AngelLestat

Why terraforming when it is so easy to live in their clouds? In that case all the problems that you are mention dissapear. The venus atmosphere is really dense, so dense that even without parachute a probe can survive (already happen), descent speed is not more than 5 to 10 m/s. Winds down there are 10km/h top speed, this is still enoght to move some rocks. Geofrey Landis (my favorite NIAC scientist) propose this: “However, viewed in a different way, the problem with Venus is merely that the ground level is too far below the one atmosphere level. At cloud-top level, Venus is the paradise planet.†Landis has proposed aerostat habitats followed by floating cities, based on the concept that breathable air (21:79 Oxygen/Nitrogen mixture) is a lifting gas in the dense carbon dioxide atmosphere, with over 60% of the lifting power that helium has on Earth.[4] In effect, a balloon full of human-breathable air would sustain itself and extra weight (such as a colony) in midair. At an altitude of 50 kilometres above Venerian surface, the environment is the most Earth-like in the solar system – a pressure of approximately 1 bar and temperatures in the 0°C–50°C range. Because there is not a significant pressure difference between the inside and the outside of the breathable-air balloon, any rips or tears would cause gases to diffuse at normal atmospheric mixing rates rather than an explosive decompression, giving time to repair any such damages. In addition, humans would not require pressurized suits when outside, merely air to breathe, protection from the acidic rain and on some occasions low level protection against heat. Alternatively, two-part domes could contain a lifting gas like hydrogen or helium (extractable from the atmosphere) to allow a higher mass density. At the top of the clouds the wind speed on Venus reaches up to 95 m/s (approximately 212 mph), circling the planet approximately every four Earth days in a phenomenon known as "super-rotation". Colonies floating in this region could therefore have a much shorter day length by remaining untethered to the ground and moving with the atmosphere. Allowing a colony to move freely would also reduce structural stress from the wind. We can even mine the platet, we can get down machinery with hot air ballons using a nuclear reactor to heat the gases that you have inside the balon to make them always equal or more light that outside atmosphere, in this way you can control your altitude wherever you want. The machinery can be 4 days working and rise them (before the heat reach their circuits) and in time to dock with the floating city that has a orbiting period of 4 days. If you kept searching about venus, you will notice that this is not the only advatage.

Hi Blackheart, I dont understand what Kw procedural fairings does? What I imagine is: you get different textures for farings, you got only 2 farings by side instead 4 and you can still make any faring size with the procedural plugin. Is like that? Or how it works? You need KW rockety installed?

If you would quote my full sentence like this: "I also read that the cost to operate curiosity this year it will be 67 millons? Just to move the joystick and pay some geologists to put an eye in the data? (That they would do it for free if they ask) heh, I know that these things has their cost.. But 67 millons.." Your answer would lose sense, dont you? Of course that it has that price, all security measures, all control procedures, the chain delegation of tasks (id´tk how it is the real name in english) from one companie to another which everyone charge their 40% or 50% plus taxes, etc. So if justify or not, does not change the fact that seems a lot. Becouse we all know that if there is the need to cut the budget to the maximun, it could be done with much less. Nascar example also seems a lot, but it does not mean that is not justify, remake those super cars for each race is not cheap. I guess in most cases, we need learn to float before walk. I guess everybody would be agree with me if you ask them, what they prefer to watch, another mars picture or venus, titan, europe, jupiter clouds, etc. Now nasa is using some CNT sheets to shield against electromagnetic radiation. But I guess Nasa wants to send many probes to europa to planning the main future mission under the ice.. That would be the expensive one. Encelado also has a high chance of having life with all the water geisser which make their way through the ice. The ice also help to block radiation. You mean since we know for sure than the ADN can be made with arsenic instead of phosphorus. Besides the possible evidence of some kind of methabolism. Is a lot more easy to find or discard if there is life in Titan with cheap mission than the needed to Europe.

