[0.23.5] Realism Overhaul: ROv5.2 + Modlist for RSS 6/30/14

[AbeS]

You were right Nathan, I was confused because I used the fairings as fuselages, I put them in another stage so I wouldn't have to decouple them, which worked like it should with the fuselages

[SFJackBauer]

As far as I know, @SFJackBauer is making such egines too, but calculating the in-game engines' stats using the proper formulas for doing so.

You mean calculating thrust and Isp given the bell geometry? Nope, I'm definitely not doing that I was just doing what I proposed barely a month ago in this post, although at a slow pace since my job is taking almost my full time for the last couple weeks.

But my methodology has been the same, so yeah, there is a duplicate effort here. But I'm not in a hurry or in a race, I like to do things slow and surely. So if you arrive at something that can be released, talk to Nathan and go ahead.

[NathanKell]

AbeS: ah, gotcha.

Re: engines, why don't we set up a google docs spreadsheet that lists all the engines, and what people suggest they look like?

Also speaking of Merlin 1D, zzz released one; I didn't even know it.

[SFJackBauer]

Just to give a glimpse of what could be done with the already existing models:

Left to right: J-2, RL-10B, SSME. In the three models the attach node was moved to hide the "engine adapter" inside the tank. The last two engines (AIES C6 and NP Bearcat S2) were given a stretch in the Y-axis. Again, would be much better to have a modeller doing the actual models instead of this contortionism, but I think this looks decent.

Another thing is I think the engines should have correct throttleability and restartability stats. I have to install the engine ignitor mod, haven't had time to check it out yet.

Also speaking of Merlin 1D, zzz released one; I didn't even know it.

There is the entire SpaceX pack here -> http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/29388-LazTek-SpaceX-Launch-Pack-2-0-1-w-Dragon-2-21-(8-2-13).

EDIT - zzz Merlin is really good but oh... that huge top adapter

Edited November 27, 2013 by SFJackBauer

[NathanKell]

inorite?

Spreadsheet: Please replace engine NewName with desired real engine name. You can also play with stats, though since Google Drive doesn't support carriage returns in formulae, the export is broken.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AvHneDAy4k99dHhBS01udUZMbnRBUkpmd1FnWjFtN1E&usp=sharing

Nice idea with the bases! It will only work on stages that are sufficiently wide, but...very nice!

Tiberion's latest Tiberdyne shuttle pack has an actual SSME clone, though a bit generic. The grid rather than ring is very distinctive. Alt suggestions for S2?

[MedievalNerd]

Very nice indeed!

Huzzah!

[SFJackBauer]

Nathan I was thinking something more in this line:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0Aotgw0qR1h0UdDhRazYxaDNPT0psVnhNNHFIVnZLM3c#gid=0

And then once the data was decided, porting to the excel and generate the cfgs.

But one question first - is there any problem if, for the realistic engines, we make new part.cfg files, (reusing the original engine models with MODEL{} calls), which is what I was doing privately? Because its easier than being obliged to find a purpose for EVERY engine in the modpacks. Of course we would have to still generate the cfgs for MFS. This would allow more flexibility.

[ANWRocketMan]

I took the models I don't use(mostly the ones that are quad or double mounts) and checked what engine model they fit best. Then I gave them the thrust of two/four such engines. Added some extra weight(5%-20%) based on the size of the mount and whether it has a shared chamber or not). I also decreased its Isp values a little.

Currently, for example, I have two RS-68 engines. One is a 5.2m wide RS-68 in a mount as seen on the Delta-IV/Delta-IV H. But I also have a single mount RS-68 that does not have the giant base.

[NathanKell]

SFJackBauer: I see. Just, can you make it editable for us?

[SFJackBauer]

SFJackBauer: I see. Just, can you make it editable for us?

Uh, thought I did. It is now.

[SFJackBauer]

I took the models I don't use(mostly the ones that are quad or double mounts) and checked what engine model they fit best. Then I gave them the thrust of two/four such engines. Added some extra weight(5%-20%) based on the size of the mount and whether it has a shared chamber or not). I also decreased its Isp values a little.

