Spaceplane Speed Challenge IV: Up and Down

[Wanderfound]

Okay, it was inevitable.

We've already got the Upgoers (http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/90354-Spaceplane-speed-challenge-shortest-elapsed-time-from-runway-to-orbit) and Cratermaker's (http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/91511-Spaceplane-Speed-Challenge-2-Fastest-time-from-orbit-to-runway) challenges. So, of course: put 'em together.

Three screenshots: runway stationary, 70x70 orbit (minimum; needn't be circular), runway stationary. Best time wins. Horizontal takeoffs and landings. Must carry crew, not just a drone core.

Fly whatever you want; separate leaderboards for stock vs mod parts or aero, etc. Let us know if you used Deadly Reentry and/or FAR aerodynamic failures.

As usual, if you'd like to treat it as a pure piloting challenge, use a Kerbodyne Benchmark: http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/90747-Kerbodyne-SSTO-Division-Omnibus-Thread?p=1357777&viewfull=1#post1357777 if you're flying FAR/NEAR. Use https://www.dropbox.com/s/lbnz9s8k9h7gwgb/Kerbodyne%20Benchmark%20StockAir.craft?dl=0 instead if flying in stock aero. Fiddle the control surface tweakables all you want, but don't change anything else.

Leaderboard

Magic Tricks

Xtoro, 0:10

Magic Thrusters

chengong, 8:55

No Magic:

FAR

Overall Time

Wanderfound, 17:24

Spaceplane

Wanderfound, 17:24

Piloting Test Control Plane (Kerbodyne Benchmark)

Wanderfound, 23:23

Jovus, 23:24

Xtoro, 23:56

FAR/DRE

Overall Time

Wanderfound, 17:24

Spaceplane

Wanderfound, 17:24

Piloting Test Control Plane (Kerbodyne Benchmark)

Wanderfound, 23:23

Jovus, 23:24

Stock Aero

Overall Time

Heagar, 14:35

sdj64, 16:17

Spaceplane

Heagar, 14:35

sdj64, 16:17

Piloting Test Control Plane (Kerbodyne Benchmark)

Edited October 4, 2014 by Wanderfound

[chengong]

Here are the three screenshots, I win.

Be assured both take off and landing are horizontal.

[Wanderfound]

Not a bad time, but I wouldn't be too sure of yourself. I reckon I could match that time in a conventional spaceplane.

What were you using as propulsion on that thing?

[Pds314]

3 minutes to orbit and 6 back down is pretty impressive. Although I bet something really fuel inefficient might be able to just plow its way up, blast itself to orbit with an overpowered engine, blast itself back down, activate drogue parachutes, and then glide in for a landing once slowed.

Edited September 21, 2014 by Pds314

[Wanderfound]

3 minutes to orbit and 6 back down is pretty impressive. Although I bet something really fuel inefficient might be able to just plow its way up, blast itself to orbit with an overpowered engine, blast itself back down, activate drogue parachutes, and then glide in for a landing once slowed.

Check the other challenges; my scores are already at about 3:30 up and 6:30 down, in conventional spaceplanes, no chutes or other trickery. Getting this under 10 minutes shouldn't be hard.

[Sirine]

@Wanderfound: That "Blue-Ring things" that use by @chengong are Alt-F12, infinite fuel equivalent. I can beat his score via his own craft. Anyhow, just let him wins (kids).

[chengong]

@Wanderfound: That "Blue-Ring things" that use by @chengong are Alt-F12, infinite fuel equivalent. I can beat his score via his own craft. Anyhow, just let him wins (kids).

Thanks for telling us, very helpful. However there are no rules against it so nobody cares.

[Wanderfound]

No rules against, but there are separate leaderboards for magic drives vs proper thrusters (as well as fastest overall). Thanks for the entry.

[Wanderfound]

Okay; just to get some times on the board, I had check on how the Benchmark would do.

One Kerbodyne Benchmark, all good to go. Good ol' all-stock 2 intake/3 engine reliable workhorse.

Wind it up.

And away.

Ready to circularise.

Done! Four minutes forty-six to orbit.

A quick flip.

And hit the brakes.

A cruisy descent.

With a warm finish.

Need to turn around and head back west to KSC. This should work nicely to scrub off speed, too.

Okay; turned around and slowed down. How far back to base?

300km!? Eeek...

Gas it back up again.

Okay, finally.

A few more S-turns to scrub the speed off again.

Lined up.

On the deck, brake brake brake.

