Crowd Sourced Science-Biome Reports Everywhere! (August 11) [6.0]

[Olympic1]

Pre-release 1.5.0 is out

Changelog:

v1.5.0

• Removed Squad reports
  
• Fixed framework in files
  
• Removed experiments for Sun and Jool
  
• .. surfaceSample
  
• .. seismicScan
  
• Removed Custom Biomes support (not maintained anymore)
  
• Fixed wrong biome names for Ike
  
• .. Central Mountain Ridge -> Central Mountain Range
  
• .. South Eastern Mountain Ridge -> South Eastern Mountain Range
  
• Fixed unreadable chars
  
• Removed poles biome on Tylo (Tylo has no poles)
  
• Added more info in the README
  
• Added "Modlist"
  
• Added "How to contribute"
  

We still need new science reports for the 0.90 biomes. You can read on our WIKI how you can contribute.

Edited January 20, 2015 by Olympic1

[harryyoung]

Since GitHub wasn't the right place I'm taking over the discussion we started here: https://github.com/DuoDex/CrowdSourcedScience/pull/12

It was about wether we should add support for experiment mods or rather pass on results to the mod holder so he can add them directly.

When I think of CSS I not only think about the frontend mod that adds results. If there is enugh manpower available I imagine it can become quite a breeding ground. To that end I think adding experiment mods to CSS, at least initially, helps accelerate content creation. Also it avoids taking time from the modmakers potentially having to take time to edit/pull quite some change requests if other pepole take on to directly contributing to the main mod. Once an experiment has sufficient contend in as high a detail level as feasable, we can always offer the mod maker to include them in his latest release.

Also, it is quite unlikely that experiment makers will support planet makers with results and vice versa. That is probably a long therm home for CSS.

So I dont think we should exclude experiments from being added. We should however prioritize mods that are popular or are not remotely fleshed out (i.E. they dont have defaults for every valid planet/situation combination) A Limit for Support should obviously be support for the current KSP version (no point in adding to dead mods)

[smjjames]

Um, how about support for Dmagics science stuff? I really like the extra science stuff from there, but he hasn't added the science stuff for the new biomes, so I'm kind of forced to use custombiomes atm, which btw, MAY be causing some kind of crash that isn't leaving a crashlog.

[Olympic1]

When I think of CSS I not only think about the frontend mod that adds results. If there is enugh manpower available I imagine it can become quite a breeding ground.

For now we are only with a few people, but we will grow.

To that end I think adding experiment mods to CSS, at least initially, helps accelerate content creation. Also it avoids taking time from the modmakers potentially having to take time to edit/pull quite some change requests if other pepole take on to directly contributing to the main mod. Once an experiment has sufficient contend in as high a detail level as feasable, we can always offer the mod maker to include them in his latest release.

So I dont think we should exclude experiments from being added. We should however prioritize mods that are popular or are not remotely fleshed out (i.E. they dont have defaults for every valid planet/situation combination) A Limit for Support should obviously be support for the current KSP version (no point in adding to dead mods)

I agree. I reacted a bit to rude, sorry for that.

Also, it is quite unlikely that experiment makers will support planet makers with results and vice versa. That is probably a long therm home for CSS.

Planet packs get support from their fans. Look at Outer Planets Mod, we added 300+ reports in 12 hours.

Um, how about support for Dmagics science stuff? I really like the extra science stuff from there, but he hasn't added the science stuff for the new biomes, so I'm kind of forced to use custombiomes atm, which btw, MAY be causing some kind of crash that isn't leaving a crashlog.

DMagic already has more then 1000 reports, but we will see.

As for Custom Biomes, it isn't supported anymore for KSP 0.90 because of the new stock biomes.

[smjjames]

If he has, then why hasn't he applied them to his own mod for the stock 0.90 biomes already? I want to be able to explore the stock biomes with the magic instruments.

[Olympic1]

If he has, then why hasn't he applied them to his own mod for the stock 0.90 biomes already? I want to be able to explore the stock biomes with the magic instruments.

