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[AAR] The Grand Tour - Voyage To The Planets

czokletmuss

By czokletmuss
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KSK

KSK

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My concern about this being published as a book is the fact that it draws from other well known sci fi stories. There may be a way around this, perhaps the source materials could be acknowledged in the blurb/about paragraph.

That's not necessarily a problem, although the distinction between 'inspired by' and 'copied' can be a tricky one to define. It's not in the same genre but if you've read 'The Sword of Shannara' by Terry Brooks, it is quite obviously inspired by 'The Lord of the Rings' (down to the level of analogous characters and plot sequences in places) but that didn't stop it being published and doing very well.

I confess (the shame, the shame!) to only being partway through 'The Grand Tour' and whilst it does seem to be inspired by '2001 - A Space Odyssey', my gut feeling is that it would be different enough to avoid any copyright problems - although Czo might want to remove some of the direct quotes. :) OK as homages on a fan-fic board, probably not so much in a published work. Of course my gut counts for precisely zip, so don't take this as any sort of advice.

I know Czo has mentioned this before but I'd be more concerned about getting permission from Squad and checking the terms and conditions for this forum, in case they include anything about Squad owning the copyright to anything posted here. If I remember correctly, the terms and conditions for mods are fairly reasonable but I'm not sure about stories, pictures etc.

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Deadpangod3

Deadpangod3

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You should seriously make it into a real book. If you make a million dollars (which you will) talk to disney about making a movie :sticktongue:

As long as there isn't tons of singing and crap in it, but knowing Disney they'd make it for children...

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The Error

The Error

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You should seriously make it into a real book. If you make a million dollars (which you will) talk to disney about making a movie :sticktongue:

Too dark to Disney. People, you know, actually die.

Disney cannot into people dying. Especially cute green guys.

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Krevsin

Krevsin

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Too dark to Disney. People, you know, actually die.

Disney cannot into people dying.

With the notable exception of the parents of each and every one of their main characters.

Edited by Krevsin
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Starwhip

Starwhip

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I heard several of you talking about making a movie. If I could just get the part models, or make them, I could do that in Blender. The whole thing would be animated. I'll admit, I might fail, but it would be some kind of experience.

On second thought, all the parts I would really need are a model of the Proteus and the planets/moons.

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BigOto2

BigOto2

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The problem I see with an animated movie is that the story is so long that it would take forever to do all the animations + voice acting + editing + music! So I think the best way to start out would be to do a particularly memorable chapter for proof-of-concept, perhaps the Eve ascent chapter which was my favorite because it was so dramatic.

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Patupi

Patupi

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I'd put myself down as a voice actor if anyone needs a British accent for anything, just not Rozer! There are too many movies where the Brit is the bad guy! *Humphs* (If he is a bad guy exactly?)

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czokletmuss

czokletmuss

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My as yet untied plot strings in this:

1. Where is Proteus, and what are Jeb and BERTY doing?

2. What happened to put the Krussian station into the situation it was in when found?

3. What happened to the Duna team, and where are they now?

4. What happened over Bop?

5. What does KSC really want?

6. What happened to Sid?

7. And, obviously, will they make it?

I'd go for a paid PDF, maybe even some sort of e-book thing. It might help if the earlier chapters got edited to make it clear who was speaking and to fix up the grammars and words and such.

These are seven very good questions for which I will answer when the time is right - or would I?! :dun dun: :P

On the topic of the PDF, I would for sure pay for it.
I would pay for a pdf of this, can't risk everything being lost if the whole forum crashes again :(
Well, thanks czo, it has been a pleasure reading this story.

Anyway, I would buy this in book form.

I would buy it, but I have no money. :(

No matter! I'm curious to see how you tie up all the loose ends!

I'd Happily buy, I suggest selling it for around 10-20$.

It might be hard to take all the pics and copy them into a .pdf, but who knows.

Or you could just take screenshots of the pages and compile them into a long PDF.

I'd like an .epub too (for iPad iBooks).

Wow, didn't expect such a positive response to this honestly. That's very nice of you - thank you!

Wow, amazing writing, really top-notch. Ever thought of making writer a full-time job? I would read all of your books front to back. Now what's happening with Jeb and BERTY.... I suppose only time will tell!

