Reach for orbit with an ion glider!

[Lazro]

Not mine, but from the KSP reddit:

http://m.imgur.com/a/vM2zY

This guy made orbit.

[Tarantulae]

Wow. Posted the craft files too. I want to try for myself now.

Question: Does it still count as SSTO if takeoff is with a release arm (launch stability enhancer)?

Edited April 14, 2014 by Tarantulae

[zarakon]

I would say so

His uses a drop-tank though, so I wouldn't call it an SSTO regardless

[Redshift OTF]

Sorry, the rules say no exploiting infiniglide, keep control surfaces to a minimum

No worries. It was fun to build anyway!

Edited April 14, 2014 by Redshift OTF

[Redshift OTF]

Not mine, but from the KSP reddit:

http://m.imgur.com/a/vM2zY

This guy made orbit.

I think that would count as infini-glide as those wings are kind of control surfaces and they are the only wings on the craft that I can see.

[gamerpuppy]

The wing surfaces were disabled

[zarakon]

Based on the speed, altitude, and time numbers in the series of screenshots, it doesn't look like that was a major factor.

Congrats on being the first!

Edited April 14, 2014 by zarakon

[Redshift OTF]

The wing surfaces were disabled

In that case that's most impressive.

[totalitor]

I needed more wing area to fly. What am I missing? Why his plane flies?

[nobbers12345]

Can I build it as a rocket and not a plane?

[donfede]

Can I build it as a rocket and not a plane?

Don't expect TWR will pass without wing lift... but you're welcome to try and prove us wrong (I'm finishing up another challenge, but hope to make presence here sooner or later ).

[zarakon]

I needed more wing area to fly. What am I missing? Why his plane flies?

Those little delta winglets have the highest lift/mass ratio in the game. His whole concept is to keep the weight to a bare minimum. With low wing mass, no extra control surfaces, no batteries, and the small xenon tank (after dropping the first) he gets a very good TWR which can overcome the small wing area

Can I build it as a rocket and not a plane?

You can try, but it won't work without cheating in some way. The highest theoretical thrust/weight ratio you can get with ion engines is something like 0.81, which won't get you off the surface.

[Blue]

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(23923 meters / 20) + 663 m/s = 1859.2 Score for my first shown attempt.

(25055 meters / 20) + 693 m/s = 1945.8 Score for highest attained, despite being the result of a lack of actual control of the aircraft.

At this weird point I began consuming more power than I received, and the batteries drained. When this happened, all incoming power was routed directly to the engines and stability control for the flaps, so I continued to accelerate and more-or-less maintain attitude, even though technically I wasn't in control. This went on until the engines shut off from fuel starvation.

Edited April 17, 2014 by Blue

[gamerpuppy]

The key to reaching high altitude is using sas for control and keeping your horizontal airspeed up so you can continue to get lift. If your plane can't fly on sas alone then you will have a hard time flying at high altitude.

[gamerpuppy]

Also keep your cog and col as close as possible at all stages of flight. If you have drop tanks they should be on the cog

[MarvinKitFox]

entry withdrawn, i cannot compete with infinigliders

Edited April 20, 2014 by MarvinKitFox

[Nedal]

So I decided to work on this challenge a bit.. then..

STUPID MUN!

[Nedal]

My Ion to orbit SSTO

Craft file: https://www./?iw9b1i9sq9xg2pw

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[MarvinKitFox]

Considering that one can use Nedal's design to repeatedly buzz the control tower, with the engine switched off, just by spiralling....

I smell infiniglide. Despite the deactivated control surfaces.

Yep. Flew to island airstrip wit 0 xenon, just a higher launch clamp.

Edited April 20, 2014 by MarvinKitFox

[Nedal]

yeah i didnt have them activated. when i first tested it with them on.. the thing did loopdeloops forever without the engine off.

I forgot time is a thing tho so ill give it another run.

Edited April 20, 2014 by Nedal

[Tarantulae]

How can you infiniglide without control surfaces?

[Nedal]

Heres the Screenie with time.

Was challenging making periapsis above 70km without having to timewarp to the other side and finish the orbit.

Basically throttle up, take off right as the sun is rising. Go straight down the 90degree heading, pitch to 25 degrees, phystimewarp to 4. go make a sandwich. when u get back you should be getting some speed. pitch up a bit keeping your surface speed between 30 and 50m/s until youre pitched up to 45degrees. then timewarp till you hit around 28km altitude, then pitch down to 25degrees to gain speed, increase timewarp, and let the rotation around kerbin pitch you back up to 45degrees and then repeat back down to 25, to 45, to 25, to 45 a few times and you're pretty much in orbit. At least thats what i did. I had to pitch way down at the end to keep my apoapse low and shift the periapse to right behind me.

Edited April 20, 2014 by Nedal

[MarvinKitFox]

How can you infiniglide without control surfaces?

Control surfaces cause phantom forces at any time when air is nor flowing smoothly over them.

These phantom forces are stronger than the drag induced by this flow.

With a very light vehicle that has SAS, a control surface will generate these forces even when the control itself is disabled, if the SAS is forcing the plane to face in a direction other than straight ahead.

In this case, one can fly (in a horrid way) if you speed is over 35m/s, your right wing is pointing 45* forward and about 20* up, while you are pressing E and S together(rotate clockwise, and up).

In his case

....

aw heck never mind, you wont believe me anyways.

[Nedal]

Control surfaces cause phantom forces at any time when air is nor flowing smoothly over them.

These phantom forces are stronger than the drag induced by this flow.

With a very light vehicle that has SAS, a control surface will generate these forces even when the control itself is disabled, if the SAS is forcing the plane to face in a direction other than straight ahead.

In this case, one can fly (in a horrid way) if you speed is over 35m/s, your right wing is pointing 45* forward and about 20* up, while you are pressing E and S together(rotate clockwise, and up).

In his case

....

aw heck never mind, you wont believe me anyways.

Perhaps you're right.. I did no holding of roll buttons or anything, all of them were fully deactivated pitch/roll/yaw all off (it did crazy things with them on), the pod torque is enough to steer that tiny craft. It's just really lightweight and well well balanced. Those little wings are the best lift for the weight is why i used em.

Everyone is free to try out the craft and let me know if there was some phantom force helping it out. I think its just the absurd lift those things give and the overall tiny weight of the thing. I think it's like .6 tons fully fueled.

[Nedal]

One other thing to note. Extraneous solar panels and such do create more drag on the craft.

There really should be a "center of drag" button like center of mass/thrust/lift and such.

My favorite space plane design has all the intakes well behind the center of mass as they have huge drag, It makes it sooo much more stable, almost like flying with a parachute deployed. Spinout recovery is simple if your center of drag is behind your center of mass.