LLL - Lack Luster Labs - Development Thread

[NathanKell]

Lack: ah, that part! Didn't connect its use.

And, ooh, purty engine. Very nice!

The way you're doing it will mean that engine packs for RF will need to get rewritten, since their rescaling of stock engines depends on the part not using a MODEL node. Then again, the only RF packs that will be rescaling engines will also desire your models, so.

Although really we can just use MM2.x functionality (NEEDS etc) to get around this.

Also, thought you might enjoy: a few uses of your plane cockpit:

The RftS universe version of the Gloster E.28/39

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A land-on-the-VAB plane I made for a challenge. Like a Cessna 150 or so, though I called it the Cub.

[Lack]

Yeah, I was using LLL-Lite but I couldn't see it

I checked again today and I found it, I guess I have to redock my truss section now

Also, if I recall correctly, the CBMs in LLL-Lite are not 'true' 1x1. I rescaled them by about .7 - .8 to fit the stock docking parts.

@OrbitalSolutionsLtd,

Yes. Well, sort of. I've tried it in the past and it sort of works, but only at very specific angles and you get some very weird effects, like sudden moments of frictionlessness, then the wheel collider slips and the whole thing either catapults at a stupid angle or explodes. Essentially it doesn't work very well.

@NathanKell,

Yeah, I figured adding in the model{} node was better than just over-writing the stock part. Well, thinking about it now, I could have it named aamodel.mu, so the config would choose that instead of the model.mu and then just add it to the stock folder, but it would complicate uninstalling a bit.

Also, if you reckon it'd be easier to set that up in another way, then just say or send a copy of how you'd do it.

Nice planes, btw. I think I should have the configs for rescaled firespitter parts for the .625 kicking around somewhere. There's a realistic (I think I based it off one of the Cesna-like plane's engines) prop engine and some smaller resizes of the wheels.

[neamerjell]

Found a fix for the cargo bay doors not having a right click menu in the VAB/SPH (may require Firespitter plugin?):

Open the .cfg files for the cargo bays and replace

MODULE
{
	name = ModuleAnimateGeneric
	animationName = cargodoor
	isOneShot = false
	startEventGUIName = Close Doors
	endEventGUIName = Open Doors
}

with this (from B9 Aerospace's cargo doors)

MODULE
{
        name = FSanimateGeneric
	animationName = cargodoor
	startEventGUIName = Close Doors
	endEventGUIName = Open Doors
	toggleActionName = Toggle doors
	availableInEVA = True
	EVArange = 10
}

[NathanKell]

Lack: Doing it that way is fine; I needed something to push me to switching to 2.x synatx anyway

And I even already have the nodes in my sheet so scaling them will be easy(ish).

Thanks! I actually have a whole album of these things (and I'm increasingly using your radial intakes, and rescales of them). Haven't yet given your jets AJE configs though.

You wouldn't happen to have AJE configs for the engine would you? And the wheel parts would be great, as you can see my selection was limited!

[Jagger]

Hey Lack, I have a big problem with both LLL and SXT. The textures are all grey in some parts. The old ones are all fine, I think, but all the crew cans and capsules are grey. Some parts don't seem affected like wings and plane cockpits, antenas, cargo boxes, wind turbines, etc.

I know what might be causing this. The mods are 0.23.5 and i'm running 0.23. ModuleManager also displays an error, saying it's outdated. Any known fixes besides updating KSP?

I can send pics if you need them, but atm I'm on a phone.

[LORDPrometheus]

Lack: ah, that part! Didn't connect its use.

And, ooh, purty engine. Very nice!

The way you're doing it will mean that engine packs for RF will need to get rewritten, since their rescaling of stock engines depends on the part not using a MODEL node. Then again, the only RF packs that will be rescaling engines will also desire your models, so.

Although really we can just use MM2.x functionality (NEEDS etc) to get around this.

Also, thought you might enjoy: a few uses of your plane cockpit:

http://i.imgur.com/8gvhmhNl.png

The RftS universe version of the Gloster E.28/39

http://imgur.com/a/AppPV

A land-on-the-VAB plane I made for a challenge. Like a Cessna 150 or so, though I called it the Cub.

