Is this alternate solar system possible?

[Findthepin1]

Also, you have 4 ice Giants. This seems unnecessary. I suggest you change one, maybe make it colder so it freezes "solid" or has an ocean made of the former atmosphere

And when does this timeline start? There was a thing in 720 AD where a dwarf planet passed really close to Saturn. If your timeline starts early enough, you can include that in the story. 

Edited January 27, 2016 by Findthepin1

[Spaceception]

  On 12/6/2015 at 3:35 AM, ChrisSpace said:

Fredinnus: (3.4x Earths Mass) Discovered by the decrypting of the Phobos and Deimos Monoliths. A rouge planet on an escape trajectory from Sol, it is currently near its apoapsis to the Sun. It could be a good refuelling stop for interstellar missions, and seems to show that rouge planets are quite common in the Milky Way (estimations range from 2 to 100,000x more rouge planets than stars). Aside from being a frozen-over carbon planet, The planet has a thick Atm 12.2x thicker than Earths, it has a day/night cycle 42 days long, the temperature -272 c, and the planet is made mostly of Silicates, with little Iron. All information on this object has been obtained from the monoliths, which have questionable reliability. Fredinnus was the name given to this object by the archiving civilization. [ 1.61 G] ROUGE PLANET (11°) {Currently 0.9 Ly from the Sun}

 

Crisplance: (2.1x Jupiter Masses) Discovered by the decrypting of the Phobos and Deimos Monoliths. A rouge planet on an escape trajectory from Sol, it is currently far from its apospsis to the Sun. It could be a good refuelling stop for interstellar missions, and seems to show that rouge planets are quite common in the Milky Way (estimations range from 2 to 100,000x more rouge planets than stars). Aside from being an enormous gas giant, The planets Atm is unknown, it has a day/night cycle lasting .3 days long, the temperature is -273 c, and the planet is made mostly of Hydrogen. All information on this object has been obtained from the monoliths, which have questionable reliability. Crisplance was the name given to this object by the archiving civilization. [12.43 G] ROUGE PLANET (5°) {Currently 1.2 Ly from the Sun}

Silverstrivler: (0.75x Earths Mass) Discovered by the decrypting of the Phobos and Deimos Monoliths. A rouge planet on an escape trajectory from Sol, it is currently approaching its apoapsis to the Sun. It could be a good refuelling stop for interstellar missions, and seems to show that rouge planets are quite common in the Milky Way (estimations range from 2 to 100,000x more rouge planets than stars). Aside from being a near-coreless water-ice planet, The planet has a thin Atm .372 of Earths, it has a day/night cycle lasting 3.02 days long, the temperature -272 c, and the planet is made mostly of Water. All information on this object has been obtained from the monoliths, which have questionable reliability. Fredinnus was the name given to this object by the archiving civilization. [.535 G] ROUGE PLANET (8°) {Currently 1.4 Ly from the Sun}

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I'm going to put in the stats from US2 down here, and add stuff up there ^ In bold. by the way, the sim lasted over ~13349 years before I closed it.

Fredinnus: | 1.61 g | 9253 km | Mass 3.4 Earths | Temp -272 c | Albedo 1.0 | 12.2 Atm | Magnetic field  1.2 Gauss | 42 day period | Materials 15% Iron, 85% Silicates |

Crisplance: 12.43 g | 105761 km | Mass 2.1 Jupiter's | Temp -273 c | Albedo 0.01 | Atm: unknown | Magnetic field 15 Gauss | 3 day period | Materials 12% Iron, Water 5.06%, 82.9% Hydrogen |

Silverstrivler: .535 g | 7559 km | Mass .753 Earths | Temp -272 c | Albedo 0.18 | .372 Atm | Magnetic field .2 Gauss | 3.02 day period | Materials Iron 27.1%, Water 72.95 |

So what do you guys think about this?

Edited January 27, 2016 by Spaceception

[Findthepin1]

  On 1/27/2016 at 7:53 PM, Spaceception said:

I'm going to put in the stats from US2 down here, and add stuff up there ^ In bold. by the way, the sim lasted over ~13349 years before I closed it.