These brakes really suck.

Stopped. But not on the strip.

Gas it up again.

Finally.

Twenty-five minutes, eight seconds. About ten minutes of that was making up for the overshoot, though. Plenty of room for improvement.

Edited September 23, 2014 by Wanderfound

[Wanderfound]

Maybe the problem was that I couldn't turn fast enough. Let's try it again in an aerobatics specialist.

One Kerbodyne Evangelist II RP. Gotta love a self-launching plane.

Let's get out of the soup.

Nice view.

Level off to gain some speed.

And zoom.

Circular (ish); 7 minutes 27 seconds.

Flip and hit the brakes.

Back down. Mach 3.8, nice cruisy reeentry speed.

Try to start the turn early.

Toasty.

Very toasty.

Extremely toasty, there goes the IVA camera.

Getting a bit low, time to pull up.

Flattened out just in time.

600km!? Turn, turn, turn. Keep the gas on.

Nearly there.

Sorted.

Gas it.

Up.

And down.

Time to cut speed again.

Lined up.

Still too fast, loop time.

And a 270 to get back on line.

Down.

And stopped. 26 minutes, 25 seconds.

Not a lot of runway to spare.

Success!

Kinda.

It's still the overshoot that's getting me. I think I'm going to have to whip up an extra-fuel Goblin for this.

[sdj64]

Check the other challenges; my scores are already at about 3:30 up and 6:30 down, in conventional spaceplanes, no chutes or other trickery. Getting this under 10 minutes shouldn't be hard.

Now, you're forgetting about the "back to the runway" part, that will probably be your most time consuming stage unless you pack a ton of dV and go straight up and down. Might want to try airbrakes or drag chutes on the small red plane?

16:17, stock aero. The chute was used to slow down after re-entry, not to land. There are two clipped turbojets, not just one. Mods used: SP+, KER, KW rocketry.

Edited September 24, 2014 by sdj64

[Alshain]

Now, you're forgetting about the "back to the runway" part, that will probably be your most time consuming stage unless you pack a ton of dV and go straight up and down. Might want to try airbrakes or drag chutes on the small red plane?

16:17, stock aero. The chute was used to slow down after re-entry, not to land. There are two clipped turbojets, not just one. Mods used: SP+, KER, KW rocketry.

http://i.imgur.com/WIys7Ih.png

http://i.imgur.com/7lZqg7D.png

http://i.imgur.com/LvDmNxa.png

Well that's one way to make sure you have pitch control.

[xtoro]

Here are the three screenshots, I win.

Be assured both take off and landing are horizontal.

http://i.imgur.com/ZJsOrUT.png

http://i.imgur.com/90uNBAP.png

http://i.imgur.com/ZmHDF51.png

http://i.imgur.com/t2lhqhO.png

Uh, I'm not competing here, but felt the need to comment... This isn't a "spaceplane".

1) It has no wings, which defines a plane.

2) It can't glide, which is also the very definition of a plane.

I understand there were no rules posted, however, the title itself states "Spaceplanes" which implies that rule.

I say this gets disqualified. If not, them I'm going to submit a rocket in the spaceplane challenge....

[Stratzenblitz75]

Uh, I'm not competing here, but felt the need to comment... This isn't a "spaceplane".

1) It has no wings, which defines a plane.

2) It can't glide, which is also the very definition of a plane.

I understand there were no rules posted, however, the title itself states "Spaceplanes" which implies that rule.

I say this gets disqualified. If not, them I'm going to submit a rocket in the spaceplane challenge....

He doesn't state in the rules that it must be a space-plane, he only says it has to take off horizontally and land horizontally. So if you can make a rocket that can do this, then go for it

[xtoro]

He doesn't state in the rules that it must be a space-plane, he only says it has to take off horizontally and land horizontally. So if you can make a rocket that can do this, then go for it

The title of the thread says "SPACEPLANE"

[Wanderfound]

Uh, I'm not competing here, but felt the need to comment... This isn't a "spaceplane".

1) It has no wings, which defines a plane.

2) It can't glide, which is also the very definition of a plane.

I understand there were no rules posted, however, the title itself states "Spaceplanes" which implies that rule.

I say this gets disqualified. If not, them I'm going to submit a rocket in the spaceplane challenge....

Finned missiles are an inevitable appearance in any spaceplane challenge. Attempting to exclude them via rules tends to just create a rule-bending contest. So, I don't bother, and use multiple leaderboards instead.