STOL?

Standard takeoff and landing?

Spicy Tomato Orange Licorice?

[Lack]

Hey Lack, I have a big problem with both LLL and SXT. The textures are all grey in some parts. The old ones are all fine, I think, but all the crew cans and capsules are grey. Some parts don't seem affected like wings and plane cockpits, antenas, cargo boxes, wind turbines, etc.

I know what might be causing this. The mods are 0.23.5 and i'm running 0.23. ModuleManager also displays an error, saying it's outdated. Any known fixes besides updating KSP?

I can send pics if you need them, but atm I'm on a phone.

Squad changed the file-names in .23.5, so if you're using the post .23.5 versions of SXT with .23 it's going to be looking for textures that don't exist, or rather, do but have a different name. A few others have had that problem, should be posted somewhere in the last dozen or so pages, or just scroll through my old posts, with solutions and what to do if you're using a texture pack.

Simple solution is to open the .cfg of the affected part (notepad'll do) and change the texture name.

i.e.

0.23 version:

	texture = model003 , Squad/Parts/Command/crewCabin/model000
	texture = model004_NRM , Squad/Parts/Command/crewCabin/model001

0.23.5 version:

	texture = model003 , Squad/Parts/Command/crewCabin/cabin
	texture = model004_NRM , Squad/Parts/Command/crewCabin/cabin_n

LLL shouldn't be doing that though. Unless you've overwritten an old version with LLL-12, which has a completely different part structure, or re-named, moved or otherwise deleted bits of the folder. Maybe check the config of those parts as well to see if there's any referencing going on in the MODEL{} and that the pathways are correct.

@Nathan,

'fraid not, haven't actually tried AJE yet, requires Real Fuels doesn't it? Haven't real used that, I had a brief look when someone asked if I could do a compatibility patch, but it looked complicated and I was tired, so I put it on my 'to do later' pile, which just happens to overlap entirely with my 'completely forget about' pile.

@Prometheus,

Short Take-Off & Landing

or maybe 'Small Tasty Orange Licorice', I'm not sure sure how spicy tomato and orange would taste. Well, presumably like some combination of the ingredients.

Edited May 1, 2014 by Lack

[Jagger]

Thank you. There are some parts which have the manufacturer as LLL, so i thought they were from the LLL pack. So maybe LLL is not like that.

I'll go and check for that, see what I can find.

[Lack]

Thank you. There are some parts which have the manufacturer as LLL, so i thought they were from the LLL pack. So maybe LLL is not like that.

I'll go and check for that, see what I can find.

Yeah, I don't think I changed the manufacturer name, I guess LLLabs is the name of the 'company', but confusingly also of the one of the 'products'. I'm going to do some Bioshock Infinite-esque handwaving and say that SXT is an alternate history thing, where the company produced stock-a-like parts. Or just that LLL mod parts happen later in the time line.

I brought that game on release, but didn't read the small print about requiring Windows 7 and above, so I've only just had the chance to play it. Thoroughly enjoyed it.

There is at least one part in LLL that does use it, it's a larger copy of an SXT part. Called 'RCS Bank [LLL resize]' or something along those lines.

Edit:

Also, Nathan,

I was thinking of having a set of 1.25, 2.5m etc. engine fairings that you add manually, rather than the stock auto-fairing system and making those engines surface attachable.

Edited May 1, 2014 by Lack

[CharlieDeBeadle]

Also, if I recall correctly, the CBMs in LLL-Lite are not 'true' 1x1. I rescaled them by about .7 - .8 to fit the stock docking parts.

@OrbitalSolutionsLtd,

Yes. Well, sort of. I've tried it in the past and it sort of works, but only at very specific angles and you get some very weird effects, like sudden moments of frictionlessness, then the wheel collider slips and the whole thing either catapults at a stupid angle or explodes. Essentially it doesn't work very well.

@NathanKell,

Yeah, I figured adding in the model{} node was better than just over-writing the stock part. Well, thinking about it now, I could have it named aamodel.mu, so the config would choose that instead of the model.mu and then just add it to the stock folder, but it would complicate uninstalling a bit.

