[0.25] Lionhead Aerospace Inc. - Icarus v0.4 updated

[Yogui87]

Great work yogui I am excited to try this out!, What are the chances of a MechJeb controlled rover folding out of the MEM? Wink wink

Yes, a MechJeb rover with no crew was planed but I forgot to add it. I\'ll add it soon in the v3.1.

Hmm having weight balance issues with the skycrane.. its doesnt like to stay upright even with an advanced SAS. I tried it without my rocket below it and here is the result.

I can see on your screenshot that you didn\'t turn on RCS, it\'s very important to stabilize the Skycrane. Full throttle isn\'t the best way to take off neitheir. It\'s true, taking offwith the skycrane is pretty hard, it\'s more easy to land with it. To take off, the better way is to build a 3m diameter rocket (using NovaPunch mod for example). I\'ll try to make quicly a pack with a launcher for my mod. During beta testing, I used MechJeb RoverPod to controle stability with RCS.

Ehm any chance for you to make suspender cables?

Yes, I hope adding it but there\'re some issues I add to fix before. Making an animated winch need 2 colliders moving away each one, and I\'m not sure that it can be done. I\'ll try with Unity but I need to improove my animation skills before. I agree with you, it\'s important to have it work.

can the rover go back into the parachute lander for the return to kerbal or does it just go to orbit and then return again until we have a planet that uses chutes? :-D

For now it can\'t because rover can\'t be re-lock in the nacele once it have been separate. We have to wait for a new planet with atmosphere.

Look in the OP, he plans on making the winch and all. The balance thing kinda bothers me but since I have been using mechjeb to land so it isn\'t too hard. Any plans on making the full exterior of the craft with functioning RCS, Chutes, and a detachable heatshield or will you just make a fairing and be done with it.? Things of that nature have been done before so it is only a matter of skill, which I lack. I have been using a decoupler on top of the crane with a RCS fuel tank + 3 chutes radially to slow down, I detach just after I hit 150 m/s. If you do happen to make the full set, mind trying to put a camera facing straight down to see where you are headed similar to how curiosity finds its LZ.

I was working on a space travel capsule with an detachable heatshield, space engine and possiblity to add parachutes for atmospheric entry. I\'m not very satisfied of it so I was thinking about restarting it from the beginning. Tell me what do you think about:

[TheCardinal]

...

snip

...

I was working on a space travel capsule with an detachable heatshield, space engine and possiblity to add parachutes for atmospheric entry. I\'m not very satisfied of it so I was thinking about restarting it from the beginning. Tell me what do you think about:

Sorry to ask, but why exactly aren\'t you satisfied with that?

It looks absolutely stunning to me. I very much like the novel way you\'ve added an engine at the front covered by shrouds.

Even if i had the required skills to build parts, i doubt if i would have come up with such a solution.

[sgtblazing]

Tell me what do you think about:

It looks pretty nice. Any chance you could add the fundamentals to mimic the Curiosity entry vehicle? I would be a bit worried about taking damage from the heat shield dropping off at the same time as the rover (I don\'t know how its setup but from the screenshot it looks like they were dropped together.) The idea for a rocket motor in the front of the vehicle is creative, and if you can find a way to get a chute(s) on it, it could work out rather well. Maybe have 3 attached radially after the engine. I tend to be a bit of a realist which is why I kinda suggest mimicking Curiosity, but I think having the chutes would be pretty nice on their own.

I really want to get into making parts, if I could find the right tuts I wouldn\'t mind taking a crack at it but I haven\'t the slightest idea where to start.

[Kreuzung]

I\'ve seen a working suspension made with cfg-edited Damned Robotics parts, so maybe you could use MuMech to make a winch that lowers and is a bit more cable-like.

[Yogui87]

I\'ve seen a working suspension made with cfg-edited Damned Robotics parts, so maybe you could use MuMech to make a winch that lowers and is a bit more cable-like.

Oh, nice. I\'ll try this with Damned Robotics. If you can find a link to the suspension you talk about it would be great.