+1 for toolbar. It cant work this plugin without extra part?

ah.. that has more sense

I dont understand, in some places said that it cost 80 millons and in other page said that it would cost 5 Billons the europa mission. It would be only some fly by, not landing in europa. I also read that the cost to operate curiosity this year it will be 67 millons? Just to move the joystick and pay some geologists to put an eye in the data? (That they would do it for free if they ask) heh, I know that these things has their cost.. But 67 millons!! In my personal view I dont find mars so intesting. I would prefer to see more missions to Europa, Titan, Encelado, Venus or Jupiter. For example missions to venus are a lot cheaper than mars, it is more easy to colonize than mars. And give us a different planet view that we dont have, those help us to keep dreaming. Instead of see the same red martian rocks.

Haha, yes. it seems this mod gets an update every day

Ok yeah, now I understand, I dint knew that they need so low working temperatures, if it was 20k then it would be easy to cool it down with normal radiation process. Good reasearch work guys.

why the IR telescope needs lqHelium? To cool it? But what heat would receive from 550AU?

So? nobody find anything in my mod list anything that can enter in conflict with IQ mod? The sun focal point (to alpha centauri) mission it has really big value for science. Is almost as important like send a probe to alpha centauri to take some pictures from the system at close distance. For that reason the mission is already been planned, but it has a lot of technical difficulties like you can see. What is the point to be in orbit at that distance? There is not orbit, your orbital speed it would be 400 m/s and your orbital period 4000 years. The focus point "start" at 550 AU (to see an object close it than 4 ly), but go on after that, the best distance to use telescopes it is 700 AU or more. So you dont need to stop there. With 200AU or 300AU you can not see any object closer than 4ly, at that distance you would could see only objects that are 500ly or more I guess. (I dint make the math) But what is the benefic in that? If we found good pictures of planets from a star 500ly from us, what is the point if we cant go there. Otherwise, if you send a mission to 550 Au or beyond, you can use that satellite to amplify the the comunications with the ship you send to that star system focal point. Those are the main reasons.

Reading all the chemistry talk and minering, it really push me to install the full IQ package. But I still need to solve some bugs. The only that I need like guide to start, if you people help me to indentify some mods conflict that I may have. I dont wanna make spend time to anybody making analisys, I just was hoping a quick read to see if someone of you had problems with mods of this list before. Thanks. This is my mod list: Squad (all tanks, adapters, chutes, aerodinamycs parts, cones and others parts remove) Real Fuels 4.3 (with chestbuster config engines) StretchySRB_v8_1 ProceduralDynamics0.7 ProcFairings_2.4.3 (I remove half of the parts) B9_Aerospace_Pack_R4.0c (all aerodinamycs parts and extra tank fuel type remove, etc) NovaPunch2_03a (all tanks, adapters, or similar parts remove) RealChute-v0.3.3.2 (some parts remove) ALCOR Capsule-v0.7 KAS_v0.4.5 (5 parts remove) InfernalRobotics0.12 (like 15 parts remove) Smart-parts-v0.4 (3 parts remove) Habitat Pack TarsierSpaceTech_2.4-VE SCANsat_b5 Toolbar 5.0 RemoteTech2_Release_1.3.3 FerramAerospaceResearch_v0.12.5.2 DeadlyReentryCont_v4.3 LifeSupportMode ECLSS 1.0.15 Action Group Manager 1.3.2.0 Raster Prop Monitor 0.14 KSI MFD1_1a targetron 1.3.4 editor extensions 0.6 KerbalAlarmClock_2.7.0.0 EnhancedNavBall_1_2 DockingPortAlignment_3.01 MechJeb2-2.1.1.01 Kos 10 MultipleSavesDA016 Kalculator-0.1 RCSBuildAid_v0.4.4 TacFuelBalancer_2.3.0.2 ThrottleControlledAvionics1.11 VertVel131 TweakableEverything-0-6-2 KerbalJointReinforcement_v2.0 VisualEnhancments-6-7 (pimp my clouds) Texture Remplacer (edraxial planets and moons, pimp my kerbals, skybox) TextureCompressor-2-15-aggressive Last ExsurgentEngineering.dll and Firespitter.dll Works fine until I add Interstellar quest, then I have some graphics bugs if I go and back 2 or 3 times from launch to the VAH (maybe due to memory), or I can not end or delete vessels from Tracking Station, some other problems with part activations, etc.) I understand, you are right, There are different approach.

