[1.12.X] Tantares - Stockalike Soyuz and MIR [16.1][28.05.2024][Mars Expedition WIP]

[Sideswiper22]

I'm still loving this mod! I think this should be bundled with KSP too! It's very fun to use!

Made a Zond recreation using a Proton launcher. I'm still using 1.0 because there are many problems with mods in 1.0.2

I made a functioning and life-like launch escape system too. (without the gridfins though)

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The rocket was too heavy to lift it properly. (only 1.38 TWR)

I also found out that after I deployed the parachute, the Proton rocket went directly to the KSC and hit the Administration Building, obliterating it! :D:D:D

[spacecookie]

Yeaah ! They are definitely better with this shape !

Edited May 6, 2015 by spacecookie

[Niemand303]

Beales's one of the most used part... The TLV core engine! It fitted the role awesomely and brought my Spiral to orbit!

Thanks for that goodness. :3

EDIT:

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Edited May 6, 2015 by Niemand303

[curtquarquesso]

Ok, I can take a look on that.

Awesome, thanks!

Wow, nice stuff!

It oddly looks "rounder" when larger?

Hard to pin down.

Certainly better than I expected at that size.

Yeah, it's not too shabby! It'll be a WIP for a while. Trying to work on reasonable scales for certain items. Getting all these parts to balance with scale is going to be a challenge.

I wonder, is there a way to raise its crew capacity to three?

You lucky... Lucky.... Person! (Nailed it) I wish I lived close enough to KSC to see SpaceX's crazy escapades. Unfortunately, I live six hours away, in Alabama.

Send us some pictures/videos, please?

Currently, not really. Changing the capacity will screw with the IVA's I think. Scaled capsules are tricky, which is why in the latest version, there's a sneakily placed toggle in the ScaleExponents.cfg to disable crew pod scaling by default. The 1.875m Soyuz was just a proof of concept; had a good smattering of different part types that each have different challenges when scaling with TweakScale.

YEAH! IT WAS AWESOME!!! Just got home a little while ago. Myself and two of my aerospace buddies carpooled over there to Playalinda beach on the Canaveral national seashore. Comments continued in album as to not crowd up the forum thread:

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[planeguy868]

Hey Beale, do you know if there is a 1.0 updated version of the Soyuz TMA add on out there?

Hi, TMA guy here. Wrapped up finals week and I'm back home, but some personal stuff happened that will likely delay the TMA update. I've confirmed that textures still work in 1.0, just the parts have a node orientation issue (alt f12 menu has an option to fix), and the pods kind of don't have heatshields.

Long story short, it's technically useable but not really, and personal stuff happened that will likely delay me releasing an update. BUT AN UPDATE WILL COME.

[Gunslinger1]

Thank you planeguy868! Hope everything irl is good.

[Beale]

I'm still loving this mod! I think this should be bundled with KSP too! It's very fun to use!

Made a Zond recreation using a Proton launcher. I'm still using 1.0 because there are many problems with mods in 1.0.2

I made a functioning and life-like launch escape system too. (without the gridfins though)

http://imgur.com/a/t9sj1

The rocket was too heavy to lift it properly. (only 1.38 TWR)

I also found out that after I deployed the parachute, the Proton rocket went directly to the KSC and hit the Administration Building, obliterating it! :D:D:D

Nice Zond mission!

Very much like the fairing setup, shame about the AB!

Beales's one of the most used part... The TLV core engine! It fitted the role awesomely and brought my Spiral to orbit!

http://cs623616.vk.me/v623616733/1f6e1/vgxMyyMmhJk.jpg

Thanks for that goodness. :3

EDIT:

http://imgur.com/a/wzcUZ

Extremely cool hot launch system!

If it is so used, perhaps needs an art pass

Currently, not really. Changing the capacity will screw with the IVA's I think. Scaled capsules are tricky, which is why in the latest version, there's a sneakily placed toggle in the ScaleExponents.cfg to disable crew pod scaling by default. The 1.875m Soyuz was just a proof of concept; had a good smattering of different part types that each have different challenges when scaling with TweakScale.

YEAH! IT WAS AWESOME!!! Just got home a little while ago. Myself and two of my aerospace buddies carpooled over there to Playalinda beach on the Canaveral national seashore. Comments continued in album as to not crowd up the forum thread:

http://imgur.com/a/IlTb0

You have a position of envy in Florida to be able to see this, very nice

Watching the video of event is good enough!

MIR

Very, very awkward to unwrap this model, and the texturing suffers a little because of that.

Still, a fair replacement I feel.

A little larger than the old one.