[Kreuzung]

I jsut realized that it was made using rotatrons, but I think you can also make a piston-like part that competely retracts under the mass of the aircrane. Maybe you whould need to eject it fast then before it comes down and crushes the rover ;P

[colmo]

I jsut realized that it was made using rotatrons, but I think you can also make a piston-like part that competely retracts under the mass of the aircrane. Maybe you whould need to eject it fast then before it comes down and crushes the rover ;P

Rotatrons can be used to make a torsion bar suspension, hinges can make a leaf spring. Pistons unfortunately don\'t work like a damper, they\'re incompressible - I asked

[Lazurkri]

Jesus Christ, the skycrane is stupidly top heavy. I\'m having to make a MUCH more massive rocket than I usually use to get to the Mun simply to keep from spinning end over end! Even WITH mechjeb and/or a BUNCH of ASAS modules I\'m still having issues with it.

[DeCi]

Jesus Christ, the skycrane is stupidly top heavy. I\'m having to make a MUCH more massive rocket than I usually use to get to the Mun simply to keep from spinning end over end! Even WITH mechjeb and/or a BUNCH of ASAS modules I\'m still having issues with it.

The next update should reduce the size and weight of this module. IN the mean time you can lower the weight yourself by going into the CFG\'s

[Yogui87]

Jesus Christ, the skycrane is stupidly top heavy. I\'m having to make a MUCH more massive rocket than I usually use to get to the Mun simply to keep from spinning end over end! Even WITH mechjeb and/or a BUNCH of ASAS modules I\'m still having issues with it.

The skycrane is just 40% heavier than a standard mun lander:

I think skycrane tanks are a little too heavy but as DeCi said I\'m waiting KSP v0.16 before rescale the full mod and reduce the weight of every parts by half probably. He tells you to modify cfg files to reduce weight, I think it\'s the best way to fit them to your launcher. I\'m interested by how you will tweek these files.

I don\'t know what size of rocket do you use but 3m diameter rockets are the best I think (I\'m using one for my tests).

Due to positive feedbacks about the space travel capsule for the Skycrane, here some fresh news:

It\'s almost finished. I made tests in Kerbin atmosphere and it works properly: no collision with the heatshield anymore due to parachutes and retro-boosters. Need to continu testing on Mun and Minmus. I\'ll change the parachute because for now it opens through the engine. I\'m making a triple parachute that will deploy around the engine, it\'s more realistic. I\'ll change the engine too because this one is just a modified stock engine.

[TheCardinal]

I\'m afraid i don\'t know the correct superlatives to express my admiration for your work. The way you persist in perfecting it borders on fanaticism with a keen eye for detail. Sir, i salute you!

[SkyHook]

Glad to see an official version of the skycrane, my rover is on Mun now, with a self-built one. I\'m REALLY looking forward to that huge cruiser. Any chance there will be facilities to launch other ships? Bay doors and the like? I can\'t tell you how awesome that would be. Also, the heatshield looks great, keep up to good work!

[sgtblazing]

The latest vehicle looks really nice with the retros and chutes. I really don\'t know which values correlate to which factors with chutes, but would you be able to test out a variant where they deploy relatively high up, and allow for mechjeb to correct to a specific landing point after chute detachment? In the chute design I have been using I kept a 1m mechjeb ontop of the crane, then a decoupler and a RCS tank with 3 chutes radially on top. I disconnect when it got to a reasonably slow speed (~150m/s) Only problem is that when the time comes to disconnect the chutes, mechjeb thinks its too low to begin course correction and goes to the decel stage. I would love to be able to pinpoint a LZ, and let Mechjeb retroburn to reenter at the right area, deploy the chute and ditch the shield, and from a higher alt, detach the crane itself and let it burn to not only decel but move to the predetermined LZ. I am sure I could toy with the number of chutes to do that myself but from the looks of things the packaged vehicle might not have room to do that.

Side note, do you need the retro boosters to aid in the detachment of the head shield when in an atmosphere? (assuming no.) What if the retro boosters had the same shape and size as the parachute pack and you could change them out depending on your target. If you are in the atmosphere you wont need the boosters, and if you are at a moon you don\'t need the chute. Just a thought, I am sure it would be easier to have both and the only downside is a bit of weight.

Sorry for any grammatical errors, 4:30 AM ftw!

[Yogui87]

I\'m afraid i don\'t know the correct superlatives to express my admiration for your work. The way you persist in perfecting it borders on fanaticism with a keen eye for detail. Sir, i salute you!