Fredinnus: | 1.61 g | 9253 km | Mass 3.4 Earths | Temp -272 c | Albedo 1.0 | 12.2 Atm | Magnetic field  1.2 Gauss | 42 day period | Materials 15% Iron, 85% Silicates |

Crisplance: 12.43 g | 105761 km | Mass 2.1 Jupiter's | Temp -273 c | Albedo 0.01 | Atm: unknown | Magnetic field 15 Gauss | 3 day period | Materials 12% Iron, Water 5.06%, 82.9% Hydrogen |

Silverstrivler: .535 g | 7559 km | Mass .753 Earths | Temp -272 c | Albedo 0.18 | .372 Atm | Magnetic field .2 Gauss | 3.02 day period | Materials Iron 27.1%, Water 72.95 |

So what do you guys think about this?

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Fredinnus, being silicates, isn't going to have an albedo of 1. It's physically impossible for anything to have an albedo of 1. Or at least infinitesimally likely. Crisplance is a gas giant. Its albedo shouldn't be too far from the albedos of our OTL gas giants. An albedo of 0.01 reflects 4 times less light than charcoal. As for Silverstrivler, it's ice. We have tons of icy objects in the solar system OTL and there is no icy body we know of with an albedo that low. I suggest you look at similar objects OTL and rethink the new albedos based on those. Here is a list of relevant albedos. The temperatures simulated will depend on the albedo. The average temperature of interstellar space is like 2.5 k so any rogue planet will be at least that.

Jupiter: 0.34

Saturn: 0.34

Uranus: 0.3

Neptune: 0.29

 

Moon: 0.12

Mars: 0.16

Mercury: 0.12

 

Europa: 0.67

Enceladus: 0.99 (?!)

Triton: 0.76

Ganymede: 0.43

Callisto: 0.22

[Spaceception]

  On 1/27/2016 at 10:43 PM, Findthepin1 said:

Fredinnus, being silicates, isn't going to have an albedo of 1. It's physically impossible for anything to have an albedo of 1. Or at least infinitesimally likely. Crisplance is a gas giant. Its albedo shouldn't be too far from the albedos of our OTL gas giants. An albedo of 0.01 reflects 4 times less light than charcoal. As for Silverstrivler, it's ice. We have tons of icy objects in the solar system OTL and there is no icy body we know of with an albedo that low. I suggest you look at similar objects OTL and rethink the new albedos based on those. Here is a list of relevant albedos. The temperatures simulated will depend on the albedo. The average temperature of interstellar space is like 2.5 k so any rogue planet will be at least that.

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It'll be the same temperature regardless, it's way to far from the Sun for the albedo to matter in any way.

Also, I believe that Enceladus has an albedo of .99, so is it really impossible? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enceladus) (Read the side bar)

Edited January 27, 2016 by Spaceception

[Findthepin1]

  On 1/27/2016 at 11:22 PM, Spaceception said:

It'll be the same temperature regardless, it's way to far from the Sun for the albedo to matter in any way.

Also, I believe that Enceladus has an albedo of .99, so is it really impossible? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enceladus) (Read the side bar)

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I mentioned it in my list of albedos. I'm surprised too. It's still impossible because an object with an albedo of 1 reflects absolutely all the light that hits it. There's no known matter that can do this AFAIK. We need to get a physicist in here.

[Spaceception]

  On 1/28/2016 at 12:35 AM, Findthepin1 said:

I mentioned it in my list of albedos. I'm surprised too. It's still impossible because an object with an albedo of 1 reflects absolutely all the light that hits it. There's no known matter that can do this AFAIK. We need to get a physicist in here.

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Oh, I didn't see Enceladus But yeah, we should get a physicist.

[Findthepin1]

BTW, US2 isn't working on my computer. I have the latest update and it keeps stopping the game. Freezing time basically, with the exception that GUI and moving the camera still work. It won't let me focus on objects, and I basically have to restart the game after it freezes. Usually to no avail, because it usually freezes as soon as you open it. When it doesn't freeze on loading, it freezes when you open the temperature/climate tab on a planet. Anyone else have this? How do I fix it?

[Spaceception]

  On 1/28/2016 at 12:54 AM, Findthepin1 said:

BTW, US2 isn't working on my computer. I have the latest update and it keeps stopping the game. Freezing time basically, with the exception that GUI and moving the camera still work. It won't let me focus on objects, and I basically have to restart the game after it freezes. Usually to no avail, because it usually freezes as soon as you open it. When it doesn't freeze on loading, it freezes when you open the temperature/climate tab on a planet. Anyone else have this? How do I fix it?

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Try deleting unneeded files, maybe you don't have enough storage space (Or hard drive space), or you may not have a powerful enough processor.

