Kerbal Government and Hierachy

[IcarusBen]

Just a speculation thread on the Kerbal government and how it works, how the military and space program operates, things like that. What is it called, who leads it, is Jeb a Kolonel or a Kommander, etc. etc.

Post your theories here.

NOTE: We are only talking about the nation that uses the main KSC. That's it. I'd estimate it takes up most of the east coast of the Africa-shaped landmass, but cuts out before it starts going further east.

[Red Iron Crown]

I like to think that Kerbin isn't balkanized into different nations, that they're united into one entity. And that they have no military.

I call Jeb the Senior Kerbonaut and Chief Test Pilot.

[IcarusBen]

My belief is that Kerbin's geography is similar to Earth, with a ton of different nations. A one-world government, in any instance, is impractical. Unless Kerbals don't live on multiple parts of the globe, then they have more than one nation.

I think the nation is something along the lines of the Federal Republic of Kerbica or something; a democratic republic with a head of state, a senate, a court system, etc. Jebediah is either a Lt. Colonel or a Commander, depending on whether he's in the air force or in the navy. If AF, the Bill is a Major and Bob is a 2nd Lieutenant, if navy, then Bill is a Lt. Commander and Bob is an Ensign.

[Red Iron Crown]

Why is a single world government impractical?

[pjj56]

A one-world government, in any instance, is impractical.

However, the total area of Kerbin is only roughly half that of the U.S. or China, and that's including oceans - a one world country on Kerbin, assuming it's approximately 70% water, would only be about the size of Mongolia.

[regex]

I can see Kerbin being a balkanized planet (and work under that assumption for my RSS config) but I don't see Kerbals being particularly violent towards each other like humans are, even though they do seem very competitive, excitable, and curious. Their governments are probably varied in form under those constraints and cause general misery in their constituents much like their human counterparts (the fact that they operate under some form of capitalism implies inequality).

[Red Iron Crown]

The limit for nation size is communication speed. Kerbals have radio, so there's not really a limit to how big a single country could be on Kerbin. Or the entire Kerbol system, for that matter.

[IcarusBen]

However, the total area of Kerbin is only roughly half that of the U.S. or China, and that's including oceans - a one world country on Kerbin, assuming it's approximately 70% water, would only be about the size of Mongolia.

The game is only scaled down for gameplay purposes. We can actually assume that Kerbin is roughly Earth-sized. In that case, a one-world government would simply encompass too many people to not have to deal with constant rebellion, revolts and protests. In a nation the size of America, we have to deal with a very reasonable amount of opinions. There are two major, non-mutually exclusive sides and any other side simply isn't big enough to pose a threat. With a one-world government the size of Earth, we have 18 bajillion different opinions and so many nations would be angry at the government, it would cause a ton of rebellions.

I'm sure that there's a better way to explain it.

Also, Kerbin is probably more like 50% water.

[regex]

In a nation the size of America, we have to deal with a very reasonable amount of opinions. There are two major, non-mutually exclusive sides and any other side simply isn't big enough to pose a threat. With a one-world government the size of Earth, we have 18 bajillion different opinions and so many nations would be angry at the government, it would cause a ton of rebellions.

Kerbals aren't American. Hell, they aren't even human. We have no real frame of reference for them so your statement above is pure conjecture.

[IcarusBen]

Kerbals aren't American. Hell, they aren't even human. We have no real frame of reference for them so your statement above is pure conjecture.

Um...

Just a speculation thread on the Kerbal government and how it works

That's what this thread is about. My statement is just conjecture, but so is your statement, Red's statement, and pjj56's statement. That's why I made this thread.

But that's neither here, nor there. What do you think of the military? Even a nation without wars between nations would still probably have to deal with pirates, terrorists, etc. Plus, most astronauts are either doctors or military men. Even Neil Armstrong used to be an ensign.

[regex]

But that's neither here, nor there. What do you think of the military? Even a nation without wars between nations would still probably have to deal with pirates, terrorists, etc. Plus, most astronauts are either doctors or military men. Even Neil Armstrong used to be an ensign.

I don't think Kerbals have to deal with any of those things because I don't think they're particularly violent towards each other.

[klappertjes]

I always view the Kerbal race as having no real concept of war or intetional violence. They haven't even invented weapons (based on that those will never make it into the game).

