[KSP v1.1.3] Stock Bug Fix Modules (Release v1.1.3b.1 - 10 Jul 16)

[Claw]

Anyway, the parachute angle probably needs to depend on the mesh geometry somehow, because if you use parachute models with risers (i.e. Ven's Stock Revamp) they stick out at ridiculous angles. If that's not possible it's probably enough just to make the angle configurable.

Even better if the angle would change between reefed and unreefed.

I'll have to look. I'm still uneasy about adding things that aren't exactly bug fixes, because I know so many other options exist. Thanks for the point out. And changing angles based on state would be pretty easy.

Is it possible to include a fix for the fuel not draining evenly when you have multiple tanks connected via fuel lines? It's noticeable with asparagus staging or with side tanks that are connected to each other via fuel lines.

I've been hearing rumblings of this. Although the resource feed system is quite complex and extremely difficult to change without extensive replacement of the stock code. My IntakeAir balancer turned out to be quite complicated, and it didn't have to do any path lookup. I'm not sure this is something practical to fix with an unintrusive addon.

Just an FYI Claw, your gimbal fix, while very much needed in the stock game, slightly messes things up in modded game.

Great idea, thank you!

Hmmm, maybe I'm just Doing It Wrong

A pic of your craft would help me out. I did test this, but not extensively. Seeing engine types and ship configuration might help me out.

Claw, I love it - but I have to admit, I've found new options springing up all weekend as alternatives. I wouldn't mind something in your set of fixes just because I think people trust them and get a lot of value. If nothing else perhaps point in your thread to these wonderful StockFixes and StockPlus options - they just feel too good to not be stock? I realize StockPlus is a slippery slope...

I definitely agree. I'm not sure how much "Plus" I want to add. My goal has always been to make fixes that are non-intrusive and don't change gameplay or balance, except when there's an unintentional bug. I've included these couple Plus features on request, but I'm still a bit torn. That's why I gave them ways to independently or globally disable.

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Since I build these fixes for all the kerbonauts out there, and mostly aimed at a stock game, what do you think about StockPlus? Should it perhaps be a separate mod?

Cheers,

-Claw

[smjjames]

I haven't had any problems with any of my rockets that use asparagus style staging as of yet. It might help if you would upload the craft file somewhere so others can download and test to see if it's an issue with the craft design. Fuel flow can be a bit quirky sometimes.

Can I post the craft file here?

- - - Updated - - -

I've been hearing rumblings of this. Although the resource feed system is quite complex and extremely difficult to change without extensive replacement of the stock code. My IntakeAir balancer turned out to be quite complicated, and it didn't have to do any path lookup. I'm not sure this is something practical to fix with an unintrusive addon.

Could you guys at least look at the ship(s) though?

Anyways. heres the two that I want a look at: http://sta.sh/01myou7rpqa8

For the mjtest one, go straight up a few kilometers so that the boosters drop off without colliding into a wing or engine, then do normal gravity turn.

Mjtest ship: This is the asparagus staged one, you can see pretty quickly that they aren't draining evenly, they're also draining in a wierd way.

Tankwierdness ship: I tried to crossfeed the orange tanks so that they would drain evenly, but they end up doing the same kind of thing, not draining evenly and in a balanced way.

Edited May 11, 2015 by smjjames

[Apollo13]

BUG:

With KSP 1.0, the Docking Mode no longer works, even in stock. That is, when I press the S-key in Translate, instead of backing, the vessel rotates. I've tried changing to Rotation, and it still rotates, as it should. I can post an image of the erroneous behavior.

Is this something you can fix? As I mentioned, this happens in a pure stock load.

Or, has this been reported previously and is being worked on by you or Squad? Or, am I the only person this happens to?

[Wintersdark]

BUG:

With KSP 1.0, the Docking Mode no longer works, even in stock. That is, when I press the S-key in Translate, instead of backing, the vessel rotates. I've tried changing to Rotation, and it still rotates, as it should. I can post an image of the erroneous behavior.

Is this something you can fix? As I mentioned, this happens in a pure stock load.

Or, has this been reported previously and is being worked on by you or Squad? Or, am I the only person this happens to?

Happens to me too. Not to mention how swapping between Linear and Rotational control still activates staging in docking mode. Oops.

[BudgetHedgehog]

Since I build these fixes for all the kerbonauts out there, and mostly aimed at a stock game, what do you think about StockPlus? Should it perhaps be a separate mod?

I'm in two minds - you could argue that the core SFBM are necessary and make the game as intended by the devs (BandwidthFix, KerbalDebrisFix etc etc) and are just literally fixing the game so should be separate to anything that extends/enhances the game. Buuuuuuut, stuff in Plus like changing the number of fairing panels or radial chute spread etc should have been in the game to begin with so it does no harm being in the same download.

