Rune's Slightly Used Vehicles

[CloudlessEchoes]

Yes those tiny thrusts don't like to move big asteroids, probably a rounding error or similar. I thought a long nudge with ions would do the trick... I was wrong! Will try that behemoth out soon.

[Rune]

9 hours ago, Raptor9 said:

I captured a Class E asteroid into a high Kerbin orbit once (somewhere between Mun and Minmus)...definitely a process I would prefer not to experience again.

Yup, it is a lot of hours burning. Still, as long as you have a stable rig and you can set up an alarm and go do something else, I find it bearable... to do in small chunks. On and off, this must have taken me a couple months of RL, 15-20 minutes at a time. But it you break it up in small chunks, it is bearable... as long as you think real hard about navigation to avoid unnecessary burns. Though next time I think I am carrying a couple nukes and a bigger buffer tank... and next time it'll be a class D for sure.

8 hours ago, CloudlessEchoes said:

Yes those tiny thrusts don't like to move big asteroids, probably a rounding error or similar. I thought a long nudge with ions would do the trick... I was wrong! Will try that behemoth out soon.

Yeah, that's what I thought, rounding error or something. Still, I think ~0.03m/s² is a sufficiently low acceleration, you just have to shoot for something slightly above that. After all, it only stopped working around my apoapsis once I got it under Mun's orbit, with the periapsis in Kerbin's atmo (the first round of aerobraking). It kept working at the ascending/descending nodes, which were about 90º from it. That is a low orbital velocity, so this must be a corner case.

In other news, I finally run out that payload test for the Orca. Yup, it can take a full Big Red up (or two halves and a bit, if you re literal about it ). I do hope you guys enjoy it! I'll get it on the first page in a while, when I short out its mess...I think I am going to totally revamp the SPH lineup. Also, I think I am releasing here from now on, no sense making new threads now that there is no RB, right?

 

Rune. It is my new favouritest spacecraft, lets see how long that lasts.

[WhiteKnuckle]

Love the Orca, so pretty. I may steal some of the design cues on my next Mk3 craft, the diamond shaped double-bigS wing really looks more elegant than any other stock wing setup.

Edit: That's a mighty big docking port on the back of it... Nuke pusher tug? (even better if it rides to orbit inside the bay)

Edited February 10, 2016 by WhiteKnuckle

[Rune]

37 minutes ago, WhiteKnuckle said:

Love the Orca, so pretty. I may steal some of the design cues on my next Mk3 craft, the diamond shaped double-bigS wing really looks more elegant than any other stock wing setup.

Edit: That's a mighty big docking port on the back of it... Nuke pusher tug? (even better if it rides to orbit inside the bay)

Thanks! I fell in love with the wing pretty soon, too, feel free to be inspired and use it wherever (the strakes on the leading/trailing edges take some gizmo-mojo to make them look right, but it's very worth it).

As to the docking port on the back, yeah, a nuke is perfectly fine for a long-distance haul (say, Jool/Moho/Eeloo, 4~5km/s to make the transfer in a single stage), but then I would use a bicoupler and put the nuke on the lower node to have it more in line with the CoM, and you'd probably get some residual torque still. It should very much fit the paylaod bay, with room to spare for some liquid fuel and a Klaw pod to install it...

However, that port can also be used to turn the Orca itself into a tug, pulling something else. 305s Isp is nothing to write home about, but if you have the fuel to burn, who cares? Enter the big chunk of fuel I just got into LKO, or a cheap bulk launcher. The Orca has 2.3km/s on internal LFO tanks only, so fill the bay with fuel, and you can tug say, a base pack (some ~30mT and already pre-packaged for transit), to some relatively near place (Mun, Duna, etc...). The really great part is that since you have engines in pairs both above and below the port's centerline, you can tweak the CoT up/down by thrust-limiting the engines on the wings. With a readout like KER's to keep track of things, you can tweak the thrust torque into disappearing that way! Might need a spacer tank to keep the thruster plumes from hitting your payload if it is very wide, but that's a place to put more reaction mass, and you can also bring those up in the bay.

