Jool 5 Mission report with far too many pictures.

[John FX]

Here is a gallery with far too many pictures from my Jool 5 attempt. I used FAR and DRE and the ALCOR capsule as it makes a good inline capsule and I like the IVA when you use RPM.

It includes all the failed attempts as well and is around 680 images.

I'll edit the gallery and this post to provide a better report for the people who have to check that it is a legitimate attempt.

I totally overprovisioned my craft as I came back with nearly a full large fuel tank...

Here is the overinflated gallery, I'm in the middle of unpacking from moving home but I'll try to make this into a more sensible report when I have the time.

I made good use of the quicksave feature so if some images seem out of order that is the reason. I'll remove those so the mission seems more like a real one when I have time.

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Edited March 17, 2015 by John FX

[Randazzo]

I'm a little surprised that ship didn't shake itself apart aerobraking over Jool with DRE.

That's about as far as I got. This looks interesting but needs some "optimization"

[John FX]

I'm a little surprised that ship didn't shake itself apart aerobraking over Jool with DRE.

That's about as far as I got. This looks interesting but needs some "optimization"

Totally agree. I'll do a bit now by removing the first attempt which did not have enough Dv, that should nearly halve the images.

EDIT down to 343 images now...

As far as shaking itself apart, there are a lot of struts on V2.0 which is part of the reason a second ship was sent...

Edited March 18, 2015 by John FX

[John FX]

Here goes.

The plan called for lander craft that could land on all 5 moons of Jool. Budget restrictions meant we only had enough funds for 2 landers so the two problem moons Laythe and Tylo were singled out as the limits of performance for the landers. An airbreathing lander was designed for Laythe and a High Dv lander was created for Tylo with the orbit section of the Tylo lander having refuel capability for the center stage and this stage was given landing legs to enable it to land on the remaining 3 moons.

It was decided to build the craft in orbit at the OCS (Orbital Construction Station) and refuel it there. A previous failed mission to Jool had found that the KR-2L did not have the performance envelope required for the mission so a cluster of NERVA engines was used for the second attempt.

The launches were separated into tylo lander, laythe lander, propulsion section, Hab unit (designed for reentry at the end of the mission), Ferry unit with 2 NERVA and some utility adapters with differing sizes of docking ports and RCS.

It was decided that just a few fixed solar panels would supply enough energy for the mission but a hefty battery bank would be needed.

The images show the construction of the Jool 5 starting with the ferry unit meeting up with the OCS then the propulsion unit. The rest of the sections are launched and assembled in orbit.

Once this is done the fuel needed is sent up and the hub and refuel craft are pulled from the middle of the two sections which then dock to make the final configuration.

Then we go off to Jool.

The initial aerobraking was not enough to capture the craft in Jool orbit so a burn was made to keep the craft in Jool SOI.

Quite a few aerobrakes followed to reduce the Ap closer to Laythe. A chance encounter with Tylo increased the Ap a bit requiring yet more aerobraking.

A small correction burn put the craft on a course for Laythe SOI. Another aerobrake and correcting burn and we entered Laythe orbit where the Laythe lander and ferry unit detached from the craft and burned to circularize around Laythe. the lander detached and burned to deorbit. There were a few failed attempts to touch down on land as it seems the Laythe lander was prone to exploding on quicksave reload if landed in water.

After launch the lander docked with the ferry unit which then burned to rendezvous with the main craft. After docking the lander was left in Laythe orbit and a maneuver was planned to transfer to tylo.

A similar method was executed for Tylo. Attain orbit, detach lander and ferry, circularise, land, launch and dock. This left the lander in a much smaller state than before although still with 2000Dv when refuelled and a good TWR. After meeting up with the main craft again the next destination was Val.

Rinse repeat.

Then Pol

rinse repeat.

Finally Bop.

At this point it was noticed that nearly a full large fuel tank remained giving nearly 8000 Dv and only needing just over 1600 to get home so the mission could probably have been done with only two of the three fuel tanks in the propulsion unit.

The burn home was made and another burn to make the craft reenter kerbins atmosphere. A couple of quicksave reloads gave us the right Pe to hit Kerbin at and the Hab pod was landed in the water.

I then spent about 10 minutes getting all the kerbals to stand on the pod looking cool but the pod then rolled and they all fell into the water...

This is my Jool 5 mission report.

[Nik333]

I would say this is legit entry for Jool-5 on 3rd Level.

You have taken pretty large vessel to Jool. Was it very wobbly? I had smaller vessel for Jool-5 and it was wobbly as hell... Also, screenshots could have been better, I mean taking screens of your Delta-v before and after every important thing.

About aerobraking, if you have used any aerobraking calculator, you would save time, not doing aerobraking so many times. I was also surprised that you did Tylo landing before Vall, but with that lander, it was necessary.

I was checking Tylo landing for long time. First I thought it was impossible with that lander. I have estimated mass of lander to 6 tons and did some thrust calculations and first result was that it will hit ground faster than it will slow down. Then I have seen takeoff and middle engine which I haven't noticed before. I have did calculations again and now I believe it was ok.

Maybe you could do a Minmus or Mun landing with so many fuel left, to make mission even better, but who cares. No further commentary needed. Good job!

