[1.12.x] Near Future Technologies (September 6)

[smotheredrun]

Thanks for the updates/fixes @Nertea!

[FirroSeranel]

18 minutes ago, Nertea said:

@FirroSeranel: The real main reason that I have never liked CKAN is that the system defines a distribution standard which is different to the typical bundle of a packaged mod. That is, the mod should exist as a single GameData level folder and specify its dependencies separately. That has advantages (dependencies can be updated independently), but has one key disadvantage: I have to maintain not only several download locations, but two distribution models, one with dependencies packaged and one without. That's a fairly large amount of work to maintain the~10 mods that I work on. It's basically double the workload whenever a release happens.

In addition, because of this dependency structure, this forces me to maintain metadata for the subpackages that I have that are technically dependencies, but should never exist in the wild outside of my mods. For example I know that there is a NearFutureProps distribution floating around on CKAN, when this really shouldn't ever exist. Same with DeployableEngines and CryoTanks.

In my opinion, CKAN is not yet reliable enough to move uniquely to that distribution model, and only really provides advantages for me, the author, if I switch fully to that mode. So I won't. 

 

 

 

Thank you for a clear and level-headed explanation. That does make sense.

I suppose the truth is, as a long-time CKAN user, I've gotten to know its landscape well enough to know that it does list dependencies separately that shouldn't really exist in the wild, and to avoid them, and only click on the main mods I want, and let it pick dependencies itself... but a new person wouldn't know that, and it's a lot of trial and error to gain that experience.

7 minutes ago, narvster said:

It lets you install 1 or 2 craft at a time into your save dir?

I know it downloads them ,it just doesn't manage them.

 

 

 

Ah. True enough. It always tells you it ran into a duplicate craft file though, and it's not a big deal to go delete that one, then try again, so it never really bothered me.

Edit: Plus I never enable default craft in my careers anyway. Everyone gets their fun from this game in their own way, and for me, it's 60% about designing rockets, planes, and spaceplanes, 20% about plotting maneuvers and understanding orbital mechanics and gravity assists, 15% about exploring, 10% about flying planes and spaceplanes, and -5% about flying rockets (which is why I let MechJeb, GravityTurn, and TCA do that part).

Edited March 10, 2017 by FirroSeranel

[Benjamin Kerman]

Just wanting to throw my hat in the ring here, I do not use ckan. As NFT was the first mod I downloaded, it said specifically on the first post of this thread that CKAN was NOT supported... As such, I never got it and am currently running around 20 mods, all installed manually.

[stk2008]

Im running 97 mods and all manually installed.

its took me ages to do and in all honesty im 100% sure there is conflicts but i have zero idea how to look for such things or where to even start wish tjere was a programme that could help.

 

Any way yeah i see some modders dont use ckan thats up to them i prefer manual but at same time even that can be hard.

love this mod though thanks so much for all your hard work.

 

P.s

where would one start to check for incompatibiletys etc?.

 

thanks

[Streetwind]

Jeebus Christ in a camper van guys. I go away for three hours to rewatch The Martian and you go on a 25-post CKAN discussion?  I appreciate that everyone is passionate about things, but a.) most of this is really off topic here and b.) no level of discussion will change anything here. I'm genuinely surprised Nertea hasn't eaten all of you alive yet. His wife must feed him well

So how about this - we all agree to disagree, and return to talking about electric engines, nuclear reactors and needlessly oversized solar arrays instead?

[FirroSeranel]

2 minutes ago, Streetwind said:

Jeebus Christ in a camper van guys. I go away for three hours to rewatch The Martian and you go on a 25-post CKAN discussion?  I appreciate that everyone is passionate about things, but a.) most of this is really off topic here and b.) no level of discussion will change anything here. I'm genuinely surprised Nertea hasn't eaten all of you alive yet. His wife must feed him well

So how about this - we all agree to disagree, and return to talking about electric engines, nuclear reactors and needlessly oversized solar arrays instead?

 

Heh, I had actually thought of that, and considered several times mentioning that we should stop devouring Nertea's forum with CKAN, I just didn't want to come off as rude, or bossy, telling people what they can or can't talk about. <.< But that's why I've stopped posting, and it's calmed down since. *blush*

[Nertea]

I'm in a good mood so you're all safe!

 

For now. 

[FirroSeranel]

2 minutes ago, Nertea said:

I'm in a good mood so you're all safe!

 

For now. 

 

lol, yay!

By the way, what is your avatar? He's kinda cute... <.<

[Merkov]

To be fair, this has been a remarkably civil discussion about CKAN, especially by CKAN discussion standards. 

[Nertea]

38 minutes ago, FirroSeranel said:

lol, yay!

By the way, what is your avatar? He's kinda cute... <.<

It's the TIE Bomber pilot from this amazing Star Wars fan-made animation project.

[FirroSeranel]

15 minutes ago, Nertea said:

It's the TIE Bomber pilot from this amazing Star Wars fan-made animation project.

Ah, so a Chiss, I take it?

Edit: Ah, no, just a human in blue lighting.

That's an awesome animation!

Edited March 10, 2017 by FirroSeranel

[Jim Starluck]

Say, would it be possible to get a 2.5m adapter for the triangular truss? I keep finding myself attaching them to 2.5m nodes and needing multiple adapters to make the transition look good...

[FiiZzioN]

11 hours ago, FirroSeranel said:

 for a heavily-modded install, CKAN isn't just a convenience. It's a requirement.

I used roughly 150 mods for over a year and I've never used CKAN... So, I'd say that statement is a bit excessive.
Edit: Didn't know that all of this spawned since I last posted, or I wouldn't have posted this. All I got was a notification that was maybe four posts below mine...

