[0.23] Squad Texture Reduction Pack - B9 and KW Packs also

[acealeam]

I really need more information to go on. What other mods are you using? Did Steam update you for any reason? Did you uninstall and re-install? Which OS are you using? What's your mother's maiden name and how come you haven't called her lately?

Lol, I recently downloaded the Lazor mod, but that hasn't seemed to impact it at all. No other changes IIRC

[PolecatEZ]

Lol, I recently downloaded the Lazor mod, but that hasn't seemed to impact it at all. No other changes IIRC

I suggest getting the very latest version, then before installing delete the entire Squad folder. Tell Steam to re-build it. Then install it again following the instructions. Let me know if it glitches out like that again. You're the first to report that issue in about 2000 downloads, so I don't know what other variables are in play.

[Jivaii]

JARFR would be epic to see someone bring it back up. I for one would love to use some of those tanks as kethane tanks. But I have little to no working knowledge on KSP modding.

[PolecatEZ]

I think I can do a config mashup using stock parts and open-license mod packs to get something that looks similar to the JARFR stuff. I'll pull it up in game right now and take a look. It seems like we're just wedging fuel tanks inside of trusses, which shouldn't be too difficult. The issue is the license, which is missing...and since we're playing by the rules this is the important thing. The default for "no license" is strict copyright (except for fair use, which dissemination of mods generally doesn't count unless its "educational"...yeah right). But, we are free to make similar stuff as the idea of stuffing a fuel tank into a truss isn't copyrighted.

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Looking into it so far, I can say that their folder structure is quite...err...creative.

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Ok, after playing with it...what exactly am I supposed to shrink when almost all of the textures are already 8x8 pixels?

I guess I'm just not seeing anything really compelling here, but I am getting some good ideas for cfg parts mash-ups.

Edited October 6, 2013 by PolecatEZ

[Jivaii]

I think I can do a config mashup using stock parts and open-license mod packs to get something that looks similar to the JARFR stuff. I'll pull it up in game right now and take a look. It seems like we're just wedging fuel tanks inside of trusses, which shouldn't be too difficult. The issue is the license, which is missing...and since we're playing by the rules this is the important thing. The default for "no license" is strict copyright (except for fair use, which dissemination of mods generally doesn't count unless its "educational"...yeah right). But, we are free to make similar stuff as the idea of stuffing a fuel tank into a truss isn't copyrighted.

============

Looking into it so far, I can say that their folder structure is quite...err...creative.

============

Ok, after playing with it...what exactly am I supposed to shrink when almost all of the textures are already 8x8 pixels?

I guess I'm just not seeing anything really compelling here, but I am getting some good ideas for cfg parts mash-ups.

I tried to get a kethane set of tanks, but when I redid the textures and everything, I got a model that was about 8 times larger then it was supposed to be. I gave up after that.

[Trann]

So how do I do this with your script? Can you PM me?

"This" being remove files without worrying about warnings? If so, it's a simple tweak: in the lines where 'del' is being changed to 'rm', you would make it 'rm -f', like so...

-e 's/^del/rm/' \

becomes

-e 's/^del/rm -f/' \

[Trann]

Heh. I might have to hunt down a few to put back: my nozzles are flickering...

[PolecatEZ]

Heh. I might have to hunt down a few to put back: my nozzles are flickering...

Which pack is that, I don't recognize that model...from KW?

[Trann]

Not a pack. That's the stock two-stage lander atop a simple capsule/jumbo tank.

After running the debloat script, things are rendered much simpler (still trying it all out since debloating).

EDIT: I should add, this is without the texture reduction pack; I'm just tinkering.

Edited October 6, 2013 by Trann

[PolecatEZ]

Not a pack. That's the stock two-stage lander atop a simple capsule/jumbo tank.

After running the debloat script, things are rendered much simpler (still trying it all out since debloating).

EDIT: I should add, this is without the texture reduction pack; I'm just tinkering.

Ahhh, ok, so that was a kitbash and not a bug with the texture pack.

Yep, multi-engine kit bashes are always tricky because of the shroud issue. I'm going to try running another thread if I can ever gather all my fellow config warriors in one place. With engines though, many older parts packs have permissive licenses and include engines without shrouds. There's a very limited few Squad engines that don't have them also, but mostly the odd-shaped ones like the aerospike and a few others.

I like it though, it looks like you're cruising around with a cartoon trombone orchestra...very stylishly kerbal. You need a sound effect with a "woomp woomp woomp" that goes in sync with the phase in/out.

