Death Engineering

Vall Station leaving LKO [Mission Report Three] "The Vall mission is underway!" The news of the first two Vall mission vessels leaving LKO was announced over the KSC loudspeaker. In every lab and office all the way out to the VAB, cheers and applause rang out in celebration of the biggest undertaking the KSC had ever taken on. The Vall Station, with eight science crew and one pilot and would also serve as the Kerbin return vehicle for the landing teams, would arrive at Jool in 250 days. The dual Vall landers, docked together for the trip out, would arrive 14 days later. Aboard each lander was a crew of five science experts and one pilot. However, one room was not celebrating: the Uncrewed Science Robotics engineering room. Due to a shortage of Kerbal engineers, the robotic components of the Vall mission were not ready for this launch window. The Vall orbiting science crew and landing teams were prepared for this and were happy to wait for the probes to arrive from the next window, but Kerson Kerman, efficiency expert, was furious! When Kerson heard that the landing team and orbiting science team were heading to Vall without their robotic science probes, he called Bob into his office and demanded answers. "Well, Kerson, you know.. it's the holidays. We didn't have time to finish the robotic components of the mission. We were thinking that the orbiting team could look around for anything interesting for the landing teams to investigate and then when the probes are ready we would just sent them out on the next window," was Bob's explanation. "The holidays? You think you get holidays?!? Holidays are.. NOT.. EFFICIENT!" Kerson yelled. "How did we ever make it to Mun?" Kerson asked rhetorically. "It is a good thing I'm going on this mission. You are going on the mission, too, Bob. You are on the landing team. Bill will pilot the other lander. Jebediah will pilot the Vall Station craft. I will be keeping an eye on you, Bob. You don't seem very efficient for the Director of the Kerbal Space Center." Eventually, Kerson agreed to let the orbiting team and landing teams head to Vall before the science probes were ready. All the crew members were boarded on their crafts and waited in LKO for the Jool window. After 4 burns arounds LKO to gain advantages from the Oberth effect, both craft were set for an encounter with Jool where they would aerocapture into Vall's orbit. During the launch of the Vall station, Jebediah looked rather exhausted like he'd been running around KSC all morning. Bill, who arrived late to the launch of his Vall lander and almost missed it, also looked rather disheveled. Kerson boarded his lander very early and was continually barking orders through the radio all morning right up until launch. He would not be denied his efficient launch. As Bob ascended to LKO he had some time to reflect and noted that he had never seen Kerson talking to Jeb or Bill but instead always gave Jeb's and Bill's orders to Bob so he could relay them. As Bob's lander achieved orbit and waited for Bill's lander to dock to it prior to leaving for Vall, Bob developed a theory: could Kerson Kerman really be Jeb in disguise? Vall Landers leaving LKO In the next mission report... Bob confronts Jeb during deep space trip to Jool Kerson makes an inefficient mistake Arrival at Jool

Although I don't have a specific revulsion to mod parts (I just simply don't use them), I am a fan of anything NASA and curious where this thread is going. Subbed! @frizzank: Nice looking Merkury you got there!

Do your ports try to repel the two craft?

Thanks for fixing my totals! The way you added the additional Kerbals here makes more sense than your earlier reply of 20 points for 4 per landing. And yep, no jet engines. All lifters will be NASA style and the ones seen in 01, but I may need to use my 'Konstellation' challenge's 'Ares V' style (still NASA.. can't blame them if the program got cancelled lol). Q: Can I move to a new save file for this challenge moving forward?

Hehe.. that LES really got out of harms way in a big hurry! Cool deployable rovers, too. Looking great! LMK if I need to update your progress score.

