[Minimum KSP version - 1.11] Kerbal Attachment System (KAS) v1.12

[Thobewill10]

Is there a way to surface-attach winches while on EVA? I mean the root structure, not the connector or the cable. When I try to have a kerbal attach it, it says it does not support surface attach, but I can attach them just fine in the VAB

Edited July 20, 2016 by Thobewill10

[Mecripp]

3 hours ago, Thobewill10 said:

Is there a way to surface-attach winches while on EVA? I mean the root structure, not the connector or the cable. When I try to have a kerbal attach it, it says it does not support surface attach, but I can attach them just fine in the VAB

Here take a look

Attachment rules

attachRules defines how this part attaches to or allows attachments from other parts. Though documented in some part files, the documentation is minimalist and difficult to understand, so here's a little clean-up and expansion.

    // attachment rules: stack, srfAttach, allowStack, allowSrfAttach, allowCollision
    attachRules = 1,1,1,1,1

The rules correspond to the numbers below - 1 is allow, 0 is prevent. The tags are:

stack - Can your part be stacked on others?

SrfAttach - Can your part be placed onto a surface?

allowStack - Will you allow other parts to be stacked on your part?

allowSrfAttach Can other parts be placed on the surface of yours?

allowCollision - A special one: Can your part be placed if part of it is intersecting another part?

and here are looking at the cfg's for the winches

name = KAS_Winch1

attachRules = 1,0,1,1,0

and 


name = KAS_Winch2


attachRules = 1,1,1,0,0

Looks like one will but one won't unless you edit the cfg for winch 1

[IgorZ]

7 hours ago, Undecided said:

I was under the impression planets counted as separate objects, so you couldn't use struts to attach bases to them.

And a follow up question, are winches also the preferred method of tethering structures to asteroids as well? I've tried using struts, which seem to totally eliminate all wobble, but are very easy to shatter (I typically have to run asteroid engines are <20% speed to prevent shattering). I was wary of attempting to use winches and hooks because I was worried I'd get amplifying wobble/oscillation if they weren't as rigid.

You cannot use strut to attach to the planet but you can use specially designed parts that can attach to the ground. In KIS it's "CB1 Ground Base", in KAS it's "Ground pylon". Third party mods may offer other parts (e.g. PBS gives "K&K Ground Base").

As for the asteroids I haven't played with them much. If you want changing asteroid trajectory then using flexible connections like winch cable is probably not what you want. Though, the main problem is still here: long bases have tendency to wobble and oscillate.

4 hours ago, Thobewill10 said:

Is there a way to surface-attach winches while on EVA? I mean the root structure, not the connector or the cable. When I try to have a kerbal attach it, it says it does not support surface attach, but I can attach them just fine in the VAB

Winches can only be attached to other parts, not the ground. I doubt you were doing it in VAB. Do you mean you were attaching winches to the vessel in VAB? You can do the same in EVA with KIS mod. If you want to create a stationary winch then you need to attach a special part to the ground (see my answer above), and then attach other parts (e.g. a winch) to the base.

[Undecided]

I've noticed tweakscale is compatible with the KAS portable struts. Does strut strength properly scale with size? Do strut bases of different sizes add their strength together to average out, or does the weakest/smallest one dictate the total strut strength? And is there a way to place extra-large tweakscaled struts into inventories?

[Jim Starluck]

So, I'm trying to use KAS to help stabilize my Minmus mining base, and I'm running into a problem. Connector ports have been working fine; I've linked them together all over the place. But the portable struts are missing the "Link" button when I right-click on them. I get the right-click menu for other stuff, but not that button.

I'm using version 0.5.9.0 of the mod, but I've got a lot of other stuff installed too, so I'm not sure if it's a conflict or something.

 

Edit: Nevermind; figured it out. Had modified the strut and connector ports to make them stackable inside KIS containers, but accidentally missed the "MODULE" line before the KIS module code on the strut.