Most of the modders and Squad are focussing on gameplay, models, parts, ..., rather then adding science reports.

When KSP added the new biomes they didn't care to add reports for them (No offense Squad), because they want to focus on gameplay and not minor things like science reports.

[smjjames]

If I remove custom biomes and install this, will Dmagics science stuff automatically take from the ones supplied by this?

[DuoDex]

If I remove custom biomes and install this, will Dmagics science stuff automatically take from the ones supplied by this?

Ahm...I don't understand the question here. Does custom biomes already provide support for DMagic Orbital Science?

[harryyoung]

There are none supplied at this point so the answer is no, at this time this won't add to any of the DMOS experiments.

[smjjames]

Yes custom biomes provides support for Dmagic, but Dmagic doesn't provide support for stock biomes. My question is if I remove custombiomes, will Dmagics science stuff still work? Though that's a question better asked in the other thread.

Also, will Dmagics science stuff use the science text in here for the stock biomes?

Edit: got ninja answered.

Custom biomes also has the problem of the biomes being rotated/mirrored off of the actual terrain features.

Edit: *grumble grumble* I like the stock biomes better IMO and I wanted the Dmagic science stuff for more variety in experiments. But feh with it *removes custombiomes and also DMOS because it's not compatible with stock biomes* I'll grab this though because it's interesting.

Edited January 22, 2015 by smjjames

[Olympic1]

Yes custom biomes provides support for Dmagic, but Dmagic doesn't provide support for stock biomes. My question is if I remove custombiomes, will Dmagics science stuff still work? Though that's a question better asked in the other thread.

Also, will Dmagics science stuff use the science text in here for the stock biomes?

Edit: got ninja answered.

Custom biomes also has the problem of the biomes being rotated/mirrored off of the actual terrain features.

Edit: *grumble grumble* I like the stock biomes better IMO and I wanted the Dmagic science stuff for more variety in experiments. But feh with it *removes custombiomes and also DMOS because it's not compatible with stock biomes* I'll grab this though because it's interesting.

Maybe ping DMagic about this.

Custom Biomes is partially broken in 0.90, so when 0.91 releases Custom Biomes will break.

[smjjames]

Hm, the mystery goo canister and the materials science pod don't have science entries for the sun anymore, intended? I mean I can't activate them via left click while orbiting the sun.

I also had a crash a few min ago where KSP threw some kind of access violation when I tried to go back to space center, but uh, that left no crash log and I didn't look at the output log, so I have no clue. Worked fine after I got back in.

[madsailor]

Sorry guys, I was actually outside today, away from my computer...what a thought!

@Olympic1 and harryyoung: I agree with what has been said here. I think that in particular it makes a lot of sense to treat CSS as a sort of clearinghouse of science reports. We collect and collate, and if we reach complete reporting for a given mod then we can contact upstream about adding our reports to their next release. Whether they do or not, CSS has still added to the community. With an eye towards this it seems to make sense to add support for currently maintained mods that support biomes, but don't have a full set of reports yet. Obviously starting with the most popular, and moving to others as time/inclination allows.

So, that's my two cents worth. I really just wanted to start a dialog and get a feel for what we all see CSS moving toward in the future. After what I read here it looks far more promising to me now than when I posted on that pull request.

An update of where I'm at: I've added content for every experiment/situation/biome combination on Kerbin outside of KSC. Seeing as there are a total of 360 line items of content for KSC it may take me a bit, though atmosphereAnalysis and evaReport are complete (1/5th of the way there!) Also I have *mostly* finished work for adding support for RoverDudes Sounding Rockets experiments. There are 4 experiments that support all planets and biomes, and there is a single report for each experiment at the moment. If we are interested in supporting it I can roll it up fairly quickly and send a pull.

[Olympic1]

Hm, the mystery goo canister and the materials science pod don't have science entries for the sun anymore, intended? I mean I can't activate them via left click while orbiting the sun.