First Mission Complete (barely) After completing the mission and making it gracefully back to LKO, I only then realized it clearly says "Minmus first". I did Mun first. The subsequent attempt was fraught with navigation problems that almost had me ejecting past Minmus into Kerbol orbit. In the end, had to sacrifice points for multiple landings in order to recover the mission. The Munar satellites were deployed first, only after barely leaving LKO. After a gravity assist pass 41km over the Mun, the VIC-20 (core craft) and VCM1 lander were on course for a Minmus encounter. The problems began when switching to the probes to get them into correct alignment. For some reason the Minmus encounter happened much earlier than expected and it coasted well past Minmus Pe. After a long burn, orbit around Minmus was set up at 20km near the equator. However, the extra fuel burned in the Minmus near-flyby recovery meant only a single Minmus landing instead of the three planned. In keeping with debris management, the now-unneeded drop tanks were disposed on Minmus. The satellite mounting structure was also dropped onto Minmus. Less than 2 days later, the Mun was in the right position and after a short burn from Minmus, orbit around the Mun was established (slightly higher at 30km). The landing site was flat and the landing team posed for one last pic before docking again with the VIC. Once the crew was back aboard the VIC, one pilot flew the LM to a Munar impact trajectory then EVA'd back to the VIC. After leaving Munar orbit, went out to 13000 km to correct inclination before aerocapture back to LKO. By the time a 75km parking orbit was established, less than 3% fuel was remaining. Much too close for a mission around the neighborhood... The crew was returned to Kerbin by a "Big Gemini" 7 crew LKO taxi. All lifters and the Big G were developed for the Apollo Applications Project challenge. The main lifter is based on the Saturn 5 with two 5-engine stages to LKO. The Big G lifter is based on the Saturn 1B with an 8 engine first stage and single engine second stage to LKO. Long EVA back from LM Summary: 2 satellites deployed around Mun 2 satellites deployed around Minmus 4 crew landed on Minmus 1 rover deployed on Minmus 4 crew landed on Mun Scoring: Mission: Mission complete with two satellites deployed and one landing per moon without refueling +150 One satellite deployed on both equatorial and polar orbits for Minmus +10 One satellite deployed on both equatorial and polar orbits for Mun +10 More than one Kerbal lands on a moon 5 *4 Kerbals *2 landings = +40 Deploy a ground communications unit attached to a rover body +10 Points that never change: Littering the system - You left space junk floating around in space = -5 Eat your vegetables - Launch a craft or attachment into orbit without asparagus staging = +5 points Bring the Gang along for the ride - For each additional Kerbal brought on a mission and returned to Kerban Orbit after the mission is complete (All Kerbals must be in a pod, external command seats not allowed) = 10 *4 = +40 Total: 260

Thanks, that answered my questions. Just one more.. do I need to refuel the core craft and deliver the mission package on a single launch, or can multiple launched be used to refit and equip the core craft? Say, could I send up a tanker then one or two separate launches of parts for the next mission?

Thanks! Your concept for a "sustainable" challenge is excellent - good job! Couple of questions, if I may.. "Landing on both Poles and the equator +10 points" - Is this +10 points for doing all three on Mun and another +10 for Minmus? "More than one Kerbal lands on a moon +5 points per Kerbal" - Is this scored for each extra Kerbal on both the Mun landing(s) and Minmus landing(s)?

I guess we will see.. hopefully not too much "err"ing! And, good luck yourself. There will be many points I don't try for.. Pending approval of the "VIC-20", this is the mission package for the first challenge:

From the Death Engineering secret underground laboratory... VIC-20 (Versatile Interplanetary Craft) Docking: 3x Clamp-O-Tron Sr. Docking Port, 1x Clamp-O-Tron Docking Port, 2x Inline Clamp-O-Tron Propulsion: 2x LV-N Atomic Rocket Motor, 4x RV-105 RCS Thruster Block, 2x Place-Anywhere 7 Linear RCS Port Fuel: 1080 liquid fuel/1320 oxidizer, 750 monopropellant Crew: 2x command crew, 4x support crew Power: 2x Gigantor XL Solar Array, 23x OX-STAT Photovoltaic Panels, 2130 electric charge Design: 123 parts, 30.2 t in orbit fully fueled - Test Run Complete

Sure that's totally fine. Are you carrying the rover to the Mun on a lander or on an orbiter? Either is fine, just curious.