[ChrisSpace]

  On 1/27/2016 at 1:54 AM, Spaceception said:

Isn't the reason Mars lost it's water (2 bya may I add) was because it was too small? I know there's a moon, but I don't really see how it could sustain a strong magnetic field to keep it's atmosphere, temperature and water.

Also, I don't see Planet 9.

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The reason Mars lost it's water is that it lost most of it's atmosphere, so most of the water either dissipated into space or froze at the poles. And P9 is there under the name of 'Persephone'.

  On 1/27/2016 at 2:54 AM, fredinno said:

Wouldn't it make more sense to make Phersphone the 9th planet tho? I really doubt there would be 2 Oort Cloud planets, we already have 2 + Neptune objects screwing with the Oort Clound Object Orbits. Another isn't necessary.

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Tyche's getting kicked out in the next front post update. Out to Nibiru, probably.

  On 1/27/2016 at 2:54 AM, fredinno said:

Honestly though, ChrisSpace, making Mars even smaller is a bad idea- make it less able to keep onto its atmosphere. We already kind of determined Mars was around the minimum mass for that, I think. 

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It's now the same size as in OTL, and can still hold onto an atmosphere. The size change was mostly to make the storyline easier to work with.

  On 1/27/2016 at 3:03 AM, Andem said:

Name Vulcan
Mass 5.77x Moon
Surface Temperature 300 degrees celsius
Gravity 5.45 m/s2
Makeup 95% Iron, 5% Silicate, 0% Water, 0% Organics
Atmo Pressure 0

Name Venus
Mass 66.2x Moon
Surface Temperature 531 degrees celsius
Gravity 8.87 m/s2
Makeup 20% Iron, 80% Silicate, 0.001% Water, 0.0000000000000006% Organics
Atmo Pressure 91.3 (Forgot to modify this one... that should explain a lot...)

Name Earth
Mass 1x Earth
Surface Temperature 24.9 degrees celsius
Gravity 9.82 m/s2
Makeup 24.7% Iron, 75.3% Silicate, 0.02% Water, 0.00000000067% Organics
Atmo Pressure 0.969

Name Luna
Mass 7.05x Moon
Surface Temperature 193 degrees celsius (It seems the water boiled off into the atmophere... damn you runaway greenhouse affect!)
Gravity 3.14 m/s2
Makeup 15% Iron, 85% Silicate, 0.01% Water, 0.000000000561% Organics
Atmo Pressure 0.856

Name Mars (My Favorite)
Mass 12.2x Moon
Surface Temperature -32.5 degrees celsius
Gravity 4.2 m/s2
Makeup 10% Iron, 90% Silicate, 0.01% Water (And half the surface is frozen!), 0.0000000006% Organics
Atmo Pressure 0.0103

Name Minerva
Mass 8x Earth
Surface Temperature -57.7 degrees celsius
Gravity 25 m/s2
Makeup 24.7% Iron, 75.3% Silicate, 0.0626% Water, 0.00000000067% Organics
Atmo Pressure 0.785

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Why is Earth 10 degrees hotter than it currently is? In any case, i'll post stats on my US2 simulated objects after my next simulation.

  On 1/27/2016 at 3:26 AM, fredinno said:

Also, Mars needs more atmosphere. I think 40-60 percent earth is a minimum.

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I was thinking the surface pressure would be somewhere between 0.5 and 0.9 times that of Earth.

  On 1/27/2016 at 4:53 AM, Spaceception said:

Alrighty, that took awhile. The system lasted 141 years by the time I finished it, then I closed it out to write this.

Vulcan: Mass 0.071 | Earths Radii 2467 km | .473 g | Temp 718 c (There was visible lava) | .665 Atm | Albedo .40 | Materials; 74% Iron, 26% Silicates | Eccentricity 0.06 | Inclination 12.7 | Orbital period 27 days | .16 by .18 AU | Tidally locked | Comet tail |

Mercury: Same

Venus: Mass/Radii/Gravity same | Temp 45.3 c | 1.8 Atm | Albedo: I forgot:/ It was high though. | Materials; Iron: 20%, Silicates 80%, Water 0.000995%, Organics 0.00600 | Inclination 33.8 | Orbital period 270 days (.8 AU) | 1.1 rotational period | Magnetic field .3 Gauss | Eros: Fit the specifications.