Currently, for example, I have two RS-68 engines. One is a 5.2m wide RS-68 in a mount as seen on the Delta-IV/Delta-IV H. But I also have a single mount RS-68 that does not have the giant base.

Of course, I know this is a possibility. In the case you mention of the RS-68 is perfectly understandable - even though the RS-68 was never used outside the Delta, it is/was considered for Constellation in a cluster of six. So having one "clusterable" version is necessary.

The quads... I borderline agree with picking a similar engine, multiplying by four and calling it "RS-68 Quad", for example. But if my first stage needs 5? Or 3? Having the stand-alone engines is much more flexible. One less engine to maintain.

And then we will run out of real engines before filling all the mods engines... so what we do with the three NP Orbital Bertha models? When committing to only MMing-out the engines is obligatory to support ALL of them, like MFS does, understandably. Otherwise the user will have to comb through the parts to see which got resized and which didn't. If we do separate part.cfgs, we can pick only the engines that make sense. And it makes possible to filter through PartCatalog (I assume everyone who have more than 3 mods use PartCatalog). But I am assuming there are no other show-stoppers that prevent us from doing part.cfgs.

Also I don't want to sound picky or whatever, I'm just used to plan things before doing it, at max doing an exploratory work to test the possibilites in a small scale, before fully committing. I've only had good results by following this philosophy.

[p3asant]

So i've been running to this strange problem:

The rockets start spinning uncontrollably and wobbling after atmosphere (no aerodynamic help), which is kinda bad for my Energya-Vulkan apparatuses due to the boosters long length.

Is there any way to improve stability of extra long parts or should i just split the core to multiple stages?

Here the configuration.

[Deadpeople37]

I'm really enjoying the life support mod you linked in the "recommended with" section. However, the inline parts in it are built for the stock 2.5 meter parts (I think). Would you consider rescaling the parts and adding them to this mod? I think it would make a lovely addition.

[Razorcane]

So i've been running to this strange problem:

The rockets start spinning uncontrollably and wobbling after atmosphere (no aerodynamic help), which is kinda bad for my Energya-Vulkan apparatuses due to the boosters long length.

Is there any way to improve stability of extra long parts or should i just split the core to multiple stages?

Here the configuration.

Most people would tell you to get Kerbal Joint Reinforcement, but I've been using it for a while and I see no difference. Your best bet is to use struts.

[p3asant]

Most people would tell you to get Kerbal Joint Reinforcement, but I've been using it for a while and I see no difference. Your best bet is to use struts.

I'm already using KJR, also the struts length limit is annoying, even more so when you'd need a 50m strut.

[15nelsoc]

Purely out of curiosity, would a re-sizing of the kerbals themselves to human size and mass even be possible? Or would it cause too many problems with their movement animations?

[NathanKell]

That's planned.

Of course, I know this is a possibility. In the case you mention of the RS-68 is perfectly understandable - even though the RS-68 was never used outside the Delta, it is/was considered for Constellation in a cluster of six. So having one "clusterable" version is necessary.

The quads... I borderline agree with picking a similar engine, multiplying by four and calling it "RS-68 Quad", for example. But if my first stage needs 5? Or 3? Having the stand-alone engines is much more flexible. One less engine to maintain.

And then we will run out of real engines before filling all the mods engines... so what we do with the three NP Orbital Bertha models? When committing to only MMing-out the engines is obligatory to support ALL of them, like MFS does, understandably. Otherwise the user will have to comb through the parts to see which got resized and which didn't. If we do separate part.cfgs, we can pick only the engines that make sense. And it makes possible to filter through PartCatalog (I assume everyone who have more than 3 mods use PartCatalog). But I am assuming there are no other show-stoppers that prevent us from doing part.cfgs.

Well, per my request to Sarbian the latest testing version of MM will let you clone nodes. So you can clone parts with MM patches. I'm pretty sure we can't release part.cfgs for non-derivative licensed parts, but MM patches (that require the original assets, includng CFG) we may be able to.

