Umbra Space Industries - (Roadmap and WIPs)

[NWDogg]

Hello

I have an issue with some AES stuff on 0.25. The AES structural beam does not appear as it does in 0.24.2 in the structural part. I cannot see it in the science field in the research building and it won't appear in sandbox mode.

I don't see the AES mini SAS in the control part. And the AES structural outrigger has got a wrong shape, just hexagonal one, you cannot see the small cube...

I downloaded all the update stuff from the github UmbraSpaceIndustries, no files or folders are missing. All my 18 adds on are checked for 0.25

I got the same adds on updated for 0.24.2 and everything is OK, but some parts are missing in 0.25 with updated adds on.

Any idea what is happening?

See the config fix I posted in the Exploration Pack release thread. http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/86695-0-25-USI-Exploration-Pack-Small-parts-big-adventure%21-v-0-2-4-2014-10-13?p=1476417&viewfull=1#post14764178

It's caused by new part locations in .25. You'll just need to open the cfg files for each of those parts, and replace the part folder names (under the MODEL reference) with the ones I've specified. It will look like this: 'model = Squad/Parts/Structural/strutCube/model'. Replace the bolded section with the new ones I've specified in that thread, and all your parts will work again.

[RoverDude]

Hey Roverdude, regarding the very very useful logistics module, would it be possible to get a version of it for crew transfers?

Currently I can use the logistics modules for a very extensive mining system linking my surface mines with orbiting factories

http://cloud-2.steampowered.com/ugc/547511114589191962/FECB868DB9D6985EC1109C1CD2B09BBC3EC0E90C/

http://cloud-4.steampowered.com/ugc/547511114590254656/7E5C9A60B2B7654EFBF1353BE67EC7E5E797F3BB/

I am building a very large OKS station and have to ship across all my kerbals manually

This sucker is going to have like a hundred residents and it is only one section of the planned colony.

http://cloud-4.steampowered.com/ugc/547511114590612169/83A4EC500985FB02E7EFBDD5EF6B45FA5E3D5780/

It would be great if you made the Logistics module be able to texture swap between a cargo port and a passenger port. The cargo port looks the same as it does now, all utilitarian and industrial; the new texture mode however swaps it too being a passenger port with a few nice viewports, an IVA like an airport terminal waiting lounge, and the little transport modules turned into passenger shuttles

Perhaps little shuttles like this:

http://up-ship.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2010/01/image164.jpg

When in the passenger port texture the logistics module can only transfer Kerbals. Have the transfer cost fuel and some life support supplies

What do you think?

Interesting idea - log something to GitHub. May also do a hi-cap passenger version of a kontainer

See the config fix I posted in the Exploration Pack release thread. http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/86695-0-25-USI-Exploration-Pack-Small-parts-big-adventure%21-v-0-2-4-2014-10-13?p=1476417&viewfull=1#post14764178

It's caused by new part locations in .25. You'll just need to open the cfg files for each of those parts, and replace the part folder names (under the MODEL reference) with the ones I've specified. It will look like this: 'model = Squad/Parts/Structural/strutCube/model'. Replace the bolded section with the new ones I've specified in that thread, and all your parts will work again.

Yep, fixing in an upcoming release, probably around 11/1

[Kolago]

Why are the FTT parts with "LiquidHydrogen"? In RealFuels we have "LqdHydrogen" already. This is annoying because we can't use some engines and tanks that are supposed to take Liquid Hydrogen together.

[RoverDude]

Why are the FTT parts with "LiquidHydrogen"? In RealFuels we have "LqdHydrogen" already. This is annoying because we can't use some engines and tanks that are supposed to take Liquid Hydrogen together.

Same reason we use Water instead of KSPI's LqdWater. We use the Community Resource Pack (one of my other projects) which includes resources used across multiple mods. One of those that joined on the playground was Near Future Technologies, which uses LiquidHydrogen, EnrichedUranium, etc. - so the USI apps are compatible with the NFT ones (also TAC-LS, Universal Storage, NearFuels, DangIt!, Extraplanetary Launchpads, etc.)

