How much math and science is needed to know how to play this game?

[Zerro]

Greetings,

Let's face it, a game like this is an engineer's or scientist's dream. But what about us more casual players who just want to have fun building various designs without having to over think things like TWR, Delta-V, etc?

That being said, I look at these various parts (ie: the engines) and I just feel dumbfounded because they have all these stats and I just don't know how to interpret them. So I'm just curious, if I want to be a regular casual gamer, with a decent amount of successful launches, then how much do I need to know about all these numbers, ratios, Delta-Vs, etc?

Thanks for the assistance

Zerro

Brian D.

[Diche Bach]

I am a social/behavioral scientist, but I know very little about engineering and physics. I'm a competent statistician but calculus is Greek to me.

Nonetheless, in ~90 hours of play and tutorial usage, I've managed to bumble my way through a good 25 or 30 successful orbital launches; half-dozen or more nearly perfect geo-synchronous orbits of Kerbin; a half dozen or more relatively successful gravity-assist maneuvers around Mun; a permanent orbiter around Mun; a temporary orbiter around Duna; most recently embarked on my first space station and that so far has been relatively successful.

So, I'd say that, with only a bit of physical science/math background it is possible by trial-and-error and building up intuition to get pretty far along. I would imagine that a reasonably bright 10 year could do at least as good as me if not better, even if they had never even had algebra or trig.

[Mygnol]

Scientific knowledge isn't really required unless you're those hardcore type who like to run around screaming "OPTIMIZE EVERYTHING!"

Most of the fun in this game is just watching stuff you made blow up, and building to get better and better.

As for how much you need to know about the numbers, you don't.

Slap a rocket onto a tank, see how far it flies, rinse and repeat. After a while, you'll start to notice how certain engines work better in certain conditions, which ones saved more fuel for your orbit, etc,etc.

And for all the trajectory planning? Again, unless you REALLY want to have an optimal flight path using the least dV,all you pretty much need to know is when to burn and when to stop. Here's where YouTube will help a LOT.

A little starter tip: Two nuclear engines strapped to a '32 Rockomax will get any decent shuttle to Jool, but only if already in orbit beforehand.

[dave4002000]

You can successfully launch rockets by just following basic guidelines. You can even go to and land on the Mun or Minmus without using anything other than the in-game map screen. If you want to go interplanetary, though, you're probably going to want to start to get into dV calulations and such. Otherwise, it's going to take a LOT of trial and error to see if you have enough.

You could also build aircraft and happily fly around Kerbin without knowing a single thing about dV, if that's what you're into.

The great thing about KSP is that it's a sandbox. It can be as simple, or as complicated, as you would like it to be.

[Cykyrios]

The basics you may need to know are "this engine is bigger, so it is moar powerful" (that one was easy), and Isp is similar to a car's L/100km or mi/gal (except it also take mass into account).

Basically, a higher Isp means your engine will eat less fuel.

I've done some calculations out of curiosity, but mainly fly my missions through trial&error (and/or nodes), which works well enough

[42undead2]

All I new when I started playing this game was ''Gravity pulls you down, stahp!'' and now I know a lot more, like how you orbit.

[Xeldrak]

Well, you basically need no science of math know how to play this game at all. I guess you should ne be averse to numbers or to complicated words. (In other words, you need to be nerdy )

Stuff like, we don't call the highest point of an orbit the highest point of an orbit, but apoapsis. Same thing for periapsis. Imposing sounding things like "Hohmann transfer orbit" are actually really simple maneuvres. And thrust-to-weight-ration (TWR) simply means how much power your rocket has and if it's smaller than 1 it doesn't even have enough power to lift itself.

That's basically it - if you are not scared of numbers or things that simply sound imposing - KSP is for you

Most of the knowledge simply comes over time if you look stuff up in forums or the wiki or on youtube...

[capi3101]

Depends on what you want to get out of it, I suppose. You want to go mucking about on other planets, the science helps. You want to blow up crap, the science is for dweebs......

[Xeldrak]

Ah, I forgot! Don't be afraid to experiment - it's THE most important thing in the game! If you are feeling dumbfounded by all these engines, just experiment. Build a rocket (i.e. a Capsule and a tank) and stick some engines on it, get a feel for it - some engines might suck you tank empty within seconds, some might last forever an not even get you rocket off the ground.

Forget the numbers and ratios (for now, they might interest you later) and just get a feeling of the parts....

[Mygnol]

Mucking around on other planets doesn't require that much science other than burning for 20 minutes. (what I do, because I suck at command nodes)

All you do is literally burn till you're not orbiting Kerbin but the Sun, then set a node to burn either backwards (if you're visiting the inner planets) or forwards (if you're going to Duna or the outer planets), spin that around till you get an encounter, hit random adjustment buttons, burn and finally burn backwards once more to get into your target's gravity well.

Aerobraking and the rest is when you're more experienced, don't worry about them.