But, if push comes to shove, I'd say make it separate - that way, purists can be sure they are playing the game as intended and without any major/minor bugs that shouldn't be there anyway. Up to them if they want to play without minor tweaks and annoyances or not and then, before they know it, they're pushing 3.4GB RAM usage with mods that add squeaky noises when kerbals hit the ground. Yes, StockPlus should be a separate gateway mod

[daver4470]

Just want to report that I had a problem with the gimbal fix, too. It did not play well at all with MechJeb's ascent autopilot. Every craft I launched wound up with an immediate -- like, within seconds of launch -- oscillation, that increased in intensity until the craft went out of control. Tuning down the gimbal range on the engines just lowered the intensity of the oscillations. Removing the fix solved the problem entirely.

Also, does the "sticky" T2 pad fix not work for craft files created prior to the application of the fix? Because I'm still getting stuck...

Thanks for making these, BTW. They're greatly appreciated. (Especially the modularity of them. Pick & choose is the way to go!)

[Black-Talon]

Since I build these fixes for all the kerbonauts out there, and mostly aimed at a stock game, what do you think about StockPlus? Should it perhaps be a separate mod?

Cheers,

-Claw

I have spent too much time thinking about this. Here's the test imo - what would be be allowed to be used in a Stock Challenge?

I do believe separating StockPlus, and pointing to it BELOW the stock bug fixes is a good approach. You can note some of the StoxkPlus functionality that doesn't exist in StockBugFix. It is unfortunate that install order matters. I love the idea of it being a gateway. I still in fact think you could and should point out other works you think are StoxkPlus worthy in the StockPlus thread.

[Psycho_zs]

I'm noticing very ineffective behavior when SAS is used to hold a vector with RCS enabled. It looks like it fires in all directions at once, leaving only small imbalance to turn the ship to desired direction. I wonder if something can be done about that.

[godefroi]

Just want to report that I had a problem with the gimbal fix, too. It did not play well at all with MechJeb's ascent autopilot. Every craft I launched wound up with an immediate -- like, within seconds of launch -- oscillation, that increased in intensity until the craft went out of control. Tuning down the gimbal range on the engines just lowered the intensity of the oscillations. Removing the fix solved the problem entirely.

I've got the same symptoms. Not only does MJ find it impossible to hold a heading, so does RemoteTech's flight computer. While it may be better in the atmosphere (I don't think so), it's definitely much worse in space. I ended up disabling it.

[Apollo13]

I've got the same symptoms. Not only does MJ find it impossible to hold a heading, so does RemoteTech's flight computer.

I have no problem with MJ holding a heading. I use SMART A.S.S. for guidance, not the Ascent Autopilot. I don't use RemoteTech; so, I can't report.

[Claw]

Can I post the craft file here?

...

Tankwierdness ship: I tried to crossfeed the orange tanks so that they would drain evenly, but they end up doing the same kind of thing, not draining evenly and in a balanced way.

You sure can. I haven't tried your ship yet, but I have heard other people saying similar things. I'm not really sure if this is something I can fix, since it's pretty deeply buried in the fuel feed system. I will try to download and try your craft when I have time.

With KSP 1.0, the Docking Mode no longer works, even in stock. ... Is this something you can fix? As I mentioned, this happens in a pure stock load.

I've seen other reports about this, but quite frankly I've pretty much never used docking mode myself. They did try to rework the input bindings and I think that's part of why it's messed up. I can take a look, and have written this down on my growing list.

Also, does the "sticky" T2 pad fix not work for craft files created prior to the application of the fix? Because I'm still getting stuck...

It should work on on any craft regardless of when it was made. But it does only work on craft where the engine is the lowest part (in contact with the launch pad). I believe there was one other report of the sticky launch pad fix not working for a mod engine. Perhaps if you could post a picture (or the .craft if it's stock) so I can have a look.

I'm noticing very ineffective behavior when SAS is used to hold a vector with RCS enabled. It looks like it fires in all directions at once, leaving only small imbalance to turn the ship to desired direction. I wonder if something can be done about that.

Yes, this is a stock bug with the pilot SAS functions. You might also see that (with reaction wheels) the ship will rapidly drain electrical charge.

I've got the same symptoms. Not only does MJ find it impossible to hold a heading, so does RemoteTech's flight computer. While it may be better in the atmosphere (I don't think so), it's definitely much worse in space. I ended up disabling it.

Okay. I'm seeing several complaints about this. I've built the fixes to be modular so they can be removed if incompatible with each player's particular install. I'm not sure if I should remove this fix from the download or not. I have flown several designs where it functions a bit better, but I can't really do really in depth testing by myself.

I have spent too much time thinking about this. Here's the test imo - what would be be allowed to be used in a Stock Challenge?

I don't know. "Stock Challenge" usually means zero mods installed, with maybe some listed exceptions. I would definitely say that some of the StockPlus options give more customization content than what you get in pure stock, but I could also say that the stock bug fixes give an advantage. Fixing Mk3 part strength, improving wheel functions, etc... But on the other side, the radial parachute spread adds zero functionality/advantages, but doesn't really "fix a bug." So I don't know. I guess that's why I'm having a bit of a struggle here.

Although it looks like all of the posts so far a in favor of leaving StockPlus components out of the Stock Bug Fixes.

Thanks for the feedback everyone, and I'll keep hammering away on some of these. Working on fixing flight controls (flaps) and air brakes at the moment.