[Pliuple]

All packs are MAG-NI-FI-CENT !!! Works like charm, the game is much smoother, recommend to all.

P.S Any plans for Firespiter Reduction ?

[Galane]

Mods I have installed. MechJeb, ReStock, Stretchy Tanks, Procedural Fairings (and base decoupler), Editor Extensions, a few parts from KSPX, both onmi docking ports** (CFGs in the UbioZur Welding thread), Quantum Struts and Kethane.

After adding Quantum Struts*, Editor Extensions, the PF base decoupler* mod, and Kethane - KSP has become very crashy for me. (Need to up this XP box to 4gig RAM!) Hopefully trimming down the stock textures will help that.

Kethane has some massive textures that could be cut down some. 101 megabytes of .mbm files. That's likely what put it over the edge into crash in 15 minutes or less territory.

Procedural Fairings has few textures but a couple of them are pretty large.

*Have plans for them but haven't used yet.

**Ever wished for a universal docking port? Nest the Clampotron Jr inside the Clampotron for 2-in-1, then nest that combo inside the Clampotron Sr for a "turducken" style 3-in-1 port so any port in the stormy sea of space can dock to it.

[PolecatEZ]

Mods I have installed. MechJeb, ReStock, Stretchy Tanks, Procedural Fairings (and base decoupler), Editor Extensions, a few parts from KSPX, both onmi docking ports** (CFGs in the UbioZur Welding thread), Quantum Struts and Kethane.

After adding Quantum Struts*, Editor Extensions, the PF base decoupler* mod, and Kethane - KSP has become very crashy for me. (Need to up this XP box to 4gig RAM!) Hopefully trimming down the stock textures will help that.

Kethane has some massive textures that could be cut down some. 101 megabytes of .mbm files. That's likely what put it over the edge into crash in 15 minutes or less territory.

Procedural Fairings has few textures but a couple of them are pretty large.

*Have plans for them but haven't used yet.

**Ever wished for a universal docking port? Nest the Clampotron Jr inside the Clampotron for 2-in-1, then nest that combo inside the Clampotron Sr for a "turducken" style 3-in-1 port so any port in the stormy sea of space can dock to it.

The Kethane creator really likes his closed licenses, so he's on his own to make a low-rez pack if he wants. Looking at it though, the textures are absurdly large for the model quality. That does bring up an interesting question though, is it license violation if one were to make wholly new textures to patch over an existing mod? I've already seen that you can patch over configs without violation, so long as you use a line editor patch program. However, I've already had a yellow card pulled, so unfortunately it won't be me to push that particular boundary.

The rest of those mods you have installed, however, shouldn't be nearly pushing your limits unless you physically have less than 4mb of RAM. Maybe its a wonky mod .dll that's lagging or crashing you out. Most of those on your list are stable for me, but I haven't yet worked with editor extensions, so can't vouch for that one. PF can lag you out in funny ways, but only under certain circumstances I can't reproduce reliably.

As was said before, Firespitter is being looked at. There's a lot of cool stuff that can be done with FS, so I'm not prepared to do a straight shrinking yet. The FS plugin actually allows you to swtich out regions of your textures on all your parts - dynamically in game, so long as the config lines support it.

Edited October 6, 2013 by PolecatEZ

[Papa_Joe]

The Kethane creator really likes his closed licenses, so he's on his own to make a low-rez pack if he wants. Looking at it though, the textures are absurdly large for the model quality. That does bring up an interesting question though, is it license violation if one were to make wholly new textures to patch over an existing mod? I've already seen that you can patch over configs without violation, so long as you use a line editor patch program. However, I've already had a yellow card pulled, so unfortunately it won't be me to push that particular boundary.

The rest of those mods you have installed, however, shouldn't be nearly pushing your limits unless you physically have less than 4mb of RAM. Maybe its a wonky mod .dll that's lagging or crashing you out. Most of those on your list are stable for me, but I haven't yet worked with editor extensions, so can't vouch for that one. PF can lag you out in funny ways, but only under certain circumstances I can't reproduce reliably.

As was said before, Firespitter is being looked at. There's a lot of cool stuff that can be done with FS, so I'm not prepared to do a straight shrinking yet. The FS plugin actually allows you to swtich out regions of your textures on all your parts - dynamically in game, so long as the config lines support it.

Really, a yellow card? I've been following this thread, so I know you have been very "aware" of licensing. I've seen your efforts to be compliant, so I'm sure that saddens you. My sympathies.