[Mission Report 2 - Kerson Kerman Arrives on the Scene] In this report, we meet Kerson Kerman, efficiency expert. Is he hiding something? Who is his assistant? The Vall Lander gets redesigned, Vall station gets to orbit, and Kessler Kerman shares his view of space debris. Vall Lander Mk.2 with its mini-tug

[Mission Report 2 - Kerson Kerman Arrives on the Scene] "Good morning. I am Kerson Kerman and most of you haven't met me. Once you get to know me, you probably aren't going to like me very much. The rest of you whom I've met, already don't like me. This is fine. This is efficient." After a brief pause, he continued in a proud voice and looking up at nothing in particular, "I am efficient." Kerson Kerman arrived at KSC early that day and had spent the entire day inspecting every production room, every design station, every test result and every storage room. However, until now, he not spoken to anyone. He was addressing the entire workforce at KSC, from Bob the director down to the kerbal who paints the little marks on the side of the Astronaut Complex for every explosion on the launch pad; Kerson had to make an appointment long in advance to talk to him. Kerson was an efficiency expert who was to play a key role in the Vall Space Program. He would have executive control on all design decisions, all pilot assignments, and all mission objectives. He was even going along on the mission to Vall to ensure that everything is carried out with the highest level of efficiency. Jeb and Bill were suspiciously absent from the meeting, however. After pacing back and forth several times, with every kerbal's silent gaze following him in unison, he said quietly, "On Duna, there was..." his voice raising in pitch and volume, "..considerable.." then finishing off in a shrill scream, "..WASTE!" He paced back and forth several times agin then resumed in a slow, quiet voice, "I read the crew reports. In the end.." voice raising in pitch and volume again, "..you destroyed.." back into a shrill scream, "..THREE SHIPS!" "This.. must not.. happen.. AGAIN! Lights!" Instantly, the lights went off. "Slide one!" Kerson yelled to a hidden operator obscured by a curtain. On the screen behind Kerson was the image of the proposed Vall lander jettisoning its booster stage. Clearly visible were pieces of the fairing, which surrounded the decoupler and protected the ascent avionics package, being ejected in all directions into space. As the KSC staff looked at the image, various quiet comments could be heard about the new lander and its ability, the new science parts added to it, and the recent loss of the prototype when Ludlong ran it out of fuel and crashed it into the grass outside the VAB. However, more notably, a 'gasp' was heard from the back of the room. Kerson continued, "Look at this lander. It is not efficient! It is massive, has many unneeded parts, probably isn't stable on anything but a perfectly flat landing site, and its incredibly ugly! This lander must be scrapped and redesigned immediately. It must be efficient! It must be more stable than this monstrosity, and don't let Ludlong do the test flight! Next slide!" The next slide showed the deployment of the Vall Station from its booster stage, again pieces of the protective fairing could be seen floating away from the station after the booster stage was jettisoned. And again, from the back of the room in a dark corner, everyone could hear a loud 'gasp' from an unseen kerbal, followed by a quiet, "Why.. why.. why.." Kerson began, "Now, bring your attention to.. who is that back there? Who is interrupting my efficient discussion of inefficiency? Lights!" As the lights came on, everyone turned to see who was causing the interruption. In the back of the room, one of the junior engineers could be seen holding his head in his hands and shaking his head slowly. As Kerson addressed him, the clearly distraught kerbal looked up and replied, "I'm Kessler.. Kessler Kerman." "Alright Kessler Kerman, why are you interrupting my efficient discussion of inefficiency? Come on, speak up," Kerson said with a harsh glaring stare towards Kessler. Kessler stood up and pointed towards the slide image still faintly visible on the screen. "Look at that debris! All those little fairing parts, the decoupler, they're all still up there in orbit above us right now! Even though the booster stage is de-orbited and crashed into the sea, all those small parts are up there in our standard orbital path travelling at almost 2.5 km per second.. if they were to hit something we're launching or is already in orbit, a collision could be katastrophic!" Silence fell in the conference room. Kerson appeared to turn a slightly lighter shade of green, then spoke, "That would not be efficient." After a short pause he regained his normal green color then said quickly and loudly, "Meeting adjurned early! You, Kessler, you're with me! We have a new lifter to design!" Without waiting to see if Kessler followed, Kerson walked out of the room. Kessler, not sure if he was really supposed to follow, shrugged his shoulders and had a confused look on his face as he sat back down. A moment later, Kerson popped his head back into the room and said loudly, "I don't like to repeat myself! That is not efficient! Kessler, you are in charge of the new debris-free lifter for the Vall Space Program. Let's go meet with Bob to get the ball rolling." Kessler stood up with a prideful smile and followed Kerson out of the room. The rest of the KSC staff slowly dispersed back to their normal routines, except for the kerbal who was operating the lights and projector; instead, he quietly ducked out the back door without anyone seeing who he was. [Vall Lander Mk.2 Mun Landing Test] After working furiously hard over the next two days, the Vall Lander Mk.2 was ready for testing. Ludlong was not chosen to test it on the ground. Instead, the lander was launched, untested on the ground, into Kerbin orbit. Unfortunately, the new debris-free lifter was not ready for this launch causing Kessler Kerman to shift uncomfortably in his seat when the lander was deployed in orbit, sending fragments of its launch fairing into space. On board the lander was Bob and Ludlong, both experienced pilots, but neither had been in space since returning from their trip to Duna. After the lander was safely in orbit, they both went on EVA to inspect the lander for damage. Being on EVA put them outside radio range of mission control, giving them a few minutes to talk privately. "Hey, Bob! Everything looking good from here!" Ludlong chirped in his typically cheerful way as he inspected the landers science equipment. Bob, who was inspecting the landing legs and fuel lines replied, "Thank you Ludlong. Say what do you think of this new efficiency expert, Kerson?" "Well, Bob, he seems a little uptight. But, I guess that's how he is good at his job. How do the fuel lines look, Bob?" "That Kerson.. there's something about him I don't trust. Fuel lines check out." "Awww, remember when you and I met? You didn't think much of me, either. Now look at us! We're space buddies!" "Yeah, I guess so. Legs check out. Lets go take this thing to the Mun." "Sure thing, Bob!" The Vall Lander Mk. 2 made a successful landing on the Mun and because it carried enough delta-v to land on Vall it was able to easily land on the Mun and have enough to spare in order to reach Mun orbit and back to Kerbin's surface. When Bob and Ludlong returned, Bob asked a few other senior staff around the KSC if they found anything usual about Kerson Kerman, besides his obsession with efficiency, but no one else felt suspicious about Kerson. However, Bob trusted his own ability to sense when things were wrong, and he sensed something very wrong with Kerson. But what could it be, he wondered? Vall Station and Vall Lander

