[0.90.0] Fine Print vSTOCK'D - BETA RELEASE!!! (December 15)

[cartmen180]

What is not showing completed (not turning green)?

I forgot about the LAN, have no idea to get that right though. Is there a tutorial on that matter?

[cartmen180]

The thing is that i don't have a clue what LAN value correspondents with my satellite, kinda takes the fun out if for me :/

[juanml82]

Shouldn't this orbit be completing the contract?

[Tobyz28]

Trying to complete an orbital mission, and am stuck on the "Neutralize controls for 10 seconds" It's in near perfect alignment with the orbit (all the other boxes are checked). Any ideas? i've tried with/without SAS/Time accel etc.

[vardicd]

It's at least as important as the others, I'm afraid.

Imagine two orbits. Both about circular, but about geosynchronous, both inclined at 45 degrees. One has it's northernmost point over North America, and its southernmost point over China-ish. The other has it's Northernmost point over Russia, and its southermost somewhere in Brazil. And yet.... both have the same AP, the same PE, and the same inclination. The only difference is that the America/China one has an LAN of about 180deg and the Brazil/Russia one has a LAN of about 0deg.

So for even slightly inclined orbits, LAN differences put you on wildly different paths.

Okay, so I see your point for synchronous orbits, but with any other orbit, since its not rotating at the same speed as the planet, it will drift anyway, won't it? I really do understand its important, especially in real life, but for those of us who can barely understand this stuff, having to figure out that LAN stuff, kind of sucks the fun out of it.

[vardicd]

Trying to complete an orbital mission, and am stuck on the "Neutralize controls for 10 seconds" It's in near perfect alignment with the orbit (all the other boxes are checked). Any ideas? i've tried with/without SAS/Time accel etc.

sometimes I have to turn sas off, turn mechjeb off, and disengage flight computer, if using remote tech, leave to the space center, come back to the flight, turn sas on, rotate sat, turn sas off, and wait 10 secs before it will clear. annoying, but its there. <this is my experience, yours may differ.}

[forsaken1111]

Okay, so I see your point for synchronous orbits, but with any other orbit, since its not rotating at the same speed as the planet, it will drift anyway, won't it? I really do understand its important, especially in real life, but for those of us who can barely understand this stuff, having to figure out that LAN stuff, kind of sucks the fun out of it.

At the risk of sounding harsh, orbital mechanics are a huge part of this game. If you are not willing to learn how they work, just don't accept those contracts.

[vardicd]

At the risk of sounding harsh, orbital mechanics are a huge part of this game. If you are not willing to learn how they work, just don't accept those contracts.

Don't get me wrong I love the science and challenge, and I'm going to fiddle and fuss with it till I get this mastered, KSP has been a struggle and a mind expanding game and I love it. It took me almost a month of play, at almost 5 hours a day, to build a rocket that could make orbit around Kerbin. {This was before I discovered Scott Manley on you-tube. I learned about 60% of what I know of this game from his vids.} I've just never had some one explain how to set/ adjust the LAN of an orbit before. I grumble, but its part of my learning process.

[forsaken1111]

Don't get me wrong I love the science and challenge, and I'm going to fiddle and fuss with it till I get this mastered, KSP has been a struggle and a mind expanding game and I love it. It took me almost a month of play, at almost 5 hours a day, to build a rocket that could make orbit around Kerbin. {This was before I discovered Scott Manley on you-tube. I learned about 60% of what I know of this game from his vids.} I've just never had some one explain how to set/ adjust the LAN of an orbit before. I grumble, but its part of my learning process.

No worried. I'm glad you're willing to learn at least.

The easiest way to closely match the LAN is to do your inclination change at the ascending/descending node where your orbit intersects the target orbit.

[vardicd]

No worried. I'm glad you're willing to learn at least.

The easiest way to closely match the LAN is to do your inclination change at the ascending/descending node where your orbit intersects the target orbit.

{inclination change at the ascending/descending node where your orbit intersects the target orbit}<this I understand. I do match inc burns all the time. Is LAN just a measurement of the inclination, or a specific point in the orbit? How does matching Inclination, control the point of LAN? the two must be independent, or matching one, would match the other. I don't understand how you do this>{inclination change at the ascending/descending node where your orbit intersects the target orbit} to change LAN. Either its way more complicated than I've figured out, or [i'm making it way more complicated than I need too.]<guilty of very often.

[undercoveryankee]

{inclination change at the ascending/descending node where your orbit intersects the target orbit}<this I understand. I do match inc burns all the time. Is LAN just a measurement of the inclination, or a specific point in the orbit? How does matching Inclination, control the point of LAN? the two must be independent, or matching one, would match the other. I don't understand how you do this>{inclination change at the ascending/descending node where your orbit intersects the target orbit} to change LAN. Either its way more complicated than I've figured out, or [i'm making it way more complicated than I need too.]<guilty of very often.