Edited July 21, 2016 by Jim Starluck

[Kraken1]

@IgorZ have you ever thought about putting 3-D printers into the mod as well? Obviously not as an external part but as an internal part. It would be nice to be able to make things in orbit with a 3-D printer and not have to spend 100,000 to get supplies up to a station just to fix some solar panels. Also, slight issue which might have been me on my end: DO NOT ever put the struts between a station core and anything docked with it... it tends to do some less than desirable     results.

[IgorZ]

19 hours ago, Undecided said:

I've noticed tweakscale is compatible with the KAS portable struts. Does strut strength properly scale with size? Do strut bases of different sizes add their strength together to average out, or does the weakest/smallest one dictate the total strut strength? And is there a way to place extra-large tweakscaled struts into inventories?

KAS doesn't scale the forces, so unless TweakScale does it the forces are non-scaled. KAS uses strength from the source port, i.e. the port you've started connecting from. You can place tweaked KAS parts into inventory as well as you can to it with other parts, there is no any difference. Though, keep in mind the following bug.

8 hours ago, Kraken1 said:

@IgorZ have you ever thought about putting 3-D printers into the mod as well? Obviously not as an external part but as an internal part. It would be nice to be able to make things in orbit with a 3-D printer and not have to spend 100,000 to get supplies up to a station just to fix some solar panels. Also, slight issue which might have been me on my end: DO NOT ever put the struts between a station core and anything docked with it... it tends to do some less than desirable     results.

I had such an idea but then figured out there are some "printer mods" around already (e.g. OSE Workshop). Making yet another printer inside KIS is barely a good idea. This mod is about containers and EVA assembly. The printers, on the other hand, is about EVA manufacturing which bring up many different questions: what is "resource", what is the cost, what is the time of manufacturing, etc. All these questions must be answered in scope of a separate mod which may integrate with KIS.

[Tyko]

I added some KAS struts to a spacecraft only to have them disappear later - I'm not sure what triggered it, could have been a reload. I went back to re-attach them and all the connectors say they're still linked. So i'm thinking it's just the visual effect that's not showing up.

Any ideas?

[IgorZ]

51 minutes ago, tjt said:

I added some KAS struts to a spacecraft only to have them disappear later - I'm not sure what triggered it, could have been a reload. I went back to re-attach them and all the connectors say they're still linked. So i'm thinking it's just the visual effect that's not showing up.

Any ideas?

More likely there was an error during structs recovery (they are re-installed on every load). Check the logs for errors or warnings.

[Kerbos]

Hello @IgorZ, I'm having a few issues with KAS and KIS, my pc only has 4gb RAM, so sometimes after long periods the game crash due lack of memory mostly, and a loot of times when it happens on flight mode my kerbals lose their inventory, wrench or whatever they have just disappear, containers will still retain their contents but not kerbals (my fix for that is creating a new game, drop some kerbals with the lost items on the launchpad, quit to main menu, edit and copy the inventory from that game and paste it into my affected saved game).

The second thing that I'm having real issues is when trying to build a primitive base using CC-R2 ports, my debug console will fill up with red messages dropping my frame rate to 12 and the bloody ships won't stop sliding (horizontal speed never gets to zero). Couldn't find how to fix that by myself (insert sad face).

This is what my log looks like most of the time when loading the wannabe base:

[EXC 04:51:55.874] NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object
    FerramAerospaceResearch.FARPartGeometry.GeometryPartModule.GetVisibleMeshData (UnityEngine.Transform t, Boolean onlyMeshes)
    FerramAerospaceResearch.FARPartGeometry.GeometryPartModule.CreateMeshListFromTransforms (System.Collections.Generic.List`1& meshTransforms)
    FerramAerospaceResearch.FARPartGeometry.GeometryPartModule.RebuildAllMeshData ()
    FerramAerospaceResearch.FARPartGeometry.GeometryPartModule.FixedUpdate ()

And the third and last is when recovering ships with containers full of stuffs, it's like whatever is inside the containers doesn't count when recovering, you don't get money back or anything (my fix is just EVA the engineer when landed, attach everything anywhere and then press recovery).