Cheers,

~Claw

[smjjames]

You sure can. I haven't tried your ship yet, but I have heard other people saying similar things. I'm not really sure if this is something I can fix, since it's pretty deeply buried in the fuel feed system. I will try to download and try your craft when I have time.

Could you also look at the mjtest one? The way that the asparagus stages are draining is a bit odd, I don't know if it's a bug or just me not understanding the new system. Both that one and the tankwierdness one are in the zip file.

If anybody else wants to look at them, that'd be cool. They're both fully stock.

[vardicd]

Also, does the "sticky" T2 pad fix not work for craft files created prior to the application of the fix? Because I'm still getting stuck...

It should work on on any craft regardless of when it was made. But it does only work on craft where the engine is the lowest part (in contact with the launch pad). I believe there was one other report of the sticky launch pad fix not working for a mod engine. Perhaps if you could post a picture (or the .craft if it's stock) so I can have a look.

~Claw

I can confirm this is still a thing with the sticky launch pad fix. Its rare, but it happens to me with the stock 'l-vt-45 swivel' It usually only happens if I have 2 touching the launch pad, and then only one sticks, so the craft lifts on one side and falls over. It doesn't seem to happen with any of the other engines, but it also doesn't happen regularly. I can take a design with the lv-t-45s on the pad launch it 30 times, and may only stick twice.

[djphllps]

Hey Claw just ran into some issues with stability assist and the gimbal module fix after a little troubleshooting i removed that fix and im back up and going but thought i would let you know. My original post for the issue if you want more details...http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/120877-SAS-Wobble-Just-Recently

[vardicd]

Actually, just had the stuck on Launchpad bug, here's the log if you want to take a look. https://www.dropbox.com/sh/g51hchxhbwpnuq3/AADxGVraekz-xIrHb_olRXjCa?dl=0

[godefroi]

I have no problem with MJ holding a heading. I use SMART A.S.S. for guidance, not the Ascent Autopilot. I don't use RemoteTech; so, I can't report.

I don't mean during ascent, I mean during a burn. Even in space, where aero is not involved, MJ (and RT) are all over the place while executing nodes.

[Claw]

Okay. Looks like too many things are tuned to deal with instant gimbals. I will remove that fix in the next download and see if there is another way to reduce SAS wobble. Until I can fix the download, please delete the EngineGimbalFix directory.

Actually, just had the stuck on Launchpad bug, here's the log if you want to take a look. https://www.dropbox.com/sh/g51hchxhbwpnuq3/AADxGVraekz-xIrHb_olRXjCa?dl=0

Awesome, thanks! I'll dig around in there and see if I can tune it a bit. Do you also happen to have a pic of the craft?

Cheers,

-Claw

[vardicd]

Awesome, thanks! I'll dig around in there and see if I can tune it a bit. Do you also happen to have a pic of the craft?

Cheers,

-Claw

As a matter of fact, I do:

[Gfurst]

Okay. Looks like too many things are tuned to deal with instant gimbals. I will remove that fix in the next download and see if there is another way to reduce SAS wobble. Until I can fix the download, please delete the EngineGimbalFix directory.

Whaaat nooo.... I like that, don't delete it, if peoples are complaining due to lack of design competence, let them disable the feature on their own.

(writing that knowingly that will create a disturbance in the force )

Maybe if too many people are complaining, leave it disabled by default.

[Spartwo]

+ ModuleWheelFix (9 May 15) - (STATUS: Updated for KSP v1.0.2) - Description: Rover wheel brakes are rendered ineffective and traction is low.

Wobbly wheels, you fixed wobbly wheels!

*struggles to handle it*

[HafCoJoe]

Okay. Looks like too many things are tuned to deal with instant gimbals. I will remove that fix in the next download and see if there is another way to reduce SAS wobble. Until I can fix the download, please delete the EngineGimbalFix directory.

Awesome, thanks! I'll dig around in there and see if I can tune it a bit. Do you also happen to have a pic of the craft?

Cheers,

-Claw

Do you think you could put slower gimbals in a separate download? I run stock and I would put the fix to good use. And a suggestion that might help with SAS wobble would be to make reaction wheels start weak and gradually speed up to normal levels over ons second. It would simulate real reaction wheels in the least haha. Could that be useful at all?

[Gfurst]

ORRRRR... just maybe, just maybe....

use the trim keys....

[Tontow]

For the wobbles caused by SAS.

The reason you wobble with SAS is because SAS keeps accelerating until it hits hits mark. IE: SAS has to move 10 degrees. It accelerates as it moves all 10 degrees and because of that it will always overshoot.

The way it is now you may as well drive a car at full speed and then hit the brakes right when you hit your parking spot. (you'll skid right past it.)

SAS should start to decelerate at the half way point. IE: SAS has to move 10 degrees. It should accelerate 5 degrees and then decelerate the last 5. Or accelerate for 4 and decelerate for 6.

[Gfurst]

@Tontow

Look for one Pilot Assistant mods, it provides utilities for flying the atmosphere, but also some options to tweak SAS, customize Pid values, so it will behave better like you want.

[Kerbas_ad_astra]

Just got stuck to the Level 2 launchpad, so the fix is still needed. (Thanks for providing it.)