[0.22] ISA MapSat 4.0 Dev Build

[Pigbear]

Does it work right now? I wanna use this but don't wanna break my game.

[daver4470]

I've tried searching, but trying to search for 'kethane' and 'mapsat' results in every second post ever coming back. Is there any way that ISA MapSat can check if a Kethane map exists, and if so, overlay it on a topographic map? If not, or there are no plans to ever do so, is it ok (license-wise, and friendly-wise) to access MapSat's data from a third (fourth?) party plugin?

I think ISA commented on this issue on his blog. The answer, if I remember correctly, was that (a) MapSat currently can't pull a Kethane map into the display, but ( there's no reason why it theoretically couldn't, but © he doesn't see the need to do anything like that until Squad implements resources into the game.

[GavinZac]

The maps displayed by both plugins are just plain graphics files stored on disk, I can't imagine any scenario in which someone could complain about you combining image files on your hard drive into a new image. The hard part is making the overlays legible - just using transparency doesn't work well because Kethane's green blobs disappear into Mapsat's heightmaps anywhere it's green.

Well, yeah, I'm sure I can legally do it, but people get irate about odd things. If the original authors had a problem with it, I could (try to*) make it for myself and just not release it. Or just make it so the user selects which two images to overlay. Colourising the Kethane map shouldnt be too hard, but of course, you'd lose the trademark green.

I think ISA commented on this issue on his blog. The answer, if I remember correctly, was that (a) MapSat currently can't pull a Kethane map into the display, but ( there's no reason why it theoretically couldn't, but © he doesn't see the need to do anything like that until Squad implements resources into the game.

a) sounds like a corner one has worked oneself into in programming - maps being certain sizes and so on. c) well, I guess necessity is the mother of invention - if it's quick, I could give it a go in a small mod without endangering the wellbeing of a massive existing mod. I can code in C# when forced to, but I need to find a "hello world" display item code example, I think.

[Markarian421]

what version of mechjeb?

Mechjeb 2.0.8. OSX 10.8.3 also. It just happened again -- it appears that the first time I visit a body (in this case Duna) with a craft with the dish on it, at some point soon after I start establishing an orbit the game locks up.

I did a clean install of 0.20.1 and downloaded and installed the mods then, and (the next day) copied them over to a clean install of 0.20.2, so nothing is terribly old.

[Benno]

Update on the issues I was having (see earlier post):

I've figured out that my freezing issue is a memory problem. To make a long troubleshooting story short, removing a bunch of parts unfroze everything, and I was able to refreeze things by turning up the texture graphics. That's pretty much conclusive evidence (for me) that it's a recurring memory allocation issue that I've run into before. (I have waaaaay too many parts. It's an addiction.)

Thankyou so much for this daver. I was going mad trying to figure what was causing crashes and freezes. I turned my render and texture settings down one notch from maximum, and now ISA is working fine. Finally!

[skendzie]

KhaosCorp, stop being an asshole to everyone. I'm not dumb and I read the first post 5~10 times before figuring out to go to his blog spot, which I learned through people on this forum. I figured out my own mistake before you even commented. So you seriously just commented to act like a smartass and not actually help.

[praskieva]

I had the exact same problem, but I got it working. No amount of waiting would fix this for me. I had an old version of the Kethane mod installed, and thing like the b9 aerospace pack that use a lot of .png files. Once I fixed the Kethane mod with the .20 compatable version and went through my parts and deleted a few extras that I didn't need it fixed the ISA mod. No lag or hanging at all now. KSP still has some very serious memory issues, even after the .20.2 update.

[Icebreaker81]

what other mods are ya running?

I also run Mechjeb 2 and Chatter mod. I only usually run these 3 mods.

[KhaosCorp]

I had the exact same problem, but I got it working. No amount of waiting would fix this for me. I had an old version of the Kethane mod installed, and thing like the b9 aerospace pack that use a lot of .png files. Once I fixed the Kethane mod with the .20 compatable version and went through my parts and deleted a few extras that I didn't need it fixed the ISA mod. No lag or hanging at all now. KSP still has some very serious memory issues, even after the .20.2 update.

KSP is a 32bit program, its always gonna have some slight memory usage issues unfortunately. Im kinda starting to notice some instability with ISA, but haven't isolated it yet (maybe its another mod messin with it..idk)

@skendzine....im trying to be helpful but I only have so much patience.....you had to read that 5+ times to get that the download is on the blog???? and im the asshole haha...

@Icebreaker, that's good to know as I run both those mods as well, seems like a good starting point to see if stuff is getting crossed up

[Castun]

I had the exact same problem, but I got it working. No amount of waiting would fix this for me. I had an old version of the Kethane mod installed, and thing like the b9 aerospace pack that use a lot of .png files. Once I fixed the Kethane mod with the .20 compatable version and went through my parts and deleted a few extras that I didn't need it fixed the ISA mod. No lag or hanging at all now. KSP still has some very serious memory issues, even after the .20.2 update.

