[WIP][1.2.2] Keridian Dynamics - Dev Thread [Last Update: 2017-01-21]

[Eleusis La Arwall]

10 hours ago, Odonian said:

Here is a link to a dropbox folder with the version of the KeridianDynamics-Converters.cfg bundled in your latest release on github: https://www.dropbox.com/s/rge8pmmjlp3wte5/KeridianDynamics-Converters.cfg?dl=0

I'm not seeing a lines in it for the "MetalOre" resource.

Whoopsy, you are totally right, I made a booboo and uploaded the wrong file to GitHub. Download is fixed now.

Thanks for pointing me to this, wouldn't have found it that fast if it wasn't for you. Sry for the inconvenience.

[Odonian]

Thanks a lot, looking forward to trying this later tonight.

[Dr Farnsworth]

It looks like career saves that use a life support and EPL mod hit a research dry spot before mining tech and other ELP stuff becomes available. Makes it dang hard to get remote bases set up pumping out research points...Oh well.

I have been using your parts (along with KPBS, Simple Construction and Snacks) in a sandbox save to see how my base drop pod methodology is going to work. So far it looks like the drop pod will need to have around 6k of rocketparts for me to get the initial structures up and running.

Not too bad. Although, comparing it to the MKS parts that I have used in the past it is huge. I don't want to pick up MKS again because I don't particularly care for the models and especially the complexity. MKS Lite is ok'ish but both variants require you to trick EPL into using material kits and that screws up other mods like yours. No thanks.

Your mod is looking great! Thank you for all the hard work. 

I hate to ask, but I will anyway.

Have you ever thought about making mini EPL parts, something that could be used to get the initial base/colony established. 

[DStaal]

4 hours ago, Dr Farnsworth said:

Not too bad. Although, comparing it to the MKS parts that I have used in the past it is huge. I don't want to pick up MKS again because I don't particularly care for the models and especially the complexity. MKS Lite is ok'ish but both variants require you to trick EPL into using material kits and that screws up other mods like yours. No thanks.

Quick question, because I see this statement repeated and I think it's based on what people think happens instead of what actually happens: How does using Materialkits/SpecializedParts screw up this mod?  (I ask this as someone who uses this mod together with MKS regularly.)

[Dr Farnsworth]

13 hours ago, DStaal said:

Quick question, because I see this statement repeated and I think it's based on what people think happens instead of what actually happens: How does using Materialkits/SpecializedParts screw up this mod?  (I ask this as someone who uses this mod together with MKS regularly.)

In the past, MKS Lite did not install a config file " EL_USI.cfg ". You had to grab it from the full MKS version. Without that file EPL will not use material kits.

 

There are mods that replace the EPL parts and add their own models (like Keridian Dynamics). If those mods don't build some ability to choose between the MKS material kits or standard EPL rocketparts you won't be able to use them along side MKS.

 

This is as of a few months ago. It may have been fixed by now. I have not checked. 

You are correct that Keridian Dynamics allows you to choose between material kits or rocketparts.

[DStaal]

1 hour ago, Dr Farnsworth said:

In the past, MKS Lite did not install a config file " EL_USI.cfg ". You had to grab it from the full MKS version. Without that file EPL will not use material kits.

There are mods that replace the EPL parts and add their own models (like Keridian Dynamics). If those mods don't build some ability to choose between the MKS material kits or standard EPL rocketparts you won't be able to use them along side MKS.

This is as of a few months ago. It may have been fixed by now. I have not checked. 

You are correct that Keridian Dynamics allows you to choose between material kits or rocketparts.

See, but the thing is Keridian Dynamics doesn't do anything to let you choose between MaterialKits and Rocketparts.  All of that logic is in EL, and dependent on whether that EL_USI.cfg exists.  (Or other similar configs.)

This is the part that annoys me: That people act like other mods have to do something to be compatible.  Any EL part uses whatever recipes EL specifies. MKS changes the EL recipes, so therefore any EL part will use the MKS recipes if MKS is installed.  There's no extra step, no having to choose, it just works: If you have the MKS recipe file loaded, those recipes get used.  Regardless of what launchpad you use to build.

Now, the *production chain* is a different story, there each part needs to specify what it consumes and produces.  But Keridian Dynamics doesn't attempt to provide a full production chain to MaterialKits anyway.  (Though it does have an optional config for the Furnace that lets you put it into the chain.)

[Dr Farnsworth]

Wow, I didn't mean to "annoy" you. 

Using the  EL_USI.cfg  file to get EPL to play nice with MKS lite IS annoying because there was no information included with MKS Lite that explained this need AND it was not included in the mod's files. You either had to ask about it on the mods forum page or dig through the forum pages and stumble across someone else that had the same issue. 

Again, this may have been fixed by now. 

