Help me verify the effect of the ingredient in this weight loss pill

[RainDreamer]

My mom just got some weight loss pills from Vietnam that advertise it provides weight loss "the natural way". It is called LIC, at the bottom of this list: http://www.stpaulbrands.com/products.html

Note that none of that got sold in US, but exclusively exported to Vietnam. Not safe enough to pass FDA inspection?

After reading some of its promotional material full of technobabble not intended to clarify anything to the average reader, it got me suspicious. So here are the listed active ingredients:

Belaunja Extract - 300 mg

Magastin Extract - 100 mg

Psilio Husks powder - 200mg

Image of the first 2 ingredients, as shown in their promotional material:

So here is the result of my preliminary investigation:

Belaunja is, apparently, the pink flower in the image, with the scientific name of Sphaeranthus indicus. The chemical that provide the weight loss effect from this flower is, according to the promotional material, 7-hydroxyfrullanolide, which match with this patent: http://www.google.com/patents/WO2012014216A1?cl=en . The patent does claim to modulate metabolic processes, but it is just a patent. Searching for more scientific sources, I came across this study: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3059449/#ref1 and this is where it goes even wilder, with claims of being a sedative, an antimicrobial and antiviral agent, and a lot more effects. The study does admit it is not a clinical evaluation, which makes me even more suspicious.

Magastin is...something I have no idea about. That exact spelling doesn't give me any good result, however, the chemical it states to be providing the weight loss effect is called alpha-Mangostin. So I hit that up and found this: http://www.sigmaaldrich.com/catalog/product/sigma/m3824. So apparently it is just a (deliberate?) misspelling of Mangosteen the fruit (Garcinia mangostana)? That is another bad sign. There is no noted effect of alpha-Mangotin in helping weight loss either, and I have no knowledge in biochemistry to understand the attached study in the link I gave above about what it does to PC12 cells and stuff.

With those two ingredient kind of identified, I looked up for a case where they are used together for weight loss purposes, and found this: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3684102/ . All the rundown the mill study and result claiming double blind study and that, but this is the only one that mentioned anything about it. Then I noticed at the end, it is a study supported by an unrestricted grant from InterHealth Nutraceuticals. Essentially a sponsored study...suspicious. Further more, I discovered that, it was essentially sharing the same ingredients with another weight loss product called Metatrim, another not-FDA-approved product, and seems to be peddled by Dr.Oz, who is essentially a scammer.

By this point I have no more leads to find the actual effect of this product, or its ingredients, and way too many red flags has been raised. I hope some of you can help me in this effort. I really don't want my mother to use something dubious and harm herself. I will try to talk to her about my suspicions, but it is unlikely she will listen until I got some evidences.

Edited August 4, 2015 by RainDreamer

[Godot]

Creating the informal name for a substance by the name of the plant/animal where it was first extracted

and suffixing it with -ine (or. in german, -in) is pretty common in organic chemistry

Very well known example ... caffeine (in german even clearewr as "Koffein") from coffea (arabica) suffixed by -ine/-in

Therefore Alpha Mangostin sounds pretty normal for me

With the -in, I guess, indicating an Alkaloid and the Alpha denmoting the position of the sidechain.

As for articles about Alpha-Mangostin, there are some, although it seems to have to do more with Apoptosis in cancer cells.

Generally however I never would trust any food supplemental that claims that just using it would make you lose pounds, without you having to change your lifestyle.

Increasing the time you move every day (even if is is "just" walking) while at the same time decreasing your daily calories intake is usually the better bet

[Shpaget]

I get a little bit annoyed every time I hear the word extract used in this manner. How the hell do you make an extract of a plant? One can extract a certain compound of it, but not the plant itself.

The best example of it would be this sort of crap. Pearl extract? What a devious way to sell chalk at $500 per kg.

Tell your mom to stay clear of those weight (mass) loss products and implement better eating habits. It's a lot better way to reduce body mass by just adjusting the amount of food you eat vs. any (non-approved) pill whose manufacturers spent more time in designing the label than the actual product.

[ZetaX]

Very well known example ... caffeine (in german even clearewr as "Koffein") from coffea (arabica) suffixed by -ine/-in

Fun fact: the german word for coffee is "Kaffee", i.e. not using the o but the a version.

[steve_v]

I'll just drop my usual response to this kind of thing: If it sounds too good to be true, and you actually have to hunt for some proper scientific evidence... It's too good to be true.