I do have a lot of other mods, in advance I apologize for not knowing what should I post to give you proper information, but I can upload my save game, log, anything you ask if needed.

Cheers!

[IgorZ]

3 hours ago, Kerbos said:

Hello @IgorZ, I'm having a few issues with KAS and KIS, my pc only has 4gb RAM, so sometimes after long periods the game crash due lack of memory mostly, and a loot of times when it happens on flight mode my kerbals lose their inventory, wrench or whatever they have just disappear, containers will still retain their contents but not kerbals (my fix for that is creating a new game, drop some kerbals with the lost items on the launchpad, quit to main menu, edit and copy the inventory from that game and paste it into my affected saved game).

Do you use any mods that improve saves? Like easy backup and such. Inventory are saved into the regular save file. I cannot imagine how a crashed game may result in loosing a part of the save file. My only guess you have a mod that actively works with the save file and does "partial" saves. Since EVA kerbals are not actual vessels this mod is probably just ignoring them when making incremental updates.

3 hours ago, Kerbos said:

The second thing that I'm having real issues is when trying to build a primitive base using CC-R2 ports, my debug console will fill up with red messages dropping my frame rate to 12 and the bloody ships won't stop sliding (horizontal speed never gets to zero). Couldn't find how to fix that by myself (insert sad face).

It's a FAR mod conflict. See this bug, there is a workaround described in it.

3 hours ago, Kerbos said:

And the third and last is when recovering ships with containers full of stuffs, it's like whatever is inside the containers doesn't count when recovering, you don't get money back or anything (my fix is just EVA the engineer when landed, attach everything anywhere and then press recovery).

It's a known issue. Parts in the container are not real parts (i.e. they don't exist in the game's world), so contracts engine doesn't see them until you actually deploy them. This is unlikely to be fixed any time soon.

[MrWizerd]

Hi, I am having a problem and I am not sure if it is KAS or KIS but for some reason I can not put anything into any KAS container.  I can put things under the seats in the command modules, in the boxes for KIS, etc.  Also, I have the old A mechanic is jeb cfg file, that uses the old KASModuleGrab command to make smaller parts usable with KAS but it seems to also not work.  Is this my problem? or is there a mod that causes this that I may have installed?   Thanks for the help in advance.

 

[IgorZ]

1 hour ago, MrWizerd said:

Hi, I am having a problem and I am not sure if it is KAS or KIS but for some reason I can not put anything into any KAS container.

KAS doesn't offer any containers, so if you say "container" then it's either KIS or some third party mod. Please, figure out the exact name of the container you cannot use, and check if it's from KIS.

1 hour ago, MrWizerd said:

Also, I have the old A mechanic is jeb cfg file, that uses the old KASModuleGrab command to make smaller parts usable with KAS but it seems to also not work

No idea what is "jeb cfg file" but "KASModuleGrab" doesn't exist in the current KAS (changed more than half a year ago). Nothing I or you can do here. Rollback to the old version won't work due to the KSP core changes.

1 hour ago, MrWizerd said:

or is there a mod that causes this that I may have installed?

If it worked in the last month and then suddenly stopped then it's for sure a mods conflict. Best approach to hunt this issue down is checking the logs (KSP.log file).

[Kerbos]

10 hours ago, IgorZ said:

Do you use any mods that improve saves? Like easy backup and such. Inventory are saved into the regular save file. I cannot imagine how a crashed game may result in loosing a part of the save file. My only guess you have a mod that actively works with the save file and does "partial" saves. Since EVA kerbals are not actual vessels this mod is probably just ignoring them when making incremental updates.

