[WIP] Infernal Robotics - Next

[kcs123]

11 minutes ago, ZodiusInfuser said:

Suspension!

Maybe it is too early to hope, but can those work when being attached to other craft part instead of ground ? Or it will be kraken invitation ?

[ZodiusInfuser]

2 minutes ago, kcs123 said:

Maybe it is too early to hope, but can those work when being attached to other craft part instead of ground ? Or it will be kraken invitation ?

I honestly can't say. I'm using the stock module for it, so anything that you can do with normal landing gear can be done with these, except these allow for node attachment.

[ZodiusInfuser]

Here's a longer variant

Few geometry tweaks to do on both (turns out the foot can only pivot around one axis), but they should be good for people to play with fairly soon!

[kcs123]

1 hour ago, ZodiusInfuser said:

I honestly can't say. I'm using the stock module for it, so anything that you can do with normal landing gear can be done with these, except these allow for node attachment.

Well, that is at least some progress, have yet to try experiment with those once become available. I hope that is possible to avoid stock landing gear "autostrut feature", it is only concern for now .

[Rudolf Meier]

5 hours ago, kcs123 said:

I hope that is possible to avoid stock landing gear "autostrut feature", it is only concern for now .

all wheels in KSP (and landign legs which are wheels too internally) do set the autostruts to "heaviest part" and this is done in a way that it's ignoring everything... so, if you have a movable joint between the landing legs and the heaviest part, it get's locked

maybe that changes in 1.7.1 (I guess that's what they will name it...) but I'm not sure... we will see

[ZodiusInfuser]

I'm not trying to make this the "Zodius shows cool stuff" thread but being able to do this with the new parts makes me super happy!

They're not the sturdiest thing for landing on due to the IR joints, but it can be done at low enough velocities (that first pic was taken after landing). Also, I'm sure the suspension will need balancing a bit as I have no clue what half the values do 

[HopelessSoap]

I might be missing something but almost every robotic part is way to weak. They are also really glitchy. Sometimes it won't even work at all, and sometimes it only works at some angles. The parts that are designed for robotic arms don't have enough power to lift them.

[ZodiusInfuser]

4 hours ago, HopelessSoap said:

I might be missing something but almost every robotic part is way to weak. They are also really glitchy. Sometimes it won't even work at all, and sometimes it only works at some angles. The parts that are designed for robotic arms don't have enough power to lift them.

The parts being really weak is a known issue that Rudolf is currently looking into, as I have encountered it too.

[Rudolf Meier]

4 hours ago, HopelessSoap said:

I might be missing something but almost every robotic part is way to weak. They are also really glitchy. Sometimes it won't even work at all, and sometimes it only works at some angles. The parts that are designed for robotic arms don't have enough power to lift them.

 

11 minutes ago, ZodiusInfuser said:

The parts being really weak is a known issue that Rudolf is currently looking into, as I have encountered it too.

 

Yes, and it's not a real problem, just one number that i had to tweak a little bit (maybe I'd have to use a number for translationals and one for rotationals) ... but, I'm currently working on preparing the release, that's why I didn't create a patch. Maybe I'll release one short before the release... depends on how it's going now. Because time is running out a little bit...

[hello there]

On 5/25/2019 at 6:57 PM, ZodiusInfuser said:

I'm not trying to make this the "Zodius shows cool stuff" thread but being able to do this with the new parts makes me super happy!

They're not the sturdiest thing for landing on due to the IR joints, but it can be done at low enough velocities (that first pic was taken after landing). Also, I'm sure the suspension will need balancing a bit as I have no clue what half the values do 

when will theses parts come out

Edited May 27, 2019 by hello there

[Rudolf Meier]

10 minutes ago, hello there said:

when will theses parts come out

1 minute ago !  

[hello there]

28 minutes ago, Rudolf Meier said:

1 minute ago !  

well i am using tweakscale and the new parts are neon orange, i have also tried it without tweakscale and it is not orange anymore

Edited May 27, 2019 by hello there

[ZodiusInfuser]

11 minutes ago, hello there said:

well i am using tweakscale and the new parts are neon orange, i have also tried it without tweakscale and it is not orange anymore

Never had that happen in any of our testing, and even then I can't see how tweakscale would cause it.

[ZodiusInfuser]

Did you try it without tweakscale first and it behave fine? Because it could be that removing tweakscale triggered KSP to refresh its database, rather than it being tweakscale itself that causes the problem. Try adding tweakscale again and tell us if they go orange again.

[hello there]

 

Just now, ZodiusInfuser said:

Did you try it without tweakscale first and it behave fine? Because it could be that removing tweakscale triggered KSP to refresh its database, rather than it being tweakscale itself that causes the problem. Try adding tweakscale again and tell us if they go orange again.

yes thats what i did first but now im trying it without infernal sequencer

and now it works

[ZodiusInfuser]

10 minutes ago, hello there said:

 

yes thats what i did first but now im trying it without infernal sequencer

and now it works

Cool, but again, weird how removing the sequencer would fix it. As I say, because of how we do the texture references of the parts (to save memory) it could be that KSP needs a nudge before it fully realises where they are. Anyway, have fun with the new stuff, and be sure to show off your creations in the release thread: 

 

[kcs123]

Some reports on new parts. Hydralic Leg have some glitches that should be possible to fix. Click on picture for full album:

Short summary:

• collider on landing foot glitch trough ground
• with default spring values very light "craft" like on picture cause them to retract too much, should be stronger by default, both spring and damper
• there is missing animation when you click on "Angle Gear" button, legs spreads instantly, retracting them have proper animation
• when you place legs in mirror symmetry mode in SPH 3D mesh is not properly mirrored. If you place one leg on truss and mirror whole truss with leg on it it works properly

 

 

[ZodiusInfuser]

13 minutes ago, kcs123 said:

Some reports on new parts. Hydralic Leg have some glitches that should be possible to fix. Click on picture for full album:

Short summary:

• collider on landing foot glitch trough ground
• with default spring values very light "craft" like on picture cause them to retract too much, should be stronger by default, both spring and damper
• there is missing animation when you click on "Angle Gear" button, legs spreads instantly, retracting them have proper animation
• when you place legs in mirror symmetry mode in SPH 3D mesh is not properly mirrored. If you place one leg on truss and mirror whole truss with leg on it it works properly

Urm, those don't look like the landing legs I made. For one, they don't have an angle gear button. Also, they're more textured than mine

Edited May 29, 2019 by ZodiusInfuser

[kcs123]

7 minutes ago, ZodiusInfuser said:

Urm, those don't look like the landing legs I made. For one, they don't have an angle gear button. Also, they're more textured than mine

Uhh, sorry for false report then. I probably missplaced those legs with IR parts, those are probably from Kerbal Foundries mod.
Have to admit that I didn't have time to check all parts from all installed mods in latest KSP instance. Have yet to check out all other cool stuff.

@Rudolf Meier, please remind me, are the following values responsible for joint strength ?

		factorForce = 35
		maxForce = 30
		forceLimit = 30

I want to try fooling around with those trough additional MM patches if I found that joints are week for my unusual contraptions.

[ZodiusInfuser]

8 minutes ago, kcs123 said:

Uhh, sorry for false report then. I probably missplaced those legs with IR parts, those are probably from Kerbal Foundries mod.
Have to admit that I didn't have time to check all parts from all installed mods in latest KSP instance. Have yet to check out all other cool stuff.

That's fine! Got me worried for a moment though

8 minutes ago, kcs123 said:

 

@Rudolf Meier, please remind me, are the following values responsible for joint strength ?

		factorForce = 35
		maxForce = 30
		forceLimit = 30

I want to try fooling around with those trough additional MM patches if I found that joints are week for my unusual contraptions.

Indeed they are, although Rudolf will have to explain the exact purpose of each.

I admit I did not have time to tweak the forces of the new parts so it may be that what you come up with would be worth us adding directly to the mod.

[kcs123]

45 minutes ago, ZodiusInfuser said:

I admit I did not have time to tweak the forces of the new parts so it may be that what you come up with would be worth us adding directly to the mod.

Yep, found that on landing legs, spring force should be set on 2 and damper on 1.2 as default, or both should be increased for some factor. I checked this time on proper new IR legs .

I will try to optimize my tweaks with medium size parts, to be reasonable strong for intended purposes, along with KJRn. So, it should suffice then for smaler and larger sized scaled versions. Have to be careful with those to not destroy kerbal universe with it .

I got often interupted when I try to do some test with all of those, so it may take a while until I come up with any findings.

[Rudolf Meier]

1 hour ago, kcs123 said:

... please remind me, are the following values responsible for joint strength ?

		factorForce = 35
		maxForce = 30
		forceLimit = 30

 

hi, yes, they are... maxForce is the design limit of the joint, forceLimit is the current limit set in the UI and factorForce is the multiplyer used to feed it into unity. So, if you have a joint with a factor of 70, it is twice as strong as the one with 35 given that the other values are the same (and in the UI both show the same strength)... this allows modders to tweak the forces behind the scene a little bit while not showing it to the player that they had to do it (e.g. when you have high-mass and low-mass parts and need to adjust something because of that)

[kcs123]

55 minutes ago, Rudolf Meier said:

hi, yes, they are... maxForce is the design limit of the joint, forceLimit is the current limit set in the UI and factorForce is the multiplyer used to feed it into unity. So, if you have a joint with a factor of 70, it is twice as strong as the one with 35 given that the other values are the same (and in the UI both show the same strength)... this allows modders to tweak the forces behind the scene a little bit while not showing it to the player that they had to do it (e.g. when you have high-mass and low-mass parts and need to adjust something because of that)

Ah, thanks for info. In other words, all that is necessary is to change "factorForce" value trough additional MM patch by multiplying by new coefficent, like 2, 3 or so and I should not worry much about rest of values. Now it is time to create such MM patch .

[Rudolf Meier]

8 minutes ago, kcs123 said:

Ah, thanks for info. In other words, all that is necessary is to change "factorForce" value trough additional MM patch by multiplying by new coefficent, like 2, 3 or so and I should not worry much about rest of values. Now it is time to create such MM patch .

in a way yes... then they become stronger without showing it  

[kcs123]

And ... I have encountered some Nullreference bug in SPH editor.

Description from top of my head, as much as I can recall:

I have placed new railed pivoted hinge on craft. Placed truss on it and on truss I have placed B9PW. Then, I wanted to check out how wings would behave if I place hinge on heavier part instead of being attached to truss. When I tried to surface attach it, additional parts attached to hinge have disapeared, and I could no longer attach it to enything. Whole GUI stoped to work, wherever I click, I was having Nullreference errors. Nasty bug, I have to force quit game with ALT+F4.

Oh, and before that, I was messiing with IR GUI and when I clicked on "()" to set new default position, I got also Nullreference error. That was first one noticed, but everything else in SPH worked fine before and after that until I encountered GUI bug. I will send log files shortly on PM.