Is this alternate solar system possible?

[silversliver]

1 hour ago, fredinno said:

1. 

What you see above is a graph showing the gases various solar system objects can hold on to for long periods of time. Luna and Mars are really getting the short end of the stick- especially Luna, due to being so much closer to the Sun, it's barely holding onto the O2 and N2 in its atmosphere. And judging by this, both planets would steadily lose water vapor over time. I might need to make Mars bigger, or farther away at higher inclination to prevent that, or at least slow it significantly.

 

I'll comment on the rest later.

But is calculating the eventual presence of magnetospheres?

[fredinno]

6 hours ago, silversliver said:

But is calculating the eventual presence of magnetospheres?

It doesn't matter. Solar Winds accelerate gases in the atmosphere, it doesn't matter if they are already at escape velocity.

[Spaceception]

Could the planet around Nibru be the home planet for that civilization that left the monoliths? (I don't know if that's already been asked) And what if you added a warm desert with an extremely inclined (Almost polar) orbital period of 300 days with a mass of .20 Earths, a temp. of 0.3 c, and an atmospheric pressure of .4 atmospheres, instead of that Gas giant idea?
 

[fredinno]

36 minutes ago, Spaceception said:

Could the planet around Nibru be the home planet for that civilization that left the monoliths? (I don't know if that's already been asked) And what if you added a warm desert with an extremely inclined (Almost polar) orbital period of 300 days with a mass of .20 Earths, a temp. of 0.3 c, and an atmospheric pressure of .4 atmospheres, instead of that Gas giant idea?
 

Huh. We were thinking of putting life in the gas giant, and you were kind of describing Venus in this thing...

Not sure if it would be better. And I kind of wanted to have the cilivilization who left the monoliths be like some sort of Atlantians from Earth that destroyed itself in a nuclear war...

 

I'm not sure, but a binary Nibiru (where the stars orbit very close (a few days orbit) in a single barycentre) went through my mind.

 

One place that really needs definition though, is the 3 rouge planets, SilverStrivlre, Fredinnus, and Chrissace or something like that. They're on the 1st post currently.

 

Also, ChrisSpace, please respond to the Atmospheric concern, otherwise, I can't really proceed with the criticism of the other stuff!

[Spaceception]

5 minutes ago, fredinno said:

Huh. We were thinking of putting life in the gas giant, and you were kind of describing Venus in this thing...

Not sure if it would be better. And I kind of wanted to have the cilivilization who left the monoliths be like some sort of Atlantians from Earth that destroyed itself in a nuclear war...

 

I'm not sure, but a binary Nibiru (where the stars orbit very close (a few days orbit) in a single barycentre) went through my mind.

 

One place that really needs definition though, is the 3 rouge planets, SilverStrivlre, Fredinnus, and Chrissace or something like that. They're on the 1st post currently.

 

Also, ChrisSpace, please respond to the Atmospheric concern, otherwise, I can't really proceed with the criticism of the other stuff!

It's not entirely like Venus, for one thing, It doesn't have a hellishly thick atmosphere and temperature. And for another, it's orbital period is longer.

The Atlantis thing would be cool, but... What if it was intelligent dinosaurs that left the monolith (That managed to evade the carnivores, and develop technology)? And it wasn't an Asteroid that wiped the Dinosaurs out, but rather, an Anti-matter rocket test gone wrong!

[ChrisSpace]

On ‎1‎/‎15‎/‎2016 at 9:26 AM, silversliver said:

What you see above is a graph showing the gases various solar system objects can hold on to for long periods of time.

Diagrams like those are never accurate. Remember that Titan has methane, Mars has water vapor, Pluto has methane and nitrogen, etc etc.

 

[fredinno]

1 hour ago, ChrisSpace said:

Diagrams like those are never accurate. Remember that Titan has methane, Mars has water vapor, Pluto has methane and nitrogen, etc etc.

