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KSP Interstellar Extended Continued Development Thread

FreeThinker

By FreeThinker
in KSP1 Mod Development

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Kyrt Malthorn

Kyrt Malthorn

Posted
Posted
Whenever the engine is under the influence of any acceleration, which includes gravity (=1G), the vortex will lose containment,

I really, really should have known that. There are some days I hate gravity, hehe. Also, just thinking out loud here, the model looks pretty enclosed. Apparently the poor Kerbals didn't read the warning labels that came with the packing slip. The future of KSC is glowing!

Anywho, thanks! And I hope when 1.1 rolls out it's not an utter nightmare to update this. And may I just say, I love KSPI-E, really appreciate your work carrying the whole mod forward. I adore the attention to detail and realism. It takes me a while to get used to all this, but I love every minute of it.

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bos

bos

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Posted (edited)
Are you sure you were not in a suborbital state? But perhaps your right and a racing condition does somehow occurs. Perhaps I can compensate for it, or allow some kind manual override.

Yeah it's not hitting the suborbital condition. I added a debug and see that I often get a zero thrust update before it packs the vessel. Unfortunately it looks like the TimeWarp.WarpMode is still set to HIGH mode so not sure if there is any way to know that it is going into warp. Maybe hack around it by ignoring the first 0 thrust update if throttle is non-zero?


 // Realtime mode
            if (!this.vessel.packed)
            {
                // if not transitioning from warp to real
                // Update values to use during timewarp
                if (!warpToReal)
                {
                    IspPersistent = realIsp;
                    ThrottlePersistent = vessel.ctrlState.mainThrottle;
                    //ThrustPersistent = this.CalculateThrust();
                    this.CalculateThrust();
                    ThrustPersistent = this.finalThrust;

                    Debug.Log ("Thrust " + ThrustPersistent + " timeWarp mode = " + TimeWarp.WarpMode);
                }
            }

(Filename: /Users/builduser/buildslave/unity/build/artifacts/MacStandalonePlayerGenerated/UnityEngineDebug.cpp Line: 56)

Thrust 1.877129 timeWarp mode = HIGH

(Filename: /Users/builduser/buildslave/unity/build/artifacts/MacStandalonePlayerGenerated/UnityEngineDebug.cpp Line: 56)

Thrust 1.877128 timeWarp mode = HIGH

(Filename: /Users/builduser/buildslave/unity/build/artifacts/MacStandalonePlayerGenerated/UnityEngineDebug.cpp Line: 56)

Thrust 0 timeWarp mode = HIGH

(Filename: /Users/builduser/buildslave/unity/build/artifacts/MacStandalonePlayerGenerated/UnityEngineDebug.cpp Line: 56)

Packing space telescope for orbit

(Filename: /Users/builduser/buildslave/unity/build/artifacts/MacStandalonePlayerGenerated/UnityEngineDebug.cpp Line: 56)

Edited by bos
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tmbomber

tmbomber

Posted
Posted

ok, another night, another collider test...

It appears that if you run the super collider in one biome, then move to another biome before collecting data. You get credit for the biome you do the collecting in rather than the biome you had the collider running in.

Possible exploit, put your collider in a 610km orbit above Kerbin, warp time to x100000 so you build up data in a few seconds, them move down to 240km to collect data "in space near"...

ummm.... that's not quite right. I don't know if it's possible, but a fix would be to have the collider loose it's data on biome change.

Just a thought.

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tmbomber

tmbomber

Posted
Posted
Are you sure you were not in a suborbital state? But perhaps your right and a racing condition does somehow occurs. Perhaps I can compensate for it, or allow some kind manual override.

Very certain. I just tried it again. 495km circular orbit above Kerbin. Throttle to 33% and pressed >. Warp thrust fell to zero.

Someone suggested popping in and out of warp several times to see if it "sticks" on one of the tries. I did that about a dozen times and warp thrust fell to zero every time.