The rub with resources in KSP is that due to the total lack of standardization, we had to plunk a stake in the ground as a starting point, and Nertea was pretty awesome (and flexible) to work with. Now, if RealFuels wanted to join in, it would require at this point them to see about aligning with some of the analogues we already have in CRP, and that would include some compromises on things like resource names, densities, etc. and I pretty much always welcome that dialogue.

Granted, you can also do what UndercoverYankee did with KSPI when Fractal decided to not continue down the interop path Wave was going down with KSPI-L - just build a MM compatibility pack that syncs everything up (either by changing USI stuff to RF, which I recall someone was already working on), or RF to CRP (especially if you use other USI mods or are considering NFT). Then spin up a release thread

Edited October 21, 2014 by RoverDude

[Night Lone]

Why are the FTT parts with "LiquidHydrogen"? In RealFuels we have "LqdHydrogen" already. This is annoying because we can't use some engines and tanks that are supposed to take Liquid Hydrogen together.

Because RoverDude's mods use CRP, which defines as Liquid Hydrogen as LiquidHydrogen; RealFuels apparently doesn't use CRP. You can read more about CRP here. If you want to use both of them as the same thing, I think an MM Config would help, that or just edit them yourself.

EDIT:

Thanks RoverDude, answer before I can!!

Edited October 21, 2014 by Night Lone
Got Ninja'ed by the Man himself!

[dwolfson]

Hey I just downloaded most of your mods today, and when I went to launch ksp the it said the version of firespitter connected to the mod was outdated. I was wondering when you were going to work on this. Thanks

[Kolago]

Yea, I stumbled over different density and unitCost in the configs. We know that Liquid Hydrogen's density is 70.85 kg/m3 in the real world. So your density of 0.0004 is for game balance in stock KSP. But for users of RSS, RF and RO it makes no sense. At the end we have to MM config the parts for that purpose.

GameData\RealFuels\Resources\ResourcesFuel.cfg

RESOURCE_DEFINITION
{
  name = LqdHydrogen
  density = 0.00007085
  unitCost = 0.00018421
  flowMode = STACK_PRIORITY_SEARCH
  transfer = PUMP
  isTweakable = True
}

GameData\CommunityResourcePack\CommonResources.cfg

RESOURCE_DEFINITION
{
	name = LiquidHydrogen // General propellant, used for high thrust electric engines
	density = 0.0004
	unitCost = 0.5
	flowMode = STACK_PRIORITY_SEARCH
	transfer = PUMP
	isTweakable = true
}

[RoverDude]

Hey I just downloaded most of your mods today, and when I went to launch ksp the it said the version of firespitter connected to the mod was outdated. I was wondering when you were going to work on this. Thanks

Nothing I can fix as I don't run that mod But the current version works fine, and there's an even newer FireSpitter out there which also works, but I am waiting till FireSpitter has an official 0.25 release before re-bundling it.

Yea, I stumbled over different density and unitCost in the configs. We know that Liquid Hydrogen's density is 70.85 kg/m3 in the real world. So your density of 0.0004 is for game balance in stock KSP. But for users of RSS, RF and RO it makes no sense. At the end we have to MM config the parts for that purpose.

GameData\RealFuels\Resources\ResourcesFuel.cfg

RESOURCE_DEFINITION
{
  name = LqdHydrogen
  density = 0.00007085
  unitCost = 0.00018421
  flowMode = STACK_PRIORITY_SEARCH
  transfer = PUMP
  isTweakable = True
}

GameData\CommunityResourcePack\CommonResources.cfg

RESOURCE_DEFINITION
{
	name = LiquidHydrogen // General propellant, used for high thrust electric engines
	density = 0.0004
	unitCost = 0.5
	flowMode = STACK_PRIORITY_SEARCH
	transfer = PUMP
	isTweakable = true
}

Actually... given that LiquidHydrogen is 5 units per liter and LqdHydrogen is 1 unit per liter, the densities are pretty darn close. In any case, CRP took it's values from Nertea's NFT mod, so will not be changing as they will break that mod, and that's just not very neighborly. Feel free to create your own MM configs to adjust whatever you see fit, but the values in CRP simply aren't changing unless the folks who curate those resources see a need, and if everyone else is cool with adjusting all of their mods to reflect this (that is, folks that participate in CRP). Since Real Fuels does not (nor do I anticipate them doing so), it's kinda a moot point. They are on their own playground from the folks who use CRP, and everything USI uses CRP.

