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[0.25] Realism Overhaul w/ RedAV8R [Terminated]

RedAV8R

By RedAV8R
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RedAV8R

RedAV8R

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No I don't.

Yes, I realise I could just grab one of them and fly happy (and might yet). But I'm just a little curious about why I'm struggling to find Real Engines, since that was what I used in 0.23.5 and got along well with.

RealEngines is no longer a separate download, it's been integrated into RealismOverhaul itself.

I asked about an EnginePack because if you do, then the RealEngine configs won't load. This is done with the ":NEEDS[!RftS,!RealFuels_StockEngines]" tag. If you have a folder with either of these (RftS or RealFuels_StockEngines), or some other MM config with a :FOR of either of these then RealEngines will not load.

Provide a log and we can try to help you out.

Edited by RedAV8R
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RedAV8R

RedAV8R

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Real Engines, to my knowledge, is included in Realism Overhaul.

As an aside: is EVE and one of the packs for it usable with the new RO?

Yes RealEngines is now included with Realism Overhaul...

RealismOverhaul has nothing to do with EVE or any of it's packs. RealismOverhaul is simply a set of MM configs which transform parts into realistic or facsimilies of real parts that exist. RO doesn't touch anything to do with a planet, asteroid, or the environment as a whole. What you are looking for is RealSolarSystem, which RealismOverhaul is designed primarily to go along with it, otherwise a 9500m/s deltaV rocket which would barely be enough to achieve orbit in real life would be making thing WAY too easy with a stock Kerbin.

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woahprettyricky

woahprettyricky

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Ah yeah, I'm sorry, I know EVE doesn't actually have anything to do with RO.

My question could have been phrased better:

If I'm running all the recommended mods here (except AJE) under 24.2 Windows x64, is there any known problems with running EVE Overhaul with the full "Realism Overhaul suite" as it were, since the 24.2 update. If this still isn't the place for it, I can either post in the RSS thread, or a mod can move it or whatever.

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RedAV8R

RedAV8R

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Ah yeah, I'm sorry, I know EVE doesn't actually have anything to do with RO.

My question could have been phrased better:

If I'm running all the recommended mods here (except AJE) under 24.2 Windows x64, is there any known problems with running EVE Overhaul with the full "Realism Overhaul suite" as it were, since the 24.2 update. If this still isn't the place for it, I can either post in the RSS thread, or a mod can move it or whatever.

Short answer is, I personally don't know, I don't use it, and nobody has come here saying that using it does bad things.

That said, I'm pretty sure RSS and EVE have certain requirements in order to play nice together (if they do at all) and I know Nathan and Rbray are working together to make them more compatible, but I'm not sure if things are where they need to be.

My philosophy, and how I help develop RealismOverhaul. I have a certain 'priority' of mods. First is function, then its parts, then it's eye candy. EVE is an 'eye candy' mod, and is therefore the very last of my worries. In my view EVE has to be compatible with my function mods and parts before I consider it, and it's up to EVE (or any eye candy) to be compatible with those. I also don't feel it's the function or parts mods responsibility to do that. If eye candy isn't compatible, it's not installed, if memory becomes an issue, it's the first to go. If there can be some reciprocal back scratching between the two, that's fine, as long as I don't lose function or parts because of it. Ex. I'm not giving up function x or part y in order to gain eye candy z. Just my 2c. Obviously some other people want things, what I'd call 'pretty', and if it's not 'pretty' then they won't play. To each his own. Just a warning to those who are like that, don't expect 'pretty' out of RO. It may act like a duck and sound like a duck, but it very well could be a very damn ugly duck.

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Jetwave

Jetwave

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Does installing the actual RO download give anything extra that the required mods do not? I ask because my KSP is running out of memory and I only want to add stuff that is essential.

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RedAV8R

RedAV8R

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Does installing the actual RO download give anything extra that the required mods do not? I ask because my KSP is running out of memory and I only want to add stuff that is essential.

It adds a few parts, but these are generally copies of existing parts, there are some small textures added for some procedural fairings, and a very small 1kB model used multiple times, otherwise that's it.