I've never given much thought to the geopolitical situation, but now I do I don't see how there can be proper different nations beyond administrative entities (towns, provinces ...) for practicality sake. If there were other nations they would have built their own launchpad. The one thing we know for sure is Kerbals really REALLY love space. It'd be top of the budget priority list. And assuming a multi-national space program, we see no signs of national identity anywhere. Look at the ISS. There's flags left and right. We humans just can't help ourselves. If Kerbals are, dare I say it?, better than us and don't care what hill they were born on, then what's a kountry other than a practical local government?

Edited June 6, 2014 by klappertjes

[Tw1]

In my interpretation, kerbals probably have little to no military. The space program was founded b--- Spoilers....

The main governing body of the planet is something which is a mix of the United Nations and a federal government, which manages issues like the environment, trade, as well as supporting and regulating things like the space program. Individual nations have governments of their own, which have less influence, but are still notable.

[razark]

I don't dig into the wider political situation on Kerbin, but my Kerbals are are assigned as follows:

The first three are military pilots, of rank (1d4+2), branch of service is (1d4: 1=Air Force, 2=Navy, 3=Marines, 4=Air Force).

The second group (5 Kerbals) are pilots ranked (1d4+1), branch is (1d4: 1=Air Force, 2=Navy, 3=Marines, 4=Army).

The third and subsequent groups are rank/grade (1d4).

Third group (8 Kerbals) are branch (1d6: 1=Air Force, 2=Navy, 3=Marines, 4=Army, 5/6=Scientist).

Fourth and subsequent groups (8 Kerbals) are branch (1d10: 1=Air Force, 2=Navy, 3=Marines, 4=Army, 5-10=Scientist).

Once I get beyond a single-crew capsule, the Mission Commander must be a pilot with at least one previous flight, or a non-pilot (Engineer or Scientist) with at least three previous missions. Promotions are handed out for certain numbers of flights (more credit for long duration missions, no credit if the crewmember is simply a passenger, such as a station crewmember lifting to the station), and if they get promoted to O7, they get pulled from flight rotation and get a desk job (or become a professor for Scientists).

Edited June 6, 2014 by razark

[IcarusBen]

Hmmm... I like that idea.

Normally, I just assign Kerbals ranks depending on what they do/what their name is. For instance, my comms officer is always a Lt., my EVA squad typically consists of a Major/Lt. Commander and a scientist, and my flight commander is always either Jeb or someone with multiple flights under their belt. And of course, anyone named Tom is a Major and anyone named Jack or Kurt is a Captain. I also place special attention to Gus. He's only popped up once but he's always been a lucky coin.

[SkyRender]

Kerbals answer to their Commander-in-Chief, a piece of rotting seaweed. Below the C-i-C is the Ministry of Snacks, which are also all seaweed. The military is lead by the Grand General, who is a particularly tasty variety of seaweed. Yes, the Kerbal government is seaweed all the way down. Kinda explains a lot, doesn't it?

[Khorso]

Gather round, friends and weary travellers, and I will tell you a tale.

-----

Long ago, the Kerbal nation was mighty, impetuous, and unrestrained in their quest for enlightenment. Their ravenous expansion drew their burgeoning society into the expanses of space, where they drew the attention of the mighty Kraken. This is an old tale, and has been disseminated many times and in many variations- though that itself does not demean the merit of it alone. No, as societies will go, the Kraken--thought mythical--came with a fury and ravaged the population of Kerbin.

A mighty interstellar empire fought back with all they had, but one by one, the Kerbal Kolonies were erased. Moho, the Mun, Duna... All that remained were mysterious monoliths whose purpose has since been forgotten. History, it seems, has fallen to the sands of time. The war raged on, the Kraken ravaged, and the Kerbals fell prey to the relentless hunger of a beast awakened by their own prideful ignorance.

Upon reaching Kerbin, the bastion of Kerbal-kind, the Kraken met the final resistance. City after city fell to his fury, until hope had faded. Soon, all that remained was the hidden valley space center of the eastern continent, the island air-field, and the Kerbal Space Center we know and cherish today. Libraries fell, theaters vanished, government buildings were vaporized, and every military base that ever existed was snuffed out like a tasty morsel- all that remained from the wanton rampage were these three bastions of society. Gathering for their final attack, the valley space center kerbals raced to KSC- and as the Kraken approached the island and began exuding his destruction upon the hapless victims there, inexorably looming toward KSC, an asparagus rocket of Whackjobian proportions was launched at the beast, it's name emblazoned valiantly on the side of the core rocket. The Kraken was summoned to the immensity of the challenge, and thus the final battle of Kerbal-kind ensued over the crumbling island airbase.