If you want to fly a lawn dart with a Star Trek engine, go for it. But you won't get on the spaceplane board that way.

And if you want to show that you can actually fly, post a time with the Benchmark.

[Wanderfound]

Now, you're forgetting about the "back to the runway" part, that will probably be your most time consuming stage unless you pack a ton of dV and go straight up and down. Might want to try airbrakes or drag chutes on the small red plane?

That, or coming up with something that has enough DV to bring its orbit to a complete stop. Get that done, and I can point my reentry glide in whatever direction I like. I was hoping that I'd be able to use a spiral descent, but there just isn't enough air grip to turn in the stratosphere.

I've got plenty of designs that can come to an orbital stop, but not in combination with a hyper-steep rapid ascent (the "straight up and down"option). I can manage straight up or straight down, but not both in one flight.

I may have to settle for "fly 500km away while ascending, stop and turn, glide 500km back". The distance isn't too big a deal if you're doing Mach 6; it's the combination of distant plus slow at the bottom of the descent that's getting me.

Edited September 24, 2014 by Wanderfound

[xtoro]

Cool, ok then, I like challenges with no rules. Here's my entry:

Ready to take off

Liftoff

70k orbit

Landed

runway to 70k orbit to runway in 10 seconds! yay I win!

[Stratzenblitz75]

Cool, ok then, I like challenges with no rules. Here's my entry:

runway to 70k orbit to runway in 10 seconds! yay I win!

You didn't take off horizontally! You just broke one of the three rules of the challenge! Your entry has been disqualified!

Add some wings and then come back

In all seriousness though, Wanderfound, I think you need some more concrete rules so that you don't have to make a bunch of categories like "magic propulsion" for every degree of rule-bending. (Seriously, other than the fact he didn't take off horizontally, xtoro's entry is completely valid according to your rules) Prohibiting OP part mods and "Cheats" like hyper-edit or infinite fuel would be a good place to start.

[xtoro]

You didn't take off horizontally! You just broke one of the three rules of the challenge! Your entry has been disqualified!

Add some wings and then come back

xtoro's entry is completely valid according to your rules

Actually, I did, hence why I angled the engines, so it would roll forward before lifting off. See on my last sceenshot distance travelled, I rolled before taking off and let it roll before hitting the brakes on landing. Horizontal takeoff and landing acheived, even though it was very very short

And thanks, according to the OP, my entry is indeed valid, thanks for the backup.

Edited September 24, 2014 by xtoro

[Wanderfound]

I'm fine with the leaderboards as they are; it'll be interesting to see who can Hyperedit or alt-F12 their way up fastest.

Still keen to see what some folks do when they actually fly, though.

[Jovus]

I had a really good time with the Benchmark on the way up (circa 3 minutes) but then KSP crashed. I'll get on it again some time soon.

[Wanderfound]

A new time!

One Kerbodyne Goblin XR ready to go.

Upsy-daisy.

Whoosh.

Supersonic climbing.

Circularise.

Flip and hit the brakes.

Out of gas.

Dive in.

Get it turned.

And gas it back up.

Chase the sun.

Icarus!

Ooh, pretty.

Engines off for some hypersonic gliding.

Time to bring it in.

Drop and roll.

Level off.

Slowing...

Slow.

Bit too low.

Line it up, throttle up a touch.

Gear down.

In we come.

And down.

Stopped, 19 minutes 11 seconds.

Well done, Anald and Tombal.

Still plenty of time to be cut, though; I took it very conservatively on the turn.

[Jovus]

Wanderfound, I beat your time with the Benchmark. I clock in at 23:24, despite waving off twice.

The plan was to take the plane up, circularize, and then burn retrograde until I could actually reverse direction and drop back into the atmosphere like a rock. That didn't quite work out.

Javascript is disabled. View full album

As noted, I also messed this up in several ways. I imagine if you had a perfect flight with the Benchmark you could probably get a time around 15 minutes. Not that I'm going to try; this plane-flying newbie is proud to have landed at all.

Oh, and I'm using FAR and DREC, so toasty warm matters.

Edited September 25, 2014 by Jovus
Mods list

[xtoro]

I don't use FAR and I don't do spaceplanes, but, I'm good at Delta-V's, math and trajectories.... Stock entry is almost ready, and I'm still tweaking my FAR entry.

Plane: The Macheto Mk VI

And yes, I'm only using stock, MechJeb, Spaceplane+ and FAR

Mach 1 @ 5000m

Mach 2.5 @ 16,500m