Is it Possible to get the Learstar A1 Into Orbit?

[michaelsteele3]

I always thought the Learstar A1 (Stock craft) seemed like an analogue for the Space Shuttles.

However, I can't seem to make it to orbit. With only the External Fuel Tank (Or whatever) attatched, it spins out of control within a certain altitude.

Any tips on getting the craft into orbit, if even possible? Am I using it wrong?

[SlabGizor117]

I've had the same problem, you probably have to tweak the thrust limiter for the radial engines in flight.

[worir4]

I don't think it is possible by leaving it as it is. I think the devs made it with some fault as it is supposed to be a guide to your own craft. I think if you tweak it a little, you can get it into orbit. Good luck!

[capi3101]

The devs have made the stock craft that come with the game generally incapable of carrying out their intended function without tweaking. It's been that way since at least 0.18, and they do it on purpose - the idea is to see what you can learn from the craft. You know, figure out what's wrong with it and then make some changes that get it working as it should. For example, the Kerbal X rocket is supposed to be a Munar lander with an asparagus booster - it's a lousy Mun lander and the asparagus is about as rotten as it gets, but it can be tweaked to a working craft pretty easily.

The wiki states the following:

"It is recommended to tweak the thrust of the orbiter's main engines to 60% and tweak down the thrust of the Kerbodyne KR-2L engine at the bottom of the large fuel tank during the flight as fuel is being drawn from the tank."

I imagine you could also just not run the thing full blast all the way up, but I don't know if that would be easier or not...

[Pecan]

...Any tips on getting the craft into orbit, if even possible? Am I using it wrong?

Use thrust-limiting to get it to orbit, changing several times during the flight. It is as possible as it is pointless - either a rocket or a spaceplane is easier. What's wrong is that it's a plane being launched on a rocket, which is very hard to do well in KSP, even if Squad had wanted to.

[panzer1b]

Yeah, learstar is more or less a failed shuttle that has terrible balance. It also doesnt look that good in my opinion, but it is definitely able to go to space with manual thrust limiting.

But like most stock craft, its more or less showing you what can be done in game, and isnt meant to be a fully functional craft right out of the box.

Ive deleted every stock craft except the kerbal X, as that one is after the buff to the poodle, able to land on mun and barely return, and probably make it to jool (never did this myself, but seen some vids with grav assists).

All in all, stock crafts are really nto worth anything, i prefer my own designs.

Finally, the ONLY way ive seen shuttles work, is through massive reaction wheel spam and vectored engines. There is one particular shuttle that works beautifully, i believe its called the STS3 or something, and the sole reason thats as easy to fly as it is due to over 100 clipped large reaction wheels internally. The stock shuttle doesnt have this, and is more or less a pain to do anythuing with because of it.

Edited February 12, 2015 by panzer1b

[Tex_NL]

I've barely given the stock craft any attention so it's quite possible I am mixing them up. But if this is indeed the craft I think you're talking about I got it into a stable low orbit while talking to my brother explaining KSP on my very first try.

But I do have to add I am using NEAR instead of the stock atmosphere.

[Taki117]

It is entirely possible to get into orbit with it. However, the radial LFO engines have been tweaked (You will need to retweak them) and the at Monoprop tank has been locked (You will have to unlock it) Also, it has Verner thrusters on it so don't be afraid to use those during ascent.

[Reactordrone]

As you get into thinner atmosphere the control authority of the aerodynamic surfaces decreases and you will have to tweak the thrust of the engines to maintain control. The mk 55s will need to be brought up to 100% and the main engine decreased. Also keep an eye on your monopropellant levels as there's a locked off tank on the learstar to supply the O-10 engines for the final insertion burn. It's not an easy one to fly but it will get you there.

Oh yes, definitely turn on both SAS and RCS on the pad.

[Lohan2008]

What everyone else said, the space plane is unbalanced; without tweaking the engines. A simple solution is to attach rockets to the wings and loose the centre tank.

