my first relay sat doesn't work

[antipro]

Hi,

I'd like to put a satellite in a duna orbit.

So I decided to first send a relay satellite in a solar orbit at 11Gm to use it as a repeater, this sat has 3 RA-2 and 1 Comm16(not really necessary), it's always in communication with Kerbin.
When I launched the Duna Sat with 2 DTS-M1, I realized that it doesn't communicate with the relay sat and lost the link,
so I tried adding a RA-2 antenna to the Duna Sat, and now I can communicate directly with kerbin,
but when sometimes the link goes off by eclipses, alignments, I don't know, it still never links with the relay sat.. why?

Do Relay antennas work as repeaters when the kerbin-vessel link is down? What am I missing?

Edited January 9, 2017 by antipro

[Superfluous J]

Sat-Sat connections need a LOT more dish power than Sat-Kerbin connections. The math is kind of ridiculous so I use the spreadsheet when I need to.

2 sats, each with 3 RA-2's, can communicate with each other when they are less than about 4.5Gm apart. Kerbin orbits at about 13.5Gm so you can talk between antennas when they're about 1/3 of a KSP AU apart. So if they're both orbiting or near the same planet they should talk, but if they're orbiting different ones then it's a no go.

Oh and here's a link to that spreadsheet.

Edited January 7, 2017 by 5thHorseman

[Servo]

The jist of what he's saying is that you're going to need a LOT more power than that to connect between Kerbin and Duna. However, there are some things that you can do without a connection. You can use the SAS controls (point prograde, retrograde, etc), and use z and x as throttle controls. This means that you can do capture burns and similar without needing a connection.

[antipro]

really? how? my probes have no control at all when lack of signal.
anyway let me know if I've understood well.
I use the above mentioned 2x DTS-M1 + 1x RA-2 to communicate at 1% with kerbin and the duna orbit vessel,then I decouple a lander, must this lander have a short range direct antenna(comm 16) or another relay(RA-2) in order to send science communicating with KSC using the orbiter bridge?

ah! forgot to ask... are poor quality signals, for example under 20%, less efficients than signals at 60%?
I mean in case of science transmissions, I'll consume more electrical energy at 20% than at 60% signal strong?

I'm just wondering if there are some contraindications to have an orbiting vessel around duna at 1% connection only.

Last thing:(doesnt matter with ksp) How do I remove blank interlines in my messages?

 

Edited January 9, 2017 by antipro

[bewing]

And if you have some little tiny thruster engines, you can use them to perform high-accuracy orbital manuevers using just z and x -- so you can easily complete satellite contracts, for example, just so long as you were clever enough to put little thrusters on your ship.

[Superfluous J]

14 hours ago, antipro said:

really? how? my probes have no control at all when lack of signal.

You may have that difficulty setting turned on. Esc, settings, difficulty options (button at the top that nobody knows is a button), somewhere in there. It's a very obvious setting though I don't know the name offhand. If it's on, your probes are dead. If it's off, you can turn SAS on/off, click the "aim at" buttons the probe has access to, and open and close antennas (to get more comms power).

14 hours ago, antipro said:

I use the above mentioned 2x DTS-M1 + 1x RA-2 to communicate at 1% with kerbin and the duna orbit vessel,

then I decouple a lander, must this lander have a short range direct antenna(comm 16) or another relay(RA-2) in order to send science communicating with KSC using the orbiter bridge?

So long as the short-range antenna can reach the orbiter with a 1% connection, the lander should be able to talk to Kerbin, regardless of the antenna on the lander. Remember though that ship-ship antennas have less range than ship-kerbin antennas.

14 hours ago, antipro said:

ah! forgot to ask... are poor quality signals, for example under 20%, less efficients than signals at 60%?

Not for control. Just for sending science.

14 hours ago, antipro said:

I mean in case of science transmissions, I'll consume more electrical energy at 20% than at 60% signal strong?

You will not consume more electricity (unless I'm very wrong about this. It's worth testing). You'll just get less science returns.

14 hours ago, antipro said:

Last thing:(doesnt matter with ksp) How do I remove blank interlines in my messages?

Hold down shift when you hit enter
and you'll get lines like this

instead of like this.

However, if you hit enter normally, remember you wanted to hit shift-enter so backspace and hit shift-enter, weird things will happen.

My advice? Get used the double spacing. It's more pain than it's worth to try to "fix" it.

[bewing]

15 hours ago, antipro said:

 

really? how? my probes have no control at all when lack of signal.

 

Check under Difficulty Settings/Advanced/"Require Signal for Control" and turn it off. That will get you back to "limited control mode" instead of "no control" when there is no signal.

 

[antipro]

ah! i rememeber. yea I knew that setting about controls, but want the game to be the most realistic as possible, so I keep it on.

Quote

You will not consume more electricity (unless I'm very wrong about this. It's worth testing). You'll just get less science returns.

you say this cause there's a formula to calculate the ratio between power signal and science points? or maybe over a determinate percentage level all the science points are sent? for example I have to send 100 science from duna at 1%. how many points Ill get instead of for example with a 25% or 50% link?

thx all

Edited January 9, 2017 by antipro

[bewing]

It depends on the experiment. A transmitted thermometer reading on Normal difficulty on the surface at 1% signal will give you 32 science points. With more signal, you may get 48 or 54 science points. An atmosphere analysis gives 96. If you had a better signal, you'd get maybe 10% more. For a gravity reading, maybe you could get 66 instead of 64. But an EVA report will give you 64 science points, no matter what your signal strength is.

[Spricigo]

2 minutes ago, bewing said:

It depends on the experiment. A transmitted thermometer reading on Normal difficulty on the surface at 1% signal will give you 32 science points. With more signal, you may get 48 or 54 science points. An atmosphere analysis gives 96. If you had a better signal, you'd get maybe 10% more. For a gravity reading, maybe you could get 66 instead of 64. But an EVA report will give you 64 science points, no matter what your signal strength is.

The fact that, if you have lower signal strength, you can transmit less science it's new for me.  And raise some questions: (I will probably check it myself later but I can't do it right now and tge answers may be usefull for someone else in the mean time.) 

1 . I suppose the example number you give its for science in orbit of Duna (since that is the OP's destination).  The amount of transmitable science it's like X%+Y*<signal strength>? 

2.lets say I transmite with a signal strength 10%  and later I come back with a bigger signal strength,  can I transmite the difference? 

3.Its based on difficult settings?  What is the path to the change it? What is the default settings? 

Thanks in advance 

 

[bewing]

5 minutes ago, Spricigo said:

The fact that, if you have lower signal strength, you can transmit less science it's new for me.  And raise some questions: (I will probably check it myself later but I can't do it right now and tge answers may be usefull for someone else in the mean time.) 

You can also think of it as getting a bonus for transmitting with a better signal strength.

5 minutes ago, Spricigo said:

1 . I suppose the example number you give its for science in orbit of Duna (since that is the OP's destination).

Example was surface of Duna.

5 minutes ago, Spricigo said:

 The amount of transmitable science it's like X%+Y*<signal strength>? 

(For each experiment, it's a different X) -- X% + F(signal strength)
-- where F() is a rather complicated function that only the devs know.

5 minutes ago, Spricigo said:

2.lets say I transmite with a signal strength 10%  and later I come back with a bigger signal strength,  can I transmite the difference? 

Yes.

5 minutes ago, Spricigo said:

3.Its based on difficult settings?  What is the path to the change it? What is the default settings? 

ESC menu, Difficulty Settings, and then adjust the slider for "Science Rewards". Default is 100%. If it's not set at 100%, then the numbers that I gave above would be different.