My bet is on 99.8% snake oil with a dash of plausible sounding ingredients that are unlikely to be researched by the average customer. And equally unlikely to do anything useful.

IME, the only true weight loss formula is controlling ones energy budget - Consume less, use more. i.e. Thermodynamics (as far as can be applied to biology).

- - - Updated - - -

The best example of it would be this sort of crap.

It really infuriates me that this BS is permitted to be sold, it's nothing but preying on the gullible and uninformed.

And yet the mostly unregulated online market is full of it.

[RainDreamer]

Creating the informal name for a substance by the name of the plant/animal where it was first extracted

and suffixing it with -ine (or. in german, -in) is pretty common in organic chemistry

Very well known example ... caffeine (in german even clearewr as "Koffein") from coffea (arabica) suffixed by -ine/-in

When I mentioned the misspelling I meant them calling it "mangastin" . Is that extracts of manga? XD

It sure made my first search on the thing a bust though, that name. Kind of feeling like a deliberate effort.

[magnemoe]

I get a little bit annoyed every time I hear the word extract used in this manner. How the hell do you make an extract of a plant? One can extract a certain compound of it, but not the plant itself.

The best example of it would be this sort of crap. Pearl extract? What a devious way to sell chalk at $500 per kg.

Tell your mom to stay clear of those weight (mass) loss products and implement better eating habits. It's a lot better way to reduce body mass by just adjusting the amount of food you eat vs. any (non-approved) pill whose manufacturers spent more time in designing the label than the actual product.

To make an extract my guess is that you boil it in water like tea or coffee. Also done with many spices.

Has the benefit that its food and not medicine so you don't need any certifications.

Perl extract nice, my guess that its made from the shell and not the pearl.

[RainDreamer]

Perl extract nice, my guess that its made from the shell and not the pearl.

The ingredient, as they call it, is " 100% Powdered Full Spectrum Water Extract of Freshwater Pearls "

I suspect it is just whatever they got from the water where the oysters lives after vaporizing it. Which could be oyster's poop for all we know.

Anyway, for my case, I will try to talk my mom out of that stuff. She is already on a low carb diet and do yoga everyday and yet she still want to get some more help from the pills. Now, if it is just even placebo, I would probably let her have them just for her peace of mind. I am more worried about the stuff in there being harmful. I mean, that article of alpha-mangostin has something about cell killing effect and it creeps me out. I am not a specialist in that field so I am worried.

Oh and have anyone identified what the 3rd ingredient is? Can't find anything about a 'Psilio' plant that gives husks. Only see psyllium, but I have no image to confirm.

Edited August 4, 2015 by RainDreamer

[KSK]

I don't have a problem with somebody saying that they're making an extract of a plant, although it might be clearer to say that they're making an extract *from* a plant. The point is though, that the extract will typically contain a whole bunch of different compounds, some of which will probably be entirely new. That makes it difficult to precisely characterise what you've got, so calling it an 'extract' is about the only honest description you can give.

But back to OP's question.

In general, I don't have a lot of patience with this hippy-dippy insinuation that something is automatically good for you solely because it's 'natural'. Deadly nightshade is entirely natural but its definitely not good for you. Neither do I have a lot of patience with quack diet pills, or faddish celebrity diets. Exercise more, eat less and pick a sensible eating plan that you can stick to. There's no point going on some ridiculously overcomplicated diet that just leaves you feeling hungry and miserable since the chances of you sticking to it are essentially zero.

It's not quick or glamorous or easy but speaking from personal experience (having lost the best part of three stone (19 kg) ), it does work.

I've had a quick look at that patent and to be fair it was a lot better than I expected it to be, as in it does actually provide some evidence that 7-hydroxyfrullanolide is having a tangible biological effect. From what I can see, it prevents fat cells from storing fat and also increases the rate at which they break down fats. So yeah, that might be doing something.

However, I'm not at all certain that it's a good something. Sure it might have the cosmetic effect of reducing body fat but that's not really dealing with the underlying reason why that fat is there in the first place. Without also reducing the amount you're eating, your body is going to be busily making fat out of any food that it can't immediately find a use for (or put into short term storage for example, as glycogen) - and that fat then has nowhere to go. I'm not enough of a biologist (and I'm most certainly not a medical doctor) to tell you what happens then but my gut feeling is 'nothing healthy'.

