[1.02] BioMass - Renewable Bio Fuel and Supplemental Life Support Modules

[seanth]

Is the BioMass Biology+ (GetHub) version stable and functional in career mode now? Last time I looked into it, it was recommended not to use that version in career which is the reason I've stuck with the other version for now.

In limited testing, BioMass+ is career mode ready, but an additional set of eyes on it would be helpful

[Chris_W]

The big pancakes are having some trouble when you mouse over them in VAB. Interstellar also uses the model and it has the same issue. The part expands until it fills the screen and disappears.

This is a known KSP bug, has to do with resources and modules not being handled correctly and breaking the info popup.

I'm on it, might be a short while tho.

Other mods are experiencing the same thing.

[JeffreyCor]

In limited testing, BioMass+ is career mode ready, but an additional set of eyes on it would be helpful

I get the hint. Quick thing I noticed right off is the compressors and supply tanks don't have tech tree entries. Are those items in more limited testing or is it just an oversight (aka no prob sticking it in myself)

[seanth]

I get the hint. Quick thing I noticed right off is the compressors and supply tanks don't have tech tree entries. Are those items in more limited testing or is it just an oversight (aka no prob sticking it in myself)

I assumed that the Kerbals would have the tech to compress gasses and store them prior to starting a space program, especially since oxygen gas compresses to make oxidizer. Their lack of an explicit techTree entry is 100% an oversight on my part due to that starting assumption.

Edited December 19, 2013 by seanth

[Roboto]

Thanks everyone! sorry I've been missing the last couple days, have a few things going at once. I'll be addressing as many issues I can today, and then I have the next 2 weeks off from the day job, so I should be around a lot during that time.. Woot!

[Roboto]

seanth:

I found not only the resources to be off, but also the experiments stopped working.

Fixed Spaceport version

Changes:

1 annoying typo in the small experiment fixed ("perfrom experiment")

Both experiments are collectable on EVA and repeatable again

Biomass base greenhouse inflatable.. thingy lacked tree integration - done

Resources made the same TAC LS uses (had different densities)

O-RadialLong lacked Techtree integration - done

The bug with the hubs is about to be shot down, it's a glitch on resources without modules. Modulemanager will tackle that.

Sit back and enjoy.

Just updated the spaceport with your corrections. Thanks!

[JeffreyCor]

I assumed that the Kerbals would have the tech to compress gasses and store them prior to starting a space program, especially since oxygen gas compresses to make oxidizer. Their lack of an explicit techTree entry is 100% an oversight on my part due to that starting assumption.

All part of the process adding TechRequired = start to each to reflect this intent.

[Roboto]

All part of the process adding TechRequired = start to each to reflect this intent.

I'm about to go and update gitHub with any missing tech tree configs.

[JeffreyCor]

I'm about to go and update gitHub with any missing tech tree configs.

I think I'll wait till your update is up, as my attempt to add them resulted in the game hanging when loading the tanks now Worked fine before I tried to "fix" it so no doubt it's my fault.

[Roboto]

I think I'll wait till your update is up, as my attempt to add them resulted in the game hanging when loading the tanks now Worked fine before I tried to "fix" it so no doubt it's my fault.

GitHub should be ready to go!

Pretty sure the parts need both TechRequired & entryCost. If you only added the TechRequired, that might be why it caused you trouble.

[Roboto]

Heads Up!

I think from here on out we should keep ongoing discussions in this new thread BioMass Ongoing Development. That way we can keep from bumping this one constantly.

http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/62631-BioMass-Ongoing-Development?p=854809#post854809

We will continue to use this original thread to notify about new releases, and you guys can feel free to use it to post images or tutorials if you want.

Thanks!

[therealcrow999]

From the Biomass+ download, which one do I use? Do I use the one in Gamedata folder or the BioMass+Science.zip thats in the zip?

[seanth]

The zip should be exactly the same as what is in the Gamedata folder...but now that I think about it, I think the zip is slightly behind. Use what's in the Gamedata folder

[seanth]

From the Biomass+ download, which one do I use? Do I use the one in Gamedata folder or the BioMass+Science.zip thats in the zip?

You can do either. The zip file and the contents of the Gamedata folder are the same.

[Mystique]

Is there an idea why compressor is making monopropellant fine, while doesn't make xenon? Efficiency shown is 0 =\ Can it be related to using modded xenon tanks?

Update: it works on time compression. All the resources are in great abundance so it can't be a deficit of something.

Edited December 24, 2013 by Mystique

[seanth]

Is there an idea why compressor is making monopropellant fine, while doesn't make xenon? Efficiency shown is 0 =\ Can it be related to using modded xenon tanks?

Update: it works on time compression. All the resources are in great abundance so it can't be a deficit of something.

I assume you are using the github science+ atmospheric extractor?

It's odd that the monopropellant should be working fine but xenon is not. We assume Xenon is 9.5x more common in Kerbin's atmosphere than hydrogen (which is compressed to monopropellant). Can you attach a screenshot?