Edit: Mirthulu is always watching...

Edited May 6, 2015 by Beale

[VenomousRequiem]

You mention the art pass to the Soyuz rocket. That would be awesome! I know recently you changed the texture, but what about a full remodel like the Proton got? Maybe make the engines look a little like the real Soyuz-FG or something. And maybe even get it it's own vernier engines! And space on the bottom of the main engines themselves to put the verniers instead of having the Waykeepers sticking out of the side.

[biohazard15]

You mention the art pass to the Soyuz rocket. That would be awesome! I know recently you changed the texture, but what about a full remodel like the Proton got? Maybe make the engines look a little like the real Soyuz-FG or something. And maybe even get it it's own vernier engines! And space on the bottom of the main engines themselves to put the verniers instead of having the Waykeepers sticking out of the side.

What Soyuz really need is rebalancing, not remodeling. The models are great.

[VenomousRequiem]

What Soyuz really need is rebalancing, not remodeling. The models are great.

Well I know the models are already great. All of the models are great, but he's still redoing them. And I agree, too. A re-balance would be cool as well. The rocket seems a little... over powered.

[biohazard15]

The rocket seems a little... over powered.

It has overpowered 2nd stage, but underpowered core stage. If you put a standard payload on it, it would lift off rather nicely, but core stage seriously lacks thrust after boosters separation. It can go to space, though - but as soon as you activate 2nd stage, you'll notice that it is too efficient.

[Sideswiper22]

Maybe also rebalance the Proton rocket? It's a bit underpowered as the first stage had difficulty lifting my zond with a block g stage under it.

[Guest]

Maybe also rebalance the Proton rocket? It's a bit underpowered as the first stage had difficulty lifting my zond with a block g stage under it.

I hit this very scenario today. Ended up attaching three SRB's rather than rebuild the entire booster.

[VenomousRequiem]

The Proton rocket seems like the first stage doesn't have enough thrust, but has way too much fuel. I find myself keeping block A until a very high altitude. Maybe that's how the Soyuz is too? Just too much fuel?

[Beale]

You mention the art pass to the Soyuz rocket. That would be awesome! I know recently you changed the texture, but what about a full remodel like the Proton got? Maybe make the engines look a little like the real Soyuz-FG or something. And maybe even get it it's own vernier engines! And space on the bottom of the main engines themselves to put the verniers instead of having the Waykeepers sticking out of the side.

It is the oldest launcher (The Proton was the first I made, but has been revamped).

Needs an art update quite dearly, I've learned quite much since making it, the rocket looks downright sloppy compared to OrionKermin's work!

It has overpowered 2nd stage, but underpowered core stage. If you put a standard payload on it, it would lift off rather nicely, but core stage seriously lacks thrust after boosters separation. It can go to space, though - but as soon as you activate 2nd stage, you'll notice that it is too efficient.

When you make distinction between "core" and "boosters", is this specifically including the engine's dual-mode settings?

I can increase the "core" mode's thrust setting, and lower efficiency

The striped second stage engine may also use a slap. IIRC it has the same efficiency as the main engine, but also weighs less? (I need to check the numbers).

But, in launching a few things, I do notice what you describe.

Maybe also rebalance the Proton rocket? It's a bit underpowered as the first stage had difficulty lifting my zond with a block g stage under it.

The Proton rocket seems like the first stage doesn't have enough thrust, but has way too much fuel. I find myself keeping block A until a very high altitude. Maybe that's how the Soyuz is too? Just too much fuel?

Haven't noticed this, but the biggest thing I've launched in 1.0 was 12 tons only.

I'll look into it

When blok-G is mentioned, do you mean specifically the one from N-1? Doesn't the Zond use Blok-D?

Would explain a little, blok-G is much heavier.

Edited May 7, 2015 by Beale

[biohazard15]

When you make distinction between "core" and "boosters", is this specifically including the engine's dual-mode settings?

I can increase the "core" mode's thrust setting, and lower efficiency

The striped second stage engine may also use a slap. IIRC it has the same efficiency as the main engine, but also weighs less? (I need to check the numbers).

But, in launching a few things, I do notice what you describe.

Yes, I mean dual-mode settings.

WRT core mode thrust, I think it would work - but you should decrease booster mode thrust to keep TWR sane. Aim for boosters separation at 700-750 m\s, core stage separation at 1500 m\s. 2nd stage should have around 1000 dV with Soyuz or Progress as payload.

[VenomousRequiem]

So if you're going to do this, then you should make the bottom of the engines like they are in this picture:

Like with space for the verniers and stuff.

