0.25 Discussion thread

[dryer_lint]

I can't wait for the new spaceplane parts. With that and the feature-that-shall-not-be-named, I'm going to build so many bombers

[Wolfos31]

I can't wait for this update. I'm terrible at building spaceplanes that are SSTO and whenever I succeed they usually look like crap because it's a giant sheet with some engines attached. Hoping the new, sleeker parts will allow me to build some attractive ones. And yes... there will be bombers aplenty. Muahahaha.

[musicpenguin]

Been gone a while, Whats been confirmed and whats been rumored?

[NecroBones]

So, this appears to be as good a thread as any to post the following in. As with everything that we disclose, folks, please do remember that things do change.

In 0.25, the Win64 build is actually more unstable than in 0.24.x.

Whereas in 0.24.x we'd see it being pretty reliable with stock but crashing with add-ons/plugins, in 0.25 it crashes for nearly everyone and almost at the exact same point. We've spent a significant amount of time in Experimentals, both on a tester and developer side, looking into it, chasing leads, narrowing down reproduction cases and generally digging deeper and deeper into probable causes. However, despite the efforts of a handful of the testers who have tirelessly (and I mean tirelessly) worked on it since the beginning of Experimentals, we have yet to hammer this one out, find the cause and fix it. The dastardly issue that causes it to crash still eludes us.

Believe me, this frustrates no-one more than myself, the testers who've worked so hard on the issue and, without a doubt, the developers. However, sometimes we have to bite the bullet, call it a day and concentrate on the issues that effect all platforms. Until such a point where this issue is at least narrowed down to a specific cause, if not fixed, 0.25 Win64 will continue to be extremely unstable for many. We'll hopefully have something sorted out for the release that is beneficial to all.

My apologies that the win64 build has such issues, but rest assured we work tirelessly to hammer 'em out!

Hope you can all still enjoy the rest of the delicious update when the time comes.

Thanks for the update! Personally, I still run the 32-bit version, so I'm not too worried.

[Red Iron Crown]

Been gone a while, Whats been confirmed and whats been rumored?

Confirmed:

Spaceplane Plus parts and some revamped stock spaceplane parts

Administrative Building where strategies are used

Navball improvements

Destructible KSC buildings

Part reordering in the VAB/SPH

Quicker loading

New visual and sound effects

Difficulty options for Career mode

Kerbal experience, logs of accomplishments

Lighter cupola module

Rumored:

Nessie, from questionable image analysis.

Sounds like a great update when it's listed out like that. Likelihood of Nessie existing is realistically simulated.

[dryer_lint]

Sounds like a great update when it's listed out like that.

Yeah, most of the improvements are small (Spaceplane parts? Cool. Destructible KSC? Sure, why not. Admin Building? Neat) but they really add up.

[musicpenguin]

Confirmed:

Spaceplane Plus parts and some revamped stock spaceplane parts

Administrative Building where strategies are used

Navball improvements

Destructible KSC buildings

Part reordering in the VAB/SPH

Quicker loading

New visual and sound effects

Difficulty options for Career mode

Kerbal experience, logs of accomplishments

Lighter cupola module

Rumored:

Nessie, from questionable image analysis.

Sounds like a great update when it's listed out like that. Likelihood of Nessie existing is realistically simulated.

Thanks! Plz have nessie..

[Rocket Farmer]

What's a "Nessie?"

[r4pt0r]

What's a "Nessie?"

lol hes making a reference to . We super over analyzed an image posted by rowsdower, just like they analyzed the nessie picture back in the day.

Confirmed:

Spaceplane Plus parts and some revamped stock spaceplane parts

Administrative Building where strategies are used

Navball improvements

Destructible KSC buildings

Part reordering in the VAB/SPH

Quicker loading

New visual and sound effects

Difficulty options for Career mode

Kerbal experience, logs of accomplishments

Lighter cupola module

Rumored:

Nessie, from questionable image analysis.

Sounds like a great update when it's listed out like that. Likelihood of Nessie existing is realistically simulated.

Crew transfer was also confirmed i thought.

[Red Iron Crown]

Crew transfer was also confirmed i thought.

You're right, I forgot it.

[Dodgey]

Just to back track a little bit, with regards to what you said Red Iron Crown about not blaming the users for complaining about the over hype of the reveal. I think the biggest problem is that Squad didn't empthisize enough that the building destruction was due to a major feature that will be released in 0.26. From what I have read it seems that many users think that it is a feature in its self and not the result of a greater mechanic. Because from what I can gather we wouldn't have destructible buildings if we didn't have the major feature in 0.26.

[tater]

I think the real complaints were more about hype than features. We also need to recall that good players would never see it… that statement alone should have defused hype about it. The rest looks pretty awesome. I have yet to crash into anything without things being destructible. I've never checked for stages falling, however… People might need to start a slight turn early to be on the safe side, even in stock.

[KevinW42]

I think the real complaints were more about hype than features. We also need to recall that good players would never see it… that statement alone should have defused hype about it. The rest looks pretty awesome. I have yet to crash into anything without things being destructible. I've never checked for stages falling, however… People might need to start a slight turn early to be on the safe side, even in stock.

I almost always look down during launches (looking at the horizon causes lag on my comp), and even dropping parts as low as 1500m you still don't hit the launch pad, because unless your TWR is atrocious and you're basically just hovering, you will reach 2500m and put the pad out of physics range before the spent stages hit the ground.

[Twreed87]

It's really the fault of anyone overhyping it that they're all so disappointed. Everything said about it should've clued people in that it was just gonna be some small, fun little feature. But no, they had to go have all their various hypemobiles and hypehovercrafts and whatnot.