Thanks so much for this mod. I've seen good reductions in memory use, and improvements in frame rate with my large 1000+ part space stations and docking maneuvers with 200+ part vessels. I was getting maybe 1-2 frames per second. Now more like 5-6.

[Ratata]

there should be a medal for what you do! thank you again kw and b9 is what i use most, i really hope you get to do kethane, that thing is big for the number of parts it actually has....

[PolecatEZ]

I would prefer not to deal with the Kethane creator myself due to philosophical differences, but you may ask him.

...We don't have a problem with mod licenses right now. What we have is a regular crop of threads with entitled users demanding mod updates....

Full context here.

Bottom line, his toys, his license, his job to debloat it if he feels it needs it. I love you all, but I can't do Kethane for you, sorry.

[Sapphire]

Aww, that's a shame. I still don't know how Kethane's parts folder is larger than all of B9...

[PolecatEZ]

Aww, that's a shame. I still don't know how Kethane's parts folder is larger than all of B9...

That's 3 different factors -

1 - B9 parts are in .png format, which are compressed on your hard drive but have little or no savings on your RAM load. These textures are re-inflated to a size commensurate with their textures squared. For example, a 1024x1024 230kb .png and a 1024x1024 4mb .mbm are seen as the same size by the KSP program when playing, both will use 4MB of RAM (give or take depending on other factors). The size you see in the folder on your hard drive may or may not have any bearing on how many resources the mod takes. Generally it doesn't.

2 - Kethane, like many mods and models, uses freshly Unity dumped ,mbm files. This is ok in some cases, but Unity really likes to make mountains out of mole-hills in most cases. Normal maps often don't need to be near the resolution of the texture they're enhancing, but they use the exact same amount of resources as a 1024x1024 texture like in the example above. With very flat colors on the textures (monocolor schemes, for example), this level of detail can be dumped easily in favor of performance for those that desire it.

Dropping just one level down, say 1024 to 512, often doesn't have any impact on visuals, but it cuts RAM usage by 75%. Another 5% can be saved by removing unnecessary channels if they can be pared without killing the texture entirely.

3 - The B9 creator also went to great pains to consolidate his parts using the MODEL command set, which means that sometimes 3 or 4 parts share the exact same textures, basically giving you "free parts" in some cases, and certainly impacting your hard drive space.

Edited October 6, 2013 by PolecatEZ

[Majiir]

That does bring up an interesting question though, is it license violation if one were to make wholly new textures to patch over an existing mod?

That is an interesting question. I don't think it would violate the license of the textures as long as you're not blatantly copying the visual appearance. However, it might violate the license of the 3D model, since the texture is by necessity a derivative of the model and its UV coordinates. There might be an extraordinarily clever way around that (automatic inference of UV maps?) but I don't know of any.

The Kethane creator really likes his closed licenses, so he's on his own to make a low-rez pack if he wants.

...

I would prefer not to deal with the Kethane creator myself due to philosophical differences, but you may ask him.

...

Bottom line, his toys, his license, his job to debloat it if he feels it needs it. I love you all, but I can't do Kethane for you, sorry.

Oh, don't be such a drama queen. If you love your users:

I grant PolecatEZ permission to distribute a texture reduction pack containing derivatives of Kethane part textures. The pack may reduce the visual fidelity of parts but may not otherwise change their appearance. The pack may be released under no-derivatives terms.

[Teradyne]

That's really cool of you Majiir. I'm sure many people in this thread will appreciate it.

[PolecatEZ]

Oh, don't be such a drama queen. If you love your users:

I grant PolecatEZ permission to distribute a texture reduction pack containing derivatives of Kethane part textures. The pack may reduce the visual fidelity of parts but may not otherwise change their appearance. The pack may be released under no-derivatives terms.

Whatever it it takes dude...though I don't think I have the Oscar around here in the bag quite yet, lots of competition.

Kethane it is for the next pack, how could I say no to such sweepingly generous offer?

Edited October 6, 2013 by PolecatEZ

[acealeam]

Oh my, so sorry for not giving an update any sooner. After I restarted my computer it started working as intended (ie 40 seconds instead of the 10 min I got previously.)

[Sudragon]

Would it be possible to have an alternate download? I've tried 4 times to get it from spaceport winding up with less than 10 meg each time.

[Galane]

The Squad reduced texture pack makes KSP playable again, even with the mods I have. Just got done with a few hours session, ended in a crash but that's typical. get the Kethane pack textures cut down in size and it'll be better.

[Ratata]

Thank you Majiir!!!!