And from your earlier question. I'm not running any mod that messes with time warping. (wasn't even aware that there was one that did)

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FreeThinker

FreeThinker

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  • Author
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Yeah it's not hitting the suborbital condition. I added a debug and see that I often get a zero thrust update before it packs the vessel. Unfortunately it looks like the TimeWarp.WarpMode is still set to HIGH mode so not sure if there is any way to know that it is going into warp. Maybe hack around it by ignoring the first 0 thrust update if throttle is non-zero?


 // Realtime mode
            if (!this.vessel.packed)
            {
                // if not transitioning from warp to real
                // Update values to use during timewarp
                if (!warpToReal)
                {
                    IspPersistent = realIsp;
                    ThrottlePersistent = vessel.ctrlState.mainThrottle;
                    //ThrustPersistent = this.CalculateThrust();
                    this.CalculateThrust();
                    ThrustPersistent = this.finalThrust;

                    Debug.Log ("Thrust " + ThrustPersistent + " timeWarp mode = " + TimeWarp.WarpMode);
                }
            }

(Filename: /Users/builduser/buildslave/unity/build/artifacts/MacStandalonePlayerGenerated/UnityEngineDebug.cpp Line: 56)

Thrust 1.877129 timeWarp mode = HIGH

(Filename: /Users/builduser/buildslave/unity/build/artifacts/MacStandalonePlayerGenerated/UnityEngineDebug.cpp Line: 56)

Thrust 1.877128 timeWarp mode = HIGH

(Filename: /Users/builduser/buildslave/unity/build/artifacts/MacStandalonePlayerGenerated/UnityEngineDebug.cpp Line: 56)

Thrust 0 timeWarp mode = HIGH

(Filename: /Users/builduser/buildslave/unity/build/artifacts/MacStandalonePlayerGenerated/UnityEngineDebug.cpp Line: 56)

Packing space telescope for orbit

(Filename: /Users/builduser/buildslave/unity/build/artifacts/MacStandalonePlayerGenerated/UnityEngineDebug.cpp Line: 56)

Good debug log. I think I can fix it by comparing the current throttle with the throttle in the previous frame.
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FreeThinker

FreeThinker

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Very certain. I just tried it again. 495km circular orbit above Kerbin. Throttle to 33% and pressed >. Warp thrust fell to zero.

Someone suggested popping in and out of warp several times to see if it "sticks" on one of the tries. I did that about a dozen times and warp thrust fell to zero every time.

And from your earlier question. I'm not running any mod that messes with time warping. (wasn't even aware that there was one that did)

There must be some special condition. On what operating system do you running and in what mode is ksp running (32bit, 64bit, direct3D, openGl) and how fast is youe PC and graphics card?

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tmbomber

tmbomber

Posted
Posted (edited)

Here's what I'm running...

OpenGL x32 KSP

Win7 Ultimate x64 SP1

Intel Core i7 3.2GHz with 12 Gig ram

AMD Radeon HD 6800 video

Here's my CKAN export file, I also have the most resent dev version of mechJeb

as well as ExceptionDetector and KSEA/Sentinel memory monitor.

Hmmmmm.... mechJeb... maybe???