EDIT: Ignore my comment about aerobraking, I have just realized you have DRE installed...

Edited March 25, 2015 by Nik333

[John FX]

I would say this is legit entry for Jool-5 on 3rd Level.

You have taken pretty large vessel to Jool. Was it very wobbly? I had smaller vessel for Jool-5 and it was wobbly as hell... Also, screenshots could have been better, I mean taking screens of your Delta-v before and after every important thing.

About aerobraking, if you have used any aerobraking calculator, you would save time, not doing aerobraking so many times. I was also surprised that you did Tylo landing before Vall, but with that lander, it was necessary.

I was checking Tylo landing for long time. First I thought it was impossible with that lander. I have estimated mass of lander to 6 tons and did some thrust calculations and first result was that it will hit ground faster than it will slow down. Then I have seen takeoff and middle engine which I haven't noticed before. I have did calculations again and now I believe it was ok.

Maybe you could do a Minmus or Mun landing with so many fuel left, to make mission even better, but who cares. No further commentary needed. Good job!

EDIT: Ignore my comment about aerobraking, I have just realized you have DRE installed...

It was the second mission to Jool. The first one was less strutted and did wobble about to the point I had to reduce thrust. The second was launched in stiffer sections with docking port Snr between. I decided to roleplay it a bit and thought that some good science could have been obtained during the aerobraking and orbits between.

It's also sensible in DRE to do more braking passes as you are aware. I tried to time it to intercept Laythe to aerobrake there also.

I did try to take screenies before and after every burn but when I looked back I noticed that a few had the wrong info screens on top.

I could upload the Tylo lander if you like, I calculated that at the start of the burn you don't need even a TWR of 1 as your orbital speed offsets the gravitational pull so I made it have a reasonable TWR only after ejecting the first deceleration stage and burning some fuel for the actual touchdown. Like most things in the mission it was overdesigned and could be made much much smaller.

I think I was influenced in my craft design by 2001...

[Red Iron Crown]

I have reviewed this mission and consider it to be a valid entry for Level-3 Jool 5. I wish you had included some text with the pictures to get an idea of your thoughts at each stage, but there's more than enough evidence that your entry is legit.

There was some discussion in the challenge thread about the use of the Alcor pod on the mothership, it seems to me that switching them out for a hitchhiker or Mk1 cans would not have substantially affected the outcome of the mission other than arriving home with slightly less fuel (and you certainly had enough left over).

[parzr]

Looks good to me. You sure it its 2001 and not Event horizon? anyway. planing, building, assembly, and flying must have all been challenging

[lajoswinkler]

Very nice. So you didn't experience any overheating with DRE?

[HANNIBALLA]

Your fuel/dv numbers are legit. Other than the initial kerbal liftoff(which is fine, it looks like a craft that would make orbit), every bit of dv was accounted for and displayed. Nice ship dude!

[John FX]

Your fuel/dv numbers are legit. Other than the initial kerbal liftoff(which is fine, it looks like a craft that would make orbit), every bit of dv was accounted for and displayed. Nice ship dude!

I launched it in a few sections and assembled it in orbit then filled it with fuel. I took it that this would be the point to start recording Dv. The hardest part was launching the thrust section which has three of the largest fuel tanks in a row (strutted up of course).

[Norcalplanner]

Well done! I agree with previous reviewers - this is a legitimate Jool-5 level 3 entry. I recognized some of the same building and piloting techniques I've used myself in similar situations. It would have been a little bit easier with fewer pictures and more captions for the pictures, but that's a minor issue in the larger scheme of things. There were also a few pics missing at key points - no powered descent for Bop, no ascent shown for Laythe - but the fuel, delta v, and mission times all work out. I liked the serial staging using docking ports and the big 3.75 meter tanks. You may want to consider putting the orbital tug LV-Ns a little further outboard on future designs so they can fire along with the main engine cluster for a higher TWR. SpaceY also has some good 3.75 m docking ports for even stronger connections between the big tanks.

At the risk of being presumptuous, I'll go ahead and say it:

Congratulations, John FX! You have completed the Jool-5 Challenge with a level 3 entry! Feel free to add the badge to your sig.

[Ziv]

Congratulation, you have finished the JOOL-5 Challenge on Level 1!

(It could be a Level 3 if you had each Kerbal landing on one-one moon...as each would be trained for one landing only. But in your mission Bill landed on Laythe and Jebediah made the other landings...the little selfish .......! )

I really loved your big main ship and your docking/moon tugs, and nice landers too! And the ALCOR capsule is all right to be used as you did it, that's not advantage gaining like that.

Nice one, thank you for participating!

Edited April 19, 2015 by Ziv

[Norcalplanner]

Congratulation, you have finished the JOOL-5 Challenge on Level 1!

(It could be a Level 3 if you had each Kerbal landing on one-one moon...as each would be trained for one landing only. But in your mission Bill landed on Laythe and Jebediah made the other landings...the little selfish .......! )

I really loved your big main ship and your docking/moon tugs, and nice landers too! And the ALCOR capsule is all right to be used as you did it, that's not advantage gaining like that.

Nice one, thank you for participating!

Whoops! Thanks for the catch on the level of the challenge.