Strange heating behavior on reentry without heat-shield

[Axela]

Hi,

I tried to make a reentry from an orbit without an heat-shield, with 0.90 and Deadly Reentry I used the engine from the last stage as an heat-shield as it could take a massive amount of heat before exploding, but when I try the same with 1.0 the engine temperature remain very low (300-400) and the temperature of the manned capsule starts to raise very fast till it explode!

Did somebody had a similar problem?

BTW It's now very difficult to keep the engine in a retrograde position and the craft tend to flip over easily.

[Maizel]

The reentry heat is no issue, because you won't get hot until well into parachute altitude, which will slow you down to a crawl within a second.

It really needs a tweak or two.

I am still going 700ms at 2k alt, if I don't use chutes >.>

[Jarin]

Yeah, that sort of problem showed up playing with FAR as well (the flipping, I mean). You're going to need aerodynamic assists, because the same shape that makes your rocket fly UP capsule-first also makes it want to come DOWN the same way. Try tossing on a few downward-facing airbrakes near the top of your rocket and toggle them on as you re-enter.

[rodion_herrera]

Two words. Drogue chutes...probably the most-ignored utility part in KSP.

[Jarin]

Two words. Drogue chutes...probably the most-ignored utility part in KSP.

Also currently overpowered as hell. We'll see how long that lasts.

[Axela]

Yeah, that sort of problem showed up playing with FAR as well (the flipping, I mean). You're going to need aerodynamic assists, because the same shape that makes your rocket fly UP capsule-first also makes it want to come DOWN the same way. Try tossing on a few downward-facing airbrakes near the top of your rocket and toggle them on as you re-enter.

Yes I understand this but I'm talking about another problem: when my engine is still facing retrograde its temperature is low, but the temperature of the manned capsule (at the other end of the rocket and well shielded from the air) raises very fast until everything explode.

[rodion_herrera]

Yes I understand this but I'm talking about another problem: when my engine is still facing retrograde its temperature is low, but the temperature of the manned capsule (at the other end of the rocket and well shielded from the air) raises very fast until everything explode.

Because you're assuming that the engine is a heat shield, when it is not--KSP 1.0 will treat it as if that engine is NOT there, and since you elected NOT to put shields on, then the obvious will occur.

This attitude is very similar compared to those complaining about "clipped" or "slipped-in" components not being shielded by the part they slipped/clipped into, when the obvious fact is that they are still radially attached outside of the fuselage, so technically they are exposed to the airstream, which means they will heat up.

[federicoaa]

I accidentally staged an mk1 chute before reentry and slowed me from 2k/m to 400m/s in a second, with a 30g peak. The semideployed status of chutes is extremely op right now

[Maizel]

I accidentally staged an mk1 chute before reentry and slowed me from 2k/m to 400m/s in a second, with a 30g peak. The semideployed status of chutes is extremely op right now

I agree.

But without using them, you will still be going at INSANE speeds until you splat on the ground.

[Axela]

Because you're assuming that the engine is a heat shield, when it is not--KSP 1.0 will treat it as if that engine is NOT there, and since you elected NOT to put shields on, then the obvious will occur.

This attitude is very similar compared to those complaining about "clipped" or "slipped-in" components not being shielded by the part they slipped/clipped into, when the obvious fact is that they are still radially attached outside of the fuselage, so technically they are exposed to the airstream, which means they will heat up.

Then I don't understand how the heat is generated and is dissipated in KSP 1.0. I don't assume that the engine is a heat shield but I assume that it exists and if put in a retrograde position it will get almost all of the air friction of the entire rocket, the manned capsule should get none. So I would expect to see the engine burn up and explode before the capsule and not vice verse.

[magnemoe]

Yes I understand this but I'm talking about another problem: when my engine is still facing retrograde its temperature is low, but the temperature of the manned capsule (at the other end of the rocket and well shielded from the air) raises very fast until everything explode.

I just tested this myself, MK3, heatshield, decopler, 360 liter tank and poodle. Landing legs, small struts down and around the legs for some thermal protection.

the lowest strut level melted, engine did not heat up, I went down to 12 km before poping parachute because I wanted to observe the legs.

The 360 liter tank had some fuel in it and temprature was pretty moderate.

[Corw]

Then I don't understand how the heat is generated and is dissipated in KSP 1.0. I don't assume that the engine is a heat shield but I assume that it exists and if put in a retrograde position it will get almost all of the air friction of the entire rocket, the manned capsule should get none. So I would expect to see the engine burn up and explode before the capsule and not vice verse.

Engines melt at higher temperatures than capsule. Your engine is heating up and it is passing the heat to the capsule. They are both heated up to the same levels but engines cane take it and capsule can't. The heat shield is not passing the heat, it is shedding it of while ablating.