The following can act as a rough estimate of how rapidly gasses(and water) can be recovered. The percentages translate into rates of recovery 1:1:

78.08% Nitrogen

20.95% Oxygen

0.035% Carbon Dioxide

0.0001745% Kethane

0.000524% Xenon

0.000055% Hydrogen

~1.0% other gasses

1% water

EDIT: I'm posting this on the other, newer thread as well

Edited December 24, 2013 by seanth

[Mystique]

No-no-no, not that complicated, I'm just using "BioMass – Renewable Bio-Fuel Modules", so compressor should just use excess oxidizer from BioReactor

[seanth]

No-no-no, not that complicated, I'm just using "BioMass – Renewable Bio-Fuel Modules", so compressor should just use excess oxidizer from BioReactor

Can't help then. Sorry.

[Patupi]

Are there maps for the atmosphere of other worlds yet? Mostly CO2 for Duna etc? Being able to extract something from the atmosphere then process it into lifesuport materials would be handy on other planets.

[seanth]

Being able to extract something from the atmosphere then process it into lifesuport materials would be handy on other planets.

Oh, I totally agree. Right now there isn't a good way to define gasses on a pre-planet basis. We're working on it, though.

[Patupi]

Hmm, well there aren't that many worlds with atmospheres yet in the game. Wouldn't it be just a matter of setting up a few templates that people can agree on? I mean Duna, Eve and Laythe. That's it right? If we use Mars as a rough Duna analogue, Venus as a rough Eve analogue (plus I believe there has been talk on the forums specifically on the composition of Eve's atmosphere before), and use a cross between Titan and Earth for Laythe (again, I think there's been talk somewhere online about that 'air') we should have it.

You can certainly tell what planet you're on and define a variable list/chart or something in system to be able to break air into different constituents based on location, can't you? Maybe I just don't know enough of the difficulties of the program deals with these things. Sorry if I'm over simplifying things here.

[seanth]

You can certainly tell what planet you're on and define a variable list/chart or something in system to be able to break air into different constituents based on location, can't you? Maybe I just don't know enough of the difficulties of the program deals with these things. Sorry if I'm over simplifying things here.

I completely agree with your approach. One could easily achieve this by having an atmospheric extractor for each planet. If the plugins (dlls) for mods could be written in python OR if cfg files could have simple embedded code in them to see what planet the active craft is on, I could very easily do exactly what you propose above.

So, you didn't over simplify things at all. The difficulty is in how parts, plugins and the game interact.

Along those lines, if someone is looking for a dll project, I have some clear ideas on dll modules I'd love to see if anyone is interested

[Patupi]

I wouldn't have thought a different part would be needed for each planet, just a different list for the same part. Still, same problems in programming it. I could see limiting a pump to not work with Eve's toxic air unless it was specially built, but for game purposes I think one air distiller would be better for all environments. Cuts back on parts spamming on the VAB components list.

As I've said before I don't know about c# programming in specific, but I could try to put other things together. Peruse the various forum threads on KSP planet atmospheres and compare with similar actual environments to see what each planet should be, then see what people thing here of the results?

[seanth]

I wouldn't have thought a different part would be needed for each planet, just a different list for the same part.<snip>Cuts back on parts spamming on the VAB components list.

Yeah. I definitely don't want to have a part for each planet. I _think_ the interstellar mod allows for planets with unique atmospheres, but the code to do so is rolled in with all the rest of the mod's code. I'd love it if such things were offered on their own vs bundled, or at least bundled into a mod that focuses on similar things. For example, if the Kethane mod allowed for "mining" of gasses, that would make sense to me since Kethane is already about recovering resources.

[Patupi]

Well, I haven't looked at the cfgs for Kethane, but from what I know it's fairly a expandable system. Multiple inputs, multiple outputs on converters. Multiple resources at any location on a planet. One problem would be that it only covers hex locations. I don't think it allows for 'all water' or any other surface terrain to have a material. Admittedly I haven't been solidly checking up on the Kethane development thread solidly recently, but I have up till maybe a month ago. It's certainly possible to say material is minable anywhere on a surface. Plus I'm 99% sure you can also do a simple second check to see if the craft is 'in water' before mining so thus can only mine water based material when dunked. Similarly this should work, for example, when in a certain biome. Mechjeb can determine fairly easily which biome you are in so you can certainly make the check easily enough. Have this super imposed on a conventional kethane based map and you have a fairly complex system that should allow mulitple resources.

It might be tricky to get atmospherics via this method though. I think for that you should just simply use a look up table for each planet. From what I know of coding it shouldn't be that hard. From what I've seen in KSP cfgs setting up such maps could easily be done in a cfg itself so it would be customizable. Getting a custom DLL to read such maps will be the hard part, and like I said I don't have direct experience in C# coding or anything specific to Unity or KSP. I really should knuckle down and learn it *sigh*

Anyway, I don't think it's an insurmountable problem at least, and I think there are ways around most of the problems connected with this mod that are already available via mods or parts of mods that are already out there.