Earth: Same, save for a .1.8 c increase. Luna: Mass 8.3 moons | 3374 km | .36 g | 12.6 | .53 Atm | Albedo .78 | Materials; 30.1% Iron, 69.9 Silicates, 0.0100 Water, 0.00900 Organics | 1.1 rotational period | Magnetic field .1 Gauss |

Mars: Mass/Radii//Gravity/Day/night cycle same | Temp 9.39 c | .8 Atm | Albedo .73 | Materials; 16.7% Iron, 83.3 Silicates, 0.00200% Water, 0.01000% Organics | Orbital period, I didn't check:/ | 1.3 AU | Magnetic field .2 Gauss | Bellona: Fit the specifications |

And Finally;

Minerva: Mass 8 Earths | 10862 km | 2.7 g | 9.06 c | 2.7 Atm | Albedo .08 | Materials; Iron 40.6, SIlicates 59.2%, Water 0.0999%, Organics 0.0800% | Orbital period, I forgot; again:/ | 1.74 AU | 1.8 rotational period | Magnetic field: 1 Gauss |

Whew, that took awhile, what do you think?

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Hmm... This is definitely the most promising simulation yet, although I don't see how Luna and Mars could have such high albedos. Venus' atmosphere is also a bit thick, I was planning on having it the same thickness as Earth's.

Oh, before I forget: When you make a simulation of one of the 'habitable' planets, it's best to use Earth as a template and change the size accordingly, because the Earth template includes some extra climate-related options.

[ChrisSpace]

  On 1/27/2016 at 7:23 PM, Findthepin1 said:

And when does this timeline start? There was a thing in 720 AD where a dwarf planet passed really close to Saturn. If your timeline starts early enough, you can include that in the story. 

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Wait, did something like that seriously happen? Source please?

Also, the timeline's Point Of Divergence (POD) is somewhere in the 1700s. Not sure where exactly.

  On 1/27/2016 at 7:53 PM, Spaceception said:

Fredinnus: | 1.61 g | 9253 km | Mass 3.4 Earths | Temp -272 c | Albedo 1.0 | 12.2 Atm | Magnetic field  1.2 Gauss | 42 day period | Materials 15% Iron, 85% Silicates |

Crisplance: 12.43 g | 105761 km | Mass 2.1 Jupiter's | Temp -273 c | Albedo 0.01 | Atm: unknown | Magnetic field 15 Gauss | 3 day period | Materials 12% Iron, Water 5.06%, 82.9% Hydrogen |

Silverstrivler: .535 g | 7559 km | Mass .753 Earths | Temp -272 c | Albedo 0.18 | .372 Atm | Magnetic field .2 Gauss | 3.02 day period | Materials Iron 27.1%, Water 72.95 |

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Great job, but I don't think adding the surface temperatures really says anything this far from the sun.

[Spaceception]

  On 1/28/2016 at 1:36 AM, ChrisSpace said:

The reason Mars lost it's water is that it lost most of it's atmosphere, so most of the water either dissipated into space or froze at the poles. And P9 is there under the name of 'Persephone'.

Hmm... This is definitely the most promising simulation yet, although I don't see how Luna and Mars could have such high albedos. Venus' atmosphere is also a bit thick, I was planning on having it the same thickness as Earth's.

Oh, before I forget: When you make a simulation of one of the 'habitable' planets, it's best to use Earth as a template and change the size accordingly, because the Earth template includes some extra climate-related options.

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I know, but the reason Mars lost it's Atm (And shortly following, the Water/Temp as well) was because it lost it's magnetic field, and that was because it was too small, so putting it to at least .12 Earths would probably be best.

Thanks Also, I had to increase their albedos because they were getting too hot, both Luna and Mars were supposed to be noticeably cooler than Earth, and they were pushing to be around the same temperature or a bit higher. Plus the front page said Venus' Atm was thinker than Earths, and seeing as how it was closer to the Sun, and likely had more volcanic activity (Like OTL), I assumed that the Atm would be between 1.2-2 Atm.

Okay, should I smack a few Asteroids at it to make it look like it's own planet, or just have a few Earths around the Sun?

  On 1/28/2016 at 1:42 AM, ChrisSpace said:

Great job, but I don't think adding the surface temperatures really says anything this far from the sun.

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Thanks, again Also, I added the Temp just because I thought it was relevant.