[Camacha]

Long story short, diets are no use. They yield at best a temporary improvement. What is needed to change your weight for the better is a change in lifestyle. You need to permanently change your eating habits (changing input), while also making sure you make different use of that input (changing output) by exercise. That is pretty much the only thing that will work. Torturing yourself for a few weeks does nothing than to stress your body and psyche, so make sure that the changes that you make are sustainable in the long run.

Sadly, a lot of people want the results, but are not prepared to deal with the practicalities of getting to the results, causing them to look for magic results in all the wrong places. It has never worked, and will most likely not work for a long time to come.

[softweir]

Most respondents seem to be assuming that there is some degree of honesty in the minds of the sellers. For all we know the ingredients in the actual pills could be chalk, sugar, salt, mud from the backyard of the "factory" where they were produced and where pigs are kept, or even high doses of warfarin - ALL these (and worse) have been found in pills bought over the internet from foreign suppliers. This applies to diet pills, fake Viagra, vitamins and many others. The makers use the cheapest ingredients and charge high prices, so it doesn't matter to them that each buyer only makes one purchase - there are millions of suckers out there. And if they only expect a buyer to make one purchase, there is no reason to keep that buyer alive.

What is advertised as being in the pill need have no relation to what is actually in the pill.

As others have said, there is only one way to lose weight: exercise more and eat less, both at the same time. There are ways to make it easier, such as cutting out sugar and sweeteners (both of which stimulate appetite), or switching to un-milled grains such as porridge oats; but there are no miracles.

[78stonewobble]

Eat less and/or exercise more.

Though low carbs isn't a bad idea, there are more obvious way to cut the energy intake. Like soda, candy, cakes and fatty chips and meats.

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but eating ALOT of fruit is equally bad, since some of these are also high in sugar content?

My "food and nourishment classes" are way behind me... but I think the best tip is still to drink a little more water during the day, so you don't go snacking as much and at every meal... cram in some vegetables. They're the filler.

EDIT: In any case, don't go overboard on your own. The body needs proteines, carbohydrates, sugars, salts and vitamins... Ask a doctor or a nutritional expert for help for some sort of food plan.

Edited August 4, 2015 by 78stonewobble

[softweir]

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but eating ALOT of fruit is equally bad, since some of these are also high in sugar content?

Indeed, some fruit do have a lot of sugar - thanks to generations of breeding for "sweeter" flavour! Fruit juice in particular, even if it hasn't had sugar added, is made from fruit varieties that are especially sweet and sugary, and juice made from concentrates is worse because only the very cheapest juices are reconstituted to their natural amount of water.

If somebody is worried about giving up on juice, eat more veg to compensate - it'll be better for you.

As you say, veg are an excellent filler, plus they have all sorts of compounds such as flavonoids which have other beneficial health effects.

I'm not sure drinking water does much to suppress appetite, but at least it stops one drinking juice.

Some recent studies suggest that eating two large meals a day is an easier way to lose weight than eating several small ones. It takes a lot of willpower to stop after eating a small meal, and that is when many dieters slip.

A neat trick is to use your phone to photograph every meal and snack you take. In one study they wanted people to record their intake before starting a diet and once they were on the diet, and decided to get them to take pics as a quick way of recording things. To their surprise, most people lost some weight even before they got to start the diet because photographing their food made them more aware of what they were eating and more self-conscious about it, which helped their self-control!

Never purge. That is the very worst way to lose weight - you eat the food, your body gets all prepared to digest it and store the carbs away, and then you dump it. One of the things the human body does to get ready for food is to produce insulin, which tells the liver it has got to absorb and store all the sugars you eat: when a meal is eaten and then purged, that leaves the liver absorbing sugars that haven't been eaten, so the "dieter's" blood sugar levels crash, making them feel even more hungry.

Edited August 4, 2015 by softweir
Decided to leave out some speculation I inserted as if it was fact.

[QuesoExplosivo]

I don't suppose you could run an LC-MS?

(Without a proper analytical chemistry lab, verifying the contents really isn't feasible.)

[Camacha]

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but eating ALOT of fruit is equally bad, since some of these are also high in sugar content?

You are both wrong and right. Yes, fruit contains a lot of sugars, so if you eat massive amounts of them, you might still gain weight. However, fruit sugars are not the same as the refined or high fructose corn syrups you will find in processed candy and soft drinks. Your body digests them differently, making them less harmful and is almost impossible to truly eat too much like you easily do with snacks. Also, fruit contains lots of minerals and fibres that help your body digest the sugars and those are absent in snacks and candy.