I can't really think of any mod that would mess up a save like that, these are the mods I use: Aviation Lights 3.9 - Chatterer 0.9.90 - Deadly Reentry 7.4.5.1 - Docking Port Alignment 6.4 - FAR 0.15.7.2 - Infernal Robotics 2.0.2 - Karbonite 0.7.4.0 - KAS 0.5.9 - KIS 1.2.12 - Kerbal Engineer 1.1.1.0 - Kerbalism 1.0.6 - SCANsat 16.3 - Universal Storage 1.1.0.13 - Kerbal Alarm Clock 3.7.1.0

The Alarm Clock is the only mod that actively does some saving, but it does his own save when jumping on ships. The only thing I can think of is KSP stock quicksave, this never happened to me before KSP 1.1.X (forgot to mention sry, only quicksave is affected independent of kerbals on EVA or inside some ship).

10 hours ago, IgorZ said:

It's a FAR mod conflict. See this bug, there is a workaround described in it.

Thanks, didn't knew that, I'll stick to the workaround then

10 hours ago, IgorZ said:

It's a known issue. Parts in the container are not real parts (i.e. they don't exist in the game's world), so contracts engine doesn't see them until you actually deploy them. This is unlikely to be fixed any time soon.

Ouch, that's a falcon punch to my unmanned carrys, but the more I think of... it just gets obvious, calculating each piece of garbage I could stuff inside a container also means the game gotta calculate mass like a fuel tank and of course FAR's gonna literally flip the table and suicide at me.

Thanks for clearing my head on this, love the mod, use it for like 3 or 4 years now, can't even remember, also thx for hopping aboard when @KospY moved on

Edited July 27, 2016 by Kerbos

[IgorZ]

42 minutes ago, Kerbos said:

I can't really think of any mod that would mess up a save like that, these are the mods I use: Aviation Lights 3.9 - Chatterer 0.9.90 - Deadly Reentry 7.4.5.1 - Docking Port Alignment 6.4 - FAR 0.15.7.2 - Infernal Robotics 2.0.2 - Karbonite 0.7.4.0 - KAS 0.5.9 - KIS 1.2.12 - Kerbal Engineer 1.1.1.0 - Kerbalism 1.0.6 - SCANsat 16.3 - Universal Storage 1.1.0.13 - Kerbal Alarm Clock 3.7.1.0

Not being familiar with the mods I'd say they are not mangling with the savefile. Well, I sad to admit but I'm out of ideas how it could possibly happen. Let's do the following. Wait till your machine crashed again, once you see the issue grab the persistent.sfs file and publish it somewhere for me. Then, let me know which kerbal (name) should have inventory but doesn't. I'm pretty sure I'll see an empty inventory in the save file but who knows... I hate to say it, but let's hope for the worst, i.e. the items are in the save file but they are not visible in the game

[Kerbos]

9 hours ago, IgorZ said:

I'm pretty sure I'll see an empty inventory in the save file but who knows... I hate to say it, but let's hope for the worst, i.e. the items are in the save file but they are not visible in the game

Yeah, I usually try everything I can imagine before really asking for help and that's exactly what you can see on the saved files, the quicksave and the persitent, you scroll down to kerbals and it says VESSEL, a few of this simbols { } with data and the name of the kerbal etc, then u go till u find ACTIONS and in there it goes ITEMS but that's the piece of save that's always missing, it's like when it crashes the game try to rebuild the stuff that was in there, and the stock kerbals don't come with an inventory so the game only rebuild "solid" stuffs and not the virtual... I mean that was my explanation until I noticed that containers wouldn't lose what was inside.

I'll try to find a way to reproduce the error and since it looks like I'm the only one who experienced this it's more than possible that the issue is on my end.

Cheers!

EDIT/// Just realized something, KSP has stock kerbals but no stock containers, maybe when rebuilding a save game KSP prioritizes the stock data for kerbals hence the empty inventory.

Edited July 27, 2016 by Kerbos

[MrWizerd]

On 7/26/2016 at 11:19 PM, IgorZ said:

KAS doesn't offer any containers, so if you say "container" then it's either KIS or some third party mod. Please, figure out the exact name of the container you cannot use, and check if it's from KIS.