Brilliant!

Never use the command seat for anything other than rover/hopper; kerbals must always launch in a command pod. No part mods of any kind (not even KER) Lost kerbals stay lost No asparagus No debug

Is that 2 stages of SRBs there, or mod SRBs? Looks cool either way!

Looking great so far. Just note that the mission profile requirement is for a single-launch mission. Not sure if that's what you're doing, but just wanted to mention that. Good luck on your Duna landing!

Made four landings there which had the intent of returning to orbit, of which only two were successful. The last successful return was two kerbals in the mk 2 Lander can. I'd like to try three or four next using a "cluster" of mk 1 Lander cans now that I've realized their low mass. Time for attempt 5...

Design assistance mods are fine. What kind of side mounted things do you mean?

Rather.. I'd say that would be something which would happen "off camera".

This part of the challenge implies that the maximum range a kerbal can EVA on foot while on Duna is 10km and the maximum range a kerbal can EVA while in their rover is 100km. Using a robotic rover to pick up the crew would have unlimited range while un-crewed. So, if they need to travel more than that to get to their KRV, they could be in trouble. However, an argument could be made that if using a pressurized rover, the range would be unlimited. I would accept that argument.

There is no exclusion of LV-N engines, same for ion drive engines. The rule against RTG's on the Orion is only there to reward designs which stick to the RL Orion specs.

Hey sturmstiger, welcome back!

Well, that is a problem then.. If you could get close enough to Kerbin you could use that Clampo-Sr. to dock a heat shield to it. That would count in your launches, so maybe send up your next mission fitted with a heat shield on one end and a Clampo-Sr. on the other with the intent of doing a deep space rendezvous and docking to your lander. One heat shield for both missions.

Have you tried coming in around 14km alt over Duna, just enough to aerocapture? If you can do that without getting re-entry effects and into at least any orbit, no matter how elliptical, then do repeated aerobrake orbits until your Ap is low enough.