Inclination tells you how far from the equator the target plane is tilted. LAN tells you which direction it's tilted. So when you've fully matched the target plane, both numbers will necessarily be equal.

Any plane change you make is likely to change both numbers at the same time, so it's easier to just burn when you pass the node markers for the target plane than to worry about the numbers separately.

Practice matching planes with moons or existing satellites. (Minmus is guaranteed to be handy.) If you target an existing object, the game shows the node markers on your orbit so it's easier to see when you're passing them. Once you can do that, hitting a Fine Print target orbit's plane is just a matter of sighting along the two node markers and putting a maneuver node where your orbit crosses that line.

[Seeker89]

I don't know if this has been asked yet, but is there a way to turn off missions?

I don't really care much about the Aerial Survey or the Rover Search, and some times they fill up the missions given for me. So is there a way to disable them?

Thanks

Seeker

[m_j_lyons]

This will be rough because I only have my phone right now.

I'm going to assume you can build and launch the required satellite.

1 - get into a stable orbit...with zero inclination

2 - match desired PE/AP

3 - get your inclination burn maneuver plotted

4 - move the inclination burn maneuver node to match the AN of the desired end orbit

5 - execute

6 - once eestablished and you see the "orbit" satisfied for the contract turn off SAS for the needed time (10 seconds) or until it greens up.

7 - profit!

You can establish the LAN via mechjeb by converting the desired LAN (given in degrees CCW from 0 degrees longitude) into a longitude East or West. The globe is 360 degrees - so if the LAN is 45 then you need to have the AN burn at 45 degrees East. If the LAN is 350 degrees the AN burn will be at 10 degrees West. If the desired LAN is >180 degrees them take the 360 - LAN to get the AN longitude west. If LAN <180 degrees then LAN = AN longitude East. Decimals get multiplied by 60 for minutes and or seconds.

Confusing enough? I hope this helps some of you.

[Threadsinger]

I'm not sure I get it, but I will certainly give it a try tonight...

[Renegrade]

I don't know if this has been asked yet, but is there a way to turn off missions?

I don't really care much about the Aerial Survey or the Rover Search, and some times they fill up the missions given for me. So is there a way to disable them?

You can always decline contracts you don't like, except for some of the one-shot ones (like "Launch a Craft" or "Explore the Mun") that come with stock.

There's no penalty for dismissing contracts you haven't accepted.

[Eleven]

I don't know if this has been asked yet, but is there a way to turn off missions?

I don't really care much about the Aerial Survey or the Rover Search, and some times they fill up the missions given for me. So is there a way to disable them?

Thanks

Seeker

You can always decline contracts you don't like, except for some of the one-shot ones (like "Launch a Craft" or "Explore the Mun") that come with stock.

There's no penalty for dismissing contracts you haven't accepted.

I asked this as well, and I gotta feeling this isn't the answer Seeker was looking for, nor me. If you decline a contract, another JUST LIKE IT appears...almost always. I want to eliminate Aerial Surveys entirely, I don't use airplanes in the game, so they do me no good.

[Seeker89]

You can always decline contracts you don't like, except for some of the one-shot ones (like "Launch a Craft" or "Explore the Mun") that come with stock.

There's no penalty for dismissing contracts you haven't accepted.

I asked this as well, and I gotta feeling this isn't the answer Seeker was looking for, nor me. If you decline a contract, another JUST LIKE IT appears...almost always. I want to eliminate Aerial Surveys entirely, I don't use airplanes in the game, so they do me no good.

This is not the answer I'm looking for... I have dismissed many and they just keep coming...

It's not that I don't use them. I just really suck.

[The Pink Ranger]

Does this work with real solar system?

[Renegrade]

I asked this as well, and I gotta feeling this isn't the answer Seeker was looking for, nor me. If you decline a contract, another JUST LIKE IT appears...almost always.

ALMOST always. Sometimes it gives you a different kind. I'm not saying that it couldn't use some refinement (although I'm worried that these may be issues that stock code is causing, which can't be overridden), but it's still a workaround.

Arsonide would have to address anything beyond that;

This is not the answer I'm looking for... I have dismissed many and they just keep coming...

You might have to complete some already-accepted contracts for different ones to appear (I notice it gets very inflexible if I have a full load of contracts)

[Arsonide]

If you already have two on the board, and you complete or decline another mission that is not an aerial survey, there is 100% chance that whatever pops up next will not be an aerial survey. If you decline the aerial surveys, dropping the number below two, then my code no longer limits the amount that is on the board. At this point, the (stock) ContractSystem chooses from the available Contract Types totally at random. I used to believe that it tried to keep an even ratio, but it is literally Random.Range from 0 to the number of contract types. This means that your next contract could be an Aerial Survey or not, at random. If it does choose an Aerial Survey, returning the number to two, then no more can pop up.