Edited January 28, 2016 by Spaceception

[Findthepin1]

2060 Chiron passed ~30 500 000 km from Saturn and significantly changed its orbit. You can look up 2060 Chiron and it won't be long before you hear something about it. You can see it on Wikipedia, you can see it if you search for the dwarf planet on Google and look at the search results. It wasn't the only time, either. Another close encounter occurred in 1664 BC, which you can find on Wikipedia. Maybe someone can simulate this in US2, just run all the orbits backward for a while until you see it pass really close to Saturn in like 2730 AD.

Edited January 28, 2016 by Findthepin1

[Spaceception]

  On 1/28/2016 at 1:57 AM, Findthepin1 said:

2060 Chiron passed ~30 500 000 km from Saturn and significantly changed its orbit. You can look up 2060 Chiron and it won't be long before you hear something about it. You can see it on Wikipedia, you can see it if you search for the dwarf planet on Google and look at the search results. It wasn't the only time, either. Another close encounter occurred in 1664 BC, which you can find on Wikipedia. Maybe someone can simulate this in US2, just run all the orbits backward for a while until you see it pass really close to Saturn in like 2730 AD.

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Why won't it be long until we hear something about it? Maybe I didn't read it closely enough, but I didn't see any reason to get excited and/or scared about it.

Is 2060 supposed to mean something?

[ChrisSpace]

  On 1/28/2016 at 1:46 AM, Spaceception said:

I know, but the reason Mars lost it's Atm (And shortly following, the Water/Temp as well) was because it lost it's magnetic field, and that was because it was too small, so putting it to at least .12 Earths would probably be best.

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The reason Mars lost it's magnetic field is that it didn't have enough Iron in its core IIRC.

  On 1/28/2016 at 1:46 AM, Spaceception said:

Thanks Also, I had to increase their albedos because they were getting too hot, both Luna and Mars were supposed to be noticeably cooler than Earth, and they were pushing to be around the same temperature or a bit higher. Plus the front page said Venus' Atm was thinker than Earths, and seeing as how it was closer to the Sun, and likely had more volcanic activity (Like OTL), I assumed that the Atm would be between 1.2-2 Atm.

Okay, should I smack a few Asteroids at it to make it look like it's own planet, or just have a few Earths around the Sun?

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Yeah, the Moon and Mars templates have problems with temperature. That's why they heated up too much.

  On 1/28/2016 at 1:57 AM, Findthepin1 said:

2060 Chiron passed ~30 500 000 km from Saturn and significantly changed its orbit. You can look up 2060 Chiron and it won't be long before you hear something about it. You can see it on Wikipedia, you can see it if you search for the dwarf planet on Google and look at the search results. It wasn't the only time, either. Another close encounter occurred in 1664 BC, which you can find on Wikipedia. Maybe someone can simulate this in US2, just run all the orbits backward for a while until you see it pass really close to Saturn in like 2730 AD.

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Huh. Well that's a bit too far back in history to be a part of the timeline, but it's interesting to know.

  On 1/28/2016 at 2:12 AM, Spaceception said:

Is 2060 supposed to mean something?

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I think that means it was the 2060th object of its kind to be discovered.

[Spaceception]

New route, should I begin simulating the Nibriu system? If so, what type of star is it, what are your parameters for the Earth-like planet, and how many planets are there?

[Findthepin1]

  On 1/28/2016 at 2:12 AM, Spaceception said:

Why won't it be long until we hear something about it? Maybe I didn't read it closely enough, but I didn't see any reason to get excited and/or scared about it.

Is 2060 supposed to mean something?

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A) I mean, if you look up 2060 Chiron on Google, it won't be long (less than a page of websites on Google) before you notice something on Google mentioning the encounter. You might have to go into a website to see it mention the encounter, though. B) I didn't mean anything was going to happen lol, no excitement about this object. C) 2060 is part of the dwarf planet's name as per a numbering scheme. Similar to 433 Eros or 1 Ceres or 50000 Quaoar.

Edited January 28, 2016 by Findthepin1

[ChrisSpace]

  On 1/28/2016 at 2:43 AM, Spaceception said:

New route, should I begin simulating the Nibriu system? If so, what type of star is it, what are your parameters for the Earth-like planet, and how many planets are there?

