DoctorCruz Posted March 17, 2014 Share Posted March 17, 2014 (edited) I read on the wiki that resources (like the ones in the Kethane and Interstellar mods) are were planned. I for one, think that this idea should be revisited, as it would really mesh well with career mode and should be a real focus in one of the coming updates. Think about it. You could get a contract from Callistic Manufacturing Corp. for x amount of a certain ore found only on the Mun. That would be a contract worth fulfilling. Or maybe Southern Kerbal Industries is going to need a shipment of x amount of a given resource every year. This would really encourage players to build bases on other planets.Anyway enough from me, what do you guys think?I also saw this is on the do not suggest list but this is kind of more a discussion of ideas on how to implement it Edited March 17, 2014 by DoctorCruz Correcting Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
astropapi1 Posted March 17, 2014 Share Posted March 17, 2014 You know they got shelved, right?The devs made a playable version but through play-testing decided it was too grindy and decided to cancel it. Instead, they focused on Career mode and got to work with NASA. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DoctorCruz Posted March 17, 2014 Author Share Posted March 17, 2014 You know they got shelved, right?The devs made a playable version but through play-testing decided it was too grindy and decided to cancel it. Instead, they focused on Career mode and got to work with NASA. I think that they should revisit it though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Iron Crown Posted March 17, 2014 Share Posted March 17, 2014 Do you have some significant reason why it should be revisited? The devs are already working on contracts for the next version, so I would imagine that incorporating resource collection into them was already considered.There are good mods out there if you really must have resources, Kethane and Interplanetary Launchpads come to mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sirrobert Posted March 17, 2014 Share Posted March 17, 2014 I think that they should revisit it though.The devs have investigated, and came to the conclusion that the current idea does not work.Suggest some alternative ideas if you want them to concider something, instead of just saying 'I want it to happen' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vger Posted March 17, 2014 Share Posted March 17, 2014 (edited) The devs have investigated, and came to the conclusion that the current idea does not work.Is there a link where this was discussed in-depth? Curious to read it. I fail to see how "mining" is any more or less grindy than "science." Both are resource-gathering, technically.That aside, I somewhat agree that contracts may bring in mining options. KSP is the taxi/trucking service that gets hired by corporations who want to do cool stuff. What gets done with that stuff is up to the corporations. If somebody wants the Mun drilled, they'll pay for it. Edited March 17, 2014 by vger Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frank_G Posted March 17, 2014 Share Posted March 17, 2014 Personally i like the kethane mod for example a lot. It totally makes sense when planning a long term space mission. Taking a view on actual space missions however would make this only look not right. If this is revisited (and yes, i would like that) then it should be kept to one or two resources at max. Otherwise i totally share the devs opinion, that this would make the game grindy.The kethane mod offers nice possibilities without exploding the part count (neither in the editor nor on your actual crafts). If you haven´t tried, Doctor Cruz... do it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vger Posted March 17, 2014 Share Posted March 17, 2014 The other problem with Kethane though is that it's ridiculously illogical to be both a valuable resource, AND be found on any world.I would like to see discoveries in the game that are less static than the same readings from the same devices all the time though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KvickFlygarn87 Posted March 17, 2014 Share Posted March 17, 2014 The devs made a playable version but through play-testing decided it was too grindy and decided to cancel it.It must have been übergrindy, since we have the science system we do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nemrav Posted March 17, 2014 Share Posted March 17, 2014 Is there a link where this was discussed in-depth? Curious to read it. I fail to see how "mining" is any more or less grindy than "science." Both are resource-gathering, technically.