Thank you, I\'m happy making you so enthousiast.

Glad to see an official version of the skycrane, my rover is on Mun now, with a self-built one. I\'m REALLY looking forward to that huge cruiser. Any chance there will be facilities to launch other ships? Bay doors and the like? I can\'t tell you how awesome that would be. Also, the heatshield looks great, keep up to good work!

I\'ve planed to make alternative parts like antennas to replace top deck cannons and lateral launch bay to replace port and strasport laser guns. It would be great to launch fighters or probe.

The latest vehicle looks really nice with the retros and chutes. I really don\'t know which values correlate to which factors with chutes, but would you be able to test out a variant where they deploy relatively high up, and allow for mechjeb to correct to a specific landing point after chute detachment? In the chute design I have been using I kept a 1m mechjeb ontop of the crane, then a decoupler and a RCS tank with 3 chutes radially on top. I disconnect when it got to a reasonably slow speed (~150m/s) Only problem is that when the time comes to disconnect the chutes, mechjeb thinks its too low to begin course correction and goes to the decel stage. I would love to be able to pinpoint a LZ, and let Mechjeb retroburn to reenter at the right area, deploy the chute and ditch the shield, and from a higher alt, detach the crane itself and let it burn to not only decel but move to the predetermined LZ. I am sure I could toy with the number of chutes to do that myself but from the looks of things the packaged vehicle might not have room to do that.

Side note, do you need the retro boosters to aid in the detachment of the head shield when in an atmosphere? (assuming no.) What if the retro boosters had the same shape and size as the parachute pack and you could change them out depending on your target. If you are in the atmosphere you wont need the boosters, and if you are at a moon you don\'t need the chute. Just a thought, I am sure it would be easier to have both and the only downside is a bit of weight.

Sorry for any grammatical errors, 4:30 AM ftw!

Capsule\'s parachutes can open at 10 000m altitude, so you could have time to correct trajectory. They will have a low drag so it only decelerates the capsule (it\'s not a landing parachute). In my mind, parachute or boosters are alternatives to atmospheric or non-atmospheric landings. I wanted to make them the same shape but I encountered issues to make a stackable multi-booster (I hope I can fix it quick). During tests in Kerbin\'s atmosphere, only parachutes or boosters are needed to slow down the capsule, I use both only for screenshots. Thank you for your sharp analysis.

[Lazurkri]

Ah, yes, after some CFG editing I am now able to launch without spinning end over end anymore.

One issue I\'m having is that whenever I touch down gently and then hit the decoupler to free the rover from the landing nacelle, the 'Deck' of the Nacelle vanishes and the rover drops down, then gets stuck on the remaining doors. I\'ll have a picture up in a few hours when i get back to my home computer, but is there something I\'m doing wrong? And I\'m NOT using the Nacelle to land on Kerbin, I\'m using it on the Mun and Minimus; is this related to the parachutes or something?

[Yogui87]

Ah, yes, after some CFG editing I am now able to launch without spinning end over end anymore.

One issue I\'m having is that whenever I touch down gently and then hit the decoupler to free the rover from the landing nacelle, the 'Deck' of the Nacelle vanishes and the rover drops down, then gets stuck on the remaining doors. I\'ll have a picture up in a few hours when i get back to my home computer, but is there something I\'m doing wrong? And I\'m NOT using the Nacelle to land on Kerbin, I\'m using it on the Mun and Minimus; is this related to the parachutes or something?

Can you tell me what did you edit in cfg file, I\'m interrested in.

For the nacelle issue, I don\'t know what it can be. The deck vanishing is strange, may because you\'re on Mun or Minmus. I never test the nacelle on moons because it was not suposed to land on non-atmospheric moons. I\'ll check if it occures to me too. Please if you have screenshots can you post them?

[SkyHook]

All of my dreams may come true! *tear* :\'(

[Kuldan]

Yeah, the Rover/Skycrane is fantastic, but:

it took me TWO HOURS to actually get a design to the Mun, because it is so unbalanced for some reason (built from the Prometheus Skycrane .craft) that as soon as I am left with only a core stage behind the Rover, it is spinning out of control like crazy - same happens when I try to land the Skycrane, it is not balanced at all, I have to manually correct for tilting and wobbling all over the place so hard that I crashed it the first three times.. can you please look into these balancing issues?

