Jump to content

Modular Fuel System Continued v3.3 (OBSOLETE)


Recommended Posts

Got a bug:

It seems that you can overload tanks with whatever fuel you're putting in. The "Available Volume" limit seems to not apply and you can put whatever values you want into it. The available volume just goes into negative figures. For example, I loaded 9999 Liquid Fuel into the jet fuselage and it was accepted and carried into launch. I think the mass calculation does calculate for that amount of fuel though.

On the plus side, it works with the old version of Toroidal and Spherical tanks, and still works with the old version of TAC life support.

Edited by Rayder
Missed some details
Link to post
Share on other sites

Well, I was too impatient to wait for stock tanks to be converted to the new 1L system, so I made some quick calculations. From what I can tell, the FL-T400 fuel tank is 1.25m x 1.875m (1.25m is a given of course, 1.875m is an estimation.) yielding a volume of about 2.3 cubic meters. 2.3m^3=2300L. Truthfully the capacity should be slightly less than that because not 100% of the tanks volume will go to storing fuel, but it's good enough. 2300/400=2.875, so 1 stock unit of fuel is about 2.875 liters. I went ahead and updated all of the volumes in Squad_modularFuelTanks.cfg to create a hotfix for anyone too impatient to wait. :)

Here is a pastebin with the code. Just open up Squad_modularFuelTanks.cfg in notepad, delete the contents, paste that in it's place, save, and you're good to go!.

EDIT: As I play with this, I notice that for some reason the .cfg update only works on new tanks, so any tanks on crafts you've already built still have the old volumes. Including saved crafts in the VAB. So yeah, this breaks crafts too, I guess.

Edited by VFB1210
Link to post
Share on other sites

Testing it. So far so good.

I can't wait to have the new RSS+MFS+Stretchy combination working again.

Oh and i'm interested in various configs for NTR... Right now LH2's low density pushes me to design rockets with very large fuel tanks, usually not easy to design if we need to consider aerodynamic stability issue with FAR.

Link to post
Share on other sites
Hm it seems with the 0.23 update I cannot anymore change what or how much fuel tanks contain. The window does not open under action groups even with original tanks. Using only "Regular Modular Fuels"

He's working on it, should be out soon

Link to post
Share on other sites
@ Mmmmyum: How does Krag's planet factory incorporate with RSS?

It works pretty well, they're all a lot easier to get to (and mostly within Kerbin's orbit), but there aren't any problems. Also I've got a feeling RSS rescales Krag's planets as well

Link to post
Share on other sites
Testing it. So far so good.

I can't wait to have the new RSS+MFS+Stretchy combination working again.

Oh and i'm interested in various configs for NTR... Right now LH2's low density pushes me to design rockets with very large fuel tanks, usually not easy to design if we need to consider aerodynamic stability issue with FAR.

Do like I Did, I modified my cfg's to allow a LH2 + LOX combination. Thas is a real life prossible combination for any NTR, the so called "Lox Augmented Ram injection". Just reduce the ISP a little.

Real life NTRs, specially the russian design, the RD0140, had 960s of ISP, with lox augmentation, the thrust increases by 3 times (so 180 vs 60) and the ISP is reduced by about 25% (I set to 800 isp my NTR with lox augmentation, keeping in par with original stock NTR)

Can´t wait for the fix of this mod, 0.23 was very disappointing, stock KSP isn´t fun anymore MFS expands the game so much more.

Link to post
Share on other sites

m_robber: Make sure you don't have any mods incompatible with .23

I've been developing MFS v4 on a stripped down KSP with just RO, DRE, MFS, and Stretchy, and a few parts mods, so my guess is your crash is coming from something else.

I have not yet officially switched to the latest MM (1.5.5) because Sarbian hasn't made it the official stable release yet. But it appears to work fine in .23. So make sure you have one (1) version of Module Manager, in the root GameData folder, and it's the most recent version (you can get 1.5.5 from Sarbian's thread). You should only ever use one Module Manager; any Module Manager with the same filename is equivalent.

Rayder: Ooh, that's a bad bug. Will fix ASAP.

