[1.1.2] Station Science (v2.0: New models by SpeedyB)

[chucksterock]

If you're running that few mods, just run 32-bit version. 64-bit KSP is buggy and unstable. I've given up on trying to debug reported 64-bit issues.

The only upside to 64-bit is it lets you use more memory (primarily for textures). Unless you have a ton of part mods, that isn't going to be an issue.

Can I move my game save from 64 to 32? I don't want to start over just yet, at least until I'm ready to add mods that make it harder and more realistic.

[ethernet]

Can I move my game save from 64 to 32? I don't want to start over just yet, at least until I'm ready to add mods that make it harder and more realistic.

Saves are fully compatible across 64 and 32 bit. Just run the 32-bit version instead. If you're not using Steam (which downloads both versions), you'll just have to copy your save directory from the Saves directory of your KSP install to the new 32-bit install.

[chucksterock]

Saves are fully compatible across 64 and 32 bit. Just run the 32-bit version instead. If you're not using Steam (which downloads both versions), you'll just have to copy your save directory from the Saves directory of your KSP install to the new 32-bit install.

Thanks for the help! I'm up and running with all the Space Station mods in 32 bit with my old save. Now to start building it.

[Mister Spock]

This mod looks great. Is it feasible to run it along with the Orbital Kolonization System, Modular Kolonization System, Karbonite, and KSP Interstellar? Or are OKS and Station Science best experienced separately?

[ethernet]

This mod looks great. Is it feasible to run it along with the Orbital Kolonization System, Modular Kolonization System, Karbonite, and KSP Interstellar? Or are OKS and Station Science best experienced separately?

Haven't tested with other mods specifically, but I don't see why not. They generally do different things. However, in particular, I believe Station Science is a better approach to "trickle" science than Interstellar's Science Lab.

[CMagnuson]

Hi there,

I have been trying to get Station Science to work for some time but have been unable to so far. I can successfully load the plugin when KSP starts, I can build rockets using the Station Science parts, I can dock all of the Station Science parts together into a space station, but that's where my success ends. Once I've docked everything together into a station, no kuarqs are generated, no eurekas are generated, and no science is generated. It's like the parts have no function.

I've recorded a quick 2 minute screenshot demonstrating the situation I've encountered. I'd appreciate it if you could take a look at the screencast and let me know what I'm doing incorrectly: http://youtu.be/z3423q4jpn4

Thank you in advance for your help!

-Charles Magnuson

[Mister Spock]

Haven't tested with other mods specifically, but I don't see why not. They generally do different things. However, in particular, I believe Station Science is a better approach to "trickle" science than Interstellar's Science Lab.

Thanks for your reply. I'll give it a try!

[Fyrem]

Hi there,

I have been trying to get Station Science to work for some time but have been unable to so far. I can successfully load the plugin when KSP starts, I can build rockets using the Station Science parts, I can dock all of the Station Science parts together into a space station, but that's where my success ends. Once I've docked everything together into a station, no kuarqs are generated, no eurekas are generated, and no science is generated. It's like the parts have no function.

I've recorded a quick 2 minute screenshot demonstrating the situation I've encountered. I'd appreciate it if you could take a look at the screencast and let me know what I'm doing incorrectly: http://youtu.be/z3423q4jpn4

Thank you in advance for your help!

-Charles Magnuson

Cmagnuson, WELL DONE on the vid.. that will help

Just to double check everything:

click on THNKR space Lab insure that it currently says State: operational, eurekas : does it say "No experiments" or "paused"

click on Zooology Bay, insure that it currently says State: operational, That it HAS some Kibble, is Science: Hibernating or something else?

Let us pick the simplest Experiment.

click Start Experiment on the "PLANT GROWTH" one.

now, Fast forward a few hours.

did you get any eurekas?

no? hmmm.

ok, llets doublecheck file structure.

first, insure you have the MOST RECEENT version, infact, just delete what ever you have now, and redownload.

delete GameData\StationScience and recopy it from a FRESH download

you should have

GameData\StationScience\parts (the parts)

GameData\StationScience\plugins ( 1 dll)

GameData\StationScience\resources (5 files)

restart KSP, and take another look at your station.

anything new?

try to restart PLANT GROWTH. Fast Forward an hour. any eurikas?

oh, and what other mods do you have?

[ethernet]

Hi there,

I have been trying to get Station Science to work for some time but have been unable to so far. I can successfully load the plugin when KSP starts, I can build rockets using the Station Science parts, I can dock all of the Station Science parts together into a space station, but that's where my success ends. Once I've docked everything together into a station, no kuarqs are generated, no eurekas are generated, and no science is generated. It's like the parts have no function.

