[1.1] BDArmory v0.11.0.1 (+compatibility, fixes) - Apr 23

[tetryds]

http://imgur.com/a/WYqDF#0

(plz someone tell me how to format so it embeds)

Just do:

[noparse]

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[/noparse]

I think that when you decide to upload your DLL it would be interesting to create a topic for it then.

I am willing to try test builds and things like that.

If you need another player to help you testing it on DMP just tell.

From what I played, DMP does not spawn bullets for the client, nor flares etc.

But it does spawn missiles wich have a certain positioning error often making them miss.

So hitting a ground target may be feasible, but hitting another flying target seems impossible.

The closest I ever got was buzzing my friend's airplane by 30 centimeters above it.

What I meant about debris is that often the ships get trow in the air, and when they hit the ground they can spawn a lot of debris, that can get multiplied if both clients spawn different debris pieces.

And it can end up like a real mess.

[LORDPrometheus]

crap, nevermind, i was using a MODDED .dll

yeah with stock /dll that is true

*misisle lock*

4444444444444444444444444444444444444444444444!

[Spectre111]

Hey BD

I have been playing around with sub assembles trying to make a pylon with a few missiles on it,

but when I place the missiles on to my craft with symmetry on, the weapon manager will fire off the missiles under one wing before firing the others.

Here is my question could you add a option in the missile right click menu that would allow me to tell the weapon manager in what order to fire the missiles?

For example just give me a text box where i can type a number and when i switch the weapon manager onto that missile type it would fire them in the numeric order i have assigned.

Thanks

[Space Scumbag]

On the side note, never increase your Physics range to multiple million/billion kilometers. Weird things are happening and are crafts fall apart.

[Yski]

Talking about physics range increases, I'd love to see some long range weaponry suited for space battles. I'm thinking along the lines of 50-100 km ranges here, and to put things in perspective our current weapons can't really hit anything further than 20km away.

Missiles would probably be relatively easy - the HEKV missiles seem to get pretty close when fired from about 40 km away, and only really miss because they lack the fuel to do the final corrections. As such, I'd imagine a larger, higher delta-v variant that's smart enough to leave some fuel in reserve for those final adjustments would probably do the trick. I'm also drooling for a cluster missile that doesn't require me to boot up a kOS script before firing one, so I'd love a carrier stage that spawns several smaller missiles withing say.. 10km of the target as well

Looking at the source code, I don't see anything immediately obvious to improve on the gun aiming formula, apart from makig a cannon (railgun?) with better accuracy value and a slightly higher projectile speed to help the bullets reach their target before it gets bored and leaves. I suppose it makes sense for unguided projectiles to be somewhat of a short range thing, but I'd still like them to work a few kilometer further, think 20-40 km ranges.

Finally, there are the lasers. They can't do anything against anything further than 5km away, and once you breach that magical barrier they vaporize everything within seconds. Instead of flat out stopping the beam, how about scaling the damage down based on distance? That way it could be somewhat useable as more than just an anti missile system, but hopefully wouldn't instantly destroy everything from 100km away.

Edited November 17, 2014 by Yski

[LORDPrometheus]

Talking about physics range increases, I'd love to see some long range weaponry suited for space battles. I'm thinking along the lines of 50-100 km ranges here, and to put things in perspective our current weapons can't really hit anything further than 20km away.

Missiles would probably be relatively easy - the HEKV missiles seem to get pretty close when fired from about 40 km away, and only really miss because they lack the fuel to do the final corrections. As such, I'd imagine a larger, higher delta-v variant that's smart enough to leave some fuel in reserve for those final adjustments would probably do the trick. I'm also drooling for a cluster missile that doesn't require me to boot up a kOS script before firing one, so I'd love a carrier stage that spawns several smaller missiles withing say.. 10km of the target as well

Looking at the source code, I don't see anything immediately obvious to improve on the gun aiming formula, apart from makig a cannon (railgun?) with better accuracy value and a slightly higher projectile speed to help the bullets reach their target before it gets bored and leaves. I suppose it makes sense for unguided projectiles to be somewhat of a short range thing, but I'd still like them to work a few kilometer further, think 20-40 km ranges.

Finally, there are the lasers. They can't do anything against anything further than 5km away, and once you breach that magical barrier they vaporize everything within seconds. Instead of flat out stopping the beam, how about scaling the damage down based on distance? That way it could be somewhat useable as more than just an anti missile system, but hopefully wouldn't instantly destroy everything from 100km away.

lasers are subject to the inverse square law. think of it this way if it has a power of... 100 (arbitrary 100) at 1km. then by 2km it has a power of 50. so yeah it would hit a point of no effect. lasers dont work like they do in movies either they are almost never visible and would be used in pulses which would cause enough surface ablation to make it cause an explosion on impact.

