The Ultimate Jool 5 Challenge - 1.0 to 1.3

[problemecium]

Welp, I have a problem and need some advice.

As mentioned in the "Sights of Kidonia" thread, when I open my old save file from 1.0.5 in the new KSP 1.1 and switch to Kidonia, it spontaneously explodes. I hypothesize that this is due to a change in how cargo bays work, simply based on eyeballing where the explosion seems to start, but I have yet to test it extensively enough to fix it. So assuming I can't, I'm left with the following options:
- Painstakingly build an exact replica of Kidonia in its last viable state, down to fuel quantities, and use HyperEdit (or hack the save file) to put it where I left off
- Use my existing backup copy of 1.0.5 to complete the mission, and make do with reduced performance and features
- Give up and start all over again.

What would the good people here in the challenge thread recommend? And what would be the ruling on using HyperEdit to salvage a bugged-out mission? I could really use some input ^^;

[Jetski]

1 hour ago, parameciumkid said:

Welp, I have a problem and need some advice.

As mentioned in the "Sights of Kidonia" thread, when I open my old save file from 1.0.5 in the new KSP 1.1 and switch to Kidonia, it spontaneously explodes. I hypothesize that this is due to a change in how cargo bays work, simply based on eyeballing where the explosion seems to start, but I have yet to test it extensively enough to fix it. So assuming I can't, I'm left with the following options:
- Painstakingly build an exact replica of Kidonia in its last viable state, down to fuel quantities, and use HyperEdit (or hack the save file) to put it where I left off
- Use my existing backup copy of 1.0.5 to complete the mission, and make do with reduced performance and features
- Give up and start all over again.

What would the good people here in the challenge thread recommend? And what would be the ruling on using HyperEdit to salvage a bugged-out mission? I could really use some input ^^;

Your call really.  I just started over on my Jool 500 entry due to landing gear bugs, lost 12 ships and many many hours.  But I like playing this game, and trying to get everything right.  Is there stuff you wish you had designed differently on your Kidonia ship?  If so, now's your chance to improve it!  

I would hesitate to use HyperEdit, maybe finish in 1.05 if you don't want to redesign?  Just my 2 cents, probably OP needs to answer this for reals 

 

[parzr]

On 4/24/2016 at 5:14 PM, Nefrums said:

Here is my fourth entry for this challenge (this time in 1.1).  I have improved almost all parts since my last attempt and managed to get the mass down to just over 12.5 t.

I used the same 4 engine design as last time.  One rapier for Kerbin and Laythe accent, one spark for Tylo and 2 ion engines for everything else.

Mods used: KER, Precition node, and mechJeb+module manager to not require the mechJeb parts.  (Only Smart S.A.S was used from MechJeb)

Nice run for sure.
I guess a lander can has adequate heat shielding

[Chuck U. Farley]

I'm gonna give this challenge a go. 

I challenged myself to build my main ship in orbit using only SSTO's. This Imgur album consists of me testing the first SSTO by putting a space station into orbit. It's a dry run, to see if everything's working. Is there anything wrong with this dry run that I can't use for the real mission? 

http://imgur.com/a/ohIbX

Mods used: 

TAC life support

Kerbal Engineer 

Kerbal alarm clock

Hyperedit

Navyfish Docking Alignment

Crowd Sourced Science

Kerbal Joint Reinforcement

Deep Freeze Continued (It's a freezer system, letting me "freeze" my Kerbals, so they don't use life support. I can send 5 Kerbals on a 8-year mission to Jool with only 60 day's life support. It's real handy.)

[Nefrums]

11 hours ago, parzr said:

Nice run for sure.
I guess a lander can has adequate heat shielding

The heat tolerance of the lander can have never been a problem, the problem was when aerobraking the Laythe lander with the Kerbal in the seat, It was a lot more difficult than i remember it in 1.0.4, And then I had to aim for the island with the big mountain from a high elliptical orbit, It took a couple of attempts to hit it.

 

Edit:   I think lower mass is possible, at least a ton lighter is surely possible.