 

Rune. The idea is all you need to set up one of my bases is one of these, the base launch, and depots to refuel along the way.

[WhiteKnuckle]

Just now, Rune said:

As to the docking port on the back, yeah, a nuke is perfectly fine for a long-distance haul (say, Jool/Moho/Eeloo, 4~5km/s to make the transfer in a single stage), but then I would use a bicoupler and put the nuke on the lower node to have it more in line with the CoM, and you'd probably get some residual torque still. It should very much fit the paylaod bay, with room to spare for some liquid fuel and a Klaw pod to install it...

However, that port can also be used to turn the Orca itself into a tug, pulling something else. 305s Isp is nothing to write home about, but if you have the fuel to burn, who cares? Enter the big chunk of fuel I just got into LKO, or a cheap bulk launcher. The Orca has 2.3km/s on internal LFO tanks only, so fill the bay with fuel, and you can tug say, a base pack (some ~30mT and already pre-packaged for transit), to some relatively near place (Mun, Duna, etc...). The really great part is that since you have engines in pairs both above and below the port's centerline, you can tweak the CoT up/down by thrust-limiting the engines on the wings. With a readout like KER's to keep track of things, you can tweak the thrust torque into disappearing that way! Might need a spacer tank to keep the thruster plumes from hitting your payload if it is very wide, but that's a place to put more reaction mass, and you can also bring those up in the bay.

 

Rune. The idea is all you need to set up one of my bases is one of these, the base launch, and depots to refuel along the way.

Love it. A big sexy utility ship, and a VTOL to boot. And with the amount of cargo capacity and docking ports front & rear, you could outfit it to do just about anything.

I'd stick a big ISRU setup in the belly like this...

...and a few extra fuel tanks or a nuke tug, then see how many planets you can hop to and from (probably a good chunk of them if it can do a vertical takeoff on Kerbin with partial fuel)

[SpaceplaneAddict]

*sees Orca*

*Faints*

Why, Rune, WHYYYYYYYY!

[Raptor9]

3 hours ago, Rune said:

Yup, it is a lot of hours burning. Still, as long as you have a stable rig and you can set up an alarm and go do something else, I find it bearable... to do in small chunks. On and off, this must have taken me a couple months of RL, 15-20 minutes at a time. But it you break it up in small chunks, it is bearable... as long as you think real hard about navigation to avoid unnecessary burns. Though next time I think I am carrying a couple nukes and a bigger buffer tank... and next time it'll be a class D for sure.

I'll probably do it one more time after my 1.1 career restart.  My idea is to use a Class E as a space station anchor just inside the orbit altitude of Minmus for staging interplanetary expeditions.  After undocking, the ship can make a short burn to start a long gravity fall and slingshot around Kerbin, saving a lot of delta-V.  Unfortunately, the low orbit velocity that far out can cause orbit drift by simple, gentle docking maneuvers by large interplanetary ships, hence the need for a large anchor mass.  Plus the potato can be mined while the ship is away so when it gets back to Kerbin it can refuel before the next expedition.

That's the plan anyway.  It'll be awhile before I find out if this concept will work, but it seems like a solid plan in my head.

[Rune]

1 hour ago, Raptor9 said:

I'll probably do it one more time after my 1.1 career restart.  My idea is to use a Class E as a space station anchor just inside the orbit altitude of Minmus for staging interplanetary expeditions.  After undocking, the ship can make a short burn to start a long gravity fall and slingshot around Kerbin, saving a lot of delta-V.  Unfortunately, the low orbit velocity that far out can cause orbit drift by simple, gentle docking maneuvers by large interplanetary ships, hence the need for a large anchor mass.  Plus the potato can be mined while the ship is away so when it gets back to Kerbin it can refuel before the next expedition.