[gilflo]

NwDogg

Thank's for your help

[TicTacToe!]

Hey RoverDude, any news on the Advanced Mining Technologies front? Would love to see what you've been cooking up.

[RoverDude]

Hey RoverDude, any news on the Advanced Mining Technologies front? Would love to see what you've been cooking up.

AMT requires two mods to be done... the first was FTT (which you saw a bit ago) because I needed a 5m platform for some of the truly massive mining equipment.

The second is a complete overhaul of asteroid resources (phase 1) and planetary resources (phase 2). The former is *almost* done.

After that, it's off to mining

It's probably going to wind up as one of my largest mods (in terms of code and gameplay, not parts). After that, it's an EPL extension and science!

[Night Lone]

Roverdude, you probably already did this but, if you haven't, I just converted every TGA in every mod (but the Asteroids one, don't use it) to PNG; if you want them, then tell me and I'll send them your way

[RoverDude]

Roverdude, you probably already did this but, if you haven't, I just converted every TGA in every mod (but the Asteroids one, don't use it) to PNG; if you want them, then tell me and I'll send them your way

Beat ya to it for my 11/1 release

[Night Lone]

Beat ya to it for my 11/1 release

Well, i wish you'd give it to the public xD that was long and tedious making all those TGA's into PNG's! but w/e, at least all your mods work without textures disappearing Great mods btw, can't wait for some more goodies!

[RoverDude]

Well, i wish you'd give it to the public xD that was long and tedious making all those TGA's into PNG's! but w/e, at least all your mods work without textures disappearing Great mods btw, can't wait for some more goodies!

Already available on dropbox I warn the folks in the MKS thread first as they tend to have all of the constellation (and I do my experimental releases as all in ones )

[Night Lone]

Already available on dropbox ...

...

Already ... on ... Dropbox... So I did all that work for nothing?! T.T Are you telling me I could've been lazy instead?!

[RoverDude]

...

Already ... on ... Dropbox... So I did all that work for nothing?! T.T Are you telling me I could've been lazy instead?!

In this case, sure - But at least you got an earlier preview

[Night Lone]

In this case, sure - But at least you got an earlier preview

No I didn't! cause I didn't download anything!! (yet)

So, just to be clear, Dropbox = All the newest and greatest and latest stuffs?

also, if I may ask, any news on the new toys we're getting at 11/1? All I know is you're working on mining stuff and...actually thats all I know...

[RoverDude]

No I didn't! cause I didn't download anything!! (yet)

So, just to be clear, Dropbox = All the newest and greatest and latest stuffs?

also, if I may ask, any news on the new toys we're getting at 11/1? All I know is you're working on mining stuff and...actually thats all I know...

11/1 is mostly a maintenance release. TGA->PNG, new DLLs, some MKS fixes, various bug fixes, etc. so not a whole bunch of new content - working on other bits behind the scenes

[Night Lone]

11/1 is mostly a maintenance release. TGA->PNG, new DLLs, some MKS fixes, various bug fixes, etc. so not a whole bunch of new content - working on other bits behind the scenes

ahh...and what are these "other bits" ?? or are they still a secret

EDIT:

Just looked at the Advanced Mining thread, ignore my above question

Edited October 27, 2014 by Night Lone

[J.Random]

I'm not sure if that's not too much to ask, but could you repackage all the mods, making the distribution really modular? I mean, MKS/OKS, Ka, Ka+, EP, SP... All of them are bundled with USI tools. Most of them are bundled with ORS/CRP. Some of them include Firespitter and even Toolbar. And everything overwrites everything on install. Sure, it makes installation of this one single pack easier because you have everything you need "out of the box", but when you use most of USI packs, plus other mods, it's hard to keep track of which one contains the latest versions of redistributed content. Maybe move each pack into separate USI/Pack_Subdirectory and put redistributables into a separate download?