Edited March 11, 2017 by FiiZzioN

[Guest]

@Nertea

Mk4-1 IVA:

At top row of seats in front of top hatch:

Click-on-Window views not only upside down, but also inside-out : they show INTERNALS of cabin instead of outside view.

P.S.

And while Nertia is in good mood: Lack of RPM screens makes cabin look like a early engineering prototype, not a functioning article.

 

 

[Nertea]

Oh wait, is that talk of IVAs I hear? Too bad, I guess I was in a good mood.

[Benjamin Kerman]

5 hours ago, WildLynx said:

Mk4-1 IVA:

First post of the thread, FAQ's: IVAs are my lowest priority.

[Drew Kerman]

1 hour ago, Benjamin Kerman said:

First post of the thread, FAQ's: IVAs are my lowest priority.

Sounds like you're trying to say he should have kept quiet? I don't think IVA issues should go unreported, but certainly no one should be poking Nertea to fix them in a hurry. Nothing wrong with what WildLynx said IMO, but he should also do Nertea the favor of creating a Github issue so that Nertea doesn't lose track of the problem since it'll be a while probably until he gets 'round to it

[Benjamin Kerman]

Something like this where the IVAs are completely broken is a big issue.

I agree completely that these types of issues should not go unreported, but I believe that Nerta has said that he does not want to be pestered about completing the IVAs for all the parts in his mods. 

My apologies, as I did not fully grasp the implication of what WildLynx was saying at the time. At first I took it that he was just saying that the IVA for one of the parts was just a little iffy, and not "dead". 

[Virtualgenius]

Is it possible to get the tank combinations in the modular multipurpose  Octo-girder Micro and Nano as they would make excellent Lander configurations

[Hardcard]

First off, a million thanks, Nertea, NFT is massively useful, beautiful and detailed, it's quickly becoming my favorite KSP mod.

Quick question (I haven't seen any post talking about this), is there a way to customize the capacitor discharge rates so the UI sliders go all the way from 0 to the maximum value?

For instance, I want to use the "CAR-EXTRA Capacitor Bank", but I can only set its discharge rate between 1600-3200 Ec/s using the UI slider, and between 16-32 Ec/s using the capacitor control screen slider... but I'd like to set it at around 150 Ec/s instead (to power the HI-SNAP Ion thruster at full thrust for a 3.5 minute burn).

Is there a way to edit the slider values? Do I need to modify config files in order to achieve this? If so, which ones? 

 

Again, thanks a million for the mod.

 

Edited March 12, 2017 by Hardcard

[Nertea]

3 hours ago, Hardcard said:

First off, a million thanks, Nertea, NFT is massively useful, beautiful and detailed, it's quickly becoming my favorite KSP mod.

Quick question (I haven't seen any post talking about this), is there a way to customize the capacitor discharge rates so the UI sliders go all the way from 0 to the maximum value?

For instance, I want to use the "CAR-EXTRA Capacitor Bank", but I can only set its discharge rate between 1600-3200 Ec/s using the UI slider, and between 16-32 Ec/s using the capacitor control screen slider... but I'd like to set it at around 150 Ec/s instead (to power the HI-SNAP Ion thruster at full thrust for a 3.5 minute burn).

Is there a way to edit the slider values? Do I need to modify config files in order to achieve this? If so, which ones? 

 

Again, thanks a million for the mod.

 

This is intended behaviour to stop people from using capacitors as really long term trickle batteries. Might change if a lot of people want it, I can at least look into providing a cfg setting.

Also,the fact that there are two discharge rates looks wrong to me. You may have discovered a bug in the UI component.

6 hours ago, Virtualgenius said:

Is it possible to get the tank combinations in the modular multipurpose  Octo-girder Micro and Nano as they would make excellent Lander configurations

Not really planned, unfortunately.

[ThreePounds]

What actually is the purpose of the capacitors? I have never used them before.

[DStaal]

1 minute ago, Three_Pounds said:

What actually is the purpose of the capacitors? I have never used them before.

Very mass-efficient EC storage, with drawbacks in how you can use it.  Really good for things like powering Xenon engines - you trickle-charge the capacitors between burns, and then discharge during the burn.  Saves you quite a bit of mass over either batteries or a reactor that can power the engine for the same burn.

[Wyzard]

1 hour ago, Nertea said:

Not really planned, unfortunately.

I'd been thinking about submitting a similar feature request, but more limited in scope.  The "micro" octo-truss is too small for things like LFO tanks with their rounded end-caps, but it could sensibly fit things like xenon (single spherical tank), ore (same size as the stock 2.5m ore tank), or mission support.  Those should be fairly easy since the models for the tanks are already built in repeating units; you could basically just take the truss-octo-02 version and slice it in half.

It's no problem if you have other priorities, but I wanted to toss out the suggestion.

[Nertea]

2 hours ago, Wyzard said:

I'd been thinking about submitting a similar feature request, but more limited in scope.  The "micro" octo-truss is too small for things like LFO tanks with their rounded end-caps, but it could sensibly fit things like xenon (single spherical tank), ore (same size as the stock 2.5m ore tank), or mission support.  Those should be fairly easy since the models for the tanks are already built in repeating units; you could basically just take the truss-octo-02 version and slice it in half.

It's no problem if you have other priorities, but I wanted to toss out the suggestion.

Yup some of them are certainly easier than others. However you know that as soon as I open the gates with that implementation, I'm going to start getting a bunch of requests to do the rest which are considerably less trivial