise. They could use the random generator of the asteroids to make it so that they are spawned at random times at 70km above Kerbin that doesn't show up on the radar and is somewhat small (no larger than, say, a launch stage). The twist is that it isn't actually an object in the game - it's just a non-collision object. This means that they can create an animation for them to re-enter and burn up etc. before reaching, say 30KM.

I don't know much in the ways of programming and whatnot but here's what I think should happen in an easy on the eyes format since the above description is confusing even to me:

• Small (1 to 100m in radius), non-collision, randomly generated asteroid spawns above Kerbin's atmosphere
  
• It is treated and generated like terrain scatter is (non-collision, randomly generated, etc.), but it is animated and far more sparse.
  
• The animation is the only way that it moves - it has no actual trajectory and the in-game physics doesn't apply to it. It's literally just an animated object.
  
• The animation takes it into Kerbin's atmosphere on a shallow angle and it burns up at 50 to 30km depending on its size.
  
• The animation could have a variable direction, one that is not a single set parameter, but rather that can change. Maybe within a certain hemisphere of the object's spawn location that points flat-side-up?
  
• Visibility is dependent on whether or not it receives sunlight - could just re-use the system that is used for solar panels.
  
  • When sunlight is present, it uses the mach effects and leaves a white jet-stream.
    
  • When sunlight is not present, it uses the re-entry effects and leaves the white jet-stream.
    
    • The jet-stream could use the same system as is used for the exhaust from the air-breathing engines but with a longer persistence time (the bit that stays behind when you're firing them in low atmosphere).
      

Note: phrases that are underlined already exist in the game in one form or another.

As you can see, most of the things that are needed for this system already exist in the game, and would be an efficient way of essentially re-cycling these systems. Of course; they'd need to be slightly tweaked, some bits of it will need to be made from scratch, etc. But on the whole, this would be a brilliant thing to have in the game. It doesn't interfere with anything at all because they don't interact with anything, but it'd give the game a certain aesthetic charm that I, for one, would love to see. It could even be tweakable in the options in exactly the same way as the ground scatter: have an option of toggling it and a slider to determine how often it happens (within reason, of course). As stated earlier, it also wouldn't be too stressful in terms of performance, as it doesn't render any physics for it - each meteor would have as much effect as a piece of space debris that is only 1 part, if my logic serves me right.

If any of this confuses you, please tell me. It's a difficult thing to describe and explain, but I think I've got my point across. I'd be happy to tweak it and make it more easy on the eyes though if need be.

[astropapi1]

This is a brilliant and well thought idea.

Me vantz.

[Shna_na]

This is a brilliant and well thought idea.

Me vantz.

Thanks! I spent some time trying to optimise the idea and figure what currently existing systems could be used to make this happen. As you can see, it turns out that this feature pretty much exists already* but is strewn about in various other parts of the game.

*as of 0.24 that is, since the asteroid malarkey isn't here until then.

[Shna_na]

Has anyone got their own views on the subject? Do you agree with this, would you like to see it in the game, any improvements, another feature that could be made mostly from recycled parts of the game?

[vger]

I already have meteors in KSP. My rockets.

[Nemrav]

a nice effect but I foresee numerous complaints....

"why can't I touch the meteor, I just go through it"

"I can't land my meteor at KSC, help plz"

"suggestion, make it so we can interact with meteors"

"bug report, asteroids can't be docked with the claw..."

I could go on all day, but what I do suspect is for artificial meteors to be well, stoc, with all the people wondering how big a rocket to land it at KSC...

Or we just see asteroids on impact courses with Kerbin..

What I'd like to see is comets which have a high chance of spawning.... gilly ish comets..

[6.forty]

I think there would be an issue with having it move without using physics. Not that it's impossible, but it would look rather unnatural. Take all the VAB background movement for example.

[vger]

What I'd like to see is comets which have a high chance of spawning.... gilly ish comets..

That's what I want next after asteroids. Comets.

If only it's possible to get them to actually look pretty with the engine. The gas had better ignite when they get close to the sun.

[Shna_na]

I see your points about the lack of physics etc., and I see now why this would be an issue. Maybe they could have physics then? Sure, it'd be slightly more of a struggle on the ol' hardware, but nothing significant since there'd only be one, maybe two or three, at a time.

[Nemrav]

I suspect, that anything to do with asteroids (comets, meteors, belt etc.) will be completely implemented by ~0.26 as nasa pack is coming as 0.23.10, which simply adds asteroids. and all of these are simply variations of asteroids based on what their behavior is, comets = highly ecentric orbit which makes sun-dives then goes back out to the edge of the system.. meteors/meteorites = comes into the atmosphere, asteroids = any of these.

just a thought, I do think that at a distance meteors should just be ground scatter but up-close maybe make them like an asteroid.

[jwenting]

a nice effect but I foresee numerous complaints....

"when I drop an asteroid on someone's Mun base in multiplayer the base doesn't get destroyed"

[Javster]

I'd like something like that, terrain scatter in space.