I hope someone beats 12,5t so I get to improve my design!  "poke" -> @Mesklin, @astrobond

 

 

 

 

 

Edited April 27, 2016 by Nefrums

[r_loewe]

i completed the jool 5 with these mods, kw rocketry, mk IV spaceplane system, and tweakscale.

[MarkoeZ]

Hi ppl,

Been planning to do this challenge for a while and finally have a couple of extra days off now. Starting tests and preparations, For Science!

Planned mods: MJ and KER

Cheers!

[Nefrums]

1 hour ago, MarkoeZ said:

Hi ppl,

Been planning to do this challenge for a while and finally have a couple of extra days off now. Starting tests and preparations, For Science!

Planned mods: MJ and KER

Cheers!

Good luck!    Jool-5 is one of the toughest but most fun challenges there are is KSP.

I would recommend having a look at the Precise Node mod. It makes all those transfer maneuvers so much easier to set up.

 

[sdj64]

First things first... @Nefrums, you have completed the Jool 5 Challenge on Level 1 with a low mass of 12.51 tons!  Great entry and improvement on your previous entry in 1.0.5.  You and the other low-mass contenders really have the design down to a science.  I'm tempted to try it with a tiny LFO Vall lander instead of ions, which would save on batteries and maybe get away with just one ion engine.  That may need more fuel for the Rapier to circularize though.

 

On 4/26/2016 at 7:48 PM, parameciumkid said:

Welp, I have a problem and need some advice.

As mentioned in the "Sights of Kidonia" thread, when I open my old save file from 1.0.5 in the new KSP 1.1 and switch to Kidonia, it spontaneously explodes. I hypothesize that this is due to a change in how cargo bays work, simply based on eyeballing where the explosion seems to start, but I have yet to test it extensively enough to fix it. So assuming I can't, I'm left with the following options:
- Painstakingly build an exact replica of Kidonia in its last viable state, down to fuel quantities, and use HyperEdit (or hack the save file) to put it where I left off
- Use my existing backup copy of 1.0.5 to complete the mission, and make do with reduced performance and features
- Give up and start all over again.

What would the good people here in the challenge thread recommend? And what would be the ruling on using HyperEdit to salvage a bugged-out mission? I could really use some input ^^;

As of 1 hour ago, 1.1 is out, try with that first.  I would accept a Hyperedit fix if you provide a screenshot in 1.0.5 before and in 1.1 after with the resources tab open in both and an info window from KER or MechJeb showing orbital parameters.

 

On 4/27/2016 at 11:51 PM, Chuck U. Farley said:

I'm gonna give this challenge a go. 

I challenged myself to build my main ship in orbit using only SSTO's. This Imgur album consists of me testing the first SSTO by putting a space station into orbit. It's a dry run, to see if everything's working. Is there anything wrong with this dry run that I can't use for the real mission? 

http://imgur.com/a/ohIbX

Mods used: 

TAC life support

Kerbal Engineer 

Kerbal alarm clock

Hyperedit

Navyfish Docking Alignment

Crowd Sourced Science

Kerbal Joint Reinforcement

Deep Freeze Continued (It's a freezer system, letting me "freeze" my Kerbals, so they don't use life support. I can send 5 Kerbals on a 8-year mission to Jool with only 60 day's life support. It's real handy.)

Cool SSTO.  Deep Freeze will be allowed since it's a life support mod.  Sort of.  At any rate, using it and any life support mod is still more difficult than stock.

 

On 4/27/2016 at 4:49 PM, r_loewe said:

i completed the jool 5 with these mods, kw rocketry, mk IV spaceplane system, and tweakscale.

Okay...

care to share some screenshots?

 

 

In other important news:

I am going to be traveling from May 7 to 20 with basically no internet access during that time.  Please continue to submit and discuss, any missions submitted during that time will be reviewed after.  Get your rules questions in BEFORE MAY 6 please so I have time to respond before I leave.

[problemecium]

2 hours ago, sdj64 said:

As of 1 hour ago, 1.1 is out, try with that first.  I would accept a Hyperedit fix if you provide a screenshot in 1.0.5 before and in 1.1 after with the resources tab open in both and an info window from KER or MechJeb showing orbital parameters.