 

Still, we should still keep that a concern-Luna is on the extremely low end of the scale for O2 N2 atmosphere, so it should be at least a little bigger, or we run the risk of screwing over Luna (especially since it is so much closer to the Sun.)

1 hour ago, Spaceception said:

It's not entirely like Venus, for one thing, It doesn't have a hellishly thick atmosphere and temperature. And for another, it's orbital period is longer.

The Atlantis thing would be cool, but... What if it was intelligent dinosaurs that left the monolith (That managed to evade the carnivores, and develop technology)? And it wasn't an Asteroid that wiped the Dinosaurs out, but rather, an Anti-matter rocket test gone wrong!

Venus in this Alternate Solar System is a habitable desert planet. It's also on the first post

 

Dinosaurs kind of sound ridiculous, TBH, since most had smaller brains (I think) and were unsuitable for evolution into an intelligent species (like Monkeys, Octipi...)

 

I'm not a biologist though.

[insert_name]

11 minutes ago, fredinno said:

 

Dinosaurs kind of sound ridiculous, TBH, since most had smaller brains (I think) and were unsuitable for evolution into an intelligent species (like Monkeys, Octipi...)

 

I'm not a biologist though.

maybe raptors

[ChrisSpace]

43 minutes ago, fredinno said:

Still, we should still keep that a concern-Luna is on the extremely low end of the scale for O2 N2 atmosphere, so it should be at least a little bigger, or we run the risk of screwing over Luna (especially since it is so much closer to the Sun.)

Didn't I already make Luna bigger?

44 minutes ago, fredinno said:

Dinosaurs kind of sound ridiculous, TBH, since most had smaller brains (I think)

I think my pets would like to have a word with you on that...

[fredinno]

1 hour ago, insert_name said:

maybe raptors

Doen't have anything that gives it an edge over other Dino's to become intelligent.

29 minutes ago, ChrisSpace said:

Didn't I already make Luna bigger?

I think my pets would like to have a word with you on that...

1. Luna is actually a little smaller than Mars, so yes, it needs to be bigger, apparently.

2. Why?

[Spaceception]

7 hours ago, fredinno said:

Still, we should still keep that a concern-Luna is on the extremely low end of the scale for O2 N2 atmosphere, so it should be at least a little bigger, or we run the risk of screwing over Luna (especially since it is so much closer to the Sun.)

Venus in this Alternate Solar System is a habitable desert planet. It's also on the first post

 

Dinosaurs kind of sound ridiculous, TBH, since most had smaller brains (I think) and were unsuitable for evolution into an intelligent species (like Monkeys, Octipi...)

 

I'm not a biologist though.

The desert I'm talking about has no water or life.

Scientists say we haven't found every dinosaur (So it's possible that there could've been an intelligent species): http://qz.com/430625/were-not-even-close-to-discovering-all-the-dinosaur-types-that-ever-existed/

Edited January 17, 2016 by Spaceception

[silversliver]

6 hours ago, ChrisSpace said:

I think my pets would like to have a word with you on that...

You have a T-rex as pet?

[fredinno]

19 minutes ago, Spaceception said:

The desert I'm talking about has no water or life.

Scientists say we haven't found every dinosaur (So it's possible that there could've been an intelligent species): http://qz.com/430625/were-not-even-close-to-discovering-all-the-dinosaur-types-that-ever-existed/

Yes, but it's also possible there's an intelligent species of extinct rat. We though, do know that there probably isn't- but there is a tiny possibility.

Sorry, but I'm going to have to reject. What do you think SilverSilver?

[Spaceception]

1 hour ago, fredinno said:

Yes, but it's also possible there's an intelligent species of extinct rat. We though, do know that there probably isn't- but there is a tiny possibility.

Alright,  Intelligent Dino, won't work, okay, the Atlantis idea then, that would be pretty cool, but perhaps they were Martians (This may be a bad idea, I dunno), that began to colonize Earth before it wiped itself out. (Panspermia!!!)

