Bases,Rovers,Satelites and Stations have purpose now

[95tiger59]

You, yeah you forum goer. what if I said that the next time you get contracts to get science from a body multiple times there was an easy way to do it? thats right folks these now useful constructs can make your career mode easier and give you a long term payout. \

*inhales* so guys what do you think? will you start using these things more now that they have a purpose?

[SDEngineer]

You, yeah you forum goer. what if I said that the next time you get contracts to get science from a body multiple times there was an easy way to do it? thats right folks these now useful constructs can make your career mode easier and give you a long term payout. \

*inhales* so guys what do you think? will you start using these things more now that they have a purpose?

Already always used them. True, bases/rovers/satellites didn't really have a lot of purpose in vanilla .23 and before (stations were quite useful as staging/refueling points), but I used them anyway for pure RP value. They were just fun to build and set up.

[Dangerous_Beans]

eh, it's not much of a purpose (though i do have permanent probes on Duna, and around Minimus and the Mun). you don't need to do those contracts, and going to the probe and hitting transmit is pretty boring.

i would still rather see science that takes time to do, eg the mapping in ScanSat, or temperature recordings for a year.

still it's a start, and i'll have to find some Kerbals i don't like to strand on other planets (maybe all the stupid ones, they'll go for it. reminds me of my KSP Interstellar game, where all the smart Kerbals were in the research complex on Minimus, and all the stupid ones were flying the prototype space planes).

edit:

They were just fun to build and set up.

that too, building a honking big station is quite fun.

[admiral9347]

oh i have an idea for uses for probes, we can use probes to discover small areas on a planets' surface to be able to pick a good landing site.

[G'th]

Yeah, its not much, but its definitely a good way to introduce more purpose to such things. Rovers in particular will be very useful once biomes get added to the other planets, as far off and hard to reach places (like Moho or Eeloo) can have a rover landed on its surface to collect biome science.

What I really hope for is contracts to construct a procedural space station/base. Either by providing new subassemblies that you have to launch into the target location, or by requiring that certain modules you can design yourself meet certain requirements. Perhaps even both.

Throw in the current Transmit contract with some other neato things to do and you'll have something really cool.

[Mufasa]

What I really hope for is contracts to construct a procedural space station/base. Either by providing new subassemblies that you have to launch into the target location' date=' or by requiring that certain modules you can design yourself meet certain requirements. Perhaps even both.

[/quote']

The more I think about this idea, the more brilliant it seems. It also opens up a huge door for user created/submitted missions. Build a sub-assembly lander/rover. Turn it into a mission to send it somewhere. Upload it. Snacks.

I have so many ideas I can't control them now.

[rodion_herrera]

Thing is, the Kerbals do not require consumables yet. If only for career purposes and contract fulfillment like flag planting, you can just plop a Kerbal on a planet's or moon's surface and he doesn't need any life support and/or food, and can survive practically forever just standing there. So the reason for a structure/base is moot. If they really want this kind of thing to develop in career mode, then they have to make Kerbals require consumables.

Edited July 25, 2014 by rodion_herrera

[Red Iron Crown]

I don't really see any purpose added to rovers, bases or stations. Probes have definitely gotten more useful for parking around a body to return science (this could be done with a manned ship, but they're heavier and thus costlier to get there).

They're still fun to play with, but the game doesn't reward them any more than they did before contracts.

[magnemoe]

Thing is, the Kerbals do not require consumables yet. If only for career purposes and contract fulfillment like flag planting, you can just plop a Kerbal on a planet's or moon's surface and he doesn't need any life support and/or food, and can survive practically forever just standing there. So the reason for a structure/base is moot. If they really want this kind of thing to develop in career mode, then they have to make Kerbals require consumables.

Even with TAC its not an huge issue to supply an small mun base with consumables, it take an day to send more and a rover with a claw can do transfer.

TAC is more an problem on the multi year missions.

[magnemoe]

oh i have an idea for uses for probes, we can use probes to discover small areas on a planets' surface to be able to pick a good landing site.

Has done that since I started, especially ketane miners and similar heavy landers. Before we got flags it was also the only way to mark a spot.

Small probe rovers are nice to explore with, on smaller bodies you can even give them a docking port and enough fuel to return to orbit and be reused.

You can roleplay that an satellite in orbit gives income by doing more useful stuff than temperature readings, an gravity sensor is more expensive but gives science for various biomes.

An base for flag planting is much of the same, make it a real base with at least an hitchhiker container, perhaps a rover to cruse around in.

[Soda Popinski]

If you really want to have a need for satellites, I recommend the Remote Tech 2 mod. This requires a satellite communication system to transmit science and to control probes. Even time delay due to the speed of light is modeled.

[rodion_herrera]

TAC is more an problem on the multi year missions.

Well Jool Moon missions are indeed multi-year missions.

[Sky_walker]

*inhales* so guys what do you think? will you start using these things more now that they have a purpose?

And they do have a purpose?

I read through your post - and still don't get it. There is no contract that would require any of these.

[95tiger59]

And they do have a purpose?

I read through your post - and still don't get it. There is no contract that would require any of these.

I'm sorry if i wasn't clear. The contracts that wan't you to explore a certain body only need science to be done to be completed; from orbit and from the surface and can be transmitted and even have a value of 0. What all of these allow you to do is when you gain these contracts again you can leave these permanent installations there so you don't have to launch another rocket. just transmit science from orbit and surface and your done

[Red Iron Crown]

I'm sorry if i wasn't clear. The contracts that wan't you to explore a certain body only need science to be done to be completed; from orbit and from the surface and can be transmitted and even have a value of 0. What all of these allow you to do is when you gain these contracts again you can leave these permanent installations there so you don't have to launch another rocket. just transmit science from orbit and surface and your done

You don't need a permanent installation like a base or station for that. A regular lander on the surface and regular ship in orbit work just as well.