And if I don't use MechJeb or KER, a screenie of the map view with the Ap and Pe labels active will do, right?
Also, what do you mean by "1.1 is out?" KSP 1.1 has been out as a full release for a few days now, and the 1.1 edition of HyperEdit came out yesterday I think. So what just came out?

Edited April 29, 2016 by parameciumkid
This new post editor sucks.

[Jetski]

9 hours ago, parameciumkid said:

And if I don't use MechJeb or KER, a screenie of the map view with the Ap and Pe labels active will do, right?
Also, what do you mean by "1.1 is out?" KSP 1.1 has been out as a full release for a few days now, and the 1.1 edition of HyperEdit came out yesterday I think. So what just came out?

1.1.1. Hot fix for wheel bugs

[MarkoeZ]

22 hours ago, Nefrums said:

Good luck!    Jool-5 is one of the toughest but most fun challenges there are is KSP.

I would recommend having a look at the Precise Node mod. It makes all those transfer maneuvers so much easier to set up.

 

Thanks!

In the first tests my insanely large rocket did not behave that well (flopping around n stuff, too big for struts) so planning to buid something in orbit now.

But its going to need a dozen launches or more for the idea i have, is it ok to use MJ ascent guidance for the boring repetitive construction launches?

IF not im going to keep it slightly smaller

[problemecium]

Good news everyone! I identified and fixed the bug with Kidonia. It turned out to be a thermal bug, like the one I had documented before. When first loading the vessel, apparently some parts spawned at ridiculous temperatures and blew the whole thing up. By momentarily turning on the "Ignore max temperature" cheat and giving the game a few seconds to recalculate the proper temperatures, I was able to save the ship.
And if I might say, I'm quite pleased at the increase in framerate ^^

[Chuck U. Farley]

22 hours ago, sdj64 said:

Cool SSTO.  Deep Freeze will be allowed since it's a life support mod.  Sort of.  At any rate, using it and any life support mod is still more difficult than stock.

The SSTO isn't really mine, nor is the other SUPER-heavy duty one I plan on using. I "borrowed" them from Vaos Human. Look his channel up on YouTube, he deserves more subs. Full credit for the SSTO's will go to him. 

I'm glad Deep Freeze is approved for this. TAC isn't an easy mod to run, plus it adds an element of realism. 

Now, ON TO THE MISSION!

[purpleivan]

On 10/04/2016 at 11:17 AM, Gravaar said:

P.s. I think it had 48 LV-Ns for the transfer stage

and I think I've been a bit greedy with the power when I've put 8 of them on a transfer vehicle... admittedly much smaller vessels though.

Battering physics into submission one nuke at a time

Edited April 29, 2016 by purpleivan

[DaMaster_Architect]

Hey all, I'd like to give this challenge a try too, but I noticed that MKS/OKS are forbidden. Why is that, if I may ask? I am using these mods in order to kolonize the kerbol system. What can and can't I do when doing the Jool-5 challenge in the same savegame? Is it okay if the mod is installed, but no parts of it are allowed on the Jool-5 mission? Or are some parts, like the rotating hab, maybe allowed?

[IncongruousGoat]

So... if I am doing a grand tour, does it have to follow the "interplanetary space in one piece" rule to be recognized here? Because my current mission profile has the ship split into 4 pieces at one point to make the delta-v work out reasonably. They do all launch as one big ship.

[sdj64]

On 4/29/2016 at 9:19 PM, parameciumkid said:

And if I don't use MechJeb or KER, a screenie of the map view with the Ap and Pe labels active will do, right?
Also, what do you mean by "1.1 is out?" KSP 1.1 has been out as a full release for a few days now, and the 1.1 edition of HyperEdit came out yesterday I think. So what just came out?

Yes I meant 1.1.1, sorry.  Too many 1's.  Congratulations on saving your ship, I know a ton of time went into the construction and mission so far so it's good to see it still working.

3 hours ago, DaMaster_Architect said:

Hey all, I'd like to give this challenge a try too, but I noticed that MKS/OKS are forbidden. Why is that, if I may ask? I am using these mods in order to kolonize the kerbol system. What can and can't I do when doing the Jool-5 challenge in the same savegame? Is it okay if the mod is installed, but no parts of it are allowed on the Jool-5 mission? Or are some parts, like the rotating hab, maybe allowed?