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It'll be a while before I get to that, but in the meantime you can start coming up with ideas. To get some ideas of what different habitable planets can be like, see here: http://www.worlddreambank.org/P/PLANETEC.HTM

[Spaceception]

  On 1/28/2016 at 4:37 AM, ChrisSpace said:

It'll be a while before I get to that, but in the meantime you can start coming up with ideas. To get some ideas of what different habitable planets can be like, see here: http://www.worlddreambank.org/P/PLANETEC.HTM

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Hmmmm, I'm thinking of a two planet system orbiting a star like Proxima, with two cold planets, one of them a "habitable" frozen Titan, i don't know what the specifications will be, but that's my rough idea.

[Spaceception]

  On 1/27/2016 at 3:03 AM, Andem said:

Name Vulcan
Mass 5.77x Moon
Surface Temperature 300 degrees celsius
Gravity 5.45 m/s2
Makeup 95% Iron, 5% Silicate, 0% Water, 0% Organics
Atmo Pressure 0

Name Venus
Mass 66.2x Moon
Surface Temperature 531 degrees celsius
Gravity 8.87 m/s2
Makeup 20% Iron, 80% Silicate, 0.001% Water, 0.0000000000000006% Organics
Atmo Pressure 91.3 (Forgot to modify this one... that should explain a lot...)

Name Earth
Mass 1x Earth
Surface Temperature 24.9 degrees celsius
Gravity 9.82 m/s2
Makeup 24.7% Iron, 75.3% Silicate, 0.02% Water, 0.00000000067% Organics
Atmo Pressure 0.969

Name Luna
Mass 7.05x Moon
Surface Temperature 193 degrees celsius (It seems the water boiled off into the atmophere... damn you runaway greenhouse affect!)
Gravity 3.14 m/s2
Makeup 15% Iron, 85% Silicate, 0.01% Water, 0.000000000561% Organics
Atmo Pressure 0.856

Name Mars (My Favorite)
Mass 12.2x Moon
Surface Temperature -32.5 degrees celsius
Gravity 4.2 m/s2
Makeup 10% Iron, 90% Silicate, 0.01% Water (And half the surface is frozen!), 0.0000000006% Organics
Atmo Pressure 0.0103

Name Minerva
Mass 8x Earth
Surface Temperature -57.7 degrees celsius
Gravity 25 m/s2
Makeup 24.7% Iron, 75.3% Silicate, 0.0626% Water, 0.00000000067% Organics
Atmo Pressure 0.785

All the other planets are behaving normally... I uncovered a few errors of mine, which will be rectified shortly.

 

Also, the Orbital parameters provided for the planets have been followed as closely as possible, as for the moons I have been working on educated guesses and assumptions from their descriptions.

 

--EDIT-- 

By lowering Venus' atmospheric pressure to logical levels the temperature dropped to much more accurate levels.

--EDIT 2--

Luna Has an stable, breathable atmosphere, but can't seem to have liquid water or a safe temperature... It seems that having the atmosphere is lowering the Albedo and holding in the heat, Luna is like a mini Vonus from OTL...

--EDIT 3--

Minerva snowballs no matter how dense I make the atmosphere... it's just far enough from the sun where it experiances a reverse runaway greenhouse affect... the Albedo is so high that the surface can't heat up enough to melt... not kidding, I put the atmosphere to 100000 atmospheres and the whole thing froze over... I'm leaving it at ten atmospheres because it seems appropriate for the current description.

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For the most part it's good, but I see a few big problems,

If a planet (Or moon) is too cold, decrease the albedo (So it absorbs heat), if it's too hot, increase the albedo (So it reflects heat), atmospheric pressure also adds/takes away temperature, so increase or decrease according.

Mars' Atm is way too thin, it needs to be at least  .5 atmospheres.

Minerva's atmosphere is also too thin, it needs to be higher than Earths' in order to have a warmish temperature.

If Earths' temperature is going up much higher than OTL, Luna is too close, and is giving too much tidal heating, I put  Luna ~110,000 km further than Luna OTL, but further would probably be just as good.

Edited January 28, 2016 by Spaceception

[Andem]

  On 1/28/2016 at 1:36 AM, ChrisSpace said:

Why is Earth 10 degrees hotter than it currently is? In any case, i'll post stats on my US2 simulated objects after my next simulation.

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It started out the same temperature, and over time it got warmer. I left the sim going for a few thousand years to determine everything was stable.

[fredinno]

  On 1/27/2016 at 6:40 PM, Spaceception said:

Later today, I'm going to characterize the rouge planets a bit more.

Don't worry, I'll highlight the add-ons (And won't add too much).