[tetryds]

lasers are subject to the inverse square law. think of it this way if it has a power of... 100 (arbitrary 100) at 1km. then by 2km it has a power of 50. so yeah it would hit a point of no effect. lasers dont work like they do in movies either they are almost never visible and would be used in pulses which would cause enough surface ablation to make it cause an explosion on impact.

No, they are not subject to the inverse square law.

They do spread out and lose power with distance, but it's not with the inverse square.

Imagine them as cones, the power density of the laser is given by the power of the laser divided by the area of the circle created by a horizontal cone section.

The angle of the cone varies, but it's never zero.

So you can use lasers at long range, the power loss caused by them is mainly by other factors rather than spreading, usually atmosphere.

Many lasers can be seen because they are so intense that the scattering on the air molecules is strong enough for it to be visible.

A laser that could be used as a weapon like the laser on BDArmory would definitely be seen by naked eye, but it would require insane ammounts of energy to run (it does!).

Lasers as weaponary are nowadays mainly used in tatical advantage, bliding targets or overheating something rather than just cutting things off midair.

By overheating you could destroy a missile warhead or disable it somehow, several anti-missile weapons work like this.

So yeah

Edited November 18, 2014 by tetryds

[KazeNinja]

In fact heres a video of the US Navys Test Bed for Anti Missile/Drone Laser Weapon system

http://youtu.be/OmoldX1wKYQ

[Yski]

lasers are subject to the inverse square law. think of it this way if it has a power of... 100 (arbitrary 100) at 1km. then by 2km it has a power of 50. so yeah it would hit a point of no effect. lasers dont work like they do in movies either they are almost never visible and would be used in pulses which would cause enough surface ablation to make it cause an explosion on impact.

That's what I'm asking for. Currently the way the damage is calculated is like this: p.temperature += laserDamage*TimeWarp.fixedDeltaTime;

LaserDamage is a constant of 10000 defined earlier, and unless I'm missing something obvious there it does not change depending on the distance. Similarly the range of the laser is defined by another constant - it's just a ray cast that goes a certain distance, and if it hits something it deals that constant amount of damage.

What I'd like is a laser that scales its damage down based on range, preferedly powerful enough to work at reasonable distances. In other words, set the ray cast distance to the physics max range, and divide the damage formula by something that depends on size of the cone and distance to the target - it should be easy enough to figure out, but I'm about to miss my buss so I can't really do the math right now

To be honest the laser part is just a simple tweak to the code that I could just as well do myself, but the missiles could use an actual model, and my artistic skills are non-existent, so making fancy 3d stuff is pretty much out of question.

Edited November 18, 2014 by Yski

[tetryds]

What I'd like is a laser that scales its damage down based on range, preferedly powerful enough to work at reasonable distances. In other words, set the ray cast distance to the physics max range, and divide the damage formula by something that depends on size of the cone and distance to the target - it should be easy enough to figure out, but I'm about to miss my buss so I can't really do the math right now

I don't really think it's needed.

Unless you are working with industrial grade power on the lasers, the power loss within 2.5km on the atmosphere will be almost negligible.

It also depends on the wavelenght, lens and a few other factors.

What would interfere on it the most is that you have a slightly bigger area receiving the heat.

So I suggest you to cast a few rays in a cone shape, and search on the internet about the atmospheric loss of the laser wavelenght you are using.

This depends on the atmosphere density too, and in space you have no loss other than spreading.

[LORDPrometheus]

No, they are not subject to the inverse square law.

They do spread out and lose power with distance, but it's not with the inverse square.

Imagine them as cones, the power density of the laser is given by the power of the laser divided by the area of the circle created by a horizontal cone section.

The angle of the cone varies, but it's never zero.

So you can use lasers at long range, the power loss caused by them is mainly by other factors rather than spreading, usually atmosphere.

Many lasers can be seen because they are so intense that the scattering on the air molecules is strong enough for it to be visible.

A laser that could be used as a weapon like the laser on BDArmory would definitely be seen by naked eye, but it would require insane ammounts of energy to run (it does!).

Lasers as weaponary are nowadays mainly used in tatical advantage, bliding targets or overheating something rather than just cutting things off midair.

By overheating you could destroy a missile warhead or disable it somehow, several anti-missile weapons work like this.

So yeah

lasers are banned under the Geneva convention for use against infantry at power levels capable of causing permenant vision damage.

That and while the air in the path of a powerful laser beam would be ionized to make an infrared or ultraviolet laser (visible are just silly for military applications) it would be about as bright ad a glow stick in midday without the color. Not something one would see easily. They would be more likely to feel the heat and smell the ozone than physically see it.

Lasers are subject to the inverse square law just like all other forms of electromagnetic radiation. Its a common misconception that they are not. And while I understand the effect is negligible over short distances this is a game in a compressed universe so its more of a balance issue rather than a realism one. Heck the laser in game is already waayyy to powerful for the current it uses.