Thanks! Well, actually my current part-time job (4 years and counting) is basically writing about... stuff, so yeah, I did thought about this :)

And yup, only time will tell :)

You should seriously make it into a real book. If you make a million dollars (which you will) talk to disney about making a movie :sticktongue:
My concern about this being published as a book is the fact that it draws from other well known sci fi stories. There may be a way around this, perhaps the source materials could be acknowledged in the blurb/about paragraph.
That's not necessarily a problem, although the distinction between 'inspired by' and 'copied' can be a tricky one to define. It's not in the same genre but if you've read 'The Sword of Shannara' by Terry Brooks, it is quite obviously inspired by 'The Lord of the Rings' (down to the level of analogous characters and plot sequences in places) but that didn't stop it being published and doing very well.

I confess (the shame, the shame!) to only being partway through 'The Grand Tour' and whilst it does seem to be inspired by '2001 - A Space Odyssey', my gut feeling is that it would be different enough to avoid any copyright problems - although Czo might want to remove some of the direct quotes. :) OK as homages on a fan-fic board, probably not so much in a published work. Of course my gut counts for precisely zip, so don't take this as any sort of advice.

I know Czo has mentioned this before but I'd be more concerned about getting permission from Squad and checking the terms and conditions for this forum, in case they include anything about Squad owning the copyright to anything posted here. If I remember correctly, the terms and conditions for mods are fairly reasonable but I'm not sure about stories, pictures etc.

That's rather complicated issue. You obviously can't steal copyright protected material but Shout Out to someone's else work is not illegal. And of course everyone is inspired by something. Bigger problem with derivative work (if this is one - it's not that simple) would be Squad's copyright to KSP universe, for instance names of the planets.

However, I'm not planning to publish this as a book, that is to put it on amazon or something as my work. As you surely have noticed, "The Grand Tour" is avaible here on forum for free. The eventual payment/donation would be not for my writing (work) but for putting this all to one piece, that is editing and so on (service). Or it can be done like this: I'm uploading the whole pdf/e-book here and if someone wants to make donation, he do so :)

Anyways, right now there's still some work to do with the last chapter, so for the time being I'm concentrated on that.

BTW - Squad does not have the right to anything we post here. For example, on paradoxplaza.com there's this little gem:

COPYRIGHT NOTICE - All content posted on the message boards of Paradox is the exclusive intellectual property of Paradox. Copyright ownership of that content resides with Paradox and the Company is free to use any of the content as they wish. Anyone other than Paradox seeking to reprint, republish, or reproduce content posted on the Paradox message boards must receive the express written permission from Paradox Interactive. By posting on the Paradox message boards you are agreeing to the above and relinquishing all copyright to the contents of the post(s) to Paradox.

But there's nothing like this in the Forum Rules or anywhere else, so fear not :)

As long as there isn't tons of singing and crap in it, but knowing Disney they'd make it for children...
Too dark to Disney. People, you know, actually die.

Disney cannot into people dying. Especially cute green guys.

Bambi's mother?

With the notable exception of the parents of each and every one of their main characters.
Was about to say that.

Exactly :)

An audiobook version narrated by Scott Manley and the dialogs done by some other famous KSP youtubers?
I would pay even more if that were a thing :D
Yes yes yes yes! That would be the best thing ever :D

Now that would be something! :D Just imagine Jeb's or Rozer's (or BERTY's) dialogue being read by him with his Scottish accent:

Hullo there. Aye, what yer doing, Jeb?

So... Learn to make a movie :D

Kidding. Maybe you can get Steetlamp or somebody to make a movie, Nassault is very busy.

I would also love to see something like this. Maybe CZO wants to get in touch with some of the KSP movie makers?
I could make a movie!

...but it wouldn't be Nassault-quality, I can tell you that. :)

I heard several of you talking about making a movie. If I could just get the part models, or make them, I could do that in Blender. The whole thing would be animated. I'll admit, I might fail, but it would be some kind of experience.

On second thought, all the parts I would really need are a model of the Proteus and the planets/moons.

The problem I see with an animated movie is that the story is so long that it would take forever to do all the animations + voice acting + editing + music! So I think the best way to start out would be to do a particularly memorable chapter for proof-of-concept, perhaps the Eve ascent chapter which was my favorite because it was so dramatic.

This is a very good idea and it was already done once:

However, this would be HUGE. I can't even start to imagine how much work would it require to put it all together considering that for several hours of work you get maybe a minute or two of animation. And I'm not talking about brand new animation, rather about playing and recording everything in KSP - doing the models and so on would be an immensely challenging thing. The adaptation would have to be much shorter than the story obviously and a lot of subplots would have to be cut out along with some characters. All in all, it sounds great and if there's someone who would like to do something like this he can take my blessing and cooperation for granted. BUT make no mistake, it would mean dozens of hours of work and it would be ready probably in September/October at its earliest. I also think that short proof-of-concept scene would be a good way to check whether it would even look good.