-snip-So far no we haven't heard it discussed in depth.. But as far as I can make out of it based on what we do have, is that it is still planned resource mining, but the original idea, although in a playable state was much too boring so it was shelved.. it may serve as the base for a later update but it simply didn't do the cut. so they decided to do career mode and busy themselves with that instead of a much more grindy thing...let's put how grindy kethane is... you send a single satellite into polar orbit around a planet, you wait, wait, wait, and wait some more, wait, wait, wait now finally you have done enough to send your FIRST lander to gather it, then you bring a refinery, you gather (wait, wait, wait) and you convert to rocket fuel (wait, wait, wait)..... so unless you simply leave KSP on and let the scanner do stuff then you won't really progress will you... all this waiting is probably why resource mining was shelved... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Iron Crown Posted March 17, 2014 Share Posted March 17, 2014 The other problem with Kethane though is that it's ridiculously illogical to be both a valuable resource, AND be found on any world.I see nothing illogical about valuable resources being common on other celestial bodies. How do you find it so? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vger Posted March 17, 2014 Share Posted March 17, 2014 let's put how grindy kethane is... you send a single satellite into polar orbit around a planet, you wait, wait, wait, and wait some more, wait, wait, wait now finally you have done enough to send your FIRST lander to gather it, then you bring a refinery, you gather (wait, wait, wait) and you convert to rocket fuel (wait, wait, wait)..... so unless you simply leave KSP on and let the scanner do stuff then you won't really progress will you... all this waiting is probably why resource mining was shelved...Well, yeah, but that's more of a weakness in the design of the mod. Take a look at scansat. You can map a planet in that at maximum warp and can even switch vehicles while it's going on. I'm pretty sure you can even have more than one planet being mapped at the same time. Kethane requires the ONE scanner to be the active vessel at all times, AND requires the warp speed to be kept low. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frank_G Posted March 17, 2014 Share Posted March 17, 2014 The other problem with Kethane though is that it's ridiculously illogical to be both a valuable resource, AND be found on any world.I would like to see discoveries in the game that are less static than the same readings from the same devices all the time though.Totally true. If revisited, there has to go a lot of thought into it, to make something not boring. But i like the scanning for example, as you must fly a mission prior to the main one, to get the readings and good possible LZs. ScanSat, Remote Tech and Kethane make the use of unkerbaled satellite missions a lot more rewarding than just reaching a specific orbit and click on the science thingies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DoctorCruz Posted March 17, 2014 Author Share Posted March 17, 2014 Personally i like the kethane mod for example a lot. It totally makes sense when planning a long term space mission. Taking a view on actual space missions however would make this only look not right. If this is revisited (and yes, i would like that) then it should be kept to one or two resources at max. Otherwise i totally share the devs opinion, that this would make the game grindy.The kethane mod offers nice possibilities without exploding the part count (neither in the editor nor on your actual crafts). If you haven´t tried, Doctor Cruz... do it!I cited it as an example of something Squad might base its system on. I do think Kethane is overpowered, but what about planet/moon specific resources? Helium-3 is a good real-life example of that. Its not very common on earth, but fairly abundant on the moon. Resources might also be used collected and perhaps sold to random companies even if you do not have a contract. I'm trying to think of some more ways it could be implemented. Anybody have any other suggestions?Also:The devs have investigated, and came to the conclusion that the current idea does not work.Suggest some alternative ideas if you want them to concider something, instead of just saying 'I want it to happen'Is there any place this is actually written? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Iron Crown Posted March 17, 2014 Share Posted March 17, 2014 Is there any place this is actually written?Straight from someone who would know.The official announcement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coolitic Posted March 17, 2014 Share Posted March 17, 2014 Lock this thread. This is on do not suggest list and I am quite tired of these kinds of posts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vger Posted March 17, 2014 Share Posted March 17, 2014 I see nothing illogical about valuable resources being common on other celestial bodies. How do you find it so?Can you name a resource that we could find in abundance on any body in the solar system that (even if the cost of tech was no issue) could power anything we send up?There are elements that can be found in great abundance in the universe, BUT, what would have to be done in order to extract it from different worlds would probably be radically different. We're not just going to find gas pockets anyplace we go. In many cases, the elements are going to be bound with molecules, and in some cases, separating it is going to be much harder than others. I just have trouble envisioning, even in the distant future, a mineable resource that we'll be able to take from nearly any rock we land on, and use it to go further. