Need Input

[Juggalotuzz]

Well hello all. I have been paying around with this game since before the Mun release but recently bought it. Didnt feel right to post on the forums till I had the purchased version. After many attempt and ignorant assumptions about needing a large craft to get to the Mun, I finally decided on a small craft. The pic is what I have come up with.

Now mind you, it makes it to the Mun just fine, except I feel I could have more fuel once I get there as I have never successfully landed on the Mun. I was wondering if anyone has any tips on howw to make this possibly more fuel efficient without leaving In-Space junk. As of current, I can blow my outer tanks while still in Kerbal Orbit before I make my burn to meet the Mun\'s orbit. So please, tell me what you think, and how to/ if any, ways to improve. Thank you.

[sal_vager]

Hi Juggalotuzz.

Hmm that\'s a small craft, I like it, you might be able to save a little fuel if you swapped the landing legs for AV-R8 winglets, they are lighter, have less drag and you could get a boost while climbing from the lift they provide.

If you use LV-T30\'s on the boosters, you can get above 100m/s sooner and then throttle back, if you get it right you\'ll have more fuel left and the boosters will last a little longer.

Another weight saving measure is to use landing legs to push the boosters off instead of radial decouplers, but it is tricky to get it to work reliably.

[Juggalotuzz]

I tend to drop my speed to about 80% after the first 10 seconds of launch, and for some reason can never get the winglets to drop below the height of the last booster, although now that I think about it, Ive never had the lander engine before due to free version builds. Ill have to try that. Also, I have read about using the legs to detach the externals but, trying to keep things as operationally 'real' as possible, so I would rather not do that.

Ive tried using SRBs for the initial launch and using this craft to get further, but for some reason they make this unstable enough to the point it is hard to fly without the SAS mods, which as you can see from the pic, is not present, unnecessary weight IMO if I am just trying to land on the Mun.

Thank you though for the input, ill try out a few different variants and placement of the winglets and see what my fuel looks like once Ive achieved orbit around the Mun.

[Juggalotuzz]

GAH!!! The winglets, while providing lift for initial takeoff, becomes an encumbrance after the first stage is dropped in Kerbal Orbit. Causes a pull in an odd direction and actually causes more fuel usage rendering Mun orbit unattainable. I could put them on decouples but that would just add more weight. I went back to the legs, and had a pretty good flight to the Mun, yet do not have enough gas for landing. I did manage a Direct orbit crossing between my flight path and the Muns orbit around Kerbal, but never have enough fuel to slow down to a survivable speed once I reach the Mun.

Perhaps starting my gravity turn at 12k instead of 10k would help get that extra speed to reduce gravity drag once I am at my angle.

[Zephram Kerman]

That\'s a very small Munship! Congratulations!

I have three ideas for you:

1) drag the icon for the lander engine so that all engines start at launch time, and put fuel lines from the bottom of the boosters to your lander fuel tank, so that it is full when they separate;

2) optimize speeds on Kerbin ascent and Mun descent,

3) remove the legs and attach struts between the lander engine and its fuel tank. (This makes the engine strong enough to survive the landing. It\'ll be tippy though.)

edit: Using the LTV-30 engines and my suggestions #1 and 2 above, I landed on Mun with half a tank to spare. It was almost enough to get home. Almost.

[sjwt]

How you fly has a big effect as well,

check this link out if you want to see a 5 tank return Mun trip.

http://kerbalspaceprogram.com/forum/index.php?topic=8278.msg120302#msg120302

[Juggalotuzz]

I consider myself a decent flyer. Only recently (thanks too one of the tutorial videos) did I figure out you could bring up the NavBall in map mode, so with this rocket Ive been flying that way. I hit 12k on takeoff, roll to 90 degrees and lay my ship down at 40 degrees for my gravity turn. Stay this way until the out tanks blow, which does not put my in full orbit. Do a small burn on my last tank to achieve orbit. The rest is easy enough to get to the Mun. So I believe I am flying in a most fuel efficient way, but i could be wrong.