I haven't actually tested memory difference between a modded w/o RO and modded w/ RO to see what kind of impact it has. That is likely to fluctuate as well, depending on what other part packs you have.

So really, it depends on what you deem essential. If you want realism, then RO is essential, and with that it's pretty silly to have RO and not RSS, otherwise rocket capabilities are way 'overpowered'. Be warned, RSS will eat memory. (Personally I'm running all 2048 textures except Earth at this time.) Now, if you have RSS it's pretty silly not to have RO as well as other part packs are going to be EXTREMELY limited in capability and you won't get into orbit with anything. So RSS and RO while not 'required' together, they are mutually beneficial to the point of being 'effectively required'.

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Jetwave

Jetwave

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*Snip* So RSS and RO while not 'required' together, they are mutually beneficial to the point of being 'effectively required'.

OK, thanks. I was using KW rocketry parts trying to get into orbit around rss earth, pretty sure it was easier to get off of eve than the new earth. I'll install RO and see if it gets any easier.

I was going to suggest I could make a more realistic tech tree, but then I saw medieval nerd's tree and that thing is wayyyy better than anything I could come up with.

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RedAV8R

RedAV8R

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Yeah, with pretty much any part pack out there is effectively designed around the stock Kerbin world. There could be a some that are specifically built for RSS and the real world, but I'm not really aware of one. There are a select few that include a RSS config for use with real world sizes, which is exactly what RO does to part packs that we support. Make sure you also have all of the dependencies installed as well, otherwise the realistic nature of RO disappears or is handicapped.

The issue with RPL by medieval nerd is that is requires RftS...which ruins RealEngines (of which I'm a huge fan of), so I actually don't use RPL...At this point RO is designed around being functional on a Sandbox level, (which it has to be before any sort of career mode is work on, what good is career mode if the darn thing won't fly anyway right). At some point there will be RPL that does work with RO in it's entirety and enables true career mode support. That's just not on the priority list right now.

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Jetwave

Jetwave

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I'm having a bit of a problem with blizzy's toolbar atm. It only shows the buttons for chatterer, kethane, scansat and alarm clock. It doesn't seem to show FAR or any of the other mods that should be displaying in it on the flight screen. They don't appear in the add a button list either. I'm thinking it might be an install order bug, if I were to remove the toolbar, start KSP with all the mods, then restart KSP with the toolbar installed, do you think that would help?

EDIT: I'm an idiot. Didn't see the FAR button in the new ksp default toolbar

Edited by Jetwave
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RedAV8R

RedAV8R

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I'm confused as to what this means; should I install it because it's under required mods, or should I wait for it to be updated?

Yeah, I should change this...Don't install it yet if you want your game to function. RO will function without it.

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AlmightyR

AlmightyR

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SUGGESTION+QUESTION:

Is there a way to define Fuel or Life-Support preset configs for the fuel tanks or pods, capsules, etc, using the configs?

Basically like the...

MODULE[ModuleEngineConfigs]
{
	CONFIG
	{
		(...)
	}
}

...nodes but for fuel, or in this case, LS resources.

Something like...

MODULE[Module[U][I]Fuel[/I][/U]Configs]
{
	CONFIG
	{
		(LF resources for 12 hours)
	}
	CONFIG
	{
		(LF resources for 1 day)
	}
	CONFIG
	{
		(LF resources for 7 days)
	}
	(...)
}

I know TANK_DEFINITION exists, but it doesn't seem to be the right way to do it...

EDIT: I know this kinda belongs to the RealFuels thread, but the change would be made on RO's configs, since RealFuels doesn't imply in the need for LifeSupport, which is the main reason for the question/suggestion; So I thought it appropriate to ask/suggest here first...

