Help for running a metric ton of mods?

[Pholic]

TL;DR: Any tips/tricks to improve the amount of mods installable? Thank you in advance for any info/help you can give me.

All I would like is a simple list:

ATM, reduces memory used for textures.

Linux, much better than windows for resources.

etc.

Edited October 18, 2014 by Pholic
lots of words were confusing a simple question...

[Padishar]

Slowdowns with very complex craft are to be expected due to the way the physics calculations are done by the game. If you also get large slowdowns with simple craft then please follow the instructions in the "How to get support" sticky thread in this sub-forum (especially the part about supplying a complete output_log.txt file).

The most likely cause, other than the Win x64 version being rather unstable, is that some of your mods are conflicting or are simply not yet updated (correctly) for KSP 0.25

[Pholic]

Slowdowns with very complex craft are to be expected due to the way the physics calculations are done by the game. If you also get large slowdowns with simple craft then please follow the instructions in the "How to get support" sticky thread in this sub-forum (especially the part about supplying a complete output_log.txt file).

The most likely cause, other than the Win x64 version being rather unstable, is that some of your mods are conflicting or are simply not yet updated (correctly) for KSP 0.25

I have read and understand the getting support sticky, but most of that seemed irrelevant to the question I am asking: What process do other people use to have tons of mods? e.g. using linux or something additional along the lines of ATM. Or do they just have $3,000 rigs and do whatever they wish...? I realize there's a picture in my post but I put a TL;DR

Like I said before which got lost in the book I wrote: I had no slowdowns with the pictured ship and x64 is completely stable for me. The problem happens when I add KSPI, MKS/OKS, 5+ part packs, all Near Future packs, and tons of utilities. I am not asking people why this is happening or how to fix it, I've got that nailed down. The novice solution is to remove things I want... I don't like that solution.

At the time, all mods were current to the version of KSP. I know how to install/uninstall mods, check capability, remove redundant/outdated dlls from overlapping mods, etc. I have tested literally 20+ installs with various combinations of mods and it's never one mod or combination of mods that causes the slowdown. I'm sure we all agree, if you tried installing every non-conflicting mod to KSP, it would slow down the best of machines. I just want to know how people get the most mods they can.

Edited October 18, 2014 by Pholic

[Robotengineer]

I have a nice Mac, but do to the limits of Unity currently, I play with ATM as well as half textures, and render quality to fast/simple. Since I don't really care about High quality textures, etc. it doesn't really bother me. I also create different installs for the different play styles I play, generally one for realism, one for aesthetics, and one for my standard mods.

[Master Tao]

@Robotengineer:

If you double the scale setting for ATM (details below), you should have similar results as ATM+half textures, but faster loading times since ATM caches scaled textures.

@Pholic:

Padishar's asking for all that information because you haven't provided enough information about why KSP is unstable for you. The solution will be different depending on what's causing KSP to crash.

1. Run KSP 32-bit. KSP 64-bit is inherently unstable, and adding any mods makes it more unstable, but in unpredictable ways. Many modders are now refusing to support KSP 0.25 64-bit for Windows.

2. Run mods only on the versions of KSP they're compatible with? At a minimum, KSPI-L has not been updated for 0.25.

3. Open KSP/GameData/ActiveTextureManagement/config.cfg and edit the bolded lines. Make scale larger (4 may be enough), and also make max_size a power of 2. Try 256 to start and then halve or double it to decrease memory usage or increase graphical quality, respectively. Same for min_size, but it should always be smaller than max_size (unless that is 0).

###  Resize the texture by the scale specified. Use powers
###   of two for best efficiency. 1 is no scalling, 2, is 1/2
###   4 is 1/4, etc.
[B]    scale = 2[/B]

###  Specifies a maximum dimension for both width and height
###   of textures, AFTER any scalling. ie. if this is set to 
###   256, and you have a 1024X1024 texture and scale set to 2,
###   the resulting texture will be 256x256. Use it without 
###   scalling to only shrink larger textures. 
[B]    max_size = 0[/B]
    [B]min_size = 64[/B]

4. Install new mods one by one and playtest them for an hour or so. This won't help you find unstable mods, especially on Win64, but it will help you find the limits for memory usage with your system and settings.

[Pholic]

OK, maybe I'm missing the point here...

#1 I have used the 32 bit version with the EXACT SAME RESULTS. It's not a stability issue, it's not a version issue, it's not any other issue you guys want to prove/disprove, I'm not asking for a forensic investigation.

I just want to know how to make KSP the most efficient it can be.

Simple example: ATM or no ATM... well ATM reduces the memory used in textures, so use ATM to improve efficiency.

#2 There is a threshold of how much I can add before it compromises/maxes out the resources I have available and the extent unity programming allows.

#3 The reason I use x64 is that it is stable for me (i.e. it doesn't crash) atypical I realize, but it does marginally increase how much I can add to KSP. Like I said, x86 doesn't help, why? most likely because the problem is exactly what I said it was in the first post and nothing else... If I upload a log file and someone tells me I'm out of memory, I can't punch them in the face... This is unacceptable to me. I am well aware this is the issue, I've said that repeatedly.