[FonVegen]

I would really like this being implemented. Also, there are certain sections in the orbit of the earth where there happen to be lots of small rocks. May that be possible too? So, whenever Kerbin is in a (randomly at the beginning of the save generated?) specific section of it's orbit, there would happen to be more meteors than at other times. Maybe that would work like some kind of SoI, just with space rocks spawning more frequently instead of source of gravity changing.

Just an idea that crossed my mind

[Helix935]

use this but it may not work

http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/49420-Micrometeorites?p=972607&highlight=micrometeorites#post972607

[Shna_na]

use this but it may not work

http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/49420-Micrometeorites?p=972607&highlight=micrometeorites#post972607

From what I gather, that seems somewhat like a random failure. SQUAD have said that they won't make it into the game, and personally I'm glad. Thanks for your input though.

[vger]

Micrometeorites hardly requires any kind of physics engine in order to implement. At the MOST, you'd just have to designate areas of space with heavier concentrations, and when a vessel is in those areas, make a collision roll every so often. If the roll is high enough, emit sparks on the hull, and deal damage if necessary (but I wouldn't do such a thing).

But for the effects of meteors entering the atmosphere, I'm not sure I see the point. Would it work on the scale of the Kerbal solar system? Earth hits meteors so fast, if you blink, they're already gone. So what would this accomplish for gameplay? It's not like you're going to wrangle a meteor once it's in the atmosphere. Anything else that asteroids do need not be any different from how ships interact with a planet. It hits the atmosphere, makes a lot of smoke and fire, and explodes on impact.

[Shna_na]

Micrometeorites hardly requires any kind of physics engine in order to implement... But for the effects of meteors entering the atmosphere, I'm not sure I see the point.

The meteorites I'm talking about are those that enter the atmosphere and keep going for a while. The moderately sized ones that are somewhere between the one that exploded over Russia and the ones that you see during the Perseid meteor storms (I believe that's the name). Though micrometeorites would be nice, too. As I said, this is for aesthetic purposes. I think everyone's too caught up with functionality, but a game can get boring if a place looks the same all the time.

... you'd just have to designate areas of space with heavier concentrations, and when a vessel is in those areas, make a collision roll every so often. If the roll is high enough, emit sparks on the hull, and deal damage if necessary (but I wouldn't do such a thing).

I think this is somewhat similar to the random events. I think that if concentrations such as these were to be there, they should be marked on the map. You also have to consider that things like these, which would affect the gameplay more than a mere aesthetic effect, are the kinds of things that SQAUD wants to have as a constant - something that's the same for each player - and so would need to be specific rather than procedural.

[jwenting]

Micrometeorites hardly requires any kind of physics engine in order to implement. At the MOST, you'd just have to designate areas of space with heavier concentrations, and when a vessel is in those areas, make a collision roll every so often. If the roll is high enough, emit sparks on the hull, and deal damage if necessary (but I wouldn't do such a thing).

ah, random failures...

Which are on the what not to suggest list for a very good reason: NOT FUN.

[vger]

ah, random failures...Which are on the what not to suggest list for a very good reason: NOT FUN.

Yeah, that's why I was trying to figure out what its purpose would be. Unless it affects the vessel in some mechanical way, it's just a very simple superficial effect that would take almost no time to implement.

The meteorites I'm talking about are those that enter the atmosphere and keep going for a while. The moderately sized ones that are somewhere between the one that exploded over Russia and the ones that you see during the Perseid meteor storms (I believe that's the name). Though micrometeorites would be nice, too. As I said, this is for aesthetic purposes. I think everyone's too caught up with functionality, but a game can get boring if a place looks the same all the time.

I think this would fall under the general category of weather effects in this case. Not that it's literally meteorological, but a bit of spice just like dust storms, auroras, lightning, etc. Whether or not it's something that needs to have actual cometary debris trails to dictate when a larger volume of meteors happens is anyone's guess. I'm thinking no though since there's no "Kerbal calendar" to track the passage of time with, beyond a clock that starts at liftoff.

Edited March 17, 2014 by vger

[Shna_na]

... there's no "Kerbal calendar" to track the passage of time with, beyond a clock that starts at liftoff.

Yep, there is actually. It's measured down to the second. Go to the tracking station, you'll see it there. It's also in the save file somewhere. They could probably base a calendar off it. And according to Scott Manley, a Kerbal day is 6 hours. So there's a start. Does that mean a Kerbal week is only 42 hours?

Edited March 17, 2014 by Shna_na
Repaired a rift in the space-time continuum

[vger]

Yep, there is actually. It's measured down to the second. Go to the tracking station, you'll see it there. It's also in the save file somewhere. They could probably base a calendar off it. And according to Scott Manley, a Kerbal day is 6 hours. So there's a start. Does that mean a Kerbal week is only 42 hours?

Oh, sweet. Never saw that before. Guess it probably would've stuck out more if I could warp from the tracking station (which totally needs to become a thing).

Well... there's roughly 424 Kerbal days in a single year, which would be about 60 weeks if we treated each 6 hour rotation as a day. Not ridiculously far off from Earth.