Star Wars Episode VIII (8) the Last Jedi Discussion

[tater]

Just now, Cheif Operations Director said:

All I want is a reason.

I gave you a reason. She's literally the best home for midclorians ever born. Anakin had 20,000/cell? She started with just 2, and now has 100,000/cell.

Done.

That is a reason, and no dumber than your citations.

[Cheif Operations Director]

Just now, tater said:

I gave you a reason. She's literally the best home for midclorians ever born. Anakin had 20,000/cell? She started with just 2, and now has 100,000/cell.

Done.

That is a reason, and no dumber than your citations.

How did you get 100,000/cell

and what's wrong with be citing something to show you the canon

[tater]

Just now, Cheif Operations Director said:

How did you get 100,000/cell

I made it up.

Lucas made up 20,000/cell.

Pick any suitably high number you like that results in her so powerful she's good without training.

She had a normal number for a random person without a pedigree, but happens to be the best place ever for midclorians to live, so they multiply like crazy (and they MUST multiply like crazy, because luke literally started out with 20,000 total)

Just now, Cheif Operations Director said:

and what's wrong with be citing something to show you the canon

One, the Clone Wars are not canon any more for the movies (I read that someplace), and 2, I haven't seen the clone wars, and won't ever see them. There are decent books I could read instead of watching a weak cartoon. If the cartoon was in a better SF universe, I might watch it. But Lucas is pretty awful, really.

[Cheif Operations Director]

Just now, tater said:

I made it up.

Lucas made up 20,000/cell.

Pick any suitably high number you like that results in her so powerful she's good without training.

She had a normal number for a random person without a pedigree, but happens to be the best place ever for midclorians to live, so they multiply like crazy (and they MUST multiply like crazy, because luke literally started out with 20,000 total)

One, the Clone Wars are not canon any more for the movies (I read that someplace), and 2, I haven't seen the clone wars, and won't ever see them. There are decent books I could read instead of watching a weak cartoon. If the cartoon was in a better SF universe, I might watch it. But Lucas is pretty awful, really.

The clone wars are canon

According to Wookipedia

[tater]

Doesn't matter, I still explained her in a way that is 100% consistent with everything you have said about midclorians.

She started with a normal person number, but is a great host and they multiply.

 

[Cheif Operations Director]

Just now, tater said:

Doesn't matter, I still explained her in a way that is 100% consistent with everything you have said about midclorians.

She started with a normal person number, but is a great host and they multiply.

 

She CANT BE THAT POWERFUL WITHOUT A REASON!

[tater]

14 minutes ago, Cheif Operations Director said:

She CANT BE THAT POWERFUL WITHOUT A REASON!

I just gave you the reason. She's a perfect home, and now has a vast number of midclorians. So many that even without training she's super strong in the force. What part of that escapes you?

Or just say "because magic." what difference does it make?

BTW, the only source of her parents being nobody is Kylo. if her parents were strong, couldn't they make it so anyone digging might think that? They can clearly place thoughts in other people's minds if strong enough. getting upset about Rey is pretty goofy. She's a character in a large set of movies of which only a small number are actually good.

 

Edited December 30, 2017 by tater

[Cheif Operations Director]

1 minute ago, tater said:

I just gave you the reason. She's a perfect home, and now has a vast number of midclorians. So many that ecven without training she's super strong in the force. What part of that escapes you?

Or just say "because magic." what difference does it make?

BTW, the only source of her parents being nobody is Kylo. if her parents were strong, couldn't they make it so anyone digging might think that? They can clearly place thoughts in other people's minds if strong enough. getting upset about Rey is pretty goofy. She's a character in a large set of movies of which only a small number are actually good.

 

How is she a perfect home what's the differance between her and anyone else.

Your picking and choosing facts you like.

[tater]

9 minutes ago, Cheif Operations Director said:

How is she a perfect home what's the differance between her and anyone else.

Because I say so. All you need is a plausible explanation.

The force comes from organisms. Organisms like some ecosystems more than others. She is strong and a nobody, so she must be a great home. That is a reason. It is consistent with the stupid midclorian canon.