[G'th]

You don't need a permanent installation like a base or station for that. A regular lander on the surface and regular ship in orbit work just as well.

Thats terribly unimaginative.

[Red Iron Crown]

Thats terribly unimaginative.

It's accurate. 0.24 has not added any new reasons to use stations, bases or rovers than existed before.

The reasons for them before were enough for some people, including me. But to claim that 0.24 makes them more useful is just plain inaccurate.

[goldenpsp]

And they do have a purpose?

I read through your post - and still don't get it. There is no contract that would require any of these.

Sheesh

Purpose =/= required

To use a simple example. Before .24 there was simply no purpose to putting say a simple probe with an antenna and temp sensor into kerbin orbit and leaving it there. At least now that probe can quickly and a no extra cost satisfy the recurring "transmit science from Kerbin's orbit" contract.

[G'th]

It's accurate. 0.24 has not added any new reasons to use stations, bases or rovers than existed before.

The reasons for them before were enough for some people, including me. But to claim that 0.24 makes them more useful is just plain inaccurate.

Except it isn't.

Before .24 all three of them didn't do anything past the initial science they provided. Rovers were the only ones that had an extended lifetime if you used them to traverse biomes. After .24, all three have a point past that initial point beyond just the pure vanity of constructing such things. A station in orbit or a base on the surface don't become pointless structures once you transmit that one-time science, as now science is reoccurring via contracts. Rovers are the same way, except they're mobile so if you're on Mun or Minmus (or even Kerbin) you can go to a different biome to fulfill the contract while at the same time getting more science out of it.

In essence, bases, stations, and rovers are now a source of income. Sure, you can just stick a <10 part probe wherever, but you may as well not even bother with the game at that point. KSP, after all, has always been about absurd contraptions, and going purely utilitarian really isn't in the spirit of the game.

[Red Iron Crown]

Except it isn't.

Before .24 all three of them didn't do anything past the initial science they provided. Rovers were the only ones that had an extended lifetime if you used them to traverse biomes. After .24' date=' all three have a point past that initial point beyond just the pure vanity of constructing such things. A station in orbit or a base on the surface don't become pointless structures once you transmit that one-time science, as now science is reoccurring via contracts. Rovers are the same way, except they're mobile so if you're on Mun or Minmus (or even Kerbin) you can go to a different biome to fulfill the contract while at the same time getting more science out of it.

In essence, bases, stations, and rovers are now a source of income. Sure, you can just stick a <10 part probe wherever, but you may as well not even bother with the game at that point. KSP, after all, has always been about absurd contraptions, and going purely utilitarian really isn't in the spirit of the game.[/quote']

I stand by my statement that there's no new reason to build stations, bases and rovers in 0.24. If everything you can do with them can be done by something smaller, lighter, and cheaper then there's no rational reason to go bigger or mobile.

The aesthetic and roleplay reasons are valid (and I use them for those reasons), but they existed before 0.24. We would need some new mechanics to make them worthwhile from a purely rational standpoint.

[goldenpsp]

I stand by my statement that there's no new reason to build stations, bases and rovers in 0.24. If everything you can do with them can be done by something smaller, lighter, and cheaper then there's no rational reason to go bigger or mobile.

The aesthetic and roleplay reasons are valid (and I use them for those reasons), but they existed before 0.24. We would need some new mechanics to make them worthwhile from a purely rational standpoint.

who said anything about going bigger?

There are several easy examples of things, such as a small science probe, that prior to .24 had no purpose to leave in orbit, but now does have a purpose in leaving it in orbit around "insert celestial here".

[Red Iron Crown]

who said anything about going bigger?

There are several easy examples of things, such as a small science probe, that prior to .24 had no purpose to leave in orbit, but now does have a purpose in leaving it in orbit around "insert celestial here".

You might notice that I never mentioned that probes were not more useful. Parking probes in orbit around bodies to easily complete science transmission contracts for minimal investment has made probes much more viable in 0.24.

[Rainbowtrout]

Bases serve the purpose of having a settlement on a body to launch rovers from, which are good for finding anomalies, and long range science. Satellites are useful for... Not much really. But, the general point is true. They are useful now.

[Talavar]

oh i have an idea for uses for probes, we can use probes to discover small areas on a planets' surface to be able to pick a good landing site.

I've been doing this since I started.. lol

[G'th]

I stand by my statement that there's no new reason to build stations, bases and rovers in 0.24. If everything you can do with them can be done by something smaller, lighter, and cheaper then there's no rational reason to go bigger or mobile.

The aesthetic and roleplay reasons are valid (and I use them for those reasons), but they existed before 0.24. We would need some new mechanics to make them worthwhile from a purely rational standpoint.

A purely rational standpoint isn't very fun. Its not like you can "win" at KSP so metagaming (IE, going utilitarian to the point of being completely beyond the threshold of boring) is really pointless. From a purely rational standpoint, these things were a complete waste of time before contracts and still are now. A purely rational standpoint is the difference between spam in a can and an astronaut. Which would you rather be?

Whats more fun? A simple <10 part probe you play with for all of 5 minutes or an interesting space station you can spend hours building and playing with?

Yes, a simple probe can accomplish the same goals, but that doesn't discount the fact that something like a space station now has more of a point. Is there a reason to specifically build them? No, but I haven't been arguing against that, I've been arguing against the idea that stations still don't have a point, when in fact, they do. (Just because a small 3 part rocket can make a Mun landing doesn't mean a full Apollo-Saturn V replica isn't also acceptable, after all)