That said, run out of real engines!?

http://www.b14643.de/Spacerockets_2/Diverse/U.S._Rocket_engines/engines.htm

http://www.b14643.de/Spacerockets_1/Diverse/Russian_Rocket_engines/engines.htm

http://www.b14643.de/Spacerockets_1/Diverse/European_Rocket_engines/engines.htm

http://www.b14643.de/Spacerockets_1/Diverse/Asian_Rocket_engines/engines.htm

Or trawl through the listing here: http://www.astronautix.com/engines/index.htm

I highly doubt we will run out.

Deadpeople37: I'll ask asmi.

[MedievalNerd]

That's planned.

Well, per my request to Sarbian the latest testing version of MM will let you clone nodes. So you can clone parts with MM patches. I'm pretty sure we can't release part.cfgs for non-derivative licensed parts, but MM patches (that require the original assets, includng CFG) we may be able to.

That said, run out of real engines!?

http://www.b14643.de/Spacerockets_2/Diverse/U.S._Rocket_engines/engines.htm

http://www.b14643.de/Spacerockets_1/Diverse/Russian_Rocket_engines/engines.htm

http://www.b14643.de/Spacerockets_1/Diverse/European_Rocket_engines/engines.htm

http://www.b14643.de/Spacerockets_1/Diverse/Asian_Rocket_engines/engines.htm

Or trawl through the listing here: http://www.astronautix.com/engines/index.htm

I highly doubt we will run out.

Deadpeople37: I'll ask asmi.

Mother of Kerbals,

If it gets to that level we 'need' to use things like part catalog or whatever, because finding things will be insane. lol

[Guest]

That's planned.

Do you think you could do it so IVA size can be adjusted to the command pod's scale? So that windows and other stuff fits.

[ChronicSilence]

Might it be possible to include some RemoteTech2 tweaks in this overhaul mod? Unfortunately RT2 doesn't jive very well with the RSS. The max dish range is 400Gm, but Vall is something like 4,400Gm from Kerbin.

[MedievalNerd]

Might it be possible to include some RemoteTech2 tweaks in this overhaul mod? Unfortunately RT2 doesn't jive very well with the RSS. The max dish range is 400Gm, but Vall is something like 4,400Gm from Kerbin.

Go to your RT2 folder, find the settings file. Change power consumption to 0.1 and increase range x10

[jrandom]

Oh holy wow... so I'm just now downloading all the pieces I need to try out RO/RSS for the first time!

Are the following mods supported or have downloadable .cfg files to make them work with RO/RSS correctly?

* B9 Aerospace

* KW Rocketry

* Novapunch

* RealChutes

I've been digging around in the forum threads, but there's a ton of posts and I didn't find any clear answers for the above.

[MedievalNerd]

Oh holy wow... so I'm just now downloading all the pieces I need to try out RO/RSS for the first time!

Are the following mods supported or have downloadable .cfg files to make them work with RO/RSS correctly?

* B9 Aerospace

* KW Rocketry

* Novapunch

* RealChutes

I've been digging around in the forum threads, but there's a ton of posts and I didn't find any clear answers for the above.

B9 I don't think there are resized engines if I'm not mistaken. KW & NP are a must, so is AIES.

And if you want a little extra spice, I have my tech tree that's in the early stages that's made for RSS/RO, etc.

Check out the link in my sig.

[jrandom]

I'm not a career player, but the tech tree sounds awesome for those that are!

Hey uh... the Mk1-2 heat shield no longer fits the Mk1-2 pod. In fact, the one that does is the 3.5-meter one. Did I miss a .cfg file somewhere?

[NathanKell]

jrandom: great to have you aboard! Figured you'd come around eventually.

B9 is supported by MFS, although in legacy mode (no techlevel support YET). No rescaled parts either; I haven't rescaled plane parts yet.

KWR is supported for engines/SRMs, but other parts are not yet rescaled.

Same with NovaPunch.

RealChutes is not rescaled yet, but should work fine.

Look further in the Structural tab: There's a 4M heatshield for the Mk1-2 pod as well; that fits.