I also had a crash a few min ago where KSP threw some kind of access violation when I tried to go back to space center, but uh, that left no crash log and I didn't look at the output log, so I have no clue. Worked fine after I got back in.

Do you have other mods installed, because this only adds science reports

- - - Updated - - -

Sorry guys, I was actually outside today, away from my computer...what a thought!

Being outside is fun, having a break sometimes really helps.

Also I have *mostly* finished work for adding support for RoverDudes Sounding Rockets experiments. There are 4 experiments that support all planets and biomes, and there is a single report for each experiment at the moment. If we are interested in supporting it I can roll it up fairly quickly and send a pull.

Cool, keep up the work. I'm taking a break for writing reports because I also have other mods to update.

[madsailor]

Cool, keep up the work. I'm taking a break for writing reports because I also have other mods to update.

Sounds good. Speaking of updates, I noticed that this release included the .git folder in the zip, which people don't need in their Gamedata directory. Maybe there is some Git-fu that can be done to remove this from the next release zip.

[Olympic1]

Sounds good. Speaking of updates, I noticed that this release included the .git folder in the zip, which people don't need in their Gamedata directory. Maybe there is some Git-fu that can be done to remove this from the next release zip.

what, normally you can't see the .git folder unless you have your folder options set to 'Show hidden files'

[smjjames]

@ Olympic1: none that affect science reports and those two science parts really don't work for the sun anymore, they work fine elsewhere.

i passed off that error crash as a fluke since I hadn't seen that before, or maybe memory related.

[Olympic1]

@ Olympic1: none that affect science reports and those two science parts really don't work for the sun anymore, they work fine elsewhere.

i passed off that error crash as a fluke since I hadn't seen that before, or maybe memory related.

I'll test it when I get home (2 hours)

[smjjames]

Oh, and just for reference, I tried to do it around the orbit of Kerbin shortly after I left the SoI.

[madsailor]

Oh, and just for reference, I tried to do it around the orbit of Kerbin shortly after I left the SoI.

I just tried reproducing your issue, and the reports worked fine for me with the latest CSS. It sounds like you may have issues with some not-quite-removed or otherwise conflicting mods.

Javascript is disabled. View full album

In any case CSS only modifies the report text, not the experiment itself, so it shouldn't create an issue like this.

- - - Updated - - -

what, normally you can't see the .git folder unless you have your folder options set to 'Show hidden files'

Yep, I do have hidden files set to shown. I tried loading KSP both with and without the .git folder, and MM applied the same number of patches, so at least it (probably) isn't parsing the folder, but it's still an extra 1.9mb that people don't need to have in their Gamedata directory.

When it comes release time it's possible to take /planets and the license from the repo, zip it up locally, and add it to the release.

[smjjames]

I'll give it another look later when I get home.

Edit: I just tested and it's fine now. It's possible that I hit some kind of glitch during the SoI transition the previous time.

Edited January 23, 2015 by smjjames

[Captinfannin]

Thanks for doing this! I was getting tried of seeing "You observed the goo" and "You recorded your crews assessment of the situation" all the time...

[Goddess Bhavani]

Saw this screenshot. Downloaded this addon immediately.

[smjjames]

I'm using the latest CSS github version (the one from two days ago), and some of the experiments (high orbit materials study for example) keep referring to the badlands even if I'm not actually over the badlands. What's up with those? I get those 'bad, horrible, nasty badlands' jokes, but they don't make sense or at least break the immersion if you aren't over the badlands.

[madsailor]

I'm using the latest CSS github version (the one from two days ago), and some of the experiments (high orbit materials study for example) keep referring to the badlands even if I'm not actually over the badlands. What's up with those?

Experiments like materials science are only biome specific in limited situations (in this case surface landed), but we set up the file structure with all situations in each biome to promote diversity of non-biome-specific reports. Perhaps it is time to revisit this decision. If you log an issue at https://github.com/DuoDex/CrowdSourcedScience/issues we'll take a look at it.