I've recorded a quick 2 minute screenshot demonstrating the situation I've encountered. I'd appreciate it if you could take a look at the screencast and let me know what I'm doing incorrectly: http://youtu.be/z3423q4jpn4

Thank you in advance for your help!

-Charles Magnuson

Thanks for putting so much effort into this report!

First thing: are you running latest KSP (v. 0.24.2), and Station Science (v. 1.1)? If you aren't (either one is too old), you'd get exactly the behavior you're seeing. KSP v. 0.24.1 broke Station Science, and the change I needed to make broke compatibility with any earlier versions.

If that's not the issue, please send me your KSP.log (after observing the problem), and your persistence.sfs file.

Edited August 10, 2014 by ethernet

[h0yer]

Hi!

Cool mod so far, but i have issues to report:

When I accept a contract (plant experiment in kerbins orbit for example) everything works fine (launch new pod, check; start new plant experiment, check; finalize results), until I get to jettison the pods, carrying the data back to kerbin. When I switch the vessels, the contract's points get resetted, as if i didn't launch or perform the experiment, so all pods reenter nicely, but won't finish the contracts.

When saving/loading a game, the options of starting/restarting an experiment disappear.

Using Win7x64 on an AMD955 with 16G RAM and a GTX560

Edited August 10, 2014 by h0yer

[munseeker]

...Station Science mod includes real life experiments. One of them is called Capillary Flow Experiments which I've worked on since 2003. The test geometry is from the principal investigator at Portland State University but the designs are mine. Here's a link to the addon:

http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/81578-0-23-5-Orbital-Material-Science-Version

Cool! Thanks for sharing!

[Geschosskopf]

My thinking was you'd send up multiple experiments over time, on multiple contracts as they come up again, to eventually recoup the cost of the initial investment. I.e., a reason to make trips up and down to/from the station.

Sorry for not getting back to this sooner but I've been severely busy.

Anyway, back to the payoff for doing Station Science. You can't even break even on it because the payments are way too low compared to the cost of setting up and doing them. First, you have to launch the 15-ton lab. Just getting that into LKO, even using the cheap 1.25m rockets and SRBs (which ain't easy to do, BTW) is going to cost you about $90-100K. But you can't do anything but Plant Growth with just the lab; you need the massive cyclotrons to do anything else. The cyclotrons cost about the same to launch as the lab. So just getting set up to do several types of experiments is going to cost in the neighborhood of $200-300K. This is money you'll never see again, because the contract payments don't even cover the cost of launching the experiment pods. Contracts at Kerbin only pay $3-5K, regardless of the type of experiment. But it's going to cost you ~$20-30K to fly several pods up and back. So you'll be losing $10-15K at least per experiment launch, on top of the sunk cost of building the station itself. And for all this expenditure, you don't get but 50-100 science for doing an experiment, even with the contract bonus thrown in. You can get way more science for way less money by sending stock Goo and Material pods to a Mun biome. IOW, Station Science isn't even close to being competitive with stock contracts on either money or science, which is a big deterrent to using this mod in a career, even though that's what it was designed for.

The above is at Kerbin but really it's not much better at Mun. Experiments at Mun pay $10-15K, which is still less than what it costs to carry them out there. And of course getting the heavy station modules out there costs rather more than just getting them into LKO. The science rewards are better, but again you can still get more science for less money doing stock stuff. I submit that as the Station Science contracts stand at present, it's just not economically viable. I do it anyway because it's cool, but I have to do a LOT of crazy but lucrative part tests to be able to afford Station Science, and Station Science is not my primary means of gathering science, nor even an important auxiliary method. This is why I think there should be well-paying contracts to launch the station modules. I wouldn't mind losing money on the experiments so much if launching the station wasn't such a huge sunk cost.

For example, here's a video I made of my 1st-ever attempt to do Station Science, as soon as it became available. Not yet having anywhere near the solar panels needed to run a cyclotron, all I could do was plant growth. Because of this, there was no real point in keeping the station up there, especially as adding modules in the future with just the Station Science "docking port" wouldn't have worked too well. Also, I lacked a big capsule so couldn't get the Kerbals back down again without spending a lot of money to get them 1 at a time. And I could barely afford to launch just the lab, so all things considered, I brought it back down again after the experiment, in hopes of recovering some of its cost that way. That was the only way I could afford to do this.

http://youtu.be/xMzUy6EgK7M

[ethernet]

Hi!

Cool mod so far, but i have issues to report:

When I accept a contract (plant experiment in kerbins orbit for example) everything works fine (launch new pod, check; start new plant experiment, check; finalize results), until I get to jettison the pods, carrying the data back to kerbin. When I switch the vessels, the contract's points get resetted, as if i didn't launch or perform the experiment, so all pods reenter nicely, but won't finish the contracts.

When saving/loading a game, the options of starting/restarting an experiment disappear.

