The mobile processing lab is terrible.

[jalapen0]

You could get custom biomes to make science trips outside Kerbin SOI worth it. Just sayin....

[Sirrobert]

You know, you don't have to bring the lab back home right?

Just bring an empty lab along with you to wherever you go, use the pilots to man it, and leave it (and the science stuf) behind when you go home.

Lab is also very usefull in a space station around Mun/Minmus to squeeze out science, without having to send 20 landers up from Kerbin

[Xavven]

I was uninformed and very upset when I posted. I'm still upset, now at my own stupidity for not testing the rig on Minimus. But I hit on another thing in the OP; as long as you need to go to 5 or fewer places on you interplanetary voyage of science, take this:

~snip~

Each masses 0.65t, 0.68t with six other radial instruments.

I completely agree. In fact, your docking port + science jr + goo design in that screenshot is almost identical to mine. I have a docking port on the top of my lander that grabs a new science jr and goo set before landing, then ascends to rendezvous with the mothership and ejects the spent science set, grabbing another for the next landing.

Using this method, you shed weight as you go, and all the duplicate science sets for the mission combined usually weigh less than 3.5 tonnes to begin with. I get much more delta-v out of my mission compared to using a mobile lab.

The mobile lab needs a buff. In addition to cleaning experiments, I think it should increase the amount of science you get from returned experiments by 15% as well, but only if it is processed in the same body's SOI (so players can't just bring science home and process it at a Kerbin space station.) Not only would this encourage people to use it to get more science, but it would encourage people to design missions with 2-3 Kerbals instead of 1, and cuts down on interplanetary mission designs that only use a command seat in order to reduce weight (sorry to criticize, but to me it's a bit cheesy).

I also think its weight should be reduced to 2.5 tonnes, the same as a hitchhiker storage container.

[Othuyeg]

If you bring a lab to mun or minmus orbit, you can store as many surface samples and other scientific reports in it.

[ICrashRockets]

I was going to agree with you, Son of Hicks, but I then realized that it was not that useful on a Kerbin Space Station, and that it needed to be brought back to give the most science (oopsie)...

One question though, is it possible to retrieve the two Kerbals from it?

[HeadHunter67]

And instead of complaining about the lack of documentation for the part maybe you should test it before beginning a long mission.

No, on this I have to agree - and it's not just an issue with KSP. Software companies have taken to relying on users to document their product. It's like "Here, you'll figure it out."

There's no documentation because the game isn't done yet, so there's no point in making documents which will need to be revised over and over again during development.

That would be valid if documents weren't ever revised again and again after development - but it happens all the time with released software.

Edited April 18, 2014 by HeadHunter67

[Sirrobert]

I was going to agree with you, Son of Hicks, but I then realized that it was not that useful on a Kerbin Space Station, and that it needed to be brought back to give the most science (oopsie)...

One question though, is it possible to retrieve the two Kerbals from it?

Yes, click on the door

No, on this I have to agree - and it's not just an issue with KSP. Software companies have taken to relying on users to document their product. It's like "Here, you'll figure it out."

That would be valid if documents weren't ever revised again and again after development - but it happens all the time with released software.

If you are going to document the way this game works, you can throw away the ENTIRE documentation every few updates.

Any documentation about science from before the Mobile Lab would have been useless after it was introduced. And when they introduce money, it'll be completely different again.

This is an alpha game. It's not complete yet. Don't expect it to be

[UberFuber]

Dumb question, can you remove science from the science lab after processing so you don't have to ship all 3.5 tons of it back to the surface of kerbin? Like can you stash a bunch of science in the hitchhiker cans or 3 person command pods? If I actually have to return the things I'll have to do some re-designs on many of my ships / stations.....

Yes you can.

I have a two flight Mum/Minimus mission. First flight is to Minimus due to its low gravity (hence less deltaVs going down and back up). I have essentially two ships.

First is a Mobile Processing Lab with large orange fuel tank and nuke engine for transfer maneuvers.

Second is a small lander with scientific equipment. This craft is launched with a decouplable large fuel-tank.

The first is launched with most of its large orange fuel tank expended to get into orbit.

The second craft is launched twice, once for a Minimus mission, and one for Mun mission.

The generally process goes as followed (after the lab is in place).

1. Launch the landing craft with attached fuel tank.

2. Dock it with the science lab, transfer fuel over to the science lab.

3. Ditch the fuel-tank attached to the lander (fuel-tank has just enough fuel to de-orbit with a probe core).

4. Transfer to Minimus polar orbit.

5. Time accelerate until desired biome is in the path of the orbit (this happens more at later stage of the mission as more and more biomes are "processed").