There is a lot of evidence that added sugar is harmful. This includes table sugar (sucrose) and high fructose corn syrup, which are both about half glucose, half fructose. The main reason they are harmful, is because of the negative metabolic effects of fructose when consumed in large amounts. Many people now believe that because added sugars are bad, the same must apply to fruits, which also contain fructose. However… this is completely wrong, because fructose is only harmful in large amounts and it is almost impossible to overeat fructose by eating fruit.

Peaches, plums, berries, melons are all at their juicy peak! Despite the smorgasbord of flavors and colors offered by summer’s fruits, many people pass them by in fear of their sugar/carbohydrate content. What many people do not know is that there is a huge difference between naturally occurring sugar found in fruits, dairy, and other foods and added sugars.

The primary sugar in fruit is fructose, which some refer to as fruit sugar. Fruits contain water, fiber and other beneficial nutrients, making them an optimal choice to include in a balanced and healthy eating regimen. Purified forms of sugar  including table sugar, honey, and high fructose corn syrup  consumed as added sugar to soda, candy, and sweetened baked goods should be consumed in moderation. Too much added sugar can contribute to weak bones, obesity, fatigue, lack of concentration and tooth decay.

Researchers are learning that Mother Nature put more thought and chemistry into her fruits than just sweetness. Many fruits contain phenols, a form of antioxidants that offers many health benefits including protection from heart disease, cancer, and other damaging effects of free radicals in the body. Added sugars certainly do not provide this benefit. In addition, the benefit seems to be derived from eating the fruit, not a mixture of added sugars and phenols. Read More about Free Radicals

Long story short, if you eat 2-4 pieces of average sized fruit a day you do not have to fear ill health effects, and probably not with quite a bit more fruit either. Of course, as always, mind your teeth and take care of them, as fruit juice tends to be sweet and often acidic.

Never purge. That is the very worst way to lose weight - you eat the food, your body gets all prepared to digest it and store the carbs away, and then you dump it. One of the things the human body does to get ready for food is to produce insulin, which tells the liver it has got to absorb and store all the sugars you eat: when a meal is eaten and then purged, that leaves the liver absorbing sugars that haven't been eaten, so the "dieter's" blood sugar levels crash, making them feel even more hungry.

I find the term purging to be a rather nasty euphemism for throwing up. That is a terrible thing to do. Your stomach acids are actually very powerful and throwing up more than the absolute minimum (illness and/or poisonings) it will quickly hurt your oesophagus, mouth and mostly, your teeth. People that habitually throw up generally have bad teeth, as that kind of acid and basically calcium teeth are a horrible combination.

We cannot stress enough how much of a bad idea this is. If you habitually do this - please, get help. You are hurting yourself in ways you cannot imagine.

Edited August 5, 2015 by Camacha

[steve_v]

I don't suppose you could run an LC-MS?

I have tried that approach before, but for some reason nobody wants to turn me loose on the expensive lab equipment

Unless there's someone here who works in a lab that has the requisite machine...

[Cirocco]

I have tried that approach before, but for some reason nobody wants to turn me loose on the expensive lab equipment

Unless there's someone here who works in a lab that has the requisite machine...

if I was still at uni I might have been able to get some time on the liquid chromatography machine, but sadly that's not an option anymore

That being said: in response to the OP

I would not trust these pills at ALL. If it doesn't get sold in the US but is exclusively imported from vietnam, then that does indeed cast doubts about its FDA approval. And frankly, if you can't be sure of FDA approval or equivalent, don't trust it. The research you yourself have done so far would already be more than enough for me to toss these things into the trash, but if you'd like to have something else to research: look for evidence of GMP certification of the producing company (GMP stands for Good Manufacturing Practices. They're a set of international rules for production of food and pharmaceuticals which MUST be adhered to to ensure customer safety). If you can't find any of that, then most definitely toss it in the trash.

Vietnam is notorious for producing dubious pharmaceuticals and supplements, GMP regulation in vietnam is limited to say the least. From what I've read in your research and my own quick searches, I'm afraid you've got a snake oil at best, and a serious health hazard at worst.

As for the precise effects of the chemicals you mentioned on the human body, that's really tough to nail down exactly. Biochemistry is messy and unpredictable, best you're going to get is probably the studies you've already found and I wouldn't trust them for reasons you've already mentioned.