Having said that, if there's anyone crazy and skilled enough to think about doing this, PM me please :)

No sneak-peak screenshot today (I'm busy writing) but take a look at this pretty cinematic by Momo which depicts the whole Solar System - can you imagine that IMV "Proteus" visited every one of this celestial bodies? :)

Argh, KSP looks so much better now than when I started - what a shame "The Grand Tour" was stuck in 0.22 this whole time...

Edited by czokletmuss
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czokletmuss

czokletmuss

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Yeah, you've got a point about SQUAD copyright. Possibly, like "Jeds adventure" you could change names of everything related to ksp?

It's rather complicated. Plus there's another problem - Squad is a Mexican company and I'm a citizen of Poland (EU). In Polish copyright law there's a distinction between derivative work and inspired work - the first one (to put it simple) requires the author of such work to get consent from the copyright holder of the original work to publish and distribute it. In case of inspired works, such consent is not needed. I don't know honestly is Poland and Mexico binded by any bilateral agreement or international convention in this aspect (me buying KSP is probably like 1% of the whole economical exchange between the two countries). So assuming "The Grand Tour" is an inspired work, basically if I make it clear that it is in fact inspired by KSP I would fulfill the requirements of due dilligence in that case - according to the Polish copyright law. I'm sure there could be some issues with EU law and/or international agreements or conventions.

But again, it's rather complicated.

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SpaceSphereOfDeath

SpaceSphereOfDeath

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I mean, the Grand Tour has always been here for us. Through the loss of our first community manager, through the resources disaster, through everything for the last few months this story has always been here to help us get through. And now it will be gone?!

I like to think of the grand tour as a record of the evolution of the forums, it's one of the main reasons why I'm anti-curse.

The KSP forums were maintained by the developers, and to be honest the best community I've ever seen across the entire internet, we have our own lore, our own idols, our own poetry, songs, inside jokes a rich history, full of horrific disasters (the 2013 April crash happened exactly 6 days before I joined IIRC) but also brilliant moments (the 0.23 waiting thread when we held the severs at hostage with all the traffic, about 10 posts every 45 seconds) and of course, the entire sub-community is part of a bigger community, if everyone who played KSP joined the forums tomorrow, yes for a short while the value of the community might go down, but after a week or so, we would have even more helpful, characterful people with even more stories to tell, which brings me back to the grand tour. This story is not of pixels changing colour and transistors flowing, it's about the spirt of community within a sub-community and Czokletmuss bringing us together and sharing his writing with us and allowing this amazing group of people who I've come to like flourish, even if it's a tiny amount, it's something, a insignificant something much like the proteus drifting through the inky blackness. Thank you Czokletmuss for this brilliant, awe inducing, trope-tastic tale. Thanks.

TL;DR: thanks or something *poetry* :cool:

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iDan122

iDan122

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Hey czok,

I'd be more than happy to spell-check and grammar-check THE ENTIRE THING.

Seriously anything for you. I'll be on holiday for 2 months with my iPad and laptop, so I can still do editing stuff.

I mean, I will have nothing to do in the evenings anyway..

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KSK

KSK

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It's rather complicated. Plus there's another problem - Squad is a Mexican company and I'm a citizen of Poland (EU). In Polish copyright law there's a distinction between derivative work and inspired work - the first one (to put it simple) requires the author of such work to get consent from the copyright holder of the original work to publish and distribute it. In case of inspired works, such consent is not needed. I don't know honestly is Poland and Mexico binded by any bilateral agreement or international convention in this aspect (me buying KSP is probably like 1% of the whole economical exchange between the two countries). So assuming "The Grand Tour" is an inspired work, basically if I make it clear that it is in fact inspired by KSP I would fulfill the requirements of due dilligence in that case - according to the Polish copyright law. I'm sure there could be some issues with EU law and/or international agreements or conventions.

But again, it's rather complicated.

Mexico and Poland are both signatories to the Berne Convention so yes - they are bound by an international treaty but I honestly don't know much beyond that. My best guess is that their copyright laws will be somewhat similar or at least will adhere to a certain agreed minimum but beyond that *shrugs*. "Rather complicated" is probably a good way of putting it. :)

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