6. Undock lander, land, do science, and redock with lab.

7. Remove science from module and transfer them to lab.

8. Clean science modules, repeat from 5.

9. Once all biomes are covered. Transfer the whole ship back to Kerbin.

10. Once in Kerbin orbit, take stored science from lab and move them back to lander.

11. Undock lander and de-orbit back to Kerbin.

Then I repeat from 1 for my Mun mission.

My record is 4000+ science in the Minimus mission.

In theory, if I have the patience, I can land the lab on Mun/Minimus, drive it around on rover wheel and do science (and cleaning on the spot), and send a "recovery ship" to recover all the science (and Kerbal) from it.

[rkman]

Because Duna has no biomes there is no point in bringing the science lab + one goo container and one material bay - instead of just a few goo containers and material bays (and no science lab).

[NecroBones]

Dumb question, can you remove science from the science lab after processing so you don't have to ship all 3.5 tons of it back to the surface of kerbin? Like can you stash a bunch of science in the hitchhiker cans or 3 person command pods? If I actually have to return the things I'll have to do some re-designs on many of my ships / stations.....

Yep.

The one time I used a lab (I don't usually bother, since my missions all return home anyway), I was a bit confused with it too. I docked my lander, and looked through the science, and processed some, but didn't transmit. I managed to land the whole science module sometime later, but none of the science came with it. It turns out, all of it resided in one of the hitch-hiker cans on the station, not in the lander or the science lab.

You'll always be able to have a Kerbal grab it from wherever it is and take it to another command module, and I don't think the science lab tends to store it itself, based on my horribly small sample size of one attempt.

[Rakaydos]

So, the lab is worth it if you're going to be sciencing at least 6 biomes in a single mission.

High orbit

Low Orbit

Surface

-Surface water

-Flying above

Moon High orbit

Moon low orbit

Moon surface

So if you can land on both Duna and ike, it's as effective to bring 1 of each science and a lab, as it is to bring 6 of each science. If you can land on eve, it's not worth it unless you land on Gilly first. Not worth it for Dres or Moho, but you should almost always bring one when you visit Jool, Mun, or Minmus.

[ayana]

Letting it transmit up to 100% with a little mod made the science lab genuinely useful. Even if I only really had the tech to make a nice station by the time the tree was nearly done.

Waiting for return windows and getting back to Kerbin to gain all the science points is just too boring to use the lab as it is in stock. Personally, I like doing more landings instead of babysitting capsules all the way to the ground.

[Kerbonautical]

I haven't actually tried using the processing lab but I had an idea for it that I was going to use, however I'm not sure if it would actually operate this way upon reading this thread.

Could I for instance take the lab on a ship which would be in orbit, then use a lander to collect science at a biome, store in the lab, rinse and repeat until eventually sending the lab back on an unmanned re-entry with many points of science. Would this work or would the game overwrite any stored ground samples with the next incoming ground sample forcing me to transmit all but the final batch?

[ayana]

I haven't actually tried using the processing lab but I had an idea for it that I was going to use, however I'm not sure if it would actually operate this way upon reading this thread.

Could I for instance take the lab on a ship which would be in orbit, then use a lander to collect science at a biome, store in the lab, rinse and repeat until eventually sending the lab back on an unmanned re-entry with many points of science. Would this work or would the game overwrite any stored ground samples with the next incoming ground sample forcing me to transmit all but the final batch?

All experiments are biome/orbit height specific. The game only overwrites matching experiments. For example, you can store an EVA report from every biome you visit all in the same pod. Just not two from the same place.

[MKI]

I haven't actually tried using the processing lab but I had an idea for it that I was going to use, however I'm not sure if it would actually operate this way upon reading this thread.

Could I for instance take the lab on a ship which would be in orbit, then use a lander to collect science at a biome, store in the lab, rinse and repeat until eventually sending the lab back on an unmanned re-entry with many points of science. Would this work or would the game overwrite any stored ground samples with the next incoming ground sample forcing me to transmit all but the final batch?

I believe the lab can store data in any amount. I believe an unmanned science lab would still hold all the science put into it, with or without kerbals in the lab itself. Just don't forget you need kerbals in the lab for it to function. They also are needed to move the Science into the lab from the probe.

[Kerbonautical]

All experiments are biome/orbit height specific. The game only overwrites matching experiments. For example, you can store an EVA report from every biome you visit all in the same pod. Just not two from the same place.