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Damn, when I was getting down to that because I assumed you wouldn't..

  On 1/27/2016 at 7:23 PM, Findthepin1 said:

Also, you have 4 ice Giants. This seems unnecessary. I suggest you change one, maybe make it colder so it freezes "solid" or has an ocean made of the former atmosphere

And when does this timeline start? There was a thing in 720 AD where a dwarf planet passed really close to Saturn. If your timeline starts early enough, you can include that in the story. 

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We are removing Tyche, and moving it to Nibiru. That's not a problem.

 

ANd the second, ask ChrisSpace. And the scenario presented is less likely than a 900 lbs man being able to walk. In other words, Fat (no pun intended) chance.

  On 1/27/2016 at 10:43 PM, Findthepin1 said:

Fredinnus, being silicates, isn't going to have an albedo of 1. It's physically impossible for anything to have an albedo of 1. Or at least infinitesimally likely. Crisplance is a gas giant. Its albedo shouldn't be too far from the albedos of our OTL gas giants. An albedo of 0.01 reflects 4 times less light than charcoal. As for Silverstrivler, it's ice. We have tons of icy objects in the solar system OTL and there is no icy body we know of with an albedo that low. I suggest you look at similar objects OTL and rethink the new albedos based on those. Here is a list of relevant albedos. The temperatures simulated will depend on the albedo. The average temperature of interstellar space is like 2.5 k so any rogue planet will be at least that.

Jupiter: 0.34

Saturn: 0.34

Uranus: 0.3

Neptune: 0.29

 

Moon: 0.12

Mars: 0.16

Mercury: 0.12

 

Europa: 0.67

Enceladus: 0.99 (?!)

Triton: 0.76

Ganymede: 0.43

Callisto: 0.22

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Actually, ChrisSplance is more like a Sub-Brown Dwarf, but it barely matters, it behaves like Jupiter in most ways anyways..

[fredinno]

  On 1/28/2016 at 1:36 AM, ChrisSpace said:

The reason Mars lost it's water is that it lost most of it's atmosphere, so most of the water either dissipated into space or froze at the poles. And P9 is there under the name of 'Persephone'.

Tyche's getting kicked out in the next front post update. Out to Nibiru, probably.

It's now the same size as in OTL, and can still hold onto an atmosphere. The size change was mostly to make the storyline easier to work with.

Why is Earth 10 degrees hotter than it currently is? In any case, i'll post stats on my US2 simulated objects after my next simulation.

I was thinking the surface pressure would be somewhere between 0.5 and 0.9 times that of Earth.

Hmm... This is definitely the most promising simulation yet, although I don't see how Luna and Mars could have such high albedos. Venus' atmosphere is also a bit thick, I was planning on having it the same thickness as Earth's.

Oh, before I forget: When you make a simulation of one of the 'habitable' planets, it's best to use Earth as a template and change the size accordingly, because the Earth template includes some extra climate-related options.

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Mars has a high albedo due to its ice. Luna, no clue. It should be near-identical to Earth.

  On 1/28/2016 at 1:42 AM, ChrisSpace said:

Wait, did something like that seriously happen? Source please?

Also, the timeline's Point Of Divergence (POD) is somewhere in the 1700s. Not sure where exactly.

Great job, but I don't think adding the surface temperatures really says anything this far from the sun.

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It actually does, it's the difference between a liquid and gaseous hydrogen atmosphere.

  On 1/28/2016 at 12:39 AM, Spaceception said:

Oh, I didn't see Enceladus But yeah, we should get a physicist.

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Hey, don't look at me..

  On 1/28/2016 at 1:57 AM, Findthepin1 said:

2060 Chiron passed ~30 500 000 km from Saturn and significantly changed its orbit. You can look up 2060 Chiron and it won't be long before you hear something about it. You can see it on Wikipedia, you can see it if you search for the dwarf planet on Google and look at the search results. It wasn't the only time, either. Another close encounter occurred in 1664 BC, which you can find on Wikipedia. Maybe someone can simulate this in US2, just run all the orbits backward for a while until you see it pass really close to Saturn in like 2730 AD.

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We don't know if it's actually a Dwarf planet, and in many case, it's thought to be near the lower limit of dwarf planet size. It could end up being a Vesta just as easily a Ceres in terms of mass. And it barely should matter anyways, that has been keeping to itself in the outer solar system forever, and it likely barely matters until much later in the timeline.