For reference: i'm a bio-engineer working in the pharmaceutical industry. I work in the quality department and the first thing you learn there is pretty much: if you cannot guarantee safety of the product then get rid of it. Never take risks with the patient's (or in this case, your mother's) health.

[RainDreamer]

The funny thing is: it is made in US by a company called St.Paul Brands, but exclusively exported to Vietnam. From researching the ingredients, I found it to be virtually identical to another product in the US called Re-body: Metatrim, which also has 400 mg of Sphaeranthus indicus and Garcinia mangostana extract, equal to 300 mg "Belaunja Extract" + 100mg "Magastin Extract" for LIC. It is also not FDA approved.

The long way around to sell this product off US under another name is another big red flag. I will talk with my mother more about this, but she seems to really believes it works, since she lost weight (which I would attribute more to her low carb diet and yoga exercise everyday rather than the pill).

Edit: any med student here can check their library for effects of alpha-mangostin? I am seeing it classified as a health hazard and that it has been used to induce cell death of cancer cells in some studies. What happen if that is taken without cancer cells?

Edited August 5, 2015 by RainDreamer

[Kryten]

You are both wrong and right. Yes, fruit contains a lot of sugars, so if you eat massive amounts of them, you might still gain weight. However, fruit sugars are not the same as the refined or high fructose corn syrups you will find in processed candy and soft drinks. Your body digests them differently, making them less harmful and is almost impossible to truly eat too much like you easily do with snacks.

'Fruit sugar' is mostly fructose and glucose. It's extremely similar to high-fructose corn syrup, and easier to digest and absorb than the sucrose is standard table sugar.

[Cirocco]

Edit: any med student here can check their library for effects of alpha-mangostin? I am seeing it classified as a health hazard and that it has been used to induce cell death of cancer cells in some studies. What happen if that is taken without cancer cells?

I had a look for alpha-mangostin. It appears that it does indeed induce apoptosis (programmed cell death) when taken orally. As for what happens when you take what is essentially a chemotherapy drug without having any cancer cells.. Well here's how chemotherapy essentially works (what I am about to write is an oversimplification, but it should get the point across).

Chemotherapy is essentially poisoning your own body. Cancer cells are cells that reproduce uncontrollably and therefore require a ton of nutrients and use them very quickly. Chemotherapy basically poisons your body (or an area of the body around the cancer) close to lethal range. Because cancer cells take up more nutrients, they take up more of the poison, pass the lethality threshold and die off (note, even with today's advanced treatments, that statement is often followed by "we hope"). If you take an agent that induces cell-death without cancer cells, then the cells you have most of will take up most of the agent and die off. If you have a ton of fat cells, you'll probably lose weight (probably. Depends on the chemical agent. Again, biochemistry is a messy business). But the thing is, while you're doing this you're also damaging other tissues. And once you start losing weight and the number of fat tissue drops, you're going to start killing off more and more other tissues.

bottom line: taking chemotherapy drugs when you don't have cancer is a very, very bad idea. I would highly suggest you ask your mother to try the diet and yoga exercises without the pills. It might be slower going, but it will be a lot safer.

EDIT: also, about losing a lot of weight quickly: fatty tissues can contain (low) concentrations of chemicals that are bad for your health. Part of the reason for this is that fatty tissues are storage tissues, they store both the good and the bad. If you lose weight at a normal pace, this is absolutely no problem as the hazardous compounds are simply filtered and excreted. But if you lose too much weight too fast, your health can actually suffer because of this. An uncle of mine went though it after having lost a lot of weight quickly due to illness. Best just to take things more slow and steady. It's healtheir and results last longer.

Edited August 5, 2015 by Cirocco

[PB666]

I get a little bit annoyed every time I hear the word extract used in this manner. How the hell do you make an extract of a plant? One can extract a certain compound of it, but not the plant itself.

The best example of it would be this sort of crap. Pearl extract? What a devious way to sell chalk at $500 per kg.

Tell your mom to stay clear of those weight (mass) loss products and implement better eating habits. It's a lot better way to reduce body mass by just adjusting the amount of food you eat vs. any (non-approved) pill whose manufacturers spent more time in designing the label than the actual product.

Annoying at it is, bonafida scientist use this in the current literature, although without clarification of the components (protein, carbohydrate, etc) the probably will end up in the reject pile.

To extract pearl, take an acid such as hydrochloric acid.