Fractal: Since you figure out how to increase speed in warp drive mode using solar sails. It would not be time to adjust the ion engine to their real values. This mean more ISP, less energy consumption, less thrust. If you reduce the solar sail mass from 1t to 0.1T, you can reach 75000 m/s in escape velocity, with that you can reach 550 AU in 1100 days. This mean 15 min in at full warp time mode? I am not sure.. But is not much.

Fractal: Since you figure out how to increase speed in warp drive mode using solar sails. It would not be time to adjust the ion engine to their real values. This mean more ISP, less energy consumption, less thrust.

Your creations looks awesome porkjet. This upgrade toroidal is great. And about the gravitational ring diameter, you have plans to add a new one with extra diameter? "but with the same tuvb diameter"

Again.. FTL is not the only way! :S But like I´m tired to reply these comments, I would make a post of all the possibilities that the game has to include near realistic propulsion methods to other star systems. Also keeping the game play and balance. I never did it before, becouse this would take me more than 5 hrs to make. here we go...

The only that matters is the structure of how the information is related. Once we understand how this process work and how to replicate.. then an AI superior to us would emerge without even noticing. You think that we are so much intelligent that cats or monkey just becouse we have cars, or internet? Why if you born in the jungle and a couple of chimps take care of you? You would not know how to make fire, how to make a trap (that idea will never cross your mind), how to hunt, unless the chimps teach you. Yeah, thats right. All the things that we know and have; is becouse our culture, millons and millons of discoveries by error or chance, transmited from generation into generation. The only difference that we might have with other animals is a different mind structure which gives us better chance to think out the box, or to relate information, etc. Also we are very good copying behaviors. But if a computer can relate information in the way that a brain does it.. Then it can scan all the internet in just some days and know all the things that we know and more in just days or less. So how you really dare to said that you would be able to "understand" and "talk" with such artificial awareness..

I am agree with mostly of your points. But I dont guess we are in position to estimate an AI behavior or feelings to predict what would happen... Even to day Neurologists and psychologists can not understand or fully predict all the human behavior and fellings. So is naive to think that we can understand how a self conscious AI would feel. Maybe the ai would process information and conscious thought in miliseconds, so wait for commads or answers from our part will be very tedious and boring.. then particuar feelings can arise. Same from the point of view of their existence and fate. Some people become crazy just becouse they are able to think and predict over different experiences.. Like death. But if you are not intelligent, you dont have such problems. We have many natural evolve brain mechanics that prevents distract us from our common activities related to survival. You should read my post in the third page to understand my point of view better. That is why I suggest we need to born in a primitive enviroment, then after some time lived, transcend to more technology place, and after many years transcend again into a new form completely artificial. That is (I guess) the only solution to face all problems that we can deal in millons of years avoiding natural extintion at the same time that self-destroy causes.

That is a question that I would like to know too, maybe I can try that with a solar sail. I dont know how it is, but if we asume that is like in the real live, it will start to function from 550AU and beyond. In fact 700Au is the best place becouse you dont have all sun corona distorting the image. But more beyond that, it will start to be a little more hard to aim. Thanks Chlue! -------------------------------------- I was testing the Solar Sail with reduced mass, from 1T to 0.1T, this is a little more close to a dielectric or carbon sail material base. In fact, if we have for the same 400x400 area, with 0,01g/m2 sail density (CNT mesh), the sail mass will be 2,5kg (instead 1T with kapton) plus 30% of that mass for inflatable booms and reirforcements (also can be deploy it using centrifugal force) it would have a total mass of 3,5 kg. So my 100kg value is still very humble. Images speak for themselves: 75000m/s in ksp is not bad. I would like to start to install other parts from interstellar Quest, but I have a lot of mods and I having already many bugs, like example, I can not start a mission more than 2 times becouse all graphics crash since I install IQ files. So there is a compatibility mod list? Or maybe I can give you the list of the mod that I have and you tell me if you had similar problems with some of those.