[fredinno]

1 hour ago, Spaceception said:

Alright,  Intelligent Dino, won't work, okay, the Atlantis idea then, that would be pretty cool, but perhaps they were Martians (This may be a bad idea, I dunno), that began to colonize Earth before it wiped itself out. (Panspermia!!!)

Though, you're going to have to ask ChrisSpace about those Atlantians. Also, could you help with the rouge planets? Thanks.

[Spaceception]

4 minutes ago, fredinno said:

 Also, could you help with the rouge planets? Thanks.

What do you need help with?

[silversliver]

6 hours ago, fredinno said:

Yes, but it's also possible there's an intelligent species of extinct rat. We though, do know that there probably isn't- but there is a tiny possibility.

Sorry, but I'm going to have to reject. What do you think SilverSilver?

Once I read an extremely interesting article (I can't find it damn) talking about a particular type of dinosaur (similar to velociraptor) with a ratio body mass/brain mass much higher than other dinosaurs, and then the article explored how this species could become an intelligent and sentient one.

However this was not possible for various reasons.

First humans became intelligent (and sentient) because they NEEDED to be. Dinosaurs ruled for millions of years without any sign of advanced intelligence because they don't needed it, they were based on physical strength, not intelligence.

Second think of dolphins or elephants or some other high intelligent animal.

They aren't building spaceships or other things because they miss something to manipulate objects like, you know, an opposable thumb.

Humans developed this because they hadn't claws or fangs, they needed tools.

Dinosaurs had all sorts of claws and fangs, you don't need tools when simply with your hand or mouth you can kill your prey.

[fredinno]

6 hours ago, Spaceception said:

What do you need help with?

I would think more with defining the planets, maybe add their own moons, characterizing the planets, etc. Currently, we have jack s**t for those.

2 hours ago, silversliver said:

Once I read an extremely interesting article (I can't find it damn) talking about a particular type of dinosaur (similar to velociraptor) with a ratio body mass/brain mass much higher than other dinosaurs, and then the article explored how this species could become an intelligent and sentient one.

However this was not possible for various reasons.

First humans became intelligent (and sentient) because they NEEDED to be. Dinosaurs ruled for millions of years without any sign of advanced intelligence because they don't needed it, they were based on physical strength, not intelligence.

Second think of dolphins or elephants or some other high intelligent animal.

They aren't building spaceships or other things because they miss something to manipulate objects like, you know, an opposable thumb.

Humans developed this because they hadn't claws or fangs, they needed tools.

Dinosaurs had all sorts of claws and fangs, you don't need tools when simply with your hand or mouth you can kill your prey.

Would octopi be able to do so though? They already have limbs that can manipulate things well, and have pretty good brain capacity.

[Spaceception]

On 1/17/2016 at 3:29 PM, fredinno said:

I would think more with defining the planets, maybe add their own moons, characterizing the planets, etc. Currently, we have jack s**t for those.

 Crisplance

I have a moon:

Anemoi :

.14 Earths mass

This is the outermost moon around the Ice giant, with a highly tilted orbit (34 degree tilt) and a thin atm (.7 atm), the moon is comprised of mostly ice, making it's appearance dirty white, due to the many impact craters, and has a weak magnetic field about 13% of Earths, It also is known to have an underwater ocean, however, it's not know whether it has life for two reasons, the first is that there is a very low amount of organics on the moon, and the second, is that the crust is 50km thick and comprised of water/rock making drilling difficult. Finally, it has many active volcanoes, pumping large amounts of Carbon dioxide/Methane making the moon -159 c.

.4g

What do you think? And what planets do you guys want to define better?

Edited January 19, 2016 by Spaceception

[ChrisSpace]

16 hours ago, fredinno said:

1. Luna is actually a little smaller than Mars, so yes, it needs to be bigger, apparently.

OH WHAT THE ----! I'll need to do some atmospheric calculations on my own.