As I said before, YouTube is your best friend for figuring these things out. There are many good tutorials out there that'll get you set up and throwing probes in no time.

[Hour Hero Yes]

Just don't think about it too much like science, math, OR homework! I think of Delta-V as "space cash" and certain maneuvers are more expensive than others. I know a TWR less than 2 won't get me off Kerbin very quickly. That's enough to get me into space, to the Mun and back. You could put 100 hours into the game just mucking around with orbiting and trying different ways to get to the Mun and back...interplanetary transfers are a strange new beast that I haven't had the courage to slay yet.

I also figure, I play a lot of RPG's that require me to learn new, strange terminology...lore, abilities, game systems--this is really the same thing! It's just a matter of getting past the initial shock of there being new things to learn, and proceeding to learn new things

[Anton P. Nym]

KSP lets you "cut and try" rocket designs at no cost, eliminating the need to do sophisticated mathematical analysis of designs before launch, and once you learn the non-mathematical Maneuver Node system orbital mechanics become understandable visually and eventually intuitively.

You really don't need math to play if you don't mind a lot of crashes when starting off.

-- Steve

[air805ronin]

Really, once they added the manuever node system to the game, the true need to do any mathematical calculations at all went away (except for possibly calculating the delta-v you need for a rocket to reach somewhere (and maybe come back, if you're nice)).

Now the only thing I reference is Olex's transfer window calculator to find out the angles between planets I need for a cheap transfer. Really though you can hit most planets if they're even remotely close to those angles if you play with the manuever nodes, it is just likely to cost more fuel for the transfer.

Before the nodes I used to have to do the math and then hold a protractor to the screen. If you don't install a mod that can tell you phase angles on the fly I would still be using a protractor.

But with a phase angle mod and manuever nodes, there is literally nowhere you cannot fly.

[Gus]

A knowledge and "feel for" Newton's 3 laws plus gravity, good mental maths skills, a logical mind and a good imagination are desired abilities to have for this game.

Being able to rotate objects in 3D in your head is also quite useful.

Edited August 1, 2013 by Gus

[Anizer]

For people who don't know any physics, this game will teach you the basics of classical mechanics. ie. inertia, newtons laws, and angular momentum.

[InteNs]

its simple really.

deltaV: if its runs out of fuel, add more fuel

TWR : if it doesnt lift up, add more engines

unstable: add more struts

have fun

i learned all this stuff along the way

[austin4050]

math is not needed to play this game, just guess, fail (or succeed), explode, rinse and repeat!

[capi3101]

Explode.

Explode again.

Explode yet again.

Explode some more.

Continue exploding until the explosions get boring.

Then change something. Watch that explode as well.....

KSP in a nutshell.

[Ralathon]

You don't need math to play the game. You need math to optimize it though.

When I feel like building a mun mission it is quite easy to guestimate how big your rocket'll have to be. No maths involved at all.

On the other hand, I play with RemoteTech and Figaro. They force unmanned probes to have LOS communications and allow you to set up a GPS network respectively. When setting up a sat constellation I do not eyeball it, I carefully calculate orbital periods and make sure all sats sharing an orbit are equidistant so they always provide good coverage.

So it really depends on how deep you want to go. You can quite easily play without ever needing a calculator. But if you have OCD and want to play like a minimalist you'll eventually need some.

[birrhan]

I'd argue that it's not "science" but it is scientific method. Accepting that there's a reason for the way the things work in the game, can you troubleshoot what will invariably go wrong? Even if you don't know it, you'll learn it. I dropped out of physics (often times it shows) but I still plug away at it, and I'm slowly learning. I mean, the percentage of people who are legitimate rocket scientists playing this game is very very small. So try not to be intimidated if you don't already know it.

[Tokay Gris]

So I'm just curious, if I want to be a regular casual gamer, with a decent amount of successful launches, then how much do I need to know about all these numbers, ratios, Delta-Vs, etc?

Really?

Nothing.

You build, you start, you explode.... You try again. That is all.

Trial and Error will get you into space within a day, I'd say.

And you learn as you go.

As for maths... all you need to know is that "200 KN" is more than "50 KN".

And that's it. Really.

You COULD use mods that tell you what the TWR is... but you can just patch something together and try it. Doesn't work? Use more struts and/or boosters. Or a different engine.

I LOVE this game!

[Skorpychan]

A solid grasp of the concepts is very helpful. You don't need to do much of the maths yourself, but a little helps.

You can probably get by with wikipedia articles as a base, and ignoring the complex equations. Trial and error is viable.

[air805ronin]

You don't need math to play the game. You need math to optimize it though.

Sorry my whole post was wrong. You don't really need math at all. You really can just keep trying things and get almost anywhere in the game.

[iamaphazael]

Like just about everything else in life, you don't need to know any math to do it, but the more math you know, the more it will make sense and the more fun you can have with it

[rpayne88]

NONE. If you have enough patience, you will be fine. Just expect to see multiple catastrophic failures and fire works displays.