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PorkWorks dev thread [Habitat Pack] [SpaceplanePlus]

Porkjet

By Porkjet
in KSP1 Mod Development

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wasmic

wasmic

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All these people suggesting xenon to go with the tricoupler are forgetting one thing, I think - ion engines have very low thrust. They can almost give a light weight probe a useable TWR. You're putting two (how are you going to power both?) one the back of a plane. Yes, SSTO planes are going to be light but really, you're pushing either 3 engines (one central and two on the wings) or 1 (RAPIER? Or a nuke? Because there's no way ion thrusters can be used as your orbital insertion engines), all the wings, a command pod.. they'd only be useful for very small OMS, not for interplanetary travel, the thrust is too damned low. And you'd need to create about 18 E/s - that's one Gigantor or 9 of the smaller extendible ones. And they have to always be in direct sunlight. Ion thrusters don't make much sense to put on the back of a heavy cargo plane. On one that's made of cubic struts, massless batteries and solar panels, sure, but not an SSTO.

You know, people have been building ion-powered spacecrafts for some time now. They're really useful (especially along with Near Future Propulsion, but also without) and IIRC, someone made a single-stage spaceplane to Gilly and back using ion engines. Heck, some people even made an SSTO that didn't even use jet engines, so I think ions can be used for orbital insertion. You do realize that the ion engines have been buffed in terms of thrust lately?

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BudgetHedgehog

BudgetHedgehog

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You know, people have been building ion-powered spacecrafts for some time now. They're really useful (especially along with Near Future Propulsion, but also without) and IIRC, someone made a single-stage spaceplane to Gilly and back using ion engines. Heck, some people even made an SSTO that didn't even use jet engines, so I think ions can be used for orbital insertion. You do realize that the ion engines have been buffed in terms of thrust lately?

And what did these spacecraft look like? I'm going to bet pretty lightweight. People making SSTO spaceplanes without jet engines kinda proves my point - the ion drives don't have to push as much mass. If you have a lightweight enough craft - pit, xenon, jet fuel, adapter, jet and the ions - then I can kind of see it working. Maybe I'm just thinking of it wrong but when I think of SSTO planes, I think of ascending on jets until air runs out and then pushing through to higher altitudes and I can't see the ions providing enough thrust then, what with all the flames and approaching terminal V. I've no doubt that one can SSTO using ions, especially now they've been buffed, I'm just questioning their usefulness in a plane built around the Mk2 shape with only two ion drives.. I have a hard time imagining it but I'd love to be proven wrong. It could just be that I've been playing with FAR and NearFuture that I have trouble imagine their usefulness in atmosphere and as an SSTO engine.

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CptRichardson

CptRichardson

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And what did these spacecraft look like? I'm going to bet pretty lightweight. People making SSTO spaceplanes without jet engines kinda proves my point - the ion drives don't have to push as much mass. If you have a lightweight enough craft - pit, xenon, jet fuel, adapter, jet and the ions - then I can kind of see it working. Maybe I'm just thinking of it wrong but when I think of SSTO planes, I think of ascending on jets until air runs out and then pushing through to higher altitudes and I can't see the ions providing enough thrust then, what with all the flames and approaching terminal V. I've no doubt that one can SSTO using ions, especially now they've been buffed, I'm just questioning their usefulness in a plane built around the Mk2 shape with only two ion drives.. I have a hard time imagining it but I'd love to be proven wrong. It could just be that I've been playing with FAR and NearFuture that I have trouble imagine their usefulness in atmosphere and as an SSTO engine.

Why would you use a manned ion plane? Well, without a lot of OMS radial points for more Ion? LOX hypersonic nosecone, drone core, payload bay with... stuff in it, deep space module, and the adapter with ion drives and aerospike. Itty-bitty stubby wings, too. The whole idea is 'Spaceplane useful for interplanetary SCIENCE!', since otherwise it'd need a carrier vessel.

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BudgetHedgehog

BudgetHedgehog

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Why would you use a manned ion plane? Well, without a lot of OMS radial points for more Ion? LOX hypersonic nosecone, drone core, payload bay with... stuff in it, deep space module, and the adapter with ion drives and aerospike. Itty-bitty stubby wings, too. The whole idea is 'Spaceplane useful for interplanetary SCIENCE!', since otherwise it'd need a carrier vessel.

I'm sorry, I just can't picture that working in my head. It still sounds like too much weight for 2 ions to push. Like I said, maybe I've just been playing with FAR and NearFuture too long, I'd love to be proven wrong on this.

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marach

marach

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And you'd need to create about 18 E/s - that's one Gigantor or 9 of the smaller extendible ones.

Now there's a part idea an S2 fuselage piece which opens to 2 solar panels (so from <> to <----->) now that I'd love to see...

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Bartybum

Bartybum

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Now there's a part idea an S2 fuselage piece which opens to 2 solar panels (so from <> to <----->) now that I'd love to see...

You sure you don't mean from <> to -----<>-----?

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marach

marach

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You sure you don't mean from <> to -----<>-----?

I was thinking of the body panels going out gigantor like carrying the panels with them, just opening and panels coming out works too though :P

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mike9606

mike9606

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Dude, you should put together a 3m capsule as part of your habitat pack. I really think we need one what with the new bigger tanks.

There is the Taurus capsule somewhere on the forums. It's a 3m capsule.

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  • 2 weeks later...
Porkjet

Porkjet

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Hi folks! You all having fun with the contracts?

I'll release the .24 compatibility update asap, just need to test some more if everythings working. This has like 25 000 downloads on curse already so I really don't wanna release broken things.

You can help me by testing this pre release here and tell me if you find anything weird. (latest firespitter.dll included)

The new "specialized" parts aren't there yet, I didnt get to finish them yet.

There are some new wing segments tho that people have been requesting.

I've revised the Budgets and tech tree entries for .24 to hopefully represent a nice spaceplane development progression in career mode.

Early on you mostly get some basic wing pieces, and most of the parts are then unlocked onwards from supersonicFlight.

There's no SP+ entry in aerospaceTech anymore, I think that should be reserved for OP things like Scramjets and powerful engines.

A detailed changelog will follow tomorrow. Hope there aren't any bugs, have fun!

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Master Tao

Master Tao

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When I attach the elevons they don't mirror. If the left is oriented to the left, the right one is oriented in the same way.

Confirmed – mirrored elevons do not rotate. Looks like that's a result of the node_attach changes between 1.2 and 1.3 prerelease. Switching them back fixes that problem and doesn't appear to cause any others, but I don't know what I'm doing. I just diffed the configs.

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Porkjet

Porkjet

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Ah yea, thank you! That's a leftover from some experimenting I forgot to reset. I was working on a way to add heatshields on wings using a plugin by Albert VDS that allows to actually mirror parts in symmetry. That'll be pretty cool when its finished.

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Fraz86

Fraz86

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I'd like to suggest adding NEAR support, which should be identical to SP+FAR.cfg, just replace all instances of ":NEEDS[FerramAerospaceResearch]" with ":NEEDS[NEAR]".

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KerrMü

KerrMü

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Ah yea, thank you! That's a leftover from some experimenting I forgot to reset. I was working on a way to add heatshields on wings using a plugin by Albert VDS that allows to actually mirror parts in symmetry. That'll be pretty cool when its finished.

would this also be visible? like heat shield tiles on the underside of the wing? just curious.

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Porkjet

Porkjet

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Am I right in thinking this means ailerons etc can start at the correct orientation? Because that, along with Pads Part Angle Display and EE will raise VAB time to unprecedented levels of epic.

Yes! It also means I can let Mk2 fuselages radial attach start at the correct rotation

I'd like to suggest adding NEAR support, which should be identical to SP+FAR.cfg, just replace all instances of ":NEEDS[FerramAerospaceResearch]" with ":NEEDS[NEAR]".

I'll check it out!

would this also be visible? like heat shield tiles on the underside of the wing? just curious.

Yepp! not only that, the heatshields will also be toggleable, for people who prefer the old plain white style.

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KerrMü

KerrMü

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Yepp! not only that, the heatshields will also be toggleable, for people who prefer the old plain white style.

ok, I lied. I wasn´t curious, I was cautiously excited. If it´s possible... wow.

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Porkjet

Porkjet

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I'm very excited about this too. A little 'preview' for this feature can be seen on the Structural Intake in version 1.3, which can now be toggled to have a black heatshield, thanks to firespitter textureswitch. I'll make more use of the FS texture and mesh switch functions in future updates.

So anyway, new version is out, changes include:

- Tech Tree and Budgets overhaul for First Contract

- Added 4 new Wing segments

- Modified some collision meshes, no more 'wiggeling' when attaching parts to the top or underside

- Structural Intake can now be toggled to a black version that fits better to spaceplane heatshielded undersides.

- Updated RPM configs for 0.17, disabled built-in cameras on standard cockpit, use external ones instead.

- NEAR support

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BudgetHedgehog

BudgetHedgehog

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- Tech Tree and Budgets overhaul for First Contract

- Added 4 new Wing segments

- Modified some collision meshes, no more 'wiggeling' when attaching parts to the top or underside

- Structural Intake can now be toggled to a black version that fits better to spaceplane heatshielded undersides.

- Updated RPM configs for 0.17, disabled built-in cameras on standard cockpit, use external ones instead.

- NEAR support

1311947803699.jpg

Downloaded so hard...

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