It looks like the MapSat mod wants to eats up 1GB of RAM (at least) on it's own. With a few mod packs, I'm sitting at 2.8GB being used by KSP. But when I try to load a ship with any MapSat part on it, the memory shoots up to over 3.7GB and hangs the game. It is definitely hitting the memory limit for a 32-bit application. I've even tried to remove the previously mapped planet and still didn't help. I might try to go through and delete some more parts that I don't use, but I think they need to fix the damn game so parts don't eat up memory until you actually use them.

EDIT: Tried removing a good bit of the NP parts that I don't use often, brought my usage down to 2.6GB, but as soon as I load a ship onto the launchpad (only a probe core and GPS box) it hits the memory ceiling and crashes. I think there is a memory problem with MapSat itself, it shouldn't be using that much memory on it's own!

Edited June 1, 2013 by Castun

[KhaosCorp]

It looks like the MapSat mod wants to eats up 1GB of RAM (at least) on it's own. With a few mod packs, I'm sitting at 2.8GB being used by KSP. But when I try to load a ship with any MapSat part on it, the memory shoots up to over 3.7MB and hangs the game. It is definitely hitting the memory limit for a 32-bit application. I've even tried to remove the previously mapped planet and still didn't help. I might try to go through and delete some more parts that I don't use, but I think they need to fix the damn game so parts don't eat up memory until you actually use them.

0.20.2 was supposed to fix it....imo its kinda silly to make a modders game 32bit, really limits the modablity of the game

[daver4470]

0.20.2 was supposed to fix it....imo its kinda silly to make a modders game 32bit, really limits the modablity of the game

This isn't related to the 0.20.1 bug -- it was happening in 0.20 too. MapSat just has a huge overhead.

I'd like a 64 bit client too... but keep in mind that Unity didn't support 64 bit at all when KSP was originally coded. Unfortunately, they've said they'd basically have to recode the entire engine to create a 64 bit client. So I'm not holding my breath, unfortunately.

[Dweller_Benthos]

Very strange, though I'm seeing a jump in memory usage of almost or a bit over 1 GB when running a ship with a map sat on it, I'm not seeing a huge jump like other people. Right now it's sitting comfortably at 2.25GB, which is a bit high, I will admit, but nothing near the numbers other people are reporting. I'm not running any other mapping mods like kethane, though, just MechJeb 2, Kerbal Alarm Clock, and a few others that would make no difference to what map sat does.

Plus, I'm running a scan at 50X time warp with a scanning resolution of 1500, game runs smooth as silk, no red flashes in the time warp indicator.

[rhoark]

I'm not having any freezing or crashing problems, but its also not filling in the map at all. The GUI comes up, but the map stays black (in a 300x300 polar orbit). Anyone encountered this?

[KhaosCorp]

I'm not having any freezing or crashing problems, but its also not filling in the map at all. The GUI comes up, but the map stays black (in a 300x300 polar orbit). Anyone encountered this?

did you turn the scanner on? they start off by default, the old mapsat dish started on

[sidew]

Same as me until I pressed the button scn....

[artao]

Well, I tried to launch my first 0.20.x mapsat last night. Spent quite awhile building the ship. Used mostly parts from Half-meter Parts and Other Useless Junk. Building went fine, but when I went to launch, the game either hung or crashed out to desktop. I tried several times. Then I started uninstalling mods. Still kept crashing. Finally I removed the mapsat dish from my ship and it worked fine. Put the mapsat dish back on the ship and it crashed out. Re-installed all the mods I'd removed, took the mapsat dish back off the rocket, and it launched fine. Put the mapsat dish back on the rocket and it crashed out.

Not sure what or why, but clearly it is mapsat causing this. MapSat worked just fine for me in 0.19.x .. I freakin LOVE MapSat, as it gives actual functionality to satellites. One of the best mods IMHO. Virtually must-have.

Thanks for your work on this mod. I look forward to a working update. .. I am using X4r1

=D

[KevinTMC]

I decided to give the dev build a try this afternoon, and it's running just fine together with Kerbal Alarm Clock, Kerbal Engineer, Kerbal Protractor, Telemachus. Don't know about other mods, but no discernible conflicts with those.

[elfindreams]

Ok, Here is what I have been able to find out. MapSat is something of a memory sink but there is something more at work here than just a memory sink.

I launched a bunch of probes with MechJeb, LazorSystem and Kethane (along with MapSat) and put them into various orbits (Moho, Eve, Gilly, Kerbin, Mun and Minmus).