Read this if you need proof:

http://www.quora.com/Is-the-light-from-lasers-reduced-by-the-inverse-square-law-as-distance-grows-similar-to-other-light-sources

[tetryds]

lasers are banned under the Geneva convention for use against infantry at power levels capable of causing permenant vision damage.

That and while the air in the path of a powerful laser beam would be ionized to make an infrared or ultraviolet laser (visible are just silly for military applications) it would be about as bright ad a glow stick in midday without the color. Not something one would see easily. They would be more likely to feel the heat and smell the ozone than physically see it.

Lasers are subject to the inverse square law just like all other forms of electromagnetic radiation. Its a common misconception that they are not. And while I understand the effect is negligible over short distances this is a game in a compressed universe so its more of a balance issue rather than a realism one. Heck the laser in game is already waayyy to powerful for the current it uses.

Read this if you need proof:

http://www.quora.com/Is-the-light-from-lasers-reduced-by-the-inverse-square-law-as-distance-grows-similar-to-other-light-sources

What I was saying is that that the power does not magically disapear, it just gets spread on a larger area.

If the whole beam hits its target, for KSP it will heat the whole part the same ammount as if it was closer.

[Yski]

2.5km on the atmosphere

I probably should've made it clearer, but I'm looking for weapons suited for long range space battles. As such, all that's between my laser and the target is a few specks of dust and lots of distance.

Here's some quick math for that scaling factor. The "a" is the angle between the center of the beam and one of its edges, "l" is the distance to the target, and "r" is the radius of the beam.

Using some basic trigonometry we'll see that

tan(a) = r/l -> r = tan(a)*l

Using that, the area of the circle should be

A = PI * r^(2) = PI * (tan(a)*l)^2

The angle "a" should be a constant for the cannon, and that's what you'd use to tweak the damage scaling to suit your needs. Or if you want to go really hard core, you could actually calculate that as well. I just did some lazy drawings to get a general idea

If you want to dive deeper into the math, try this link: http://www.projectrho.com/public_html/rocket/spacegunconvent.php

The part you are looking for starts after the fourth "Equation" on the page.

[tetryds]

I probably should've made it clearer, but I'm looking for weapons suited for long range space battles. As such, all that's between my laser and the target is a few specks of dust and lots of distance.

Here's some quick math for that scaling factor. The "a" is the angle between the center of the beam and one of its edges, "l" is the distance to the target, and "r" is the radius of the beam.

Using some basic trigonometry we'll see that

tan(a) = r/l -> r = tan(a)*l

Using that, the area of the circle should be

A = PI * r^(2) = PI * (tan(a)*l)^2

The angle "a" should be a constant for the cannon, and that's what you'd use to tweak the damage scaling to suit your needs. Or if you want to go really hard core, you could actually calculate that as well. I just did some lazy drawings to get a general idea

If you want to dive deeper into the math, try this link: http://www.projectrho.com/public_html/rocket/spacegunconvent.php

The part you are looking for starts after the fourth "Equation" on the page.

Ahh, sorry I misunderstood what you were trying to do.

You are probably searching for a railgun, or a coil gun, or a hybrid.

If I find something that would work I will make sure to let you know.

Just be warned that you may have issues with such big physics loading range, unless you only load your target and only if in orbit.

[Yski]

Ahh, sorry I misunderstood what you were trying to do.

You are probably searching for a railgun, or a coil gun, or a hybrid.

If I find something that would work I will make sure to let you know.

Just be warned that you may have issues with such big physics loading range, unless you only load your target and only if in orbit.

There are plenty of space worthy weapons out there, so why settle for just guns? If anything, unguided projectiles would be at a disadvantage, since hitting anything that's actively trying to dodge is going to be really difficult due to the long travel times for the bullets.

Lasers are perfectly viable for space combat. For instance, if we pluck in an angle of 10^(-4) radians, we'd still do about 1/100th of the original damage at 50 000 meters, and seeing how quickly things break when hit by the laser cannons of doom that come with the mod, 1/100th wouldn't be all that terrible. The angle I gave you might sound small, but using the formulae I linked earlier the theoretical minimum angle for an infra red laser with a wave length of 3800nm (the kind of laser US military is experimenting with) and a mirror (~laser gun) size of 2m (a random number, more or less) would be 1.9*10^(-6), and that's a laser designed to be used in atmospheres.