Oh that's cool then, It functions more or less exactly as I expected it would. I can see why it would be a disappointment to have on an interplanetary journey for now but I can see this being an integral part of almost any ship designed for science in my future career files.

I believe the lab can store data in any amount. I believe an unmanned science lab would still hold all the science put into it, with or without kerbals in the lab itself. Just don't forget you need kerbals in the lab for it to function. They also are needed to move the Science into the lab from the probe.

Gotcha, I actually really like that. The Science lab will be one of the reasons for me to use EVA in the stock game outside of getting reports and surface samples.

[brdavis]

There are some other potentially interesting aspects to the science lab with contracts.

What if a contract specifies you need to return a certain amount of science from, say, Duna, in a narrow time window? A window too small to take a Hohmann transfer out, and one back, but one big enough to get out there and "process up" some data from landers to transmit back? Think the the 'space race' - getting there was only a part of the challenge, getting there *before someone else* was just as critical.

I agree it might need more… and personally I *really* want an IVA for it, just because it's the largest stock habitable module around (are the round things windows? I want to look out of them!!). But I've used it at Minmus and really enjoyed it - it not only allowed me to feel like I was maximizing science (without spamming landers everywhere), but it just felt… *right*.

[ArmchairGravy]

The science lab is useful for every science mission. The goo and material science can be used a high altitude, low altitude Etc. and the lab can reset it. Bring two experiments. Refine and transmit one, store the other in the pod. Then, clean and reset experiments and move to the next area. It is possible to get much science this way.

Exactly this. I radially attach two sets of science stuff, radial rockets, landing gear and a probe core. It doesn't weigh that much, and it'll gather all of the available science points in one go. Has enough delta v to get back from the surface of everything except Tylo and Eve. Dock a drive module and science my brains out.

[DivisionByZero]

With something like 14 biomes on mun and 9 or so on minmus, the usefulness of the lab is obvious - even in the stock game. Add the various locations in orbit and there could still be advantage on interplanetary trips. Install custom boomed and it becomes even more useful. The thing is fine if you ask me.

Edited April 19, 2014 by DivisionByZero
less snarky. sorry.

[Caelib]

It's definitely not useless, but I agree that 15% isn't adequate. It should be at least 50%.

[SkyRender]

The lab is most useful for missions that involve large amounts of trips to and from the surface of a body. For the Mun and Minmus, it's truly indispensable. Also handy for the Jool system. Anywhere else, though... Well, until we have more biomes, the lab is mostly only helpful for local space.

[qromodynmc]

I rarely use mobile processing lab,I cant say it is useles,neither I can say it is useful..

[-Velocity-]

I guess I still don't understand how science works. Do I only need to bring a single goo container/science module? I can then EVA a Kerbal, remove the results, store them in a command pod, and the lab can then clean out the goo container/science module so they can be re-used? The way I always did it, if I thought I was going to visit four biomes, I'd take four of each type of science-generating part. Is that unnecessary?!

BTW, I'm not interested in transmitting the results, it's such a waste if you do.

[SkyRender]

I guess I still don't understand how science works. Do I only need to bring a single goo container/science module? I can then EVA a Kerbal, remove the results, store them in a command pod, and the lab can then clean out the goo container/science module so they can be re-used? The way I always did it, if I thought I was going to visit four biomes, I'd take four of each type of science-generating part. Is that unnecessary?!

BTW, I'm not interested in transmitting the results, it's such a waste if you do.

For any mission requiring less than 6 samples' worth of data for materials study and/or goo, there's not really any point in bringing a lab along. For 6 or more, however, the lab is a much better call. Make an ultra-light lander, bring a lab and spare fuel, and you can get all the science off Minmus or the Mun with a relatively small investment. My classic mission for the Mun in that regard uses a lab, a Rockomax 32 fuel tank, and a lander so sprightly that it has only an FL-T200 for fuel. It visits all 15 biomes, gets all the science, and the lab cleans up the experiments once it returns to the mothership in its polar orbit. The net profit from this is almost enough to unlock every tech tree node on its own; by the time you have all the science necessary to run the mission, it's more than enough to complete what remains of the tech tree.

[Rakaydos]

The way I always did it, if I thought I was going to visit four biomes, I'd take four of each type of science-generating part. Is that unnecessary?!

4, it's still worth bringing separate instriments. It only becomes worth bringing a lab if you're hitting 6 or more biomes.