Also, this update seems to be coming along in a timely manner, so to anyone complaining that Squad "wasted" time on this, if this feature was never added, and the update came out at the same time, you'd have never even noticed. Some people just want to complain.

[LABHOUSE]

Well I knew it would involve making a huge mistake and/or your rocket malfunctioning. I have crashed into vab trying to make a huge rocket before.

[pxi]

As far as destructable buildings goes, I'm a fan.

However, I would like to echo the sentiments expressed by others regarding the hype. I'm not a huge fan of engaging in speculation regarding updates. It's not all Squad's fault either - when the awesome secret thing is unknown, there is only one possible correct answer, but an infinite number of possibilities. In the end there are few winners, and a lot of disappointment.

Regardless, this looks to be another good update.

[kiwiak]

Were there any new biomes for 0.25 mentioned?

[Hannu]

It's really the fault of anyone overhyping it that they're all so disappointed.

It is not just overhyping. Squad have had about one year and several updates clear tendency to concentrate just things around KSC. They have told it clearly, they have hyped it and it can be seen in versions. Both playing functions (administration and economic functions and resources) and visual things (fine buildings and their damage modeling). I and many others criticize that choice and hope that it is planet's turn as soon as possible. I see the KSC just when my rocket leaves. Even then I watch mainly MechJeb's information windows before and after liftoff. KSC is fine in the scale of KSP, but it is not (and should not even try to be) fine as example of state of the art computer graphics. There are much better models of terrestrial building environments in other games if I want to drive or walk on ground and watch places. And KSC is very uninteresting place in the scope of space exploration.

Also, this update seems to be coming along in a timely manner, so to anyone complaining that Squad "wasted" time on this, if this feature was never added, and the update came out at the same time, you'd have never even noticed. Some people just want to complain.

Different people want to different things. Squad have limited work resources and it has decided to make some things and to leave something without attention. But it could have chosen other things and then we would have something other in the game. Of course, whatever the choice is, somebody disappoint and complain. It can not be avoided if you sell huge amount of games to everyone. I am sure that Squad's professional workers understand that they can use hundreds or thousands of complaints as some kind of statistical information what people averagely wants and do not take it personally. And they can consider is there any reason to change anything or not, depending what are their objectives.

[Dodgey]

Sure, but the point stands that this feature was primarily a byproduct of another major feature of 0.26. That is the important part of all of this.

[Hannu]

We'd then have people complaining about it being an incomplete feature because the destructions aren't up to par with that the users would like.

Yes, somebody complain always.

That's on us to not "cheat" and warp to the future when it's completed.

This is a computer game. Absolutely nobody will not wait two months before next possibility to play after making some mistake in the game. Time penalty can work only if it have some clear consequences in game world.

Quite a bit of what you suggested is already here in the form of mods.

I know that and I use many of these mods. However, it is one pain in the ass after every update to wait that all mods are updated and how they conflicts with KSP and with each other. And who of modders get bored to use their time to maintaining and developing mods. Therefore I hope that as much as possible of the functionality I want to have would become a part of stock game under Squad's quality assurance. I understand that all exotic wants can not be part of the game, but I talk about very basic things in space exploration.

[Zaphod12]

I think that they should totally add payload fairings in 0.26(I know that there are mods with that)

[TouhouTorpedo]

I think they should just bite the bullet and go procedural on wings and payload fairings, ie buy the existing ones codes and work off those. lego wings are garbage that you just can't go back to even if the graphics are nice once you've gone to pwing.

[GusTurbo]

Just to back track a little bit, with regards to what you said Red Iron Crown about not blaming the users for complaining about the over hype of the reveal. I think the biggest problem is that Squad didn't empthisize enough that the building destruction was due to a major feature that will be released in 0.26. From what I have read it seems that many users think that it is a feature in its self and not the result of a greater mechanic. Because from what I can gather we wouldn't have destructible buildings if we didn't have the major feature in 0.26.

If people misunderstood, it's because they didn't read the Dev notes. It was made pretty clear.

[Renegrade]

Confirmed:

Spaceplane Plus parts and some revamped stock spaceplane parts

Administrative Building where strategies are used

Navball improvements

Destructible KSC buildings

Part reordering in the VAB/SPH

Quicker loading

New visual and sound effects

Difficulty options for Career mode

Kerbal experience, logs of accomplishments

Lighter cupola module

Rumored:

Nessie, from questionable image analysis.

You've actually got this backwards, Nessie is the ONLY confirmed feature. :Trollface:

On a more serious note, you forgot the full throttle key. After installing FloorIt Pro, I have to say that a full thrust key makes a lot more difference than one might imagine.

Maxmaps said "The update is just full of tiny changes we hope you'll like. Reduced Cupola mass from 4.5 to 1.8 tons, that kind of stuff", implying that there's other little changes too. Would it be fair to say "a number of changes to parts" is confirmed?

(Oh please let it include some levelheaded specific impulse buffs to the radial engines)

Crew transfer was also confirmed i thought.

I forgot about this one - thanks, crew transfer will definitely be nice.

Were there any new biomes for 0.25 mentioned?

I haven't seen any, but that would certainly be VERY nice. Planet improvements are on the board, but we haven't seen any in a while...

[Sandworm]

So destructible buildings exciting not for what they are but for because they enable some other future feature ... that they don't want to talk about? So the big feature today is in fact only a quasi-promise for something better tomorrow. I don't get excited about promises, especially ones hedged with unknowns.