A plant extract simply means grinding the plant and taking the water soluble (or alcohol, or urea, whatever). You can take the pellet and re-extract after treating it with something (for example cellulase). A [Plant] extract is simply all the soluble components either in it original unstable liquid form, or lyophilized to produce a powder extract that has a much longer shelf life (when packed in helium, argon or nitrogen).

I am not going to knock the technique, the single most important step in any purification/characterization routine is the first step (usually the extraction). But its not the end all. Minimally you can filter in a HMWCO filter or run it over a desalting or other gel filtration column. Also, bulk Ion-exchange is very good at plucking one desired component out and leaving the rest behind.

Adding my opinion on the original topic - these herbal remedies - often less herb than you think and not very effective. See thread about diabetes.

[RainDreamer]

-post

Thanks so much for those information. How long does those agent like alpha-mangostin stay in the body, usually? Can they be accumulated somehow and cause more harm?

I think I will try some of the fear-mongering tactics to scare my mom from using them. Finally a use of my communication degree that doesn't make me feel horrible.

[Cirocco]

Thanks so much for those information. How long does those agent like alpha-mangostin stay in the body, usually? Can they be accumulated somehow and cause more harm?

I'll be honest with you here: I don't know. I have some knowledge on biology and biochemistry, but I'm no oncology expert. That being said, I can make an educated guess.

Educated guess being as follows:

I've had several people in my family suffer from cancer. All of their chemotherapy sessions usually came once every 2 to 3 weeks, and they were always sick for about 3 days to a week after their sessions. so my guess would be that the amount of time these kind of compounds stay in the body can be measured in days to weeks. Give it a month, maybe two to be absolutely sure and it should all be gone.

As for if they can accumulate and cause more harm: if you keep taking things that induce cell-death and kill off your tissues, it probably will start causing more harm the longer you take it. Partly because of accumulation but also because you're weakening yourself and then you keep attacking our own weakened body, weakening it further, etc. If you just stop taking the stuff before any real damage is done, you should be okay. Remember, people who take chemotherapy can also fully recover once the therapy is successful. The biggest danger here is that chemotherapy is very carefully monitored and dosed but these diet pills are not. If you take these things without close monitoring, you have no idea what you are doing to your body until it's too late.

That being said, the above is pure conjecture and educated guesswork on my part. I have no idea about the long-term effects such things might have, and I'm guessing that lack of knowledge of long-term effects may be one of the reasons why this stuff is not FDA-approved.

Edited August 5, 2015 by Cirocco

[lajoswinkler]

I'd never ever take those "omg new exotic plant" "extracts". A plant is a biochemical factory. We have thoroughly analyzed only a handful of plants on this planet so we can say, with a decent certainty, what are their effects, short term and long term.

These diets (a diet is a regime of nutrition, not neccessarily to get slim) are potentially very dangerous. But as long as you don't claim it's a drug/medicine/cure, and you stick a "food supplement" on it, you're safe from the law. The fact you might be selling stuff that quietly wrecks your liver or neurons... oh well, caveat emptor, right?

Since you're asking how long do compounds stay in the body, here's the answer. In idealized conditions, their overall concentration drops just like radioactivity of a sample. It has a halflife. All drugs have it determined, but it's not strict as it depends on more complex factors. The compound is metabolyzed and excreted, and sometimes concentrated in one area of the body. It's very complex, not like a bucket with two holes, one in, one out, and a stirrer inside.

[Cirocco]

These diets (a diet is a regime of nutrition, not neccessarily to get slim) are potentially very dangerous. But as long as you don't claim it's a drug/medicine/cure, and you stick a "food supplement" on it, you're safe from the law. The fact you might be selling stuff that quietly wrecks your liver or neurons... oh well, caveat emptor, right?

This right here is exactly correct and a very sad truth. If it's labelled drug/medicine, then you're subject to FDA (EMEA for europe or other regional equivalent) regulation and a whole slew of other rules and regulations put in place to protect the patient. Food supplements don't need to follow the same regulations. Be very, very careful with them.

It's very complex, not like a bucket with two holes, one in, one out, and a stirrer inside.

And this right here, ladies and gentlemen, is why I far prefer non-living chemistry over biochemistry. Living things obey certain patterns in large numbers, but individually, a living system does whatever the hell it wants. And heck, even a "simple" example such as a bucket with an two holes, a stirrer and a reaction happening inside it already requires differential equations to properly model