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sirrobert Posted March 17, 2014 Share Posted March 17, 2014 Is there any place this is actually written?Yes, there have been MORE than enough discussions about this when it was announched that they shelved it.Go look those up if you want to find it, I'm not oing to do it for you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Iron Crown Posted March 17, 2014 Share Posted March 17, 2014 I guess we have different definitions of what "illogical" means.There is water on various bodies in the solar system, which is easily electrolysized into propellant and oxidizer. Titan has liquid hydrocarbon lakes in its polar regions. It's not unheard of for useful materials to be easily accessible once we actually get somewhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vger Posted March 17, 2014 Share Posted March 17, 2014 I guess we have different definitions of what "illogical" means.There is water on various bodies in the solar system, which is easily electrolysized into propellant and oxidizer. Titan has liquid hydrocarbon lakes in its polar regions. It's not unheard of for useful materials to be easily accessible once we actually get somewhere.That sounds more in line with what I've been thinking. The amount of available water is anyone's guess, but an all-purpose system for extracting it from any world is highly unlikely. I think we stand a better chance at one world becoming a veritable 'gold mine' than getting it in smaller amounts from everywhere. A lot of factors would go into choosing a mining planet. Distance, environment, gravity, ease of extraction, etc. In keeping with the pseudo-realism of KSP, any official resource gathering project would probably have to reflect this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DoctorCruz Posted March 17, 2014 Author Share Posted March 17, 2014 That sounds more in line with what I've been thinking. The amount of available water is anyone's guess, but an all-purpose system for extracting it from any world is highly unlikely. I think we stand a better chance at one world becoming a veritable 'gold mine' than getting it in smaller amounts from everywhere. A lot of factors would go into choosing a mining planet. Distance, environment, gravity, ease of extraction, etc. In keeping with the pseudo-realism of KSP, any official resource gathering project would probably have to reflect this.I agree, if they choose to implement this, I'd want it to be at least a little realistic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DoctorCruz Posted March 17, 2014 Author Share Posted March 17, 2014 Also, if this gets locked, sorry, I wasn't aware there was a "Things not to Suggest list" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Iron Crown Posted March 17, 2014 Share Posted March 17, 2014 That sounds more in line with what I've been thinking. The amount of available water is anyone's guess, but an all-purpose system for extracting it from any world is highly unlikely. I think we stand a better chance at one world becoming a veritable 'gold mine' than getting it in smaller amounts from everywhere. A lot of factors would go into choosing a mining planet. Distance, environment, gravity, ease of extraction, etc. In keeping with the pseudo-realism of KSP, any official resource gathering project would probably have to reflect this.It might be interesting to have the resources of a body be proportional to how difficult it is to get them to orbit. E.g. Eve and Tylo teeming with resources while Gilly and Minmus have virtually none. Not necessarily realistic, but balanced for gameplay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nuke Posted March 17, 2014 Share Posted March 17, 2014 Straight from someone who would know.The official announcement.i would argue that getting "shelved" is completely different from being "abandoned". in that its something that may be reconsidered further down the development pipe. im happy to use kethane in the mean time, regardless of its (minor) annoyances. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DoctorCruz Posted March 18, 2014 Author Share Posted March 18, 2014 i would argue that getting "shelved" is completely different from being "abandoned". in that its something that may be reconsidered further down the development pipe. im happy to use kethane in the mean time, regardless of its (minor) annoyances.It might be interesting to have the resources of a body be proportional to how difficult it is to get them to orbit. E.g. Eve and Tylo teeming with resources while Gilly and Minmus have virtually none. Not necessarily realistic, but balanced for gameplay.Both very good ideas. Hope that if the debs revisitthis idea they'll think about this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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