[Paul Kingtiger]

Hey Rover,

Have you thought about tackling Electrical units as part of the community resource pack?

There's no real direction from Squad as to what they represent. Some people use 1Kw which is fine except it makes stock solar panels massively over powered. I use 33watts, which balances the panels but is an odd number.

1kw or 100w see like good options, but either would need agreement from modders and a module manager file to balance the stock parts.

Do you think this is something the community can agree on? It would really help mod compatibility.

[Crater]

Hey Rover,

Have you thought about tackling Electrical units as part of the community resource pack?

There's no real direction from Squad as to what they represent. Some people use 1Kw which is fine except it makes stock solar panels massively over powered. I use 33watts, which balances the panels but is an odd number.

1kw or 100w see like good options, but either would need agreement from modders and a module manager file to balance the stock parts.

Do you think this is something the community can agree on? It would really help mod compatibility.

Not wanting to derail the thread, but the issue with electricity in-game is that it depends on what you balance it against. For example, if you take the 33W unit definition, then a Z-100 battery pack has 3,300Ws of power, or 0.92 Watt hours, and weight 5kg. A modern rechargable AA battery can easily hold 1500mAh at 1.2V nominal, which equals 1.8 Watt hours. so a 5kg space battery (that's 11 lbs in old money) holds a fraction over half of the power of a 20g AA cell.

Even when you allow for charging cirtuitry, power management, hardening for space etc. then the batteries in game are actually pretty reasonably balanced for 1U=1kWs when compared to modern DC systems (at least based on commercial UPS units I use in the server rooms here).

So setting 1EC/s=33W may well balance solar panels, but it royally throws off all the other electrical systems in game.

[RoverDude]

Yep, I think ElectricCharge nomenclature is the Viet Nam of KSP.

What I have seen as the most consistent, both in use and on things like the RTG, batteries, etc. is the

1 EC/S = 1000 Watts

1 EC = 1000 Joules

[Felbourn]

Yep, I think ElectricCharge nomenclature is the Viet Nam of KSP.

What I have seen as the most consistent, both in use and on things like the RTG, batteries, etc. is the

1 EC/S = 1000 Watts

1 EC = 1000 Joules

My 2 pennies...

Imagine how much time someone would need to spend before they might say "I've spent an embarrassing amount of time on this idea so I do not want to really tell you how much it has been." Now double it.

I rebalanced my entire game to use a factor of Wh for electric charge. I wanted to use Ah but it was too hard to find voltage info about enough things to make it easy to convert stuff. I waved my hands a little and said "in my world, all voltages are the same!" Yeah! Suddenly, with roughly 28 V on everything, I could just normalize real world into my world and use Wh instead of Ah. However, the values were too small, so I multiplied by 10 just to get a prettier interface.

Anyway, specifically, I take real world watts and divide by 360 to get drain. So a modern solar panel that generates 250 watts per square meter for me generates 250/360=0.6944 e per second per square meter. Batteries are 1 million e per cubic meter. I dug into literally hundreds of solar panels and batteries and electrical appliance information (ground-based, Apollo, ISS-based, etc) to come to this conclusion.

So if you're looking at a real world car battery and it says 1000 watts, you add a 0 (10000 e) and stick into the game. Attach a 200 watt computer to that battery (200/360 = 0.5555 e/s drain) and it'll drain in 18000 seconds (5 hours). That's what it should be for a 1000 Wh battery draining 200 watts (1000/200=5). BAM! Problem solved.

I realize this is not the commonly adopted method of energy/power, but I wish it were.