I am looking for ways to make my resource use more efficient either by using linux, ATM, any other option, or combination of options available.

I am NOT looking for ways to check my current version, version of mods, how to install mods, how to check compatibility of mods, verify current/conflicting/repeated dll files. I know how to do that, have done that, doesn't seem to be the issue.

Sorry I am a jerk, I realize you guys are trying to help. But I feel like I'm being treated like an infant here... I feel like I said I have a grease fire over here and I need a chemical fire extinguisher because water isn't helping... then you guys are asking me if if I know how to turn on water from a faucet and asking to see if my bucket has a hole in it...

Edited October 18, 2014 by Pholic

[Master Tao]

Like I said, x86 doesn't help, why? most likely because the problem is exactly what I said it was in the first post and nothing else... If I upload a log file and someone tells me I'm out of memory, I can't punch them in the face... This is unacceptable to me. I am well aware this is the issue, I've said that repeatedly.

The point your missing? You haven't actually described the problem, so everyone is giving good general advice.

Punching someone in the face for trying to provide help is generally unacceptable to them. I'm done here.

[Pholic]

I very clearly described the problem: I do not know what other people have done to improve the resource efficiency of KSP. I know there were lots of other confusing words around the one question I asked, so I deleted them.

The only question I am asking:

What options are there for improving resource efficiency for KSP?

Answers to questions I am not asking that Master Tao told me to do:

1: x86 vs x64 stability comparisons, both are stable for me.

2: KSP version vs mod version compatibility, all of my play and testing was done using correct, compatible versions (NOT 0.25), both on x86 and x64, why I believe that's not an issue.

3: ATM in depth modification, I have done this, it works up to a certain degree. If I need 40 tarabytes of RAM reducing 90% of it still won't help (this is an exaggerated example please don't ask me to post a log of my ram usage).

4: Install mods one by one to test memory cap. I have done this extensively, this is how I came to the conclusion that I need to make my memory usage more efficient. I have two options: Use less mods or my only question so far: how do I make my usage more efficient?

Read every response so far: Robotengineer is the only person who actually read and properly responded to my post... hence why I am being a jerk (I will admit I erased my first post to make it quite simple, but not before robotengineer actually read through it and responded). Instead I'm arguing back and forth about my specs and general advice about checking compatibility and install integrity.

Edited October 18, 2014 by Pholic

[Padishar]

There must be over a hundred threads on this forum that all give the same answers to your TL;DR question. Use ATM, use -force-opengl, quit other running programs, etc. There really aren't many other options.

The only problems you should get when you install too many mods are that the game will either crash because it either reaches the 32 bit memory limit (for x86) or because it is even more unstable than usual when you approach or exceed 4 gig usage (for x64), your machine will start VM page swapping because KSP combined with the OS and all the other programs you have running are trying to use more memory than you have installed, or your video card will run out of room for all the textures currently being used and needs to start swapping textures constantly between main memory and VRAM. If your game is not actually crashing then either of these last two issues may be what you are seeing. The best solution is still the same: use ATM and/or opengl mode to reduce overall RAM usage and size of textures being sent to the video card.

My point was that if the game is not actually crashing and your machine is of a decent spec (i.e. > 4gig of RAM and a video card with a decent amount of VRAM) then you should not be getting large slowdowns with simple craft no matter how many mods you have installed. This is especially true if those mods aren't actually being used by the vessels you are flying.

[Pholic]

There must be over a hundred threads on this forum that all give the same answers to your TL;DR question. Use ATM, use -force-opengl, quit other running programs, etc. There really aren't many other options.

I searched all 10 pages within the support (modded installs), opened many threads and read through them. Individually, I saw many options but not an all-inclusive thread. Sorry for beating a dead horse.

Thank you very much for continuing to help me through my frustration, I will try -force-opengl and linux, in addition to using ATM.

In all fairness, technically I do not have a problem yet, there is no log file to produce, I haven't installed any mods or even KSP 0.25.

Once I do install everything, then deal with conflicts, then deal with memory issues, then I will post an actual log file/details that I will more than likely experience as per the sticky on getting help. I was merely trying to add background to my question rather than troubleshoot that problem, clearly all I did was cloud my question.

As for raging at Master Tao: I'm sorry, but I will point to the fact that robotengineer answered my question. You went as far to treat him like he had a problem as well, he just stated here's his setup, what he does, no problems, no issues... You were frustrated with me for not providing log files and information that does not exist, conflicts that haven't arisen yet and using incorrect versions of things I'm not using. See why I'm so frustrated? It's my fault for writing so much to start, why I did that I have no idea. Thank you for trying to troubleshoot my background information. Maybe I am in error, but what I did solved my background issues after extensive testing over a year of mods/versions/and several installs. This post was about future prevention and not about my background issues/incoherent ramblings. I am sorry for not stating that sooner but I was a little more than upset.