By the time I got them all into orbit, I switched to Gilly to scan and I was getting around 3.5+ GB memory utilization, <1 fps my machine was unresponsive and that was even before switching to 50x speed. This was with the resolution set to 200.

When I quit and ran with an empty MapSat data directory (except Hilo and the textures) I could get reasonable scanning performance even with extremely high resolutions (>1000) at 50x speedup. The FPS never dipped. The KSP memory utilization stayed around 2.2gb.

Loading in all my new maps (not from old version, all recreated under the new devel version) and artifacts.dat/etc... and going back in and scanning the same planet, I got "reasonable" speeds... I was getting about 11fps on 50x speedup with anywhere from 200-1000 resolutions with the memory utilization staying around 2.25gb.

None of the other plugins changed.

So my questions lead me down the path of memory leak or garbage collection problems in MapSat. The key questions I have are:

1) What happens if you load a single vessel with more than one MapSat dish (i.e. a multi-stage rocket with 4 probes that get separated from each other prior to scanning?

2) When does the data files get read and is there an attempt to make sure the data file doesn't get red multiple times before whatever is used to store it is freed up.... namely if I have two MapSat satellites around Kerbin and switch between them, does the Kerbin data get loaded in twice? What about if I have a Kerbin satellite and a Eve satellite, does the Kerbin data get freed up when I switch to Eve? The reason I ask is my csv files for each of these places is extremely large (Kerbin is 750m, Minmus for whatever reason is 1.3Gb) if it is reading in each of these into memory in order to prevent writing duplicate data and not freeing up those spaces in memory when I switch away, that is a over 2Gb of memory hanging around just between those two planets.

3) How are the data structures being freed? I have not gotten into unity development but my understanding is it is C#/.NET Framework at its core. Memory management and garbage collection in .NET can be an extremely finicky/difficult thing...

4) Why is a "completed" map of Minmus' CSV file bigger than my "completed" map of Kerbin's? Why is either so large?

Those are my thoughts, but as I said I have never gotten into Unity development myself. But based on the little testing I have been doing even aside from this it definitely seems to be MapSat related and affected by how long (or how many) maps you have been working with and not really related to other Mod inter-dependancies except that all the mods need to compete for the same memory state.

My next step is to wait till there is a problem again and try just quitting/re-entering (should have tried this first but you know, insane) to see if it is simply a memory allocation issue and quitting the program/coming back in fixes it. Also I wonder if scanning without creating the CSV files might work better, but personally those CSV files are awesome.

Either way just hoping some extra info might help.

[Camacha]

Well, I tried to launch my first 0.20.x mapsat last night. Spent quite awhile building the ship. Used mostly parts from Half-meter Parts and Other Useless Junk. Building went fine, but when I went to launch, the game either hung or crashed out to desktop. I tried several times. Then I started uninstalling mods. Still kept crashing. Finally I removed the mapsat dish from my ship and it worked fine. Put the mapsat dish back on the ship and it crashed out. Re-installed all the mods I'd removed, took the mapsat dish back off the rocket, and it launched fine. Put the mapsat dish back on the rocket and it crashed out.

Not sure what or why, but clearly it is mapsat causing this. MapSat worked just fine for me in 0.19.x .. I freakin LOVE MapSat, as it gives actual functionality to satellites. One of the best mods IMHO. Virtually must-have.

Thanks for your work on this mod. I look forward to a working update. .. I am using X4r1

=D

Did you use the dev version from the blog? The version in the first post will not work, as stated often in this thread.

[Calbino]

I've installed the latest version to version .20.1 of the game, and for the life of me I can't find the GUI buttons. The parts are loaded in, just no buttons for them while in flight. Has anyone else had this problem or am I overlooking something obvious?

[Fyrem]

Don't use 20.1 use 20.2

There is a huge bug in .1 that effected mods such as this one

[Dweller_Benthos]

Ok, Here is what I have been able to find out. MapSat is something of a memory sink but there is something more at work here than just a memory sink.

I launched a bunch of probes with MechJeb, LazorSystem and Kethane (along with MapSat) and put them into various orbits (Moho, Eve, Gilly, Kerbin, Mun and Minmus).

By the time I got them all into orbit, I switched to Gilly to scan and I was getting around 3.5+ GB memory utilization, <1 fps my machine was unresponsive and that was even before switching to 50x speed. This was with the resolution set to 200.

When I quit and ran with an empty MapSat data directory (except Hilo and the textures) I could get reasonable scanning performance even with extremely high resolutions (>1000) at 50x speedup. The FPS never dipped. The KSP memory utilization stayed around 2.2gb.

Loading in all my new maps (not from old version, all recreated under the new devel version) and artifacts.dat/etc... and going back in and scanning the same planet, I got "reasonable" speeds... I was getting about 11fps on 50x speedup with anywhere from 200-1000 resolutions with the memory utilization staying around 2.25gb.