I am not a modder, I don't speak the language. So if I explained something incorrectly, made a comment, or asked a question that a mod maker would know automatically and ruffled some feathers in the process, I apologize. 

I do however love Kerbal Space Program and enjoy mods such as EPL, KPBS, and Keridian. And I love it even more when all the mods play nice with each other. 

[DStaal]

Not a big problem - and it wasn't that your one post annoyed me, really.  It was that in *lots* of places, by *lots* of people, I keep seeing 'EL parts don't work with MKS'.  They do.  EL is written that way.

So it's not so much that you annoyed me as that your post was the one I finally decided to respond to. 

(As for MKS-Lite and getting the config with that - MKS-Lite no longer exists.  There are plans for a config-file option to downrate the current MKS into a lite version, but the mod itself is depreciated and there hasn't been a version for KSP 1.2 onward.)

[Dr Farnsworth]

Don't worry. I can take the heat!

[Dr Farnsworth]

I accepted a mission to rescue someone from the orbit of the Mun. When I got within physics range they were in a ST2502FS tank. There is no Image of the kerbal and no way that I can find to get them to EVA out of the tank.

[DStaal]

18 hours ago, Dr Farnsworth said:

I accepted a mission to rescue someone from the orbit of the Mun. When I got within physics range they were in a ST2502FS tank. There is no Image of the kerbal and no way that I can find to get them to EVA out of the tank.

Known issue with KSP - any part with crew capacity can be used for a rescue contract - not really within the scope of this mod to try to fix.  If this type of thing bugs you, try this mod:

 

[Dr Farnsworth]

I terminated the craft from the space center and the Kerbal was then available to me but had zero experience. The mission to rescue did not complete either. All I had to do was launch the Kerbal and then recover the craft that they were in to complete the mission.

[Eleusis La Arwall]

On 08/12/2016 at 11:19 PM, Dr Farnsworth said:

I hate to ask, but I will anyway.

Have you ever thought about making mini EPL parts, something that could be used to get the initial base/colony established. 

Don't worry, I'm always happy about new input!
I had been thinking about 1.25 m variants of the 3D-Printer and the Furnace when the small ISRU came out but never really started anything. However, now I'm thinking about it again
I have quite some imagery left in my head about a smaller Furnace, just have to find some time.
An automated 1.25 variant of the 3D-Printer is not going to happen because that thing is already very slow. What I'm currently thinking about is some sort of small work-bench-cabin for 1 Kerbal that requires to be crewed in order to operate.

On 09/12/2016 at 7:03 PM, DStaal said:

But Keridian Dynamics doesn't attempt to provide a full production chain to MaterialKits anyway.  (Though it does have an optional config for the Furnace that lets you put it into the chain.)

Actually there is a full production chain to MaterialKits and SpecializedParts that requires CRP (CRP triggers the MM-config). 1.) Ore/MetalOre -> Metal -> MaterialKits. 2.) Metal + Ore -> SpecializedParts. It was initially designed for OSE Workshop support.
I'll see if I can integrate a an optinal config to use MaterialKits (& SpecializedParts) with EL. Specially in combination with OSE it would be easyier to have one set of resources for all building needs.

On 11/12/2016 at 10:44 PM, Dr Farnsworth said:

I accepted a mission to rescue someone from the orbit of the Mun. When I got within physics range they were in a ST2502FS tank. There is no Image of the kerbal and no way that I can find to get them to EVA out of the tank.

First off, did you install the optional crewed container config?
I was wondering why this does not happen to the 2-kerbal cabin that has no door and looked up the config file. There is an entry unknown to me:

noAutoEVAMulti = True

Maybe this will fix it, I'll have to look deeper.

[DStaal]

42 minutes ago, Eleusis La Arwall said:

Actually there is a full production chain to MaterialKits and SpecializedParts that requires CRP (CRP triggers the MM-config). 1.) Ore/MetalOre -> Metal -> MaterialKits. 2.) Metal + Ore -> SpecializedParts. It was initially designed for OSE Workshop support.
I'll see if I can integrate a an optinal config to use MaterialKits (& SpecializedParts) with EL. Specially in combination with OSE it would be easyier to have one set of resources for all building needs.

I'd say don't bother: That's known to be tied to MKS, so either people will be using MKS and get the chain already, or you'll confuse people.  (Worse: You could conflict with MKS's EL config, and cause issues.  Though MM can solve that.)

Now if you're talking about the production chain - again, I'd stay away, if I were you.  MKS has a complex chain that seems to get tweaked every time RoverDude updates.  You'd either be duplicating his work, and constantly chasing him, or you'd be offering a shortcut chain that makes the MKS chain a bit redundant.