10 hours ago, Spaceception said:

Scientists say we haven't found every dinosaur (So it's possible that there could've been an intelligent species)

I'm pretty sure evolution doesn't work that way. If there were a species of intelligent dinosaur that existed in the past, not only would it's remains be quite widespread (remember that humans went from being in one part of Africa to covering the entire world in less than 150,000 years), but we'd also see precursor species that show early traits of advanced intelligence. And so far we have yet to see any 100-million-year-old Australopithecus yet.

8 hours ago, Spaceception said:

Alright,  Intelligent Dino, won't work, okay, the Atlantis idea then, that would be pretty cool, but perhaps they were Martians (This may be a bad idea, I dunno), that began to colonize Earth before it wiped itself out. (Panspermia!!!)

An interesting idea. But perhaps Mars isn't the best place for the 'precursors' to have risen up in.

3 hours ago, silversliver said:

Humans developed this because they hadn't claws or fangs, they needed tools.

Dinosaurs had all sorts of claws and fangs, you don't need tools when simply with your hand or mouth you can kill your prey.

Well, they may not have had opposable parts of their hands, but they had hands.

59 minutes ago, fredinno said:

Would octopi be able to do so though? They already have limbs that can manipulate things well, and have pretty good brain capacity.

Oh yeah, cephalopods have all the manipulative organs they'll ever need! I actually remember watching a documentary about what the Earth would be like if humans packed their things and left Earth for 200 million years, and it showed that the descendants of squid could develop into a species that could replace humans as the planet-destroying biosphere-decimating ocean-polluting climate-disrupting evil overlords intelligent species.

[Spaceception]

1 hour ago, fredinno said:

50 minutes ago, ChrisSpace said:

An interesting idea. But perhaps Mars isn't the best place for the 'precursors' to have risen up in.

 

 Venus then? Or maybe Luna.

[fredinno]

2 hours ago, Spaceception said:

 Persephone/Tyche 

I have a seventh moon:

Azeroth (I found it on google images):

.14 Earths mass

This is the outermost moon around the Ice giant, with a highly tilted orbit (34 degree tilt) and a thin atm (.7 atm), the moon is comprised of mostly ice, making it's appearance dirty white, due to the many impact craters, and has a weak magnetic field about 13% of Earths, It also is known to have an underwater ocean, however, it's not know whether it has life for two reasons, the first is that there is a very low amount of organics on the moon, and the second, is that the crust is 50km thick and comprised of water/rock making drilling difficult. Finally, it has many active volcanoes, pumping large amounts of Carbon dioxide/Methane making the moon -159 c.

.4g

What do you think? And what planets do you guys want to define better?

I meant for Fredinnus, ChriSplace, and Silverstrilver:

Fredinnus: (3.4x Earths Mass) Discovered by the decrypting of the Phobos and Deimos Monoliths. A rouge planet on an escape trajectory from Sol, it is currently near its apoapsis to the Sun. It could be a good refuelling stop for interstellar missions, and seems to show that rouge planets are quite common in the Milky Way (estimations range from 2 to 100,000x more rouge planets than stars). Aside from being a frozen-over carbon planet, little else is known about it. All information on this object has been obtained from the monoliths, which have questionable reliability. Fredinnus was the name given to this object by the archiving civilization. [? G] ROUGE PLANET (11°) {Currently 0.2 Ly from the Sun}

Crisplance: (2.1x Jupiter Masses) Discovered by the decrypting of the Phobos and Deimos Monoliths. A rouge planet on an escape trajectory from Sol, it is currently far from its apospsis to the Sun. It could be a good refuelling stop for interstellar missions, and seems to show that rouge planets are quite common in the Milky Way (estimations range from 2 to 100,000x more rouge planets than stars). Aside from being an enormous gas giant, little else is known about it. All information on this object has been obtained from the monoliths, which have questionable reliability. Crisplance was the name given to this object by the archiving civilization. [? G] ROUGE PLANET (5°) {Currently 0.5 Ly from the Sun}