I don't know why they are banned as they mostly make it harder, not easier.  It might have been based on the old rules for ISRU.  I will reclassify them as allowed.  Since the ISRU functions only refine life support resources, it won't count for the ISRU tag for this challenge by itself.

2 hours ago, IncongruousGoat said:

So... if I am doing a grand tour, does it have to follow the "interplanetary space in one piece" rule to be recognized here? Because my current mission profile has the ship split into 4 pieces at one point to make the delta-v work out reasonably. They do all launch as one big ship.

That's currently a bit of a legal grey area with the current rules, but even my own 1.0.5 grand tour didn't stay in one piece for all the time in interplanetary space (smaller ship went to Moho).  Cross Kerbin SOI in one piece both leaving and returning should be fine.

[sdj64]

On 4/17/2016 at 4:54 PM, OrbitalBuzzsaw said:

Can you clear SXT?

Realized I never responded to this.  SXT is prohibited for some of the pods such as the Bonny and MEM being much lighter than stock options.  The engines are fairly balanced.  I want to avoid the confusion of banning individual parts.

[IncongruousGoat]

1 hour ago, sdj64 said:

That's currently a bit of a legal grey area with the current rules, but even my own 1.0.5 grand tour didn't stay in one piece for all the time in interplanetary space (smaller ship went to Moho).  Cross Kerbin SOI in one piece both leaving and returning should be fine.

Hmmm... my plan involved making it to LKO in one piece (one launch) and then splitting up into 4 pieces that go off and do various things. Is that fine? There is only the one Kerbal getting flown around the system.

[sdj64]

5 hours ago, IncongruousGoat said:

Hmmm... my plan involved making it to LKO in one piece (one launch) and then splitting up into 4 pieces that go off and do various things. Is that fine? There is only the one Kerbal getting flown around the system.

Well, the thing is that someone may just put a bunch of separate missions that all leave from LKO up in a single launch and call it a Jool-5 or a Grand Tour.  If you decide to do this, you can separate parts to go to other planets, but they can't come back and help your Jool 5 part.

As an example, you send one ship from your starting "bundle" in LKO to Eve and Moho, one to Duna and Dres, and one to do the Jool-5 and Eeloo.  All three go out, do their missions, and come back to LKO.  This would still count as a Jool 5 completion but not a grand tour because your Jool 5 ship only went to Jool and Eeloo, and didn't do a grand tour itself.  Anything goes in Kerbin's (and Mun's and Minmus's) SOI "before the mission starts" but only one ship that crosses the border of Kerbin's SOI is your Jool 5 ship and any other separated ships will be considered different missions, therefore can't bring Kerbals or supplies to or from the Jool 5 ship.

 

[IncongruousGoat]

2 hours ago, sdj64 said:

Well, the thing is that someone may just put a bunch of separate missions that all leave from LKO up in a single launch and call it a Jool-5 or a Grand Tour.  If you decide to do this, you can separate parts to go to other planets, but they can't come back and help your Jool 5 part.

As an example, you send one ship from your starting "bundle" in LKO to Eve and Moho, one to Duna and Dres, and one to do the Jool-5 and Eeloo.  All three go out, do their missions, and come back to LKO.  This would still count as a Jool 5 completion but not a grand tour because your Jool 5 ship only went to Jool and Eeloo, and didn't do a grand tour itself.  Anything goes in Kerbin's (and Mun's and Minmus's) SOI "before the mission starts" but only one ship that crosses the border of Kerbin's SOI is your Jool 5 ship and any other separated ships will be considered different missions, therefore can't bring Kerbals or supplies to or from the Jool 5 ship.

 

Ah. Well, that scrubs my plan as far as submitting it here goes. I'll just post it in mission reports.

[HoloYolo]

Can I do a Jupiter 4 with stock RSS :D?

[MarkoeZ]

Testing launcher designs and first draft of a lander module at the top (untested as of yet) 

Spoiler

 

Edited May 1, 2016 by MarkoeZ

[Sean24135]