[fredinno]

  On 1/28/2016 at 2:29 AM, ChrisSpace said:

The reason Mars lost it's magnetic field is that it didn't have enough Iron in its core IIRC.

Yeah, the Moon and Mars templates have problems with temperature. That's why they heated up too much.

Huh. Well that's a bit too far back in history to be a part of the timeline, but it's interesting to know.

I think that means it was the 2060th object of its kind to be discovered.

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No, it was because it cooled down too quickly, and the liquid inner core, which forms the mag, field, solidified. It has little to do with mass, though a smaller object cools down more rapidly...

 

They both have a** albedos. You should always use the object most similar to the one you want when doing this stuff.

 

And yes, ChrisSpace is correct here.

[fredinno]

  On 1/28/2016 at 2:43 AM, Spaceception said:

New route, should I begin simulating the Nibriu system? If so, what type of star is it, what are your parameters for the Earth-like planet, and how many planets are there?

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No, not now, please. You guys are all going too fast: I can't catch up. 

  On 1/28/2016 at 1:26 PM, Spaceception said:

Hmmmm, I'm thinking of a two planet system orbiting a star like Proxima, with two cold planets, one of them a "habitable" frozen Titan, i don't know what the specifications will be, but that's my rough idea.

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Leave that to me for now, please. Let's pick up the pieces from what we did, and get a few things straight.

  On 1/28/2016 at 3:31 PM, Spaceception said:

For the most part it's good, but I see a few big problems,

If a planet (Or moon) is too cold, decrease the albedo (So it absorbs heat), if it's too hot, increase the albedo (So it reflects heat), atmospheric pressure also adds/takes away temperature, so increase or decrease according.

Mars' Atm is way too thin, it needs to be at least  .5 atmospheres.

Minerva's atmosphere is also too thin, it needs to be higher than Earths' in order to have a warmish temperature.

If Earths' temperature is going up much higher than OTL, Luna is too close, and is giving too much tidal heating, I put  Luna ~110,000 km further than Luna OTL, but further would probably be just as good.

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No, don't mod the albedo, the albedo of planets is like Earth due to having life. There are differences, like Minervera's water, Mars' ice, and Venus' LACK of water, but please, don't mess around with that part. Use the atmosphere bar instead. God knows it's incredibly low anyways.

 

BTW, one more thing, having three people doing sims is great, but it's really confusing. We need to make this more orderly. Maybe I or ChrisSpace can assign things? Especially when the simulations are all so off from each other. I think we should only have one or two people doing sims. More than that, and it gets really confusing, as they are all different due to someone doing the planets slightly differently.

[fredinno]

 

  On 1/27/2016 at 7:53 PM, Spaceception said:

I'm going to put in the stats from US2 down here, and add stuff up there ^ In bold. by the way, the sim lasted over ~13349 years before I closed it.

Fredinnus: | 1.61 g | 9253 km | Mass 3.4 Earths | Temp -272 c | Albedo 1.0 | 12.2 Atm | Magnetic field  1.2 Gauss | 42 day period | Materials 15% Iron, 85% Silicates |

Crisplance: 12.43 g | 105761 km | Mass 2.1 Jupiter's | Temp -273 c | Albedo 0.01 | Atm: unknown | Magnetic field 15 Gauss | 3 day period | Materials 12% Iron, Water 5.06%, 82.9% Hydrogen |

Silverstrivler: .535 g | 7559 km | Mass .753 Earths | Temp -272 c | Albedo 0.18 | .372 Atm | Magnetic field .2 Gauss | 3.02 day period | Materials Iron 27.1%, Water 72.95 |

So what do you guys think about this?

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Fredinnus needs more iron, more like twenty to twenty five percent. It's also a carbon lanes, so give that one bad albedo. It's atmosphere is too thick- literally nothing will be gaseous at that point. Actually, there should be NO atmosphere to speak of, all of it should be frozen- and that also applies to Silverstriver.

 

Sivlersrtiver should have silicates laced in the iron too, so add some of that too, probably changing the compositions to fifteen iron and thirty silicate, along with the rest as water? It was inspired by Castillio (Jupiter's moon), so they would have similar albedos. It also should have no magentic field, lacking a core.

 

Chrisplance needs a Jupiter Albedo. And it has WAY too much water- it should be a trace compound- actually, just replace it with an oversized stock Jupiter. That's easier.

 

Also, should I include compositions in percentage in my stats? Just asking.