Using Win7x64 on an AMD955 with 16G RAM and a GTX560

I haven't been able to reproduce this. Are you certain the Plant Growth pod you did the experiment with, and undocked, is the one you launched after taking the contract. If so, if you could try again, and quicksave before you do the separation, and send me that quicksave, that would help. Also please send me the KSP.log file as it is after the separation.

Anyway, back to the payoff for doing Station Science.

I agree with your assessment. Thanks. I'll release a new version soon that will have dramatically higher payment for the first time you do a contract for a given experiment at a given location, then a lesser payment for repeats.

For example, here's a video I made of my 1st-ever attempt to do Station Science, as soon as it became available. Not yet having anywhere near the solar panels needed to run a cyclotron, all I could do was plant growth. Because of this, there was no real point in keeping the station up there, especially as adding modules in the future with just the Station Science "docking port" wouldn't have worked too well. Also, I lacked a big capsule so couldn't get the Kerbals back down again without spending a lot of money to get them 1 at a time. And I could barely afford to launch just the lab, so all things considered, I brought it back down again after the experiment, in hopes of recovering some of its cost that way. That was the only way I could afford to do this.

http://youtu.be/xMzUy6EgK7M

Great video. That's exactly the kind of effort I'd want to reward significantly.

What do you mean that adding modules in the future wouldn't have worked well? The whole reason I have the Attach-O-Tron is to try to make sure you can start building stations with it as soon as possible. I understand wanting to bring it back for recovery, though.

[Geschosskopf]

I agree with your assessment. Thanks. I'll release a new version soon that will have dramatically higher payment for the first time you do a contract for a given experiment at a given location, then a lesser payment for repeats.

Good idea but be sure to make it Kerbal-proof. Suppose for example the player declines the initial contract or lets it expire before accepting it. If that was the only time the big money was available, he'd be screwed. That's kinda why I was thinking it might be better to have separate contracts just for putting the big station parts up there. No science rewards, just lots of money to help pay for the launch, and maybe some rep for what is, depending on tech level, a reasonably difficult feat. Then you could leave the experiment contracts alone (or maybe up their rewards a bit).

What do you mean that adding modules in the future wouldn't have worked well? The whole reason I have the Attach-O-Tron is to try to make sure you can start building stations with it as soon as possible. I understand wanting to bring it back for recovery, though.

The Attach-O-Tron is 0.625m diameter. The lab is 2.5m on the ends and closer to 3m in the middle. Stacking a 2.5m part, especially one weighing 15 tons plus whatever else you stick on, on top of a 0.625m connector means your rocket will wobble badly, maybe break, during launch. Might be more of a problem for folks using FAR/NEAR/DRE though, but it gave me fits. The biggie for me, however, was the inability to move resources through the connection, which is a serious impediment if you're using a life support mod. Because you can't transfer resources through the connection, you can't simply restock the station when you send up an experiment. Instead, you have to keep adding more life support tanks as permanent attachments, which eventually causes other problems. That more than anything else (although other factors did play a part) is what decided me not to leave the station up there.

[ethernet]

Good idea but be sure to make it Kerbal-proof. Suppose for example the player declines the initial contract or lets it expire before accepting it. If that was the only time the big money was available, he'd be screwed. That's kinda why I was thinking it might be better to have separate contracts just for putting the big station parts up there. No science rewards, just lots of money to help pay for the launch, and maybe some rep for what is, depending on tech level, a reasonably difficult feat. Then you could leave the experiment contracts alone (or maybe up their rewards a bit).

My plan is to look for completed, awarded contracts. If none exist, big reward. If not, smaller reward.

The Attach-O-Tron is 0.625m diameter. The lab is 2.5m on the ends and closer to 3m in the middle. Stacking a 2.5m part, especially one weighing 15 tons plus whatever else you stick on, on top of a 0.625m connector means your rocket will wobble badly, maybe break, during launch. Might be more of a problem for folks using FAR/NEAR/DRE though, but it gave me fits. The biggie for me, however, was the inability to move resources through the connection, which is a serious impediment if you're using a life support mod. Because you can't transfer resources through the connection, you can't simply restock the station when you send up an experiment. Instead, you have to keep adding more life support tanks as permanent attachments, which eventually causes other problems. That more than anything else (although other factors did play a part) is what decided me not to leave the station up there.

It's 1.25m, not 0.625m. But I'm not sure why the diameter matters that much. During launch, you can just use struts (in the same node as the Attach-O-Tron), assuming it's load-bearing, and once its in orbit, it doesn't matter at all.

TAC resources makes more sense. Hadn't considered that interaction. I might make the limitation explicitly for fuel and oxidizer.

[saqueeb]

Cmagnuson, WELL DONE on the vid.. that will help

Just to double check everything:

click on THNKR space Lab insure that it currently says State: operational, eurekas : does it say "No experiments" or "paused"

click on Zooology Bay, insure that it currently says State: operational, That it HAS some Kibble, is Science: Hibernating or something else?

Let us pick the simplest Experiment.

click Start Experiment on the "PLANT GROWTH" one.

now, Fast forward a few hours.

did you get any eurekas?

no? hmmm.

ok, llets doublecheck file structure.

first, insure you have the MOST RECEENT version, infact, just delete what ever you have now, and redownload.

delete GameData\StationScience and recopy it from a FRESH download

you should have

GameData\StationScience\parts (the parts)

GameData\StationScience\plugins ( 1 dll)

GameData\StationScience\resources (5 files)

restart KSP, and take another look at your station.

anything new?

try to restart PLANT GROWTH. Fast Forward an hour. any eurikas?

oh, and what other mods do you have?

I am having the exact same issue. i'm running station science v 1.1, and KSP v.24.0.549

i have removed and reloaded station science and i still get the same result. no eurekas/ quarks/ anything from any experiment.

any ideas?

also running:

b9

docking port alignment

mechjeb

kerbal alarm clock

kethane

engineerRedux

astronomers visual

[Konisforce]

This mod looks great. Is it feasible to run it along with the Orbital Kolonization System, Modular Kolonization System, Karbonite, and KSP Interstellar? Or are OKS and Station Science best experienced separately?

I'm running with all of those (except Interstellar) and it's been going fine. Well, memory crashes, but no moreso than usual.

[saqueeb]

I'm running with all of those (except Interstellar) and it's been going fine. Well, memory crashes, but no moreso than usual.

so possibly its interstellar causing the issue? anyone else experience this?

[ethernet]

I am having the exact same issue. i'm running station science v 1.1, and KSP v.24.0.549

You need to upgrade to v. 0.24.2 of KSP, which is the latest version.

[stefwilliams]

This mod is great, but I've had an issue recently where, after installing some other mods (I have a LOT installed), two station science contracts I'd already accepted suddenly disappeared from my list - they're not active, inactive or in the archive, just gone. Not a massive concern because prograde quarks has reappeared and I can accept that again, but my problem is that the prograde quarks experiment was already underway, so I can't trigger the 'launch' and 'start experiment' parameters of the experiment...

So, is there a change I can make to my persistent file (or something else) to tell the game that I've completed those two paramaters already? Also, can I trigger the plant science one myself (that's the other one that disappeared...)

[ethernet]

This mod is great, but I've had an issue recently where, after installing some other mods (I have a LOT installed), two station science contracts I'd already accepted suddenly disappeared from my list - they're not active, inactive or in the archive, just gone. Not a massive concern because prograde quarks has reappeared and I can accept that again, but my problem is that the prograde quarks experiment was already underway, so I can't trigger the 'launch' and 'start experiment' parameters of the experiment...

So, is there a change I can make to my persistent file (or something else) to tell the game that I've completed those two paramaters already? Also, can I trigger the plant science one myself (that's the other one that disappeared...)

First, search for "UT =", and copy the number you find there.

Then, search for "StnSciExperiment2", and find the StationExperiment module section. In there, you'll find "launched" and "completed" values. Paste in the number you copied for each of them.

When you restart, and focus on your vessel, the first two objectives should automatically complete (provided the experiment is actually complete; if not, just complete it).

[stefwilliams]

First, search for "UT =", and copy the number you find there.

Then, search for "StnSciExperiment2", and find the StationExperiment module section. In there, you'll find "launched" and "completed" values. Paste in the number you copied for each of them.

When you restart, and focus on your vessel, the first two objectives should automatically complete (provided the experiment is actually complete; if not, just complete it).

Excellent, that fixed my kuarqs! Thanks...

Can you tell me how to trigger the Plant science contract too? Then I'll do the same to get that back to where it was...

Cheers

Edited August 12, 2014 by stefwilliams

[ethernet]

Excellent, that fixed my kuarqs! Thanks...

Can you tell me how to trigger the Plant science contract too? Then I'll get do the same to get that back to where it was...

Cheers

Should be the same, but with StnSciExperiment1 instead.

[stefwilliams]

Should be the same, but with StnSciExperiment1 instead.

Yeah but the contract isn't currently active - and isn't available to select in the contracts list... How do I trigger the offer?

[ethernet]

Yeah but the contract isn't currently active - and isn't available to select in the contracts list... How do I trigger the offer?

You can use the Debug menu (alt-F12) to spawn contracts. Go to Contracts, then Add, then scroll down and look for StnSciContract, and try pressing the E button until the Plant Growth appears again. You can then reject any others you spawned if you want.