Note however that it won't _really_ work with Spherical Tanks yet (or any tank excep stretchies) if you're playing Real Fuels mode, since eveything is 1/5 as dense and so volume units get multiplied by 5 (due to the switch from 1 KSP Volume Unit = 5 liters, to 1 = 1).

VFB1210: Actually, it's just a factor of 5 increase in a tank's volume, since I'm not yet (ohai Greys) using real volumes, just moving from the old MFS assumption of 1 unit = 5 liters to the new 1 unit = 1 liter. Note that that means, in either case, that I'm assuming that 80% of the "tank" volume is used for actual fuel tanks, which comports pretty well with Greys's calculation of actual usage for normal-shaped tanks.

the save breaking issue is twofold. First, MFS and Stretchie now care about loading order; the StretchyTanks module must appear after the MFT module in the .craft file (and in your SFS files). Second, RealFuels volumes changed but volume per tank (also basemass, also everything else) is persistent so if you want your old save and/or craft to work you will need to (1) multiply volume by 5, (2) multiply all resource amounts and tank amounts by 5, (3) fix basemass and each mass = line in every MFT module to be correct according to the new basemass and tank mass configuration in RealTankTypes. Note basemassPV is what appears at the top of the tank defintion (basemass = x * volume; x is basemassPV).

HoneyFox: LqdMethane is where it's at. Little loss of Isp, but enough of an increase in mass ratio to make up for it. Bob Braeunig did the calcs; I forget the link, but Starwaster has it.

Kass: metaphor released a version of RealSolarSystem.cfg designed to use both stock and Krag's planets. It's somewhere on the RSS thread. It also uses Visual Enhancements to make all planets look like they should, with proper clouds.

Mmmmyum: RSS doesn't by default, but it sure can if you change the cfg. :)

sephirotic: LANTR. You sure won't get 800s in LANTR though. More like ~550. (about 0.6941 the Isp, Starwaster calculated.) RD-0140 is a methalox engine; not sure to what you're referring.

Thanks so much! :)

EDIT: Ah, of course, RD-0410. I see 910s for it though, and haven't found anything on LANTR mode.

================

More testing notes.

If you DON'T want to play with Real Fuels, delete the RealFuels folder. No more 1 unit = 1 liter, too, you'll be back to stock KSP unit amounts and densities.

If you DO want to play with Real Fuels, and use non-stretchy tanks, just open the appropriate CFG in the ModularFuelTanks folder (like Squad_modularfueltanks.cfg) and multiply all volumes by 5 (so the FL-T800 would have volume 4000). I plan to do this myself, but...fell asleep last night.

Edited by NathanKell
Link to post
Share on other sites

I can't and don't read every post, so I very well might have missed it. From what I am gathering, MFS with RealFuels/RealMass will now be based on the 1Unit = 1Liter from here on out. Is this true. It's just fine by me, just trying to keep things straight.

Link to post
Share on other sites

sephirotic: LANTR. You sure won't get 800s in LANTR though. More like ~550. (about 0.6941 the Isp, Starwaster calculated.) RD-0140 is a methalox engine; not sure to what you're referring.

Thanks so much! :)

EDIT: Ah, of course, RD-0410. I see 910s for it though, and haven't found anything on LANTR mode.

================

More testing notes.

If you DON'T want to play with Real Fuels, delete the RealFuels folder. No more 1 unit = 1 liter, too, you'll be back to stock KSP unit amounts and densities.

If you DO want to play with Real Fuels, and use non-stretchy tanks, just open the appropriate CFG in the ModularFuelTanks folder (like Squad_modularfueltanks.cfg) and multiply all volumes by 5 (so the FL-T800 would have volume 4000). I plan to do this myself, but...fell asleep last night.

I'm going to have to take that Isp with a grain of salt in the absence of some indication that the USSR did a lot more hands on research (i.e. ground testing) than anything I've managed to find so far. Granted though, 1960s, iron curtain, total secrecy, so who knows. Even so we're talking about a 68kN thrust engine. If that's what they were aiming for in 1969 that doesn't speak well for LOX Augmented NTR or any Isp's in the 900s.