[passinglurker]

So if you're going to do this, then you should make the bottom of the engines like they are in this picture:

http://www.west-point.org/class/usma1983/images/PTB2QNewsLtr/soyuz%20engines.jpg

Like with space for the verniers and stuff.

remember part count this is supposed to be ones first orbital rocket

[Beale]

Yes, I mean dual-mode settings.

WRT core mode thrust, I think it would work - but you should decrease booster mode thrust to keep TWR sane. Aim for boosters separation at 700-750 m\s, core stage separation at 1500 m\s. 2nd stage should have around 1000 dV with Soyuz or Progress as payload.

Ah, the TWR slipped my mind, you're right there. I'll play around with the numbers tonight hopefully and try to get something sensible in place.

So if you're going to do this, then you should make the bottom of the engines like they are in this picture:

http://www.west-point.org/class/usma1983/images/PTB2QNewsLtr/soyuz%20engines.jpg

Like with space for the verniers and stuff.

remember part count this is supposed to be ones first orbital rocket

Interesting the RD-117s are noticeably wider than the core stage... (Or at least the casing).

But, passinglurker is quite a good point, low part count allowances in first two VAB make this a little less feasible (And Vostok MonoProp necklace).

Could integrate the verniers into the engine, but then would actually need two separate engines for core and booster, rather than just different toggle settings.

Interesting the light Soyuz 2 variant uses NK-33 for main engine also.

Bleh! Too many ideas rushing around my head, not enough time to give them (for now).

Edited May 7, 2015 by Beale

[VenomousRequiem]

Oh, I forgot about part count limits... Maybe make two variants? Like keep the old one but include a new fancy one? Or maybe include the smaller part count one separately in the download for people who only ever play in Sandbox and Science like myself so part count doesn't matter? :0

[Sideswiper22]

When blok-G is mentioned, do you mean specifically the one from N-1? Doesn't the Zond use Blok-D?

Would explain a little, blok-G is much heavier.

It uses a stage similar/ the same as the n-1 block g.

[spacecookie]

http://www.astronautix.com/graphics/l/l1.jpg

It uses a stage similar/ the same as the n-1 block g.

Block D and G were both designed and used for the N-1, the G used as a fourth stage and lifted the D which is well recognizable by his unique shape, the block G has a common cylinder shape. The zond in your picture is lifted by a block D.

http://www.russianspaceweb.com/n1_d.html

http://www.russianspaceweb.com/n1_g.html

http://www.russianspaceweb.com/n1.html

Here are some links that may interest you

[biohazard15]

http://www.astronautix.com/graphics/l/l1.jpg

It uses a stage similar/ the same as the n-1 block g.

Native Russian here...

That's not Block G, that's block D.

Rockets made by Progress plant have their stages named for Cyrillic alphabet letters. N-1 stages are named ÃÂ-Ñ-Ã’-Ó-Æ(A-B-V-G-D). You may see that D is fifth letter in Cyrillic, that's because Block D is actually N-1's fifth stage. Block G was Earth departure stage (it's LLV-T160D fuel tank and LLV-E0150D engine in TantaresLV)

Now, on a three-staged Proton it would be a 4th stage - but Khrunichev didn't assign letters to Proton stages, so Block D still would be called "Block D".

Interesting note: Soyuz stages are:

- Boosters: Blocks B, V, G, D

- Core stage: Block A

- 2nd stage: Block E on Vostok and its variants, Block I on later variants.

Also, Progress calls Soyuz a three-staged rocket - because in Soviet (and later Russian) space program boosters are considered as a separate stage, not just strap-on rockets or "Stage 0".

Edited May 7, 2015 by biohazard15

[Sideswiper22]

^Apologies there

[HeadHunter67]

I have noticed what appears to be an issue with the T-RP and TK-RC04B Return Parachutes. When I hover over the tooltip, the semi-deployed and fully-deployed effective diameters read 0.0 for both modes and both models.

Consequently, this means that when I deploy the chute, the graphics and animation show a chute deploying - but to the game system there's nothing to cause resistance to slow the capsule, which slams into the ground and kills the crew. I am pretty sure a T-RP should normally be sufficient to slow a Khleb carrying nothing more than the two crewmen and a basic antenna (total mass 1275kg including the chute).

Am I doing something wrong, or is this a genuine bug? I'm sure I can change the values in the configs but if it's a real issue I wanted to bring it to your attention.

[EDIT: OK, I found an answer several pages back - deleting the partdatabase.cfg did work, just wondering why this happens now...]

Edited May 7, 2015 by HeadHunter67