Stage after stage was volleyed, as Delta-V bled away in a rushing torrent upon the Kraken. SSTO's pushed and shoved, SRBs were lobbed relentlessly, and the unbelievable happened. The Kraken roared a resounding roar, sated beyond measure by the gluttonous desire for Delta-V consumption. His very strength became his greatest weakness. Bloated, the armor that held back the onslaught slowly expanded and let in the searing furnaces of oxidized liquid fuel and the chilling sprays of hyper-cooled monopropellant. Wounded, the beast turned tentacle and fled- with the Kerbals in pursuit, captained by the fearless Jebediah Kerman and his two best friends, Bob and Bill. Though young at the time, they knew they were the last hope. Every other more qualified Kerbal than them had been spent; Werner von Kerman had injured his leg that day, and was sleeping it off in the lab, snoring uproariously.

Pouring Dv out relentlessly, the trio pushed the Kraken to the system limits at Jool, where they lost sight of him in the depths of the gas giant. They waited many orbits, scanning and seeking, hoping and praying that their nemesis was gone. No sight. No sound. In disbelief, they took stock of their life support, ran the calculations, and at the last moment they broke their vigil and headed toward a Tylo gravity assisted maneuver back to their ravaged planet Kerbin in what remained of their Kraken-buster ship.

The jewel of Kerbin expanded large in their eyes as they returned- the green of life returning over the scars of decimation. Much had been lost. Countless tomes of knowledge was gone forever. All that remained were the faithful remnant at KSC.

"We can rebuild, you know," muttered Bob. Bill nodded- mute by the traumas he had witnessed. What choice did they have? Jeb pondered this as they wrecked their ship outside of KSC. And from the pile of rubbage, Jeb began searching the Junkyard for parts to build a new Kerbal world. The lone road back to KSC had a few surprises littered for him as well. Space was their consolation; space was their prize. All they had left was space, so explore they would, and explore they do.

They don't speak of that day often- but they wear the orange spacesuits as heroes. That alone is their testament to the past. Today is the first day of the future. Today they do all they know how to do. Today, they return to space.

-----

And that my friends, is the end of my story. That, my friends, is why there is no weapons of war, no mighty nations, and no governance upon the planet of Kerbin today. Learn from history, while we still can- before it too is swallowed by the sands of time.

-Khorso

Edited June 6, 2014 by Khorso
typos, style, and grammar

[Jesrad]

The way I see it, Kerbal "government" is very similar to how the Pirates of the Interstrata collectively "function" as a society.

Jeb, Bob and Bill at the commands - the Interstrata Pirates version.

For the unfamiliar - and the young - this means that they run a loose mock democracy where the more prestigious individuals (= the guys who managed to accumulate the more cool stuff through any combination of salvaging, pilfering, fixing, clever trading and blind luck) control the media by seduction, which allows them to lie, intimidate and reluctantly recruit the rest of the people behind them to do more cool stuff (and hopefully salvage more cool sciencey stuff in the process). This scheme usually backfires spectacularly at any given step of the part salvaging, media-manipulation or collective projects. There is a small number of different factions each following the leader that they think has the better potential for giving a good show, and behind the scenes those leaders will try to snatch the more interesting rocket parts from each other in order to pursue bolder and bolder missions and (try to) boost their own prestige.

There is no military branch in the proper sense, everyone is a potential milita member and any faction can turn to organized gun-backed violence whenever they see fit - but they don't do gratuitous bloodshed as it is very bad for prestige.

Edited June 6, 2014 by Jesrad
Typos

[bsalis]

I like to think they do not have a government.

With Kerbin being like one planet wide Kerbal version of Hobbiton.

[KerbMav]

For me they have no nations, too. They have provinces, town, villages, settlements with mayors or elders, but they are all Kerbals under two moons.

They are not numbered in the billions and not spread really far over Kerbin, some small settlements everywhere of Kerbals driven by their inherent curiosity and urge to explore, turning towards the corners of the land and sea, as the illustrious Kerman folk at KSC turned towards space.