{
	"kind": "metapackage",
	"abstract": "A list of modules installed on the default KSP instance",
	"name": "installed-default",
	"license": "unknown",
	"version": "2015.09.04.07.44.07",
	"identifier": "installed-default",
	"spec_version": "v1.6",
	"depends": [
		{
			"name": "ModuleManager",
			"version": "2.6.8"
		},
		{
			"name": "AviationLights",
			"version": "3.7"
		},
		{
			"name": "BDAnimationModules",
			"version": "v0.6.2"
		},
		{
			"name": "TextureReplacer",
			"version": "2.4.8"
		},
		{
			"name": "Karbonite",
			"version": "0.6.4"
		},
		{
			"name": "KSP-AVC",
			"version": "1.1.5.0"
		},
		{
			"name": "SCANsat",
			"version": "v14.2"
		},
		{
			"name": "UKS",
			"version": "0.31.6"
		},
		{
			"name": "USI-FTT",
			"version": "0.4.1"
		},
		{
			"name": "VesselView",
			"version": "v0.71"
		},
		{
			"name": "WaypointManager",
			"version": "2.4.2"
		},
		{
			"name": "WiderContractsApp",
			"version": "1.2.0"
		},
		{
			"name": "xScience",
			"version": "4.8"
		},
		{
			"name": "Toolbar",
			"version": "1.7.9"
		},
		{
			"name": "KIS",
			"version": "1.2.2"
		},
		{
			"name": "CoherentContracts",
			"version": "1.02"
		},
		{
			"name": "ContractsWindowPlus",
			"version": "5.3"
		},
		{
			"name": "ContractConfigurator",
			"version": "1.7.2"
		},
		{
			"name": "USITools",
			"version": "0.4.2"
		},
		{
			"name": "CommunityResourcePack",
			"version": "0.4.4"
		},
		{
			"name": "FirespitterCore",
			"version": "v7.1.4"
		},
		{
			"name": "OuterPlanetsMod",
			"version": "1:1.8"
		},
		{
			"name": "AlternateResourcePanel",
			"version": "2.7.3.0"
		},
		{
			"name": "AGExt",
			"version": "1.33a"
		},
		{
			"name": "Chatterer",
			"version": "0.9.6"
		},
		{
			"name": "DavonSupplyMod",
			"version": "014"
		},
		{
			"name": "KerbalEngineerRedux",
			"version": "1.0.18.0"
		},
		{
			"name": "KSPInterstellarExtended",
			"version": "1.4.9"
		},
		{
			"name": "QuickScroll",
			"version": "v1.31"
		},
		{
			"name": "RealChute",
			"version": "1.3.2.3"
		},
		{
			"name": "TacFuelBalancer",
			"version": "v2.5.1"
		},
		{
			"name": "TACLS",
			"version": "v0.11.1.20"
		},
		{
			"name": "TACLS-Config-Stock",
			"version": "v0.11.1.20"
		},
		{
			"name": "TransferWindowPlanner",
			"version": "v1.3.1.0"
		},
		{
			"name": "ModuleRCSFX",
			"version": "v4.2"
		},
		{
			"name": "ASETAvionics",
			"version": "1.0"
		},
		{
			"name": "ContractConfigurator-RemoteTech",
			"version": "2.0.0"
		},
		{
			"name": "CrossFeedEnabler",
			"version": "v3.3"
		},
		{
			"name": "CrowdSourcedScience",
			"version": "v3.0"
		},
		{
			"name": "EnhancedNavBall",
			"version": "1.3.6.0"
		},
		{
			"name": "FirespitterResourcesConfig",
			"version": "v7.1.4"
		},
		{
			"name": "Fusebox",
			"version": "1.50"
		},
		{
			"name": "MK12PodIVAReplacementbyASET",
			"version": "0.1.1"
		},
		{
			"name": "PlanetShine",
			"version": "0.2.3.1"
		},
		{
			"name": "PlanetShine-Config-Default",
			"version": "0.2.3.1"
		},
		{
			"name": "QuantumStrutsContinued",
			"version": "1.3"
		},
		{
			"name": "RandSCapsuledyne",
			"version": "1:1.5.3"
		},
		{
			"name": "RemoteTech",
			"version": "v1.6.7"
		},
		{
			"name": "ScienceAlert",
			"version": "1.8.9"
		},
		{
			"name": "TweakScale",
			"version": "v2.2.1"
		},
		{
			"name": "DockingPortAlignmentIndicator",
			"version": "6.2.0"
		},
		{
			"name": "ASETProps",
			"version": "1.3"
		},
		{
			"name": "RasterPropMonitor-Core",
			"version": "v0.22.2"
		},
		{
			"name": "KerbalAlarmClock",
			"version": "v3.4.0.0"
		},
		{
			"name": "RasterPropMonitor",
			"version": "v0.22.2"
		},
		{
			"name": "DistantObject-default",
			"version": "v1.6.1"
		},
		{
			"name": "DistantObject",
			"version": "v1.6.1"
		},
		{
			"name": "EditorExtensions",
			"version": "2.12"
		},
		{
			"name": "KerbalJointReinforcement",
			"version": "v3.1.4"
		},
		{
			"name": "ContractConfigurator-Tourism",
			"version": "1.2.0"
		},
		{
			"name": "ContractConfigurator-KerbinSpaceStation",
			"version": "2.2.1"
		},
		{
			"name": "FilterExtensions",
			"version": "2.4.1"
		},
		{
			"name": "OPMclouds",
			"version": "0.6"
		},
		{
			"name": "InterstellarFuelSwitch",
			"version": "1.15"
		},
		{
			"name": "InterstellarFuelSwitch-Core",
			"version": "1.15"
		},
		{
			"name": "AstronomersPack-Clouds-Medium",
			"version": "Interstellar.V2"
		},
		{
			"name": "EnvironmentalVisualEnhancements",
			"version": "7-4"
		},
		{
			"name": "ActiveTextureManagement-x86-Basic",
			"version": "5-0"
		},
		{
			"name": "origameFoldableAssets",
			"version": "0.5"
		},
		{
			"name": "FilterExtensionsDefaultConfig",
			"version": "2.4.1"
		},
		{
			"name": "HyperEdit",
			"version": "1.4.1.0"
		},
		{
			"name": "Kopernicus",
			"version": "1:beta-03-3"
		},
		{
			"name": "HeatManagement",
			"version": "0.26"
		},
		{
			"name": "FilterExtensionsStockRework",
			"version": "2.4.1"
		}
	]
}

