Help with Duna & Jool missions

[Delta-Cheese]

Ok, quick question will this duna lander explode in a dunian reentry (it doens't have a heat shield).

I wanna play it safe... sending my best men to Duna, don't wanna them to go KABOM.

Edited October 18, 2015 by Delta-Cheese

[Alshain]

It shouldn't. Duna's atmosphere is thinner than Kerbin's. If you can test it around Kerbin and it succeeds, heat will not be a problem on Duna. Smashing into the ground might be though, I don't see parachutes. EDIT: n/m, I see them. Of course you will still need your engines, those aren't going to be strong enough.

[Warzouz]

Nothing will blow in Duna atmosphere. You can deploy regular chute at around 650m/s (probably 700m/s).

PS : you ship is nice !

Drogue chutes might not be useful.

EDIT: but the bottom batteries might not be safe. I think they ave a very low temperature tolerance.

[sebi.zzr]

When i land on duna,i usually do it from 120 km orbit,putting my "Pe" at 10 km and i barely see any heat effects.You can even deploy drogue parachutes at 600-500 m/s.

[Delta-Cheese]

Thanks!I shall put more chutes.

[Warzouz]

My Dunian lander is 7 tons and have 6 regular chutes. You can do with less, but you'll have to burn a bit before hitting the ground.

[Delta-Cheese]

Nothing will blow in Duna atmosphere. You can deploy regular chute at around 650m/s (probably 700m/s).

PS : you ship is nice !

Drogue chutes might not be useful.

EDIT: but the bottom batteries might not be safe. I think they ave a very low temperature tolerance.

Thanks on the compliment, I was trying to make a cool lander with some nifty mechanics (but then again that made it's price become HUGE).

I don't think the batteries will blow up, they have the same heat tolerence as a rcs tank ( i think).

[Warzouz]

When i land on duna,i usually do it from 120 km orbit,putting my "Pe" at 10 km and i barely see any heat effects.You can even deploy drogue parachutes at 600-500 m/s.

No,you can deployr REGULAR chutes at 650m/s. Drogues can surely be opened at much high speed, but their low drag make them quite unuseful in a thin atmosophere.

Kerbin

Regular = 250m/s

Drogue = 600m/s

Duna

Regular = 650m/s

Drogue (higher but too little drag)

Eve

REgular = 200m/s

Drogue (unusefull, terminal velocity will slow you down enough to deploy regular chutes)

[The Aziz]

Are you sure you need this amount of RCS? For me, one medium tank (250 units) is waaay more than enough.

I don't see any thrusters though.

[Warzouz]

Are you sure you need this amount of RCS? For me, one medium tank (250 units) is waaay more than enough.

I don't see any thrusters though.

You're right. Usually, you don't need more that the RCS in the command pod to dock.

[Alshain]

That wasn't his question though. You have no idea how he intends to use the ship. Just that he is landing it on Duna.

[Azimech]

Beautiful lander!

[jarmund]

First things first: Awesome lander design! Congrats

As stated by someone else, simply put: Probably not, but that depends on how you fly it.

The thing about Duna reentry is that the atmosphere is so thin that if you bleed off your speed as high as possible, you should have no problem. However, the thin atmosphere often results in aerobraking being replaced by lithobraking when the surface jumps up and smacks your lander. Parachutes are important, and I see you're well equipped. Just keep in mind that you might have to assist with a retro burn to make sure you go slow enough.

[Delta-Cheese]

You're right. Usually, you don't need more that the RCS in the command pod to dock.

I am going to dock several times, to my kerbin station (kinda of a long story), then I am going to dock on my interplanetary tug, and then, after landing on Duna I will dock to it again. I tried to make this mission interesting and fun, so a lot of things are disposable and useless.

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Do you guys wanna see the interplanetary tug? Shouldn't hurt right? Specially because I think I screwed up my latest interplanetary tug to Jool... Is 3000 delta-v enough to enter in orbit and visit a moon and enter joovian atmosphere?

[Tatonf]

Nothing will blow in Duna atmosphere. You can deploy regular chute at around 650m/s (probably 700m/s).