[Dr Farnsworth]

2 hours ago, Eleusis La Arwall said:

Don't worry, I'm always happy about new input!
I had been thinking about 1.25 m variants of the 3D-Printer and the Furnace when the small ISRU came out but never really started anything. However, now I'm thinking about it again
I have quite some imagery left in my head about a smaller Furnace, just have to find some time.
An automated 1.25 variant of the 3D-Printer is not going to happen because that thing is already very slow. What I'm currently thinking about is some sort of small work-bench-cabin for 1 Kerbal that requires to be crewed in order to operate.

The 1.25 ISRU is a nice size for starting out a base. It's light and versatile since it can make metal (with simple construction) or fuels.

A small rocketpart producing crewed command pod of some kind would be neat! It sounds similar to Roverdudes inflatable workshop. Since it's going to be crewed maybe it should have production delays based on the engineer experience. You could also make it an EPL survey station, how awesome would that be!

[The-Doctor]

@Eleusis La Arwall hey I got a question, um, what exactly are specialized parts?

[DStaal]

15 minutes ago, The-Doctor said:

@Eleusis La Arwall hey I got a question, um, what exactly are specialized parts?

A resource used by EL (when MKS is installed) and OSE Workshop to build things.  Also used by MKS for various other purposes.

[The-Doctor]

4 minutes ago, DStaal said:

A resource used by EL (when MKS is installed) and OSE Workshop to build things.  Also used by MKS for various other purposes.

but then I wonder why it shows, I don't use MKS, is there a way to get rid of it?

[The-Doctor]

@Eleusis La Arwall does this mod require just extraplanetary launch pads dll or do I need all of extraplanetary launch pads?

[Eleusis La Arwall]

On 23/12/2016 at 4:01 AM, The-Doctor said:

but then I wonder why it shows, I don't use MKS, is there a way to get rid of it?

It shows if CommunityResourcePack is installed. I did not account for the situation that one has CRP and not OSE or MKS. I'll see if I can fix that for the next update.
If you don't use the MetalOre --> Metal converter you can simply delete KeridianDynamics-Converters.cfg in GameData/KeridianDynamics/, otherwise open the file and replace the content with the following:

Spoiler

@PART[KD-Furnace]{
    @description = This heavy blast furnace extracts Metal from Ore and MetalOre.  During the process non-metallic compounds within the Ores will be lost. Only 1 mass-% Metal can be obtained from Ore but up to 70 mass-% from MetalOre. The thermal extraction is the quick'n dirty way to refine Ore.
    MODULE,2
    {
        name = ModuleResourceConverter
        ConverterName = MetalOre-->Metal
        startEventGUIName = Heat Furnace
        endEventGUIName = Shutdown Furnace
        actionGUIName = Toggle Furnace
        StartActionName = Start MetalOre --> Metal
        StopActionName = Stop MetalOre --> Metal    
        AutoShutdown = true
        TemperatureModifier
        {
            key = 0        200000
            key = 1800    50000
            key = 2200    30000
            key = 3000    3000
            key = 3600    0
        }
        GeneratesHeat = true
        DefaultShutoffTemp = .8
        ThermalEfficiency
        {
            key = 0        0.02    0        0
            key = 1000    0.1    0        0
            key = 2000    1    0        0
            key = 3000    0.01    0        0
        }
        UseSpecialistBonus = true
        SpecialistEfficiencyFactor = 0.2
        SpecialistBonusBase = 0.05
//        Specialty = Engineer
        ExperienceEffect = ConverterSkill
        EfficiencyBonus = 1
        INPUT_RESOURCE
        {
            ResourceName = MetalOre            //    Density(MetalOre) = 0.0275
            Ratio = 0.1
            FlowMode = STAGE_PRIORITY_FLOW
          }
        INPUT_RESOURCE
        {
            ResourceName = ElectricCharge
            Ratio = 180                //    How much Ec is used per second.
        }
        OUTPUT_RESOURCE
        {
            ResourceName = Metal            //    Density(Metal) = 0.039
            Ratio = 0.07                //    Yield = ~70%
            DumpExcess = false
            FlowMode = STAGE_PRIORITY_FLOW
        }                        //    0.1*0.0275 > 0.07*0.039
    }
}

 

 

On 24/12/2016 at 5:15 AM, The-Doctor said:

@Eleusis La Arwall does this mod require just extraplanetary launch pads dll or do I need all of extraplanetary launch pads?

You just need the dll.