They are not filling your board, because there cannot be more than two. Granted, there can be two aerial surveys and two rover contracts, for a total of four missions you are not interested in, but this happens at random. In testing I've seen boards full of Test Part contracts. I've seen strings of Rescue missions, and yes, I've seen strings of my missions (in groups of two, because I limit mine, unlike stock code).

It is RNG.

I am currently researching the best way to implement configuration into the plugin to allow people to customize my limits, and at that point, if you want, you could lower the limit from 2 to 0 to auto-snuff any that try to pop up at generation. Also, before 0.56 there was a bug involving rover contracts that may have allowed them to creep over the limit, a typo really, but it was fixed.

Edited August 21, 2014 by Arsonide

[Eleven]

I am currently researching the best way to implement configuration into the plugin to allow people to customize my limits, and at that point, if you want, you could lower the limit from 2 to 0 to auto-snuff any that try to pop up at generation. Also, before 0.56 there was a bug involving rover contracts that may have allowed them to creep over the limit, a typo really, but it was fixed.

In the meantime, can I just delete AerialContract.cs? Will that just simply prevent those types from being generated in the first place?

[NonWonderDog]

{inclination change at the ascending/descending node where your orbit intersects the target orbit}<this I understand. I do match inc burns all the time. Is LAN just a measurement of the inclination, or a specific point in the orbit? How does matching Inclination, control the point of LAN? the two must be independent, or matching one, would match the other. I don't understand how you do this>{inclination change at the ascending/descending node where your orbit intersects the target orbit} to change LAN. Either its way more complicated than I've figured out, or [i'm making it way more complicated than I need too.]<guilty of very often.

To get your LAN correct first try for Kerbin orbits, launch when the target orbit passes over KSC. LAN describes the location of the ascending node compared to the fixed starfield, and since KSC is on the equator you should launch when the ascending or descending node is directly over KSC.

To change the position of the ascending node when already in orbit (to precess the orbit), one way is to thrust normal to the orbit at the point 90 degrees past the ascending or descending node. This is most obvious (and correct) in a circular polar orbit -- thrusting out of plane at the poles won't make your orbit any less polar, but it will change the point at which you cross the equator. Be aware that this is NOT an efficient or even really correct maneuver otherwise, and it will change both your inclination and argument of periapsis.

Better for a circular orbit is to thrust at one of the two points at which your current and desired orbits cross. Better for an elliptical orbit is to scrub the mission and try again (seriously, don't look at the math for this one if you value your sanity). Your best bet for large changes is a bi-elliptic transfer, but figuring out where to start it can be fun.

LAN for orbits around Earth is almost always called RAAN (Right Ascension of the Ascending Node) for astronomical reasons (and to understand why you need other fun terms like "obliquity of the ecliptic"). You'll probably have more luck with "RAAN" in a Google search.

Edited August 21, 2014 by NonWonderDog

[Arsonide]

In the meantime, can I just delete AerialContract.cs? Will that just simply prevent those types from being generated in the first place?

You should be able to delete AerialContract and FlightWaypointParameter, but you'll have to recompile, and make your source code available under the GPL.

[Silpion]

A suggestion to fix the over-sensitivity to LAN in equatorial orbits: Rather than testing if the craft's LAN is within x% of the target orbit, test whether it is within something like 90*(cos(2*target_inc)+1)+180*x%.

What this does: When the target is an equatorial orbit, retorgrade or prograde, then the expression is just over 180 degrees, meaning you can be at any LAN. When the target is a polar orbit, the expression is 180*x%, which I assume is your current test. The expression smoothly transitions between the two like a cosine curve (graphed for 7% as an example).

These make sense because in an equatorial orbit the LAN is irrelevant, and in a polar orbit it is critical.

I'm not certain whether this is the optimal expression, but I do think it's a pretty good one and much better than doing the basic direct comparison.

Edit, more info on that expression: If the margin of error (x) is 3%, then my test would allow any LAN if the target inclination is < 10 deg or > 170 deg, and if 7% then < 15.5 deg, > 164.7 deg

Edit2: Actually maybe we want the restriction to kick in a bit quicker than that cosine allows. You can use higher powers of the cos + 1 term and rescale to make it sharper.

Edited August 21, 2014 by Silpion

[Eleven]

You should be able to delete AerialContract and FlightWaypointParameter, but you'll have to recompile, and make your source code available under the GPL.

lol I know NOTHING about any of that. I'll just wait on you to do what you do.