Re: Sleep. Do what I do! Sleep when you're dead :sticktongue:

Sephirotic: Nathan's right. You're not going to have an Isp of 800 with LANTR at triple the thrust. There's a table around that details what kind of thrust gains you'll get at varying H2/LOX mixture ratios and the corresponding drop in Isp. You're talking more like 500-600 Isp. The NTR configs I did that will be in the next big update have more realistic LANTR values and I'm thinking of expanding it to support multiple mixture ratios. It uses the hybrid engine interface to switch between them but it's a little clunky with more than two engine configurations. (but do-able)

Link to post
Share on other sites

One more thing I noticed, was removing tanks. On a stock tank that holds Liquid Fuel and Oxidiser, if you remove the Oxidiser tank and fill the rest with Liquid Fuel it works fine. But when you go back to parts editing and right click the tank the Oxidiser is still there, but it reads NaN and zero. Is the tank still meant to be there and just read zero? Or is it meant to be gone entirely? I vaguely remember in 0.22 the tank being completely gone.

Link to post
Share on other sites

@all re: sleep. Heh.

RedAV8R: yes, the RealFuels portion of MFS will be moving to 1L = 1 unit. "stock" MFS will still be around with no extra resources and normal volumes, for the (2?) people who use MFS but not RealFuels. :)

Rayder: Interesting. I've had all sorts of issues with stock resources being added back to a tank. Which tank was this?

Link to post
Share on other sites

I can't remember which tank it was, but it was one of the stock ones. It didn't really affect my design so I kinda shrugged it off and remembered later. I'll try it out again.

Re: Real Fuels

Well count me as 1 of those 2 that uses it without RealFuels :P

EDIT: It was the SA-1 LFT from KW Rocketry. Seems like the only tank it happens on, from what I can tell.

Edited by Rayder
Link to post
Share on other sites
@all re: sleep. Heh.

RedAV8R: yes, the RealFuels portion of MFS will be moving to 1L = 1 unit. "stock" MFS will still be around with no extra resources and normal volumes, for the (2?) people who use MFS but not RealFuels. :)

Rayder: Interesting. I've had all sorts of issues with stock resources being added back to a tank. Which tank was this?

I thought I mentioned this to you too. I've seen it in quite a few of them and I was under the impression that you were aware of it from something you said.

I've seen it in the KWR tanks.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Just a quick question. I am one of those that was using MFS with stock fuels (however I liked the real fuel ones). The only issue I had with the real fuels was that I had planned a long range mission but I only had enough fuel to get there and I was planning to get the fuel for the return trip by mining with kethane. Only then I realised that the converters didn't convert for the fuels I needed.

I am at work ATM so I don't remember the type of fuels that I used. But did I do something wrong and I should have been able to convert kethane back into real fuels or was it normal for me to not be able to use it??

At some point I would love to go full realism while using kethane and plan missions with being able to refine fuel to extend the range of the crafts (while keeping them light).

Link to post
Share on other sites

RedAV8R: yes, the RealFuels portion of MFS will be moving to 1L = 1 unit. "stock" MFS will still be around with no extra resources and normal volumes, for the (2?) people who use MFS but not RealFuels. :)

Awesome! Keep up the good work, and looking forward to the update! Probably grab the test to check out a few things myself.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Starwaster: I removed LF/Ox from all tanks via MM to get around that bug. You should have only seen it in the prior version, not the one I posted here.

SVoyager: MFS should support Kethane->Real Fuel conversion. But I haven't updated it in a bit. Will try to do so for this.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Bug report? Bug report. KW Rocketry engines are nonfunctional with the latest MF patch. I notice that under "real fuels" there used to be an engine.cfg file (rather large) that doesn't exist anymore--I gather you're trying to update all the mod engines, yes? Since that file is probably formatted incorrectly, pasting it in from the last version of MFSC stalls game loading out completelyAnyhow, file that one away, for when you wake up. and thanks for burning the midnight oil, man. It's been a sad week rummaging through my Steam library looking for other things to play while I waited for your patch to post....

Link to post
Share on other sites
This thread is quite old. Please consider starting a new thread rather than reviving this one.

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

×
×
  • Create New...