[Reactordrone]

I should also add that once you get back into atmosphere its performance is also pretty bad with very little pitch authority and a narrow track landing gear that make rollover crashes on landing very likely. Moving the landing gear further out on the wing and replacing the canards with advanced canards make it much more user friendly.

[SaturnV]

Tried it several days ago, it seems that it's impossible to take it to orbit if you fly as it was. It lost control at ~15km due to the thin air as the controlling of this craft depends on aero controlling surface heavily.

Roll until the orbiter points to the sky and increase the thrust limit of those radial engine to 75% or higher from 43% at default, then you nailed it

[maltesh]

Yeah, learstar is more or less a failed shuttle that has terrible balance. It also doesnt look that good in my opinion, but it is definitely able to go to space with manual thrust limiting.

But like most stock craft, its more or less showing you what can be done in game, and isnt meant to be a fully functional craft right out of the box.

Ive deleted every stock craft except the kerbal X, as that one is after the buff to the poodle, able to land on mun and barely return, and probably make it to jool (never did this myself, but seen some vids with grav assists).

Even before the recent changes to the poodle and the Mainsail, the original Kerbal-X had enough delta-V to get to Jool without gravity assists. Safe landing anywhere in the Jool SOI other than Laythe was right out, though. I only had a few dozen m/s of delta-V left in the tanks when I crossed the Jool SOI boundary back when flew the mission in 0.21

[Random Tank]

I love the idea that all the stock craft have these little faults... You can go through them and point them out, like here's the rockets:

Ion-Powered Space Probe: Has no-where near enough power production to keep the Ion running for a decent period of time, so has to do short bursts or constant low thrust to actually get anywhere; it also needs a launch stage to actually get into orbit, as it can't do it itself.

Kerbal 2: Generally useless; can only go up to just over 3km alt, and no-where else; has an insane amount of MP for it's RCS thrusters which are nearly useless in Atmo. Needs a launch stage to actually get into orbit, as it can't do it itself.

Kerbal X: Even though it has asparagus, it's nearly useless as the LVT-30's have so little fuel to use; the Mainsail does most of the work. Surprisingly, not only does it have enough dV to get into orbit, it even has enough to and land on the Mun, but not get back

Orbiter 1A: Not bad in space, can get some decent fly-bys, even to Duna.... as soon as you add the fuel lines from the main fuel tank to its engines that it is currently missing; without those it's going no-where! Needs a launch stage to actually get into orbit, as it can't do it itself.

Rover + Skycrane: The Rover actually functions quite well; the Skycrane, not so much... it doesn't have the dV to land the Rover on the Mun (unless you bring something extra to de-orbit it, and even so it's very tight), and of course it can't gain orbit by itself... It can happily land on Mintmus though, and add one extra Oscar-B and it can land on the Mun! The Skycrane itself doesn't actually have a Probe Core, so ditching it after landing can be interesting

Space Station Core: Not bad actually, does what it's supposed to do... though anything that stays in orbit can be considered to be a station, so that isn't a hard goal to achieve. Needs a launch stage to actually get into orbit, as it obviously can't do it itself.

Super-Heavy Lander: Not particularly "Super Heavy" with that awful TWR, and it loses quite a bit of dV because of the angled engines; but it can land on pretty well anything, you just need to make a rocket to get it there, and it needs a launch stage to actually get into orbit, as it can't do it itself. Also, its RCS is actually completely imbalanced, and has waaaay too much MP on it.

Two-Stage Lander: I quite like this craft, it works well; it has enough dV to land on ANY body (yes, even Tylo), and even has enough to get back into orbit around any body excluding Laythe, Eve, Kerbin and Tylo (and obviously Jool). The issue? Well, obviously it's lander, so it something to get it into orbit, a transfer stage, and something to get the pilots back to Kerbin; and good luck docking to that without any RCS...

Z-MAP Satellite Launch Kit: Gets a sat into orbit... shame said sat doesn't have a battery, so it dies at night. The launch stage works well though, and would be useful for the Ion probe or the Skycrane if they were any good... its TWR is pretty insane though, the staging could use some work!

Gotta love em