- - - Updated - - -

How to bring 1250 science home from Kerbin orbit:

hTqqMuX.png

fc2bu2S.png

dUEk2F4.jpg

Edited by tmbomber
Remembered MechJeb has warp helper
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Bishop149

Bishop149

Posted
Posted

I've notice an issue with the Atmospheric Scoop.

Essentially if you leave the scoops activated and change scene, the next time you go to the ship with scoops they aren't working.

They don'te even appear in the list of equipment drawing power, switching them on and off in the same scene does nothing to help.

Picture of failure state below:

7khaeb2.png

What DOES fix it however is to switch them off, change scene, change back and then turn them on again.

I've also noticed they don't collect when you're not flying the ship. . . . which is irritating and perhaps related to the above?

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FreeThinker

FreeThinker

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  • Author
Posted (edited)
Here's what I'm running...

OpenGL x32 KSP

Win7 Ultimate x64 SP1

Intel Core i7 3.2GHz with 12 Gig ram

AMD Radeon HD 6800 video

Here's my CKAN export file, I also have the most resent dev version of mechJeb

as well as ExceptionDetector and KSEA/Sentinel memory monitor.

Hmmmmm.... mechJeb... maybe???

Perhaps, but OpenGL is ore suspicious. I heard it changes the way frames are being processed in KSP, something about doing half the amount of processing. THis might cause the event that forces the throtle to reset to happing durring the same time frame on rails is initialised. The engine code assumes the throtle is being lowered in the frame after the time frame it is put into time acceleration.

I will try to reproduce the problem and fix it.

Edited by FreeThinker
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ss8913

ss8913

Posted
Posted

OK I could swear I've used the new hyperdrive parts... but I just made a new survey craft with a 1.25m foldable alcubierre drive (the new one), and I can't... I can't power it. I've charged it as high as it will go.. and I don't understand what the "warp throttle" thing is all about. used to be you'd set your lightspeed factor and that was that, now that number is fixed and I can select a throttle %? how come I can't charge it enough to activate it? Here's a screenshot of the problem:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/dgsqdz64bop30zw/small-hyperdrive-error.png?dl=0