[Othuyeg]

I would love to think that Kerbin is just a massive mystery even to the kerbals themselves. They just do whatever they feel like and they have a massive urge to explore. They don't really have any official hierarchy or officials.

[KSK]

This is a bit of a work in progress, so details may change but here goes.

My version of kerbal society revolves around two historical castes, the kermol and the kerman. 'Caste' isn't quite right word since there aren't any social barriers that would block a kerbal from moving between the two groups and in fact many of them will swap several times during their lives. Broadly speaking, kermol are rural dwelling farmer/priests and kerman are the more technologically inclined urbanites. There's no particular friction between the two groups - kermol are quite happy to use whatever technological conveniences the kerman can come up with and likewise, kerman have long since concluded that Agriculture is Hard and are similarly happy for others to grow their food for them. First Flight, my fanfic story goes into this in much more detail if anyone is curious.

Kerbin has a world government. At the top is the Council of Twelve Pillars which consists of six Presidents and six Chief Ambassadors, one of each from each of the six principal regionalities of Kerbin. Presidents are elected representatives of the kerman, whilst Chief Ambassadors are appointed representatives of the kermol. Each regionality has its Ruling Council (kerman) or Conclave (kermol), which deal with regionality governance and also appoint/elect a Chief Ambassador or President.

In turn, each regionality is divided into a number of sub-territories and each sub-territory elects a representative to the Ruling Council. (Havn't decided on a name for the council members yet) and appoints an Ambassador to the Conclave. Elections would be familiar to anyone from Earth but Appointment is fairly complex - any kermol is free to stand as Ambassador but does need the unanimous acclamation of the Conclave. Age, experience, judgement, good works, community involvement all tend to be positive factors - in general kermol are a pragmatic lot and tend to be more concerned with appointing a competent Ambassador than faffing around with politicking.

The larger sub-territories have added another similar sub-layers of governance to ensure adequate representation at the town or village level.

Finally, any kerbal whatsoever can demand his or her Right of Conclave, or personal audience with the Council of Twelve. This is not taken lightly, that kerbal will get his/her audience with an absolute minimum of delay... but there is a general unwritten understanding that he/she better have a very good reason for requesting it. If nothing else, requesting the Right to deal with a matter that could be adequately addressed by Ruling Council or other lower tier of governance will be severely frowned upon. Kerbals that cry gronnek don't tend to win any friends or influence.

[klappertjes]

I find it interesting that many people here tend to think of kerbals as having democracies as complex as the real world ones. But many also agree that kerbals are non-violent and somewhat averse to class differences. Maybe we're really hard-wired to think that true democracy is the only acceptable way, even if it's really neither here nor there in this case.

Now I realise it sounds like I'm of some anti-democratic political persuasion. I'm not. My instinct is the same. I'm wary to think that my perfect society of green men isn't democratic. But then I project humanity's imperfections on them. For our naturally peaceful and selfless kerbals something like a "benign dictatorship" might work. The administration would still have everyone's best interest at heart. No need for checks and balances since they're not like that. Dictatorships are great at making decisions efficiently, that at least can be said for them

[KerbMav]

.

Maybe because the idea of such a society appeals very much to us.

[J4CKAL2014]

Since Kerbals seem a lot less violent and...how can I put this in a nice way...simpler than humans, I imagine they all live under a unified system

Maybe we're really hard-wired to think that true democracy is the only acceptable way [...]Dictatorships are great at making decisions efficiently, that at least can be said for them

A good example of this - and I'm not necessarily picking a "dictatorship", here, this example isn't intended as that, but I'm just picking a nation which isn't democracy-based - is what China did during the 2008 economic crisis. Because the majority of the biggest industries, banks, corporations, etc. in China are state-owned (unlike in a democracy, where they are privately-owned), China was able to get spending before the big crash and turn its money into infrastructure and investment before all that money was devalued. Sure, they now have debt to deal with, but its fair to say their economy is doing a lot better than most others (they're set to overtake the US economy by 2020, some estimates as early as 2018).

I'm not anti-democratic, but I'm just putting this out there to back up the idea that democracy isn't the ONLY workable political system, which is a viewpoint that some*people naively adopt. There are some advantages of other systems too. Alternative models could well work if bred in the right environment, so to speak. But that's just my opinion. I don't want to turn this into a political argument, I just think this was a point worth supporting because I expect some people may well attack it, and I wanted to give them something to seriously think about before they tried that which might make them reconsider.