It fits the now canon fact that a nobody can be strong.

Done.

Quote

Your picking and choosing facts you like.

You're being religious about a badly considered fantasy world.

Edited December 30, 2017 by tater

[Cheif Operations Director]

Just now, tater said:

Because I say so. All you need is a plausible explanation.

The force comes from organisms. Organisms like some ecosystems more than others. She is strong and a nobody, so she must be a great home. That is a reason. It is consistemt withthe stupid midclorian canon.

It fits the now canon fact that a nobody can be strong.

Done.

You're being religious about a badly considered fantasy world.

I'm done with this conversation with you.

[PakledHostage]

55 minutes ago, tater said:

I'd be happy for that, actually, in which case anyone who agrees cannot be concerned with Rey's pedigee, right?

Let's do it then... Let's fire those midiclorians (sp?) out of the canon...and into the Sun.

[GoSlash27]

1 hour ago, tater said:

You're being religious about a badly considered fantasy world.

^ Pretty much where I'm at when somebody mentions "canon".

Best,
-Slashy

[DAL59]

Can we have midiclorians not be canon?

3 hours ago, tater said:

That's fine, I guess, but if you do that, follow through with story. Some beings are then objectively better than others. Substantially better. In the Lucas universe, there are wizards. They can be improved via going to Hogwarts (training), but they are none the less wizards, and vs muggles, muggles lose, every time. That's the Lucas universe, and both sides are therefore bad, IMO. Instead of good vs evil, it should shade things more, since the Rebellion is only one bad wizard away from being the Empire by a different name---a civilization run by the tiny minority who are wizards.

The first movie mentioned the Force as somethng more democratic. Something everywhere. It gave the impression that everyone has it, or at least implied that. Han ddin't have it because he's a skeptic, not because he literally didn't have it.

4 hours ago, DDE said:

What about that blind guy in Rouge One?

[GoSlash27]

1 hour ago, tater said:

It fits the now canon fact that a nobody can be strong.

It also, unfortunately, commits the unpardonable sin of bad storytelling

Best,
-Slashy

[tater]

2 minutes ago, GoSlash27 said:

It also, unfortunately, commits the unpardonable sin of bad storytelling

Best,
-Slashy

That's a perenial problem with much of SW. I think the initial Luke arc was something that they knew about (even not knowing there would be more movies) at some level. Darth's his father, Leia his sister. Some angsty conflict.

The prequels were a hot mess (while I only saw the first one, I did watch the red-letter media take downs on the other 2, that were about an hour each, so I know the basic plot).

 

[GoSlash27]

1 minute ago, tater said:

That's a perenial problem with much of SW. I think the initial Luke arc was something that they knew about (even not knowing there would be more movies) at some level. Darth's his father, Leia his sister. Some angsty conflict.

tater,
 The *original* original SW wasn't even "episode IV". It was simply "Star Wars". When that movie was first made, there was no intention of making any sequels whatsoever. All that angsty family drama stuff was just an afterthought. Vader wasn't originally Luke's father and Leia wasn't his sister. That was tacked on like an aftermarket spoiler.
 In fact, the only reason the original movie wasn't a disaster was because it was saved by the editors.
 

Spoiler

 

 

^ Fascinating stuff...

 I was forced to see all of the prequels on DVD due to having an impressionable offspring in the house when they came out. I don't recommend them.
 This is where my whole gripe comes from; most of them are simply not good movies, objectively speaking. In fact, most of them are pretty bad movies. And it's not like I set the bar particularly high, either. I mean... VII was pretty fun and even Rogue One was passable IMO. But VIII... My favorite human summed it up best: "Worst movie since Men Who Stare at Goats"
 I can't say it's quite that bad, but Lord it ain't good...

Best,
-Slashy

[tater]

I saw Star Wars in the theater when it was just Star Wars. in 1977.