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FreeThinker

FreeThinker

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Posted (edited)
OK I could swear I've used the new hyperdrive parts... but I just made a new survey craft with a 1.25m foldable alcubierre drive (the new one), and I can't... I can't power it. I've charged it as high as it will go.. and I don't understand what the "warp throttle" thing is all about. used to be you'd set your lightspeed factor and that was that, now that number is fixed and I can select a throttle %? how come I can't charge it enough to activate it? Here's a screenshot of the problem:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/dgsqdz64bop30zw/small-hyperdrive-error.png?dl=0

Notice your exotic matter bar is full. Therefore It cannot charge further. You need either a bigger warp drive or lighten the vessel. I will look if I can make it more accessible

Edited by FreeThinker
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ss8913

ss8913

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Posted

This vessel is only 17 tons. I did notice that the closer I got to Kerbin, the lower the %-charged got when the bar was full.. is that a new mechanic? takes more exotic matter to enter warp the closer you are to a gravity well? This craft pictured is a 2-seat runabout with 2 magnetic engines and the warp drive and a bunch of SCANsat gear... designed to operate in vacuum and scan planets. I think it may need bigger magnetic nozzles, though, at full thrust I can get about 1.0G and only 15k dV. So I either need more thrust, more dV, or practice that using-the-sun's-gravity-to-kill-inertia-after-warp maneuver that I've heard people talk about and I can kind of almost do.

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Nansuchao

Nansuchao

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Posted
This vessel is only 17 tons. I did notice that the closer I got to Kerbin, the lower the %-charged got when the bar was full.. is that a new mechanic? takes more exotic matter to enter warp the closer you are to a gravity well? This craft pictured is a 2-seat runabout with 2 magnetic engines and the warp drive and a bunch of SCANsat gear... designed to operate in vacuum and scan planets. I think it may need bigger magnetic nozzles, though, at full thrust I can get about 1.0G and only 15k dV. So I either need more thrust, more dV, or practice that using-the-sun's-gravity-to-kill-inertia-after-warp maneuver that I've heard people talk about and I can kind of almost do.

1G of acceleration in vacuum is really good...

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tetrapack

tetrapack

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Posted

I'm not sure what's causing your problem but I noticed that the ship is significantly larger than the warp drive ring. I haven't tested it myself yet but wouldn't all the parts that stick out explode if you try to warp?

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ss8913

ss8913

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Posted

I'm just using the Interstellar drive. I noticed something else just now though on a different ship (ring is big enough :) )... even at 1% warp throttle.. I engage the drive, and "Jebediah Kerman has died due to G force damage". at 2% or more, the ship explodes too. Is this a matter of "lighter ships need smaller warp drives and don't use a 5m drive on a 140t craft, use the 2.5m drive instead" ? This seems like there are some new mechanics in the new warp drive which are very different from how it worked before. I'm not complaining, I think it adds depth and balance and makes it not "overpowered" - I'm just trying to make sure I understand what's going on so I can differentiate "problem with my understanding of the operation" from "bug in the module" :)

I've definitely never seen Kerbals die from g force damage engaging the warp drive before, *that* seems to be new behavior that I seemingly have no way to prevent :(

Also in the screenshot - the ship is only a LITTLE bigger than the ring.. the angle I took the screenshot at makes it look "off" a bit.

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FreeThinker

FreeThinker

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Posted (edited)

Version 1.4.10 for Kerbal Space Program 1.0.4

Released on 2015-09-05

  • Added IXSWarp Ring as Heavy Warp ring capable of warping heavy vessels.
  • Folding Warp Ring is now classified as medium warp drive for average sized vessels
  • Original KSPI ring is reintroduced as light warp ring, for warping light vessels
  • Increased Isp of Magnetic nozles to allow propellant less propulsion (Charged Particles serve as propellant)
  • Removed Heat throttling from Dusty Plasma Bed but reduced maximum Power to 3 GW
  • Added Fix to allow low trust engine on some systems
  • Added Cross Feed to all Interstellar Tanks, and Nose cone can also be attached radially

Edited by FreeThinker
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tetrapack

tetrapack

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Posted

As much as I love the magnetic nozzle are you perhaps making them a little too powerful for how early they can be researched? Should practical interstellar travel not be reserved for the warp drive? Was not the fusion rocket supposed to make everything else obsolete? :D

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FreeThinker

FreeThinker

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Perhaps their Maximum Isp should not accessible right away at a 100% efficiency. But magnetic nozzles are actually quite balanced by all of its limitations. In contrast to Warp engines, it's actually technology we can build today. So it makes a lot of sense it is available relative early in the KSPI-E carreer.