That's the plan anyway.  It'll be awhile before I find out if this concept will work, but it seems like a solid plan in my head.

Sounds like a plan, though I would advise you a lower orbit, say, Mun's (with the same orbital period, your could RP it into the "L4/5 spot"). The energy difference is trivial (100m/s or so), but the period is completely different. And you care about the period, since it defines the frequency of your launch windows to a given ejection angle. At Mun's orbit, you get a given ejection angle every ~38h, at Minmus' orbital altitude, much less often, on the order of "months" (hundreds of hours at least). That means you plan less and still be precise enough for interplanetary burns, with big orbital periods you have to take into account how kerbin will rotate around the sun as your window approaches (since you have to establish your ejection angle by dropping your periapsis much farther form the ideal window), and wait in that highly elliptical orbit where a Mun encounter can screw you royally. Trust me, below-Mun staging orbits are much more convenient. I put mine all the way down in LKO to save on tugs, but hey, you could put two, one high, one low. Not much of a reason to put it above, say, KEO (window every six hours), though, other than the cool L4/5 thing. Good luck and favorable Mun encounters with it when the time comes!

3 hours ago, SpaceplaneAddict said:

*sees Orca*

*Faints*

Why, Rune, WHYYYYYYYY!

Because rule of cool, that's why! You wouldn't think that I would come up with something like this and not share it, right? Thanks for the kind words!

3 hours ago, WhiteKnuckle said:

Love it. A big sexy utility ship, and a VTOL to boot. And with the amount of cargo capacity and docking ports front & rear, you could outfit it to do just about anything.

I'd stick a big ISRU setup in the belly like this...

...and a few extra fuel tanks or a nuke tug, then see how many planets you can hop to and from (probably a good chunk of them if it can do a vertical takeoff on Kerbin with partial fuel)

Thanks! And yeah, there is a module for that.

Many people miss that you need the big sensor dish, tough, unless you have already prospected the body in question, and that antenna is cumbersome. The way I go about it, anyhow, is to drop a base ISRU module everywhere I go, and work from there. Did I mention that the nose docking port is at the right height to dock with one of my surface bases? Now that I think about it, I don't think I did:

It can also dock on the rear docking port if you fool around with RCS and the landing gear, but I'm phasing out horizontal modules soon, and it takes a low gravity field.

 

 Rune. The fact that it docks at a very slight angle is the source of hilarious jumps on low gravities when physics loads, tough...

Edited February 10, 2016 by Rune

[CloudlessEchoes]

I'm curious what you mean by "phasing out horizontal modules".

[Raptor9]

6 hours ago, Rune said:

Sounds like a plan, though I would advise you a lower orbit, say, Mun's (with the same orbital period, your could RP it into the "L4/5 spot"). The energy difference is trivial (100m/s or so), but the period is completely different. And you care about the period, since it defines the frequency of your launch windows to a given ejection angle. At Mun's orbit, you get a given ejection angle every ~38h, at Minmus' orbital altitude, much less often, on the order of "months" (hundreds of hours at least). That means you plan less and still be precise enough for interplanetary burns, with big orbital periods you have to take into account how kerbin will rotate around the sun as your window approaches (since you have to establish your ejection angle by dropping your periapsis much farther form the ideal window), and wait in that highly elliptical orbit where a Mun encounter can screw you royally. Trust me, below-Mun staging orbits are much more convenient. I put mine all the way down in LKO to save on tugs, but hey, you could put two, one high, one low. Not much of a reason to put it above, say, KEO (window every six hours), though, other than the cool L4/5 thing. Good luck and favorable Mun encounters with it when the time comes!

That's a good observation.  I'll need to give this plan some more thought I guess.

[Rune]

1 hour ago, CloudlessEchoes said:

I'm curious what you mean by "phasing out horizontal modules".