No idea what is "jeb cfg file" but "KASModuleGrab" doesn't exist in the current KAS (changed more than half a year ago). Nothing I or you can do here. Rollback to the old version won't work due to the KSP core changes.

If it worked in the last month and then suddenly stopped then it's for sure a mods conflict. Best approach to hunt this issue down is checking the logs (KSP.log file).

Hey IgorZ thanks for the quick reply, I do apologize, I have not played in a  long while.  The "A_Mechanic_is_Jeb.cfg" was an old cfg for KAS that gave the ability to grab and store other small parts like small struts and pipes and solar panels and the like to items not included in KAS.  I have to admit, I am unsure as to the relation of KIS/KAS nor what handles exactly what function as I have not been playing for a while.   But it seems that I am a bit dim, and just didn't know what I was doing I believe I have it all sussed out now.  Again thanks for the quick reply.... and the PDF file I found.

[Loren Pechtel]

The description for KAS includes "vessel consolidation"--something that Google is unwilling to explain.

What I would like to do is land multiple vessels and hook them together as one.  Docking ports would certainly do it but they require maneuvering the pieces together--a real pain when the pieces are large tanks.  The resource transfer pipes (are they KIS or KAS?  I have both installed) don't fuse the craft together.

(What I'm looking to do is fly the various storage tanks for a mining outfit up separately.  If the mining is to fill the tanks properly it needs to be one vessel.)

 

[ExplorerKlatt]

3 hours ago, Loren Pechtel said:

The description for KAS includes "vessel consolidation"--something that Google is unwilling to explain.

What I would like to do is land multiple vessels and hook them together as one.  Docking ports would certainly do it but they require maneuvering the pieces together--a real pain when the pieces are large tanks.  The resource transfer pipes (are they KIS or KAS?  I have both installed) don't fuse the craft together.

(What I'm looking to do is fly the various storage tanks for a mining outfit up separately.  If the mining is to fill the tanks properly it needs to be one vessel.)

 

Pictures of what you already tried would help a lot. 

[Loren Pechtel]

12 minutes ago, ExplorerKlatt said:

Pictures of what you already tried would help a lot. 

Unfortunately the Kracken says no.  The save on Minmus won't load.

What I had was what was supposed to be the habitat that would hold the engineer connected by a resource pipe to the skycrane that brought it which I landed nearby.  KSP still saw them as two craft, though.  I want one craft without the pain of jiggling heavy fuel tanks around to make things line up.

[ExplorerKlatt]

23 minutes ago, Loren Pechtel said:

Unfortunately the Kracken says no.  The save on Minmus won't load.

What I had was what was supposed to be the habitat that would hold the engineer connected by a resource pipe to the skycrane that brought it which I landed nearby.  KSP still saw them as two craft, though.  I want one craft without the pain of jiggling heavy fuel tanks around to make things line up.

Do you mean the CC-R2 Connector Port?

 

 

Edited July 30, 2016 by ExplorerKlatt

[Loren Pechtel]

25 minutes ago, ExplorerKlatt said:

Do you mean the CC-R2 Connector Port?

 

 

I have no such part available.  The whole tree except the claw is unlocked.  What is missing?

[ExplorerKlatt]

Second picture in album on first post. Bottom right corner. Do you have that part?

Edited July 30, 2016 by ExplorerKlatt

[Loren Pechtel]

20 minutes ago, ExplorerKlatt said:

Second picture in album on first post. Bottom right corner. Do you have that part?

Oh, I see it now--I was looking for something that looked like a pipe, not something that looked like a docking port.  I'll try it out once I get this load of tourists home.

[IgorZ]

1 hour ago, Loren Pechtel said:

Oh, I see it now--I was looking for something that looked like a pipe, not something that looked like a docking port.  I'll try it out once I get this load of tourists home.

Existing KAS design is not "material". Those pipes come from nowhere when you link two connector ports. This is going to change in KAS 1.0.