[Yogui87]

Yeah, the Rover/Skycrane is fantastic, but: it took me TWO HOURS to actually get a design to the Mun, because it is so unbalanced for some reason (built from the Prometheus Skycrane .craft) that as soon as I am left with only a core stage behind the Rover, it is spinning out of control like crazy - same happens when I try to land the Skycrane, it is not balanced at all, I have to manually correct for tilting and wobbling all over the place so hard that I crashed it the first three times.. can you please look into these balancing issues?

What type of launcher did you use? A screenshoot could help. For now the Skycrane still unbalanced because of its size. I\'ll rescale it and reduce weight when the KSP v0.16 is out.

I recommand using a 3m diameter rocket for the launcher, NovaPunch pack fits well. You\'ll probably need to activate MechJeb for take off to help to stabilize the rocket. Tell me if these tips can help.

[Alchemist]

If a decoupler disappears that might be because of mechjeb on the decoupled stage.

[Kuldan]

What type of launcher did you use? A screenshoot could help. For now the Skycrane still unbalanced because of its size. I\'ll rescale it and reduce weight when the KSP v0.16 is out.

I recommand using a 3m diameter rocket for the launcher, NovaPunch pack fits well. You\'ll probably need to activate MechJeb for take off to help to stabilize the rocket. Tell me if these tips can help.

Yes,even Mechjeb was not able to keep it going steady..until I actually put the only engine on that stage to be a gimbaling one, and include RCS.. as for the Rocket, I\'m too lazy to boot up my gaming PC now, but it was a stock parts center stage with 5 Fuel Tanks and one LFE-30, surrounded by four four-fuel-tank stages with one LFE-45 each, fuel crossfeed from the outer to the inner tanks (so when I decoupled, the 5 tanks in the middle were still full) - as soon as I decoupled, the craft spiraled out of control.. I also tried a 3M Design including a Nosecap once, and that had even more spiraling issues because of no gimbaling engines at all in the design.. flying the beast felt like crazy.

And even after I modified the design with a LFE-45 for the center stage too (so it can gimbal to compensante for tumbling) it was very hard to keep it steady.. and even after being left only with the skycrane system, it was extremely hard to fly straight. just for example, I tried launching with the skycrane only.. which should give me a solid nice upwards thrust motion, no? It did a backflip even before I fully cleared the launch tower..

Update: I just did a manual fly in orbit, and as soon as I powered up the engine, the craft spiraled out of control.. since this time I didn\'t compensate for it, it actually TORE OFF THE ENGINE due to shear forces.. pictures of the flight:

First picture, launch with Mechjeb (tends to crash in the tower if I fly it manually)

Second picture, directly after Stage Separation..so far so 'good', even though it is not very good on keeping the inclination I want..

Third picture, after Mechjeb 'gave up' (200km apo, -50km periapsis.. yeah..) I manually powered up the engine, and up to this point, was going in a straight line.

10 seconds later, I was wildly tumbling (the ship was doing about 10+ rpm at the time of the screenshot) and about 5 seconds later, the engine tore off.

[sgtblazing]

The fact that the mount under the rover and the mount above the crane to link the parts together is off appears to be causing a ton of problems. Does the new vehicle account for the balance issue? If not, do you think you could look into finding away to keep the center of mass in the middle of the vehicle?

[moxzot]

just about to ply with the rover but nice cruiser your working on

[Yogui87]

I\'m working on the winch witch seems to cause a lot of issues. I\'ll make it a strut part and I\'ll try to more equilibrate the skycrane.

Capsule is almost done and tested. I\'m thinking about a release on saturday, just before I go in holydays.

[kevinlacht]

I\'m working on the winch witch seems to cause a lot of issues. I\'ll make it a strut part and I\'ll try to more equilibrate the skycrane.

Capsule is almost done and tested. I\'m thinking about a release on saturday, just before I go in holydays.

Tip: if 0.4 of the rover ready on satuday, do also hold the link of 0.3 in the topic. If 0.4 will crashes and you are on holiday, you cann\'t fix it, people still can download 0.3.