Also, if you reckon it'd be easier to set that up in another way, then just say or send a copy of how you'd do it.

Nice planes, btw. I think I should have the configs for rescaled firespitter parts for the .625 kicking around somewhere. There's a realistic (I think I based it off one of the Cesna-like plane's engines) prop engine and some smaller resizes of the wheels.

Yes, that seems about right, I think it works well that way. Do you have any plans for a 2x1 passenger capsule?

[Lack]

Yes, that seems about right, I think it works well that way. Do you have any plans for a 2x1 passenger capsule?

The 2x1 hull is already a cabin, but they're handled slightly differently in LLL. That is, it is done via adding a hatch or airlock.

If you're not using anything else then they go straight into the hatch, if you have ship manifest you can move them into the structural parts (They nearly all have a crew capacity) or if you're using Vanguard they should automatically be shuttled into the nearest available space.

[MrWizerd]

Also if your using Connected Living Space mod, which is now supported by Ship Manifest I have created cfg files for them.

LLL_CLS.cfg

LLL_Extra_CLS.cfg

SXT_CLS.cfg

I created these after speaking with Lack in depth on which items that we felt were traversable. The only possible addition to these would be the 2x1 hubs, and I think this was more about the fact that you would need to be able to get passed the front hub, to get to the compartments in the back, but the fact that the space is so small. I Think I will add them, because my SUV isn't MEANT to be able to be traversed from front to back betwixt the seats but it can. so... if you rather them not you can remove them, they will be at the end after a comment.

Oh, and they do require Module Manager

Edited May 1, 2014 by MrWizerd

[Jagger]

Hey lack, about that download, were you referring to SXT alpha version 11a? That's all I found

[AntiMatter001]

the cargo bays are a mess BTW XD although the file system is easier to navigate the 1x1 and (not all) the 2x1 cargobays aren't there.

[Lack]

the cargo bays are a mess BTW XD although the file system is easier to navigate the 1x1 and (not all) the 2x1 cargobays aren't there.

How so? They very much are there.

@Jagger,

SXT 11a was released for KSP 0.23. Although there's no actual need to role back, just do the edits I mentioned above, there's only a few parts that need changing.

[MrWizerd]

Which ones are missing? are they missing from the Tech Tree or are they missing from the file system? and Which cargo bays?

I have the cargo bays in /LLL/Parts/Structural/2x1/CargoBayLong then /CargoBayShort then you have the CrewBay after that. with both cargo bays unlocking at heavyaerodynamics.

[MrWizerd]

Ok, New mod cfg files, these ones are for Deadly Reentry (DRE) All pods and fuselages that have heat tiles will get reflective heat tiles, I believe these are oriented correctly, if you find they are not please let me know here in this thread. I also set the debris shields up as ablative shields per Lacks request, I originally was going to neglect them, however, they now have 250 units of ablative shielding, hopefully also directed properly. Lack, you may want to double check to see if the orientation is correct, I don't know how to check it in Unity, so I am going to try to build something and test it which requires me to return DRE to its full position I will work on testing later, I have a tree swing to hang.

LLL_DRE.cfg

LLL_Extra_DRE.cfg

[Jagger]

How so? They very much are there.

@Jagger,

SXT 11a was released for KSP 0.23. Although there's no actual need to role back, just do the edits I mentioned above, there's only a few parts that need changing.

Is it always the same texture? I had no idea you could do that with the same model xD. I have no idea how it works anyhow. I'll get to work now.

EDIT: I think it won't be worth it, only a new engine and lander can. I'll just keep it

Edited May 2, 2014 by Jagger

[Lack]

Is it always the same texture? I had no idea you could do that with the same model xD. I have no idea how it works anyhow. I'll get to work now.

EDIT: I think it won't be worth it, only a new engine and lander can. I'll just keep it

Fair enough. Yeah, there was only a few textures which had their names changed, generally the ones where they've added flags to and have re-exported them from Unity, the new KSP part tools don't change the texture name, so instead of model000 it uses whatever name the dev had the textured saved as.

Finally got round to doing those crew cabins I posted ages back:

@MrWizerd,

Thanks. I'll check and see if they work or the orientation needs changing. Added links to OP.