Well, just that I am starting to dislike the sight of those Sr. docking ports open, plus they are a hassle to move around and most often screw the potential for symmetry in my bases (symmetry is pretty!). I am in the process of building and testing new ore dumps and refinery modules, with more defined functions (the ore dump stores the fuel, the refinery mines it). Plus, I'm making them vertical cylinders like the other modules, with up-righting mechanisms of their own. The old fuel/monoprop storage module will likely be discontinued totally, since it makes more sense to store fuel as Ore IMO, and docking an Orca or two you can fulfill LFO requirements for bases very easily. Something for the next version of the base, I guess.

13 minutes ago, Raptor9 said:

That's a good observation.  I'll need to give this plan some more thought I guess.

Glad to have provoked some thought. Mind you, there are ways of making a Minmus orbit work for you, and you absolutely minimize the dV of the departure burn. For example, you could do the periapsis drop in two separate burns, with the first tweaked so you get to the second at the right time for ejection (dodging Mun if necessary, inclination changes will be a joke at that altitude). But below Munar altitude, you get quite literally 80% of the effect (you save ~800m/s instead of ~1000), with much less hassle.

 

Rune. In rocketry, cheap usually means a long time.

[CloudlessEchoes]

Ah I see, the Sr ports are also more difficult to get lined up for some reason. I'd work on my own bases more, but the lack of snapping in height on legs/ports is frustrating.

[Oddbin]

Just dropping in to say thanks for sharing your craft. Just got back into KSP and managed to find your Lacklustre. It is a great craft, looks great and the landing gear location is brilliant, and you weren't kidding about being on fumes when it got to orbit. 

Do you still only use mediafire or are you hosting on another site?

[Rune]

On 13/2/2016 at 11:49 PM, Oddbin said:

Just dropping in to say thanks for sharing your craft. Just got back into KSP and managed to find your Lacklustre. It is a great craft, looks great and the landing gear location is brilliant, and you weren't kidding about being on fumes when it got to orbit. 

Do you still only use mediafire or are you hosting on another site?

Thanks for the kind words!

The new stuff is going up in KerbalX, but yeah, until I update everything, and probably after that, everything that was in mediafire is still safe in mediafire. Links still work, too, if you know how to fix them (it's easy if you think about it, but if you don't know how, ask by PM), and do it at your own risk

On 11/2/2016 at 4:45 AM, CloudlessEchoes said:

Ah I see, the Sr ports are also more difficult to get lined up for some reason. I'd work on my own bases more, but the lack of snapping in height on legs/ports is frustrating.

Well, you can work out a simple measuring system of your own. Me, I have the leg/port relative position chosen, and I replicate it by putting a sample module next to the one I'm working on, and superimposing them with gizmos every now and then to check that everything is still where at the height it's supposed to be. Gizmos make keeping a constant measure about a gazillion times easier than it used to be!

In related news, a pic of WiP stuff, whre you can actually see where I'm at in the development of the next base pack. You can check out the new modules in it!

 

Rune. 1G unpackaging test: check.

Edited February 15, 2016 by Rune

[inigma]

Rune, the SpaceDock.info team (KerbalStuff replacement site) would like to commission you to draft a Rune perfected SpaceDock out of stock parts, pictured in orbit over a planet (Kerbin preferably, or Laythe), for use as our official logo, if you're interested.

[Rune]

1 hour ago, inigma said:

Rune, the SpaceDock.info team (KerbalStuff replacement site) would like to commission you to draft a Rune perfected SpaceDock out of stock parts, pictured in orbit over a planet (Kerbin preferably, or Laythe), for use as our official logo, if you're interested.

Got the PM, and I sent you a crapton of pics in response. If you want something more specific, feel free to ask!

 

Rune. So KerbalX is moving?

[inigma]

No KerbalX is not SpaceDock. SpaceDock is for mods to replace KerbalStuff that went down.

Thanks Rune for the pics. We're picking and choosing and will let you know.

