After finding this topic, all I want to do is experiement with FRT\'s, thanks alot ??? But seriously, I have found that from a nice circular orbit at 120km at a heading of 90 degrees, if I burn at \'munrise\' till my Ap is 14.5M km, that a free return is almost guaranteed, and for some reason I derive so much satisfaction from doing this over and over, it is almost pathetic... :\'( To the point where I have not even bothered with continuing to try to land on the mun, and have instead been working on fine tuning my rocket so that I have just enough fuel to get into orbit and do the munshot burn, and no more...