That being said, I'm not looking just for lasers, like I mentioned earlier missiles would be amazing as well, and cannons too, though improving their aim enough for those ranges could be trickier. As for physics instability, I'll take a few Kraken attacks for the joy of blowing up a tiny dot I might be able to see with the right mods installed

Edited November 18, 2014 by Yski

[Yski]

So, I messed around with the code a bit, and my infinite range lasers seem to be working as intented. I might have to work on the damage scaling a bit as it turns out it falls of a bit too quickly, but it's just tweaking the numbers at this point

[Hodo]

http://imgur.com/a/WYqDF#0

(plz someone tell me how to format so it embeds)

Simple....

[ imgur ] WYqDF [ / imgur ]

no spaces in the code so it comes out like this.

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[AntiMatter001]

just a question but...

i just thought of a way to fire something one by one. (like a chain-gun or something or maybe the small 50. cal turret.)

why not make both "barrels" a gun? like so you can fire one barrel but not the other.

in simple words. two barrels on the 50.cal right? barrel A and barrel B. try make barrel A and barrel B seperate "guns" so you can fire barrel A without firing barrel B...

if this is confusing or not possible just message me... i'll get to it sometime...

[tetryds]

just a question but...

i just thought of a way to fire something one by one. (like a chain-gun or something or maybe the small 50. cal turret.)

why not make both "barrels" a gun? like so you can fire one barrel but not the other.

in simple words. two barrels on the 50.cal right? barrel A and barrel B. try make barrel A and barrel B seperate "guns" so you can fire barrel A without firing barrel B...

if this is confusing or not possible just message me... i'll get to it sometime...

You mean make it so you enable both at the same time using the weapons manager and they alternate when firing for increased rate of fire?

Or have one gun with two barrels behave like two guns?

If it's the former that is very interesting.

[AntiMatter001]

You mean make it so you enable both at the same time using the weapons manager and they alternate when firing for increased rate of fire?

Or have one gun with two barrels behave like two guns?

If it's the former that is very interesting.

former. i came across the idea when i was recording a space battle and forgot to assign one of my turrets to duel fire mode. (also i may have made a double barreled tank during one of my drunken battles)

although it is interesting it may not be possible due to the plug-in and I’m fairly sure bahamotoD has come across this idea before...

if not and this has worked then holy cowpat batman i'm a freaking genius lol·

EDIT: also i'll take no credit in coming up with this idea. i love this mod and i am very happy to have helped at all

Edited November 19, 2014 by AntiMatter001

[LORDPrometheus]

former. i came across the idea when i was recording a space battle and forgot to assign one of my turrets to duel fire mode. (also i may have made a double barreled tank during one of my drunken battles)

although it is interesting it may not be possible due to the plug-in and I’m fairly sure bahamotoD has come across this idea before...

if not and this has worked then holy cowpat batman i'm a freaking genius lol·

EDIT: also i'll take no credit in coming up with this idea. i love this mod and i am very happy to have helped at all

If each gun were stored as an individual system in the same model it may work but as you said it would depend on how the code handles things

[panzer1b]

You mean make it so you enable both at the same time using the weapons manager and they alternate when firing for increased rate of fire?

Or have one gun with two barrels behave like two guns?

If it's the former that is very interesting.

This is a planned featuire of my MP mod thats based on the original BDA code.

While super low priority (probably wont make in earlier releases), it WILL be done eventually, as i have a cannon planned that is a quad barreled gun, but i need it to fire one barrel at a time with each barrel having its own recoil anim! Im so gonna implement an actual quad 20mm AA gun, maybee then i can make an ACTUAL wirbelwind! And itd look pretty nice on capital ships, quad 20 turret

That gun will likely have selectable rof settings, meaning u can switch between half the guns or all of them. Since it had that irl, you can set it to fire 2 guns separately, with infinite but lower rof, or fire all 4 max rof but overheat/reloads.

Heck, one more thing im gonna implement are reloads for guns that make sense to have them. Aside from minigun like things (which is all thats in teh pack for the most part as is), almost every other gun had a reload rate and used a fixed length belt/clip. Thequad 20 should have 80 shots, 20 per gun, then like a 3 sec reload, wasnt belt fed

Edited November 19, 2014 by panzer1b

[AntiMatter001]

If each gun were stored as an individual system in the same model it may work but as you said it would depend on how the code handles things

well yes that's the whole point of my idea. if the turrets have a singular point/points which spawn the "bullet" which will travel forward at the speed it has said in the .cfg file then i thought that maybe you could add one point to each barrel but have them act as two separate "guns" so you could fire one and then the other and not both at once.

[Yski]

Long range laser testing. I opted to make a larger version of the laser for long ranges, and have the current one remain a short range weapon. Both now scale down with distance squared, one just does it faster.

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Edited August 12, 2015 by Yski

[eeveelution]

Hey! Could anyone here do a video on how to make some parts for the mod? Specifically guns, missiles, and cannons (maybe even rocket pods). I'd love to make my own parts, but I'm not quite sure how the unity animation and stuff works. If anyone would like to help me out, I would really appreciate it