But that does not change my point, don't you? So you find your speed direction problem? it was one of those 4 that I mention?

you dont need to excuse your self, I know that you are too busy with so many comments and all your stuff that you are doing. But I just want to feel my self usefull due to you are doing all the work of what I like most. There is not structure. Is all inflatable booms, here there is a rudimentary example All the gas tanks and mechanism to inflate and deploy the solar sail are detached once the sail is open. Here is a sunjammer pdf of how it works. Sunjammer mass is 34 kg, sail mass is 8 kg, but the remaning 26 kg is not solar sail structure, is mostly payload (instruments). With 1T of mass that you set, reduce a lot the amount of payload that we can add, also make impossible to make some escape maneuvers from kerbol system. So there is not KSP limit to how light can be? Also I find it interesting if that weight is the base weight and then we can upgrade it like you do with radiators. (but i cant do it from sandbox i guess)

damm what I said to get always ignored by fractal? :S Well I need to ask others, someone know if the solar sail values or radiators values can be upgrade or (already are upgraded) in sandbox mode? Solar Sail 1T mass seems like it use to day solar sails materials with a densitie of 7g/m2, but the radiators are made of graphene according to description, or is just due to some KSP problem with strenght-lightness config? If we take the same 400x400 solar sail area made of graphene with density of 0,01 g/m2, their mass will be only 0,05 T (this a realistic aproximation of what we can achieve in 10 or 20 years with reflective surfuce, of course if is pure graphene it will be a lot less light than that.)

But I was surprice be one of the first to comment about that since the 10. version. I can imagine 4 possibilities.1-You thought that already leave kerbin sphere of influence and you point the solar sail into some polar direction in your navball, when in fact was pointing to kerbin. (it happen to me) 2-You place your probe or manned part in different direction from the sail. Or you have more than one and you mess with "control from here" option. 3-The gain speed in the direction that you saw was cause by gravity depeding the position of your orbit. 4-bug

Fractal, can you answer my 623 page post about sails. Why nobody else use them?

Like nobody does, I will.. I test the new solar sail, so I will leave my thoughts. Is great, I love it. I had a lot of fun playing with it. The acuracy of the physsics laws involved like angular light incidence, radiation inverse square law and thermal radiation properties (i dint check them very much). Or the way that you solve the warp time problem; even squad would not do it better. Also the SasquatchM Solar Sail model and deploy animation is better than I imagine. Very elegant. But I have some doubts or questions, to test this, I delete almost all other parts less the ones that has relevance with thermal or electrical properties. I did this becouse I am full of mods, and I cut almost 60% of parts to each mod, plus the active texture reductor. So I experiment some weird bugs, and I am not sure if all the data that I see is correct. "I will install most of your parts eventually, but first I need to planning how to do it." I play in the sandbox mode. I notice that some parts can lv up with tech improvements, But in sandbox I dint see the option, so what value the parts choose? The solar sails mass is 1T? This is the base weight or not? My estimation taking 1300 w/m2 at (1AU kerbin orbit) with 1N of force, is that the real solar sail dimentions are close to 400mts x 400mts, in KSP scale 1/10 this will be 40x40 like the model that we see (I understand this is mostly to avoid some unity engine problems and practical implementation of the solar sail) Why you choose 1T? Is for technical problems with the strenght of the sail due to KSP way to calculate things or the weight of the sail in 400mtsx400mts using kapton (sunjammer material)? Well like I said, is a great mod and job, Congrats Fractal. Is weird that not much people is testing this. Maybe is difficult at first. I will add a little guide: How to use solar sails for those who wanna try and still had some doubts: You need to try to make your payload the most light possible. This is how I test it. My payload is 0,6T. Like fractal already explain, we can thrust at different directions just reflecting the light in the opposite direction that we want. The potential is great, we can achieve 22 m/s by day at 1AU, in few days we can achieve a DV of 700 m/s without any proppelent. Close to the sun this will be a lot faster. Some advices: -You can use Maneuver nodes to planning some encounters. -Set these maneuver nodes some days ahead of your mid ""burn"" estimation. -You can use and set all different cordinates from the maneuver node less one. "The Radial In" (sun direction) See this, so you need to plan your encounters without using that cordinate. Is like sail boats, we can not sail in the opossite direction that the wind blows. How you can see in some of the images, this has a lot of potential, how much proppelent you will need to get so close to the sun? Unfortunately in that image I lost conection and my sail crash XD

not, is just lack of creativity But I can not judge becouse I dint read any of those. The movie is great to that time, is even more acurate that acurate movies from this time. Fun fact, I discover Song of distant earth book listening Song of distant earth music album