(EDIT: 1977, I guess)

Edited December 30, 2017 by tater

[GoSlash27]

5 minutes ago, tater said:

I saw Star Wars in the theater when it was just Star Wars. in 1976.

tater,

 As did I, except I believe it was the spring of '77, not '76. I was 6 years old and a lot of the film went over my head, but I remembered enough to spot every time Lucas went back and monkeyed with stuff.

Best,
-Slashy

[tater]

I was 12.

That video you linked is great.

[GoSlash27]

1 minute ago, tater said:

I was 12.

That video you linked is great.

Old fart

Happy New Year,
-Slashy

[tater]

I don't know enough about what (if any) writing Lucas had done as background. I'll take your word that the relationships were not thought of ahead of time.

 

What's funny is that as kids, we all wanted to be Luke or Han.

Now, pretty much every child I interact with (my kids are 14 and 11) loves the "dark" side characters. No exceptions. My son only has rebel lego stuff as targets, lol.

[GoSlash27]

tater,

 Ironically, Lucas had no ideas whatsoever about the background, other than the stuff in the original "Whills" screenplay. The original screenplay for Empire Strikes Back was actually written by Leigh Brackett.
http://www.starwarz.com/starkiller/the-empire-strikes-back-first-draft-by-leigh-brackett-transcript/

Not only was Vader not envisioned as Luke's father, but Luke actually meets his father's ghost on Dagobah. And of course, Leia was a legit love interest at the time rather than his sister, who was named "Nellith".

My nerd is showing,
-Slashy

 

Edited December 30, 2017 by GoSlash27

[SpaceN00b]

On 12/27/2017 at 4:40 AM, Cheif Operations Director said:

It can be used in atmosphere too and technically the fuel is stored inside a ship with an atmosphere.

The light speed thing I enjoyed because it wouldn't work with a hammerhead. What people I don't think are getting is that That huge Flag Ship just made it to the end of the Snoke ship both had Sheilds and fuel. That sort of mass at that velocity could really do that a Xwing would just explode on the side a Hammerhead would breach a big space but not cut it in half. I doubt a Imperial II could even break it in half... Its all in the mass and acceleration 

This Legends from the Star Wars Wiki but: Hyperspace collisions, whether they be intentional or by accident, could devastate or even destroy a planet. Considering the fact that the output of the reactors of many Capital ships rivaled or eclipsed that of a star, and that the energies needed to make hyperspace travel possible were vast, one could unleash a great deal of destructive power on a target. Even if a planet had its planetary shielding up at the time of a hyperspace collision, it could still have the potential to kill millions on a world such as Coruscant just due to the fallout. http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Hyperspace/Legends

[tater]

9 minutes ago, SpaceN00b said:

This Legends from the Star Wars Wiki but: Hyperspace collisions, whether they be intentional or by accident, could devastate or even destroy a planet. Considering the fact that the output of the reactors of many Capital ships rivaled or eclipsed that of a star, and that the energies needed to make hyperspace travel possible were vast, one could unleash a great deal of destructive power on a target. Even if a planet had its planetary shielding up at the time of a hyperspace collision, it could still have the potential to kill millions on a world such as Coruscant just due to the fallout. http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Hyperspace/Legends

Star Destroyers are not even "huge" by SW standards, and are produced in large numbers. Snoke's ship (saw a pic from a SW book) is vastly larger than a SD (SDs look like fighters next to the pic I saw). The Rebel cruiser is certainly not vastly larger then a SD. The wiki entries for SDs are wrong I think (I measured one once using the Falcon stuck to the side), they have them way too big. None the less, star drives for even just a rock, or a shell of a ship with drives, and shields, would be much, much cheaper than a real ship with artificial gravity, a large crew, many carried craft, etc. They'd make fine, if very big, missiles. Jump in, point at target, engage hyperdrive. Profit.

[regex]

After reading this thread and other opinions out there on teh internets I have come to the conclusion that a lot of people are mad about these new films because they just realized Star Wars is, and always has been, a basic AF space opera, and that anyone with decent writing skills and a solid set of editors can crank out a halfway decent Star Wars film.