PorkWorks dev thread [Habitat Pack] [SpaceplanePlus]

[Porkjet]

So I want wings with heatshield on the underside, and of course this happens:

Is there any way to make the part actually mirror with symmetry or do I have to say good bye to this thing?

[Deathsoul097]

No, parts don't mirror the way you want them to. Unfortunately parts in KSP mirror by rotating around what they are attatched to in the VAB or SPH. You can either make the entire wing heatshielded, or use seperate wings for each side to combat this. I am at school, so I can't see the images, but I'm pretty sure that is what is going on from what you have said.

[a__gun]

So I want wings with heatshield on the underside, and of course this happens:

http://i.imgur.com/mwaIeC9.jpg

Is there any way to make the part actually mirror with symmetry or do I have to say good bye to this thing?

The Mini-Shuttle uses a seperate left and right wing so I guess theres no way round it :/

[Porkjet]

Hmm alright. I was hoping someone knew a magical CFG command that turned on mirror-ing.

I'll just add some black tiles to the front of the wings then. Better than nothing.

[Mekan1k]

You could make a plugin that makes the underside (as in the SPH) dark...

[NoMrBond]

I remember reading that wings need to be oriented slightly differently from other parts (for lift), not sure if that also effects the mirrored orientation though

[Sage Sagan]

Playing around with rovers and other uses for the bays and passenger section it occurred to me that a short, neat way of ending the MK2 shape is sorely needed and should be relatively straightforward. There are lots of long, tail style 1.5m to MK2 adaptors I mean more of an end covering plate or a short MK2-1.5m...or both would be really nice!

[MaverickSawyer]

Playing around with rovers and other uses for the bays and passenger section it occurred to me that a short, neat way of ending the MK2 shape is sorely needed and should be relatively straightforward. There are lots of long, tail style 1.5m to MK2 adaptors I mean more of an end covering plate or a short MK2-1.5m...or both would be really nice!

Should have an upward slope on the underside to mitigate tail strikes. God knows I've blown up more engines on rotation than on any other phase of spaceplane flight...

[a__gun]

Hmm alright. I was hoping someone knew a magical CFG command that turned on mirror-ing.

I'll just add some black tiles to the front of the wings then. Better than nothing.

The only way around it I can think of (besides seperate left and right wings) would be to make a single part that contains both wings welded together, such that when the wings are attached they clip through the body:

[MaverickSawyer]

And how would you attach that? I'm not sure KSP would like that!

[cfds]

Do parts have to be connected? a_gun's idea would probably work if the clipping part of the wing does not have a collider put I do not know if this is possible.

[Albert VDS]

There are a couple of choices, each with their pros and cons.

1 wing piece - less parts, but no heat shield.

2 separate parts - makes it possible to have a heat shield, but might make aligning the wings a problem

Both wings connected as 1 piece - makes a heat shield possible and solves the aligning problem, but only one possible use.

1 wing piece with Firespitter texture replacer - less parts, heat shield possible. Mirror problem solved by changing 1 side's texture.

I would go for the Firespitter texture replacer option, keeps it simple and fixes the texture and I believe you are already using it for this mod?

[Porkjet]

A single wing that clips through the body is possible, but not very versatile.

Albert, can you tell me more about that firespitter texture replacer? I've never heard of it.

[MaverickSawyer]

It's done via context menu in the VAB, and changes the texture of the entire part. it is NOT symmetry-sensitive, and would work with dual textures: one for the left wing, and one for the right.

Hmm... Might need to kick that over to the P_Wing crew for consideration. I use the P_Wings on my Valkyrie SSTOs for simplicity and reduced part count.