[The-Doctor]

5 hours ago, Eleusis La Arwall said:

It shows if CommunityResourcePack is installed. I did not account for the situation that one has CRP and not OSE or MKS. I'll see if I can fix that for the next update.
If you don't use the MetalOre --> Metal converter you can simply delete KeridianDynamics-Converters.cfg in GameData/KeridianDynamics/, otherwise open the file and replace the content with the following:

  Reveal hidden contents

 

@PART[KD-Furnace]{
    @description = This heavy blast furnace extracts Metal from Ore and MetalOre.  During the process non-metallic compounds within the Ores will be lost. Only 1 mass-% Metal can be obtained from Ore but up to 70 mass-% from MetalOre. The thermal extraction is the quick'n dirty way to refine Ore.
    MODULE,2
    {
        name = ModuleResourceConverter
        ConverterName = MetalOre-->Metal
        startEventGUIName = Heat Furnace
        endEventGUIName = Shutdown Furnace
        actionGUIName = Toggle Furnace
        StartActionName = Start MetalOre --> Metal
        StopActionName = Stop MetalOre --> Metal    
        AutoShutdown = true
        TemperatureModifier
        {
            key = 0        200000
            key = 1800    50000
            key = 2200    30000
            key = 3000    3000
            key = 3600    0
        }
        GeneratesHeat = true
        DefaultShutoffTemp = .8
        ThermalEfficiency
        {
            key = 0        0.02    0        0
            key = 1000    0.1    0        0
            key = 2000    1    0        0
            key = 3000    0.01    0        0
        }
        UseSpecialistBonus = true
        SpecialistEfficiencyFactor = 0.2
        SpecialistBonusBase = 0.05
//        Specialty = Engineer
        ExperienceEffect = ConverterSkill
        EfficiencyBonus = 1
        INPUT_RESOURCE
        {
            ResourceName = MetalOre            //    Density(MetalOre) = 0.0275
            Ratio = 0.1
            FlowMode = STAGE_PRIORITY_FLOW
          }
        INPUT_RESOURCE
        {
            ResourceName = ElectricCharge
            Ratio = 180                //    How much Ec is used per second.
        }
        OUTPUT_RESOURCE
        {
            ResourceName = Metal            //    Density(Metal) = 0.039
            Ratio = 0.07                //    Yield = ~70%
            DumpExcess = false
            FlowMode = STAGE_PRIORITY_FLOW
        }                        //    0.1*0.0275 > 0.07*0.039
    }
}

 

 

 

 

 

You just need the dll.

I have OSE installed and intend on using Keridian to build rockets, will the next update remove the uneeded resources? Also, do I need launchpads dll? What is the specific dll I need?

[Eleusis La Arwall]

1 hour ago, The-Doctor said:

will the next update remove the uneeded resources?

I'll set the SpecializedParts converter to only appear if MKS/UKS is installed. That way you can still produce MaterialKits for OSE.

1 hour ago, The-Doctor said:

What is the specific dll I need?

You need Launchpad.dll (located in GameData/ExtraplanetaryLaunchpads/Plugins/ OR in GameData/SimpleConstruction/Plugins/ depending on what mod you use).

[Eleusis La Arwall]

Next update will hopefully complete the storage tank series with the addition of 1.25 m parts. I'm not quite sure about the adapters. I've made some but I realized that it may be a bit too much to have adapters from any size to any other size. To have two variants for several adapters seems real overkill now.
The non-passable series is pretty strait forward with three different tanks for each size and an adapter for 1.25 to 2.5 and one for 2.5 to 3.75 (I could add a 1.25 to 3.75 adapter, but is there a need for?):

Spoiler

The crew-passable series is more complicated. ATM I have 2 variants of adapters, one with a rounded transition and another, smaller one with flat transitions.
ST1001 Adapter from 1.25 to 1.25 profil (crew-passable 1.25 m tanks are wider than 1.25 profil)
ST2001 Adapter from 2.50 to 1.25 profil (flat)
ST2002 Adapter from 2.50 to 1.25 profil (round)
ST3001 Adapter from 3.75 to 1.25 profil (flat)
ST3002 Adapter from 3.75 to 1.25 profil (round)
ST3251 Adapter from 3.75 to 2.50 profil (flat)
ST3252 Adapter from 3.75 to 2.50 profil (round)

Spoiler

In total there are 27 different storage tank entrys in the editor atm. This is a bit too much for my taste and I'm thinking about to move some tanks/adapters into a separate pack. One way would be the seperation of the entire crew-passable series. Another way would be to keep one tank for every size and move the rest.
A different approach would be to keep all tanks by default and add some small MM-config files that disable certain tanks if installed.
Feedback is appreciated.

[wasml]

8 hours ago, Eleusis La Arwall said:

Feedback is appreciated.

I would say split the crew passable tanks into a separate pack - they're a unique take on tanks that are usable by them selves. If both are wanted it's easy to add multiple packs to get it all.

I would vote against the MM patch to disable tanks as the resources are loaded but not used - could be an issue for heavily modded games (though it looks like you may be reusing textures so this may not be much of an issue).

[colmo]

FYI @Eleusis La Arwall - you no longer need to use EPL to erect a fundament, allista's Ground Construction should be able to do it instead, and this time, it'll be level!

http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/index.php?/topic/154167-122-ground-construction/&do=findComment&comment=2904240