[Rune]

4 minutes ago, inigma said:

No KerbalX is not SpaceDock. SpaceDock is for mods to replace KerbalStuff that went down.

Thanks Rune for the pics. We're picking and choosing and will let you know.

Oh, right, brainfarted a bit there. So many kerbal things... anyhow, best of luck with it!

 

Rune. That one I actually use every chance I get.

[XB-70A]

Rune, I got a small problem with your Mk VI Ring Station (excellent by the way). The Kickback and Thumper boosters start burning at the launch, pretty strange as there is no fuel in them, but the BACC won't stop at all, they keep burning all the time. What can explain this ?

[Rune]

2 hours ago, XB-70A said:

Rune, I got a small problem with your Mk VI Ring Station (excellent by the way). The Kickback and Thumper boosters start burning at the launch, pretty strange as there is no fuel in them, but the BACC won't stop at all, they keep burning all the time. What can explain this ?

Maybe you have infinite fuel on? Careful with that, nowadays I also thrust-limit them to zero when I use them as structural pieces, but I've had my share of explosions because I had the cheats on...

 

Rune. With great power comes great fumbling.

Edited February 22, 2016 by Rune

[XB-70A]

None at all. I add more fuel tanks and used the gravity hack at the first time, but never switch the infinite fuel on. Could there be a way to shut them down by editing the craft file ?

[Rune]

41 minutes ago, XB-70A said:

None at all. I add more fuel tanks and used the gravity hack at the first time, but never switch the infinite fuel on. Could there be a way to shut them down by editing the craft file ?

Well then you have me baffled. The fix I cold offer is to move the SRBs in the staging list to the top, and make sure to never fire, but this can certainly be filled under the "bug" category... The don't thrust, though, do they? Just the visual effects? Do you have any engine.changing mods, like realplumes?

 

Rune. Never happened to me!

[XB-70A]

 

It's a first to me too. I would have like to add Real Plume but the RSS point force me to not install it. And as you guess well they don't produce any thrust (and only the Thumpers do it), the flames are here but also the sound of burning.

Your suggestion seems to be the best, simply avoid to light them up.

 

Simple edit :

I also try the Mk IV station and a similar problem appears, the Mainsails keep on burning even after running out of fuel and oxidizer but without producing any thrust. Clearly a new game problem.

 

Thanks for your help.

Edited February 22, 2016 by XB-70A

[SingABrightSong]

So I decided to test how the Orca would perform in FAR, and I think "Slick" would be the best word for how it performs. It has a very smooth cross-sectional area curve(Yellow line), but was somewhat unstable in flight. SAS was sufficient to manage the instability, so I'm going to go with a positive view and call it maneuverable. It did not burn up in reentry, and despite going into a spin repeatedly the SAS Prograde Hold was able to quickly correct it, so again, maneuverable. I can't tell you how it lands, because despite being a spaceplane fan I kind of suck at piloting them, but the VTOL thrusters do seem like they could assist with a "flare" landing.

 

Whee, first post!

[Rune]

8 hours ago, SingABrightSong said:

So I decided to test how the Orca would perform in FAR, and I think "Slick" would be the best word for how it performs. It has a very smooth cross-sectional area curve(Yellow line), but was somewhat unstable in flight. SAS was sufficient to manage the instability, so I'm going to go with a positive view and call it maneuverable. It did not burn up in reentry, and despite going into a spin repeatedly the SAS Prograde Hold was able to quickly correct it, so again, maneuverable. I can't tell you how it lands, because despite being a spaceplane fan I kind of suck at piloting them, but the VTOL thrusters do seem like they could assist with a "flare" landing.

 

Whee, first post!

Well, thanks for the review! I can't say I'm too surprised (the thing is designed with RL principles, and it has an absurdly low cross-section, as you say), but I am pleasantly so! It's not somethign that I would have found out by myself. I hope you had a blast trying it out!

 

Rune. And yeah, it is built to be very maneuverable, especially with the RCS on.