Edit:

And new release for SXT with them in,

SXT-alpha-14.zip

Edited May 3, 2014 by Lack

[pilfit]

Any chance of a 3 man lander can in SXT? Always looking for a good one and never find a good one, only one I know of is ALCOR and that one gives me problems.

[Neutrinovore]

Hello, Lack, long time no speak.

I just discovered a minor oversight in LLL-Full 12.1 last night. The 2.5m to dual 2x1 adapter is missing from this version. After investigation, I discovered that the model is in the right place; LLL/Models/Structural/2x1x25New/bicoupler.mu, but there was no config file for it in Parts/Structural/Adaptors. I fixed my own setup, just created a new config file in the right place, using the config from 10.7.3 and referencing the correct current model location, but I just thought you might like to fix this for the next release version.

And, I guess I should post the config for anyone who wants to add this part back in to their current install. Here ya go.

PART
{
name = 2x2to25m
module = Part
author = Lack
MODEL
{
 model = LLL/Models/Structural/2x1x25New/bicoupler
}
scale = 1
rescaleFactor = 1
node_stack_top1 = 0.648716, 0.2725, 0, 0.0, 1.0, 0.0
node_stack_top2 = -0.648716, 0.2725, 0, 0.0, 1.0, 0.0
node_stack_top3 = 0, 0.2725, 0, 0.0, 1.0, 0.0
node_stack_bottom = 0, -0.31, 0, 0.0, -1.0, 0.0
TechRequired = specializedConstruction
entryCost = 0
cost = 800
category = Structural
subcategory = 0
title = 2x2 to 2.5m Adaptor Plate
manufacturer = Lack Luster Labs
description = Goes from a lovely simple circle to TWO ridiculous and needlessly fiddly shaped hulls. Takes all sorts I guess.
attachRules = 1,1,1,1,0
stackSymmetry = 1
mass = 0.3
dragModelType = default
maximum_drag = 0.2
minimum_drag = 0.2
angularDrag = 2
crashTolerance = 40
breakingForce = 200
breakingTorque = 200
maxTemp = 3400
fuelCrossFeed = True
}

I hope you don't mind that I changed the description just a tad.

[Lack]

Hello, Lack, long time no speak.

I just discovered a minor oversight in LLL-Full 12.1 last night. The 2.5m to dual 2x1 adapter is missing from this version. After investigation, I discovered that the model is in the right place; LLL/Models/Structural/2x1x25New/bicoupler.mu, but there was no config file for it in Parts/Structural/Adaptors. I fixed my own setup, just created a new config file in the right place, using the config from 10.7.3 and referencing the correct current model location, but I just thought you might like to fix this for the next release version.

And, I guess I should post the config for anyone who wants to add this part back in to their current install. Here ya go.

I hope you don't mind that I changed the description just a tad.

Ah, excellent, thanks. I'm hoping that's the last of the parts that got missed, it's mainly been ones were there was more than one part in a config and it got missed out. I'll update the maindownload later.

Yeah, long time no see, how trix?

Edit: Screenshots!

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Edited May 5, 2014 by Lack

[Gristle]

Last night I noticed an oddity with the Landing Leg-Small Underside. It seems that this part's animations are reversed in that gear up lowers the leg and gear down raises it. In addition, although not really broken, it doesn't have a lower gear or raise gear animation defined.

Heres a pic of the vessel I was using when i found this quirk, the GRR RoboRay Explorer.

Edited May 5, 2014 by Gristle

[Lack]

Yeah, it's just the animation being the wrong way round in Unity. I tried to fix it once, should be easy but those damn things seem to break if I so much as even breath near them in Unity.

Not sure what you mean when you say it doesn't have an animation defined, though.

[Gristle]

Yeah, it's just the animation being the wrong way round in Unity. I tried to fix it once, should be easy but those damn things seem to break if I so much as even breath near them in Unity.

Not sure what you mean when you say it doesn't have an animation defined, though.

Here is a screen shot that shows what i'm trying to describe:

The Landing Leg - Small Underside doesn't have a Raise Leg or Lower Leg AG choice.