PS : you ship is nice !

Drogue chutes might not be useful.

EDIT: but the bottom batteries might not be safe. I think they ave a very low temperature tolerance.

I lost my parachutes in the same situation. I would strongly recommand drogue chutes for Duna.

Do you guys wanna see the interplanetary tug? Shouldn't hurt right? Specially because I think I screwed up my latest interplanetary tug to Jool... Is 3000 delta-v enough to enter in orbit and visit a moon and enter joovian atmosphere?

3000 from where ? Starting from LKO you can try Pol or Bop, if you can get good trajectories.

[Delta-Cheese]

3000 from where ? Starting from LKO you can try Pol or Bop, if you can get good trajectories.

I am currently transferring to Jool with a trajectory that will encounter Tylo, giving me a gravity assist (assuming I know what I am doing, which I don't...)

[Tatonf]

Well you're doing it the right way, don't panic.

Once you enter Jool's SOI you can see what your orbit will be after your encounter with Tylo, and you're so far away in the Jool's SOI that you can get whatever orbit you like after the encounter. Make sure it touches the orbit of the moon you're amaing for and you should be able to land on it (even Tylo, if your TWR is acceptable).

[Whovian]

Don't forget RCS thrusters, either.

[Delta-Cheese]

Don't forget RCS thrusters, either.

I have them, but you can`t see them in the picture.

[Delta-Cheese]

I slightly modified the lander, I wasn't liking the fact that the 4 way symmetry was overlaping the 3 way symmetry.

I think the landing legs are kinda to far, but I couldn't find another place.

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I think I wll change the thread name to "Help with Duna & Jool Mission" because I went a little off topic...

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Well you're doing it the right way, don't panic.

Once you enter Jool's SOI you can see what your orbit will be after your encounter with Tylo, and you're so far away in the Jool's SOI that you can get whatever orbit you like after the encounter. Make sure it touches the orbit of the moon you're amaing for and you should be able to land on it (even Tylo, if your TWR is acceptable).

I don't plan on landing, all I have is a probe with some science stuff and a Joovian Atmo Entry thing. One quick question: The closer I get to Tylo, the more of a gravity assist I shall get right?

[Tatonf]

I don't plan on landing, all I have is a probe with some science stuff and a Joovian Atmo Entry thing. One quick question: The closer I get to Tylo, the more of a gravity assist I shall get right?

Yes. But depending on your trajectory the gravity assist might not apply the exact way you would like it. You mainly want it to go retrograde for your insertion in the Joolian system, but you can add some vector towards Normal/AntiNormal or Radial/AntiRadial if your trajectory is not perfect (it can be voluntary or not). What you can do is letting your final orbit touches Tylo's one for multiple gravity assist.

Be aware that your Joovian Atmo Entry will blow up quickly after entering Jool's atmosphere because of it's high speed and the stupid modelization of atmospheres in KSP (except that of Kerbin), except if you get out very quickly. I would recommand a periapsis of 199 950m.

EDIT : Here are some pictures of a Tylo Gravity assist I made. I intentionally made it touches Laythe's orbit, and once I entered Tylo's SOI I slightly changed my trajectory so I could get a Laythe encounter.

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Edited October 18, 2015 by Tatonf

[Delta-Cheese]

Here is my Joovian ship and my trajectory:

In the picture, Tylo is going toward the right

Did I do the gravity assist correctly?

[Tatonf]

It depends of what you expect from your gravity assist.

I don't remember how does gravity assist work actually, I just check my post-encounter orbit to see if it looks like what I want.

In your case I guess you want a stable orbit around Jool ?

[Delta-Cheese]

It depends of what you expect from your gravity assist.

I don't remember how does gravity assist work actually, I just check my post-encounter orbit to see if it looks like what I want.

In your case I guess you want a stable orbit around Jool ?

I wanna get in a orbit that will cross at least some moon, so I can use that gravity to jump from moon to moon, like a pebble thrown in a lake.

[Delta-Cheese]

This is my Duna tug for my lander. Once I get the OKs I will start the mission, maybe along it I will ask some extra stuff here.

Does it have enough Delta-V?