Edited by AlmightyR
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RedAV8R

RedAV8R

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Essentially, you can 'configure' your Life Support however you want with the RealFuel's GUI. Sure it takes a little bit of time, but it's not that bad. TANK_DEFs could work if there was a way to change tank type like in Procedural Parts. Now realistically speaking, for the most part, I'm installing by default the largest amount found in a pod that size. A mercury sized craft isn't going to get 30 days of supplies or even 7, usually pods are ServiceModule type to allow for propellant of some sort, but a person could increase life support a little bit, or of course they can make life support even smaller and add more propellant, or however they want.

Thinking out loud here...what could work...is creating +/- buttons with a readout of how many days/hours of life support to be installed, of course that amount goes against a given volume for a part, but it would be an easier way of increasing/decreasing resources with more of the 'work' being done behind the scenes.

Edited by RedAV8R
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AlmightyR

AlmightyR

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Ok. So in the meantime, before a plugin solution in implemented, it would be useful to know how to calculate the amount of each resource needed for an LS of X days...

Can you help me figure out the meaning of the consumption rates in RO's included ThunderAerospace\TacLifeSupport\PluginData\TacLifeSupport\LifeSupport.cfg? So that I can create a calculator in Java later tonight?

I need the meaning of the rates relevant to LS, so that I can calc the needed amount/volume to allocate in any given pod to result in X days of LS (without considering time of survival without the resource)...I think they are:

//Delta times influence the consumption rates? or are they here just for settings/control? If they do, I need info on them too...

MaxDeltaTime = 86400

ElectricityMaxDeltaTime = 1

//Basic LS resources...

FoodConsumptionRate = 3.472222E-05

WaterConsumptionRate = 1.967592E-05

OxygenConsumptionRate = 0.006365

//...And electricity...

ElectricityConsumptionRate = 0.05

BaseElectricityConsumptionRate = 0.2

EvaElectricityConsumptionRate = 0.333333

//Relevant to allocate storage space for waste...

CO2ProductionRate = 0.005856

WasteProductionRate = 2.360301E-05

WasteWaterProductionRate = 2.314815E-05

I've gone in-game and, using TacLS's plugin's display, set oxygen for exactly 7 days in the mk1pod...Got a value of 962.39...But when I multiply the consumption rate for 7 days in hours or seconds, it doesn't equal that value...That's what I need help figuring out...

Edited by AlmightyR
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AlmightyR

AlmightyR

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I thought tacls just consumed one unit of each resource per kerbin day?

I don't know about TacLS separate from RO, but with RO that doesn't seem to be the case...

...Well, that or TacLS's plugin's visual helper ain't mean to be used with RO, and displays (very) wrong values in the VAB...

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NathanKell

NathanKell

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TACLS in prerelease form now uses 1L = 1 unit. Even if it didn't, RO makes that change.

Regarding RF and presets: You *can* switch tank types. Procedural Parts RF tank implements that.

Regarding AJE: I have built a compiled-for-.24 version of AJE. You can get it here: https://github.com/NathanKell/AJE

Just download the repo and stick the AJE folder in GameData.

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Jetwave

Jetwave

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Speaking of TAC, does the fuel balancer work with realfuels? Also after getting ro all the fuel tanks are smaller than normal. Any way to fix it without downloading anything?

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AlmightyR

AlmightyR

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TACLS in prerelease form now uses 1L = 1 unit. Even if it didn't, RO makes that change.

I've updated both TacLS (pre-release) and RO, just to make sure (they were already the same version, but I deleted the old folders and re-installed, in case any silent updates were made)...And here's the result:

fOhbSnP.png

One thing I've noticed is that even with "MaxDeltaTime = 86400", the TacLS plugin still changes makes days be 6h...So that's something to be reported there...

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Jetwave

Jetwave

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If you're trying to find out how much water food and o2 you would need for a trip, AFAIK you could just do irldays x 4 = units needed, then just have solar panels or rtgs for electricity.

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RedAV8R

RedAV8R

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@AlmightyR: Ok, that LS file shows you what consumption/production rates are per second....also shows your RO is out of date...need to grab the new one before you go making something...So for a days worth, multiply by that MaxDeltaTime which is the number of seconds in a day. What is the setting in your KSP set for 24 or 6 hours/day?

Edited by RedAV8R
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