Edited by FreeThinker
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tetrapack

tetrapack

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Posted
Perhaps their Maximum Isp should not accessible right away. But magnetic nozzles are actually quite balanced by all of its limitations. In contrast to Warp engines, it's actually technology we can build today. So it makes a lot of sense it is available early.

Perhaps you could put them somewhere in the bottom of the tech tree close to plasma thrusters and such? That would force the player to research two separate branches - magnetic nozzles and charged particle reactors - to access them... not sure if I like this prospect myself but it is an idea...

They also seem like an almost straight upgrade from the plasma and atila engines. They are much easier to research and their only disadvantage is that they can not run on beamed power. But if you have a reactor on board anyway there seems to be no real reason to not use the magnetic nozzle instead of plasma until you research the quantum thruster that is... Although I never use beamed power so I'm probably not the best man to judge that...

Also I was quite surprised to see how little water there is on Minmus (just some traces near the poles) seeing as the entire surface consists of ice... do you think it is actually frozen dessert rather than water? :D

And speaking of the resource system. Is it possible to integrate it with the stock resource system? Maybe give the stock refinery some basic refining options and later unlock either new options for the same part or heavier, more advanced refineries? The stock drills could perhaps also be used to mine all kinds of resources (at least on solid surfaces) rather than having the refinery teleport the resources inside it.

I also don't know how possible or desirable this would be but how about removing the stock ore?

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FreeThinker

FreeThinker

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Perhaps you could put them somewhere in the bottom of the tech tree close to plasma thrusters and such? That would force the player to research two separate branches - magnetic nozzles and charged particle reactors - to access them... not sure if I like this prospect myself but it is an idea...

Well they do belong in the high efficient engine technode but the magnetic nozzle is kind of a hybrid between a thermal nozzle and electric engine, as it uses a high magnetic fields to direct the energy that originates from a reactor. What I could do it unluck the magnetic nozzle true power with Plasma technology,an upgrade which get's available with plasma technology allows the magnetic nozzle to maximize their Isp and efficiency . That way the player is motivated to research the electric engine branch as well, but is not forced to it.

- - - Updated - - -

They also seem like an almost straight upgrade from the plasma and atila engines. They are much easier to research and their only disadvantage is that they can not run on beamed power. But if you have a reactor on board anyway there seems to be no real reason to not use the magnetic nozzle instead of plasma until you research the quantum thruster that is... Although I never use beamed power so I'm probably not the best man to judge that...

Well that's not their only disadvantage, in contrast to electric engines which can use almost anything as a propellant, magnetic nozzles can only use charge particles with Hydrogen which is much harder to store. Also their thrust is useless in any atmosphere and insufficient to get into orbit.

- - - Updated - - -

And speaking of the resource system. Is it possible to integrate it with the stock resource system? Maybe give the stock refinery some basic refining options and later unlock either new options for the same part or heavier, more advanced refineries? The stock drills could perhaps also be used to mine all kinds of resources (at least on solid surfaces) rather than having the refinery teleport the resources inside it.

I also don't know how possible or desirable this would be but how about removing the stock ore?

Well I have the intention to improve integration with the stock resource system, but not any concrete plan yet. Most likely I will use the existing drills, or other public domain drills to improving mining

- - - Updated - - -

Also I was quite surprised to see how little water there is on Minmus (just some traces near the poles) seeing as the entire surface consists of ice... do you think it is actually frozen dessert rather than water? :D

Well most of the water on Minmus has sunken deep into the ground. The best places to find water is on some of the lower basins. I will increase it abundance at these locations

Edited by FreeThinker
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