None of the other plugins changed.

So my questions lead me down the path of memory leak or garbage collection problems in MapSat. The key questions I have are:

1) What happens if you load a single vessel with more than one MapSat dish (i.e. a multi-stage rocket with 4 probes that get separated from each other prior to scanning?

2) When does the data files get read and is there an attempt to make sure the data file doesn't get red multiple times before whatever is used to store it is freed up.... namely if I have two MapSat satellites around Kerbin and switch between them, does the Kerbin data get loaded in twice? What about if I have a Kerbin satellite and a Eve satellite, does the Kerbin data get freed up when I switch to Eve? The reason I ask is my csv files for each of these places is extremely large (Kerbin is 750m, Minmus for whatever reason is 1.3Gb) if it is reading in each of these into memory in order to prevent writing duplicate data and not freeing up those spaces in memory when I switch away, that is a over 2Gb of memory hanging around just between those two planets.

3) How are the data structures being freed? I have not gotten into unity development but my understanding is it is C#/.NET Framework at its core. Memory management and garbage collection in .NET can be an extremely finicky/difficult thing...

4) Why is a "completed" map of Minmus' CSV file bigger than my "completed" map of Kerbin's? Why is either so large?

Those are my thoughts, but as I said I have never gotten into Unity development myself. But based on the little testing I have been doing even aside from this it definitely seems to be MapSat related and affected by how long (or how many) maps you have been working with and not really related to other Mod inter-dependancies except that all the mods need to compete for the same memory state.

My next step is to wait till there is a problem again and try just quitting/re-entering (should have tried this first but you know, insane) to see if it is simply a memory allocation issue and quitting the program/coming back in fixes it. Also I wonder if scanning without creating the CSV files might work better, but personally those CSV files are awesome.

Either way just hoping some extra info might help.

I just did a few tests, and I seem to be getting different results than you. I'm not running Lazor System or Kethane though, just MechJeb, Map Sat, and a few other mods which I don't think cause much difference (Protractor, Kerbal Alarm Clock, etc). Here's what I found, answering some of your questions.

Loading the game used a little over 1GB of memory. Opening the VAB and loading a ship with no map sat used a bit over 2GB. Launched it and memory went to a bit over 2.25GB. This is a very simple ship with only a few parts.

Loaded my biggest ship, a Jool system mapper with a main ship and four probes, each has a map sat dish (so 5 total). This is a fairly complex ship, three main stages, lots of struts, engines, etc. Loaded a bit slow, memory use jumped to 2.5GB and frame rate dropped, maybe to below 20 FPS (is there a way to show FPS in game?), but it wasn't drastic enough to cause me any problems, and once I had it launched and started dropping stages, frame rate improved. This is with map scanning off of course. Memory still at 2.5GB. Game runs fine, though CPU and GPU are both running a bit over 50° C and fans are on high, but this is no different than with any other 3D game running like FarCry3.

I am also not saving CSV files, so I just turned on CSV saving and memory didn't change yet.

To try to answer your questions, already covered the first one, the second & third will have to be answered by the mod author, but as far the your last question, CSV files, as far as I know, will continue to grow in size the longer you leave the map sat active for that planet/moon. So, if you completed the visual map for Kerbin in an hour or so, but left the Minmus mapper running for several hours, it's quite possible to get a very large CSV file. I know in previous versions of map sat, I had a CSV file well over 2GB for Kerbin, as I let it run long after the visual map was completed. If you use the map gen program to render a larger map than is used in the game, you will have gaps from the data that was enough to complete the smaller map used in game. So, letting it run longer fills in the gaps that would complete a higher resolution render. If you're exporting the data to another mapping program, this might not apply, as those program may interpolate the missing data to give a complete map for a given resolution.

So the TL: DR is, loading a map sat for me isn't much different than loading a normal ship, memory usage stays pretty much at 2.5GB no matter what I'm doing in the game. This is all at a scan resolution of 1500 as well. It seems that the save raw data does create an FPS hit, when I have it turned on, the MET counter goes yellow no matter what planet I'm mapping, but turning it off makes the FPS jump back to green and the game runs smoothly again. Memory stays the same though.

[Maddmatts]

Now that I can zoom into the map I've just noticed that some ocean trenches south of the KSC (-33, -81) show up as "=D". Pretty awesome if that was intentional because you really wouldn't notice it without MapSat.

[thtechnologist]

I've installed the latest version to version .20.1 of the game, and for the life of me I can't find the GUI buttons. The parts are loaded in, just no buttons for them while in flight. Has anyone else had this problem or am I overlooking something obvious?

I am using 20.2 and am experiencing the same issue. The part is there and can be attached to a ship, but no gui button is present.