Silverstrivler: (0.75x Earths Mass) Discovered by the decrypting of the Phobos and Deimos Monoliths. A rouge planet on an escape trajectory from Sol, it is currently approaching its apoapsis to the Sun. It could be a good refuelling stop for interstellar missions, and seems to show that rouge planets are quite common in the Milky Way (estimations range from 2 to 100,000x more rouge planets than stars). Aside from being a coreless water-ice planet, little else is known about it. All information on this object has been obtained from the monoliths, which have questionable reliability. Fredinnus was the name given to this object by the archiving civilization. [? G] ROUGE PLANET (8°) {Currently 0.6 Ly from the Sun}

The moon you described would be pretty bad for Tyche, since it would dominate the other moons, but it sounds like something great to put around Crisplance, so that's going to be the baseline currently. I think.

[Spaceception]

@fredinno

Ok, no problem:)

I have a moon idea for your planet,
Mustafar:

.1x Earths mass

Mustafar is a medium sized moon closely orbiting Fredinnus just outside it's Roche limit, making the moon extremely volcanically active, it has a thick atmosphere from all of it's volcanoes (1.2 atm) made up of CO2, CH4, S, and H2SO4. Due to it's close orbit, it's extremely volcanically active (More so than Io), no impact craters are visible, and it has a weak magnetic field (20% of Earths), it's average temperature is 2 c.    ? g

And Silverstrivlers,

Loki:

.0031 moons mass

Loki is a small moon, a little over 2x the mass of ceres, and 3x the radii (Making it 200km wider than Pluto), and almost 100% ammonia ice, because of it's small orbit (1/3 the Earth moon system) It's extremely cold (-220 c), however, it does have ammonia cryovolcanoes, suggesting that there's small underground lakes of ammonia, and perhaps exotic life.

? g

I also want to re-name the moon for Chris "Azeroth" to "Anemoi" if you're (Or he) is putting it in.

 

Edited January 18, 2016 by Spaceception

[fredinno]

"OH WHAT THE ----! I'll need to do some atmospheric calculations on my own."

Sorry. You go do that, Chris.

 

"An interesting idea. But perhaps Mars isn't the best place for the 'precursors' to have risen up in."

I would disagree. We are already making Mars a freezing planet covered by ice and Canada-like land, you might as well go the full way to nuclear winter level. Of course though, the people on this forum have questioned the validity of nuclear winter, and the current timescales suggest collapse 11000 years ago, so it would currently be the same temperature as it would otherwise be. https://ca.answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20080403190745AAbnC9U The REAL impact is nuclear fallout, which is still abnormally high, and leaves parts uninhabitable, dispite the time since. Civilization has collasped into an agrigan society. The nonrenewable resources on Mars are largely depleted after the Atlantians used them up, and they colonized Bellona. However, these bases were small, and collasped after the Atlantians died, as they placed little value to expansion into space. 

 

"Well, they may not have had opposable parts of their hands, but they had hands."

Hands terrible for object manipulation. Also, many dinos had no hands.

 

Also, Spaceception, you can also do simulations in Universe Sandbox 2 http://universesandbox.com/, something that is kind of necessary to validate all this. My computer isn't powerful enough for it. And you can pirate it if you do not have the money you really shouldn't, but it IS an option. I'm not endorsing it though. If not, hopefully someone else can do them.

Edited January 18, 2016 by fredinno

[Spaceception]

54 minutes ago, fredinno said:

Also, Spaceception, you can also do simulations in Universe Sandbox 2 http://universesandbox.com/, something that is kind of necessary to validate all this. My computer isn't powerful enough for it. And you can pirate it if you do not have the money you really shouldn't, but it IS an option. I'm not endorsing it though. If not, hopefully someone else can do them.

The earliest I could possibly get US2 is my 16th birthday in April, but even then I don't know if my computer can handle it, I'll try, but I don't know:/ It looks like I have most of the specs, but I have no clue on how it'd run.

Edited January 18, 2016 by Spaceception