[Albert VDS]

It's part of the firespitter.dll

The MODULE should look like this:

MODULE
 {
name = FStextureSwitch
displayName = Nose Art Texture // name of window
moduleID = 0
textures
{
// list of textures
name = Firespitter/Parts/Command/FS_bomberCockpit/noseArt/ozymandius_model003
name = Firespitter/Parts/Command/FS_bomberCockpit/noseArt/early_bird_model003
name = Firespitter/Parts/Command/FS_bomberCockpit/noseArt/swift_demise_model003
}
objects
{
name = noseartplate // name of mesh
}
 }

Edited February 21, 2014 by Albert VDS

[MaverickSawyer]

The Wings and Shock-cone intakes are from Taverio's Aerospace http://kerbalspaceprogram.com/0-18-1-taverios-pizza-and-aerospace/

I just found the changeover to closed cycle operation was happening too low for my liking with stock intakes, with 4 shock intakes I get to around 28000m before the engines switch. I came in 300km short of KSC on my last re-entry and there was plenty of fuel left for the long, slow, flight home. The plane is actually very safe to fly Starwaster,although I haven't carried a payload yet.

There's been a lot of discussion about those RAPIERs as of late... I stick with two separate powerplants myself: one stock Turbojet fed by two B9 SABRE inlets, and two AIES MODOC-2s for rocket power. I typically get a flameout at around 35-36 km and 1800-2200 m/s, depending on how rapid I am with the pitch changes. (Yes, I use MechJeb to help manage the craft on ascent with far more precision than I can manage myself.)

Hmm... Maybe I should post the craft file for the Valkyrie. Any takers?

[landeTLS]

I see one problem with the firespitter sollution. If you where to make the wings heatshield actually functional with deadly reentry (ie. Having abliviative shielding direction on the bottom but not on top) ofcourse this could be solved by having the entire wing shielded but would be kindof cheating:D. The best in my oppinion would be to have a single part with two wings clipping through the fusulage but id use some procedural mesh to make it more versatile.

[MaverickSawyer]

I see one problem with the firespitter sollution. If you where to make the wings heatshield actually functional with deadly reentry (ie. Having abliviative shielding direction on the bottom but not on top) ofcourse this could be solved by having the entire wing shielded but would be kindof cheating:D. The best in my oppinion would be to have a single part with two wings clipping through the fusulage but id use some procedural mesh to make it more versatile.

Uhm, DRE does Shuttle-style TPS too. That's what the cockpit and fuselage have. No ablative needed.

In any case, I've found that if you run a smooth entry from LKO, the max temps you'll reach are around 1300*C, typically for lights or RCS pods under the belly or on the nose. Most parts can withstand such temps (FASA Mercury RCS being a notable exception. Don't ask how I know this...>.> )

[Albert VDS]

I see one problem with the firespitter sollution. If you where to make the wings heatshield actually functional with deadly reentry (ie. Having abliviative shielding direction on the bottom but not on top) ofcourse this could be solved by having the entire wing shielded but would be kindof cheating:D. The best in my oppinion would be to have a single part with two wings clipping through the fusulage but id use some procedural mesh to make it more versatile.

Having the whole wing be a heat shield isn't really a problem. If you do end upside down then the rest of the plane will still be exposed to the heat(unless you cover the whole craft with this wing).

[Starwaster]

And how would you attach that? I'm not sure KSP would like that!

By giving it two collision meshes leaving a gap where it needs to intersect with the other part.

[Parkaboy]

To deal with the wing mirroring issue, how about having two parts: the wing and the heatshield? You just apply the heatshield to the underside of the wing. That should work, right?

A different part for each wing isn't a good solution, since you'd need to attach it on a node, and that limits the way you can build a ship.

[Albert VDS]

But then both the wing and the heat shield would need 2 nodes each.

[Rockstar04]

But then both the wing and the heat shield would need 2 nodes each.

You would only need one wing, and two, optional, heatshields.

Honestly that seems like a reasonable solution. Then the heatsheild becomes optional, saving weight for craft that wont go to space, and they can be separated in career mode for more realistic progression in the tech tree.

[Albert VDS]

1 wing and 1 heat shield, because you can flip the part around.

And with nodes I meant attachment nodes.

[Rockstar04]

1 wing and 1 heat shield, because you can flip the part around.

And with nodes I meant attachment nodes.

I was assuming the heat shield would be curved around the front of each wing, requiring 2 unique